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Author Topic: understanding labs  (Read 4961 times)

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Offline wcasv5

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understanding labs
« on: July 14, 2020, 05:59:36 pm »
Im not sure if im in the right place or not. I just got some lab results and my cd4 count increased by over 100 cells but my cd4% dropped about 6%. what does this mean. In addition, my cd8 cells increased almost 200 cells but cd8% only increased 1.5%. I'm worried about the decline in cd4 percentage. Please reply.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2020, 06:04:14 pm by wcasv5 »

Offline Jim Allen

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2020, 06:20:59 pm »
Hiya,

So dropped 6% from what?

How is your viral load? Are you on treatment?

Jim
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Offline wcasv5

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2020, 07:52:48 pm »
Dropped from 41% to 35.4% but the cd4 themselves increased over 100. Last check of viral load was only 1150. No not on treatment yet. Could this be a glitch or lab error? Is the decrease clincally significant?
« Last Edit: July 14, 2020, 08:15:31 pm by wcasv5 »

Offline Jim Allen

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2020, 12:22:07 am »
The CD4% is within the normal average range and will fluctuate up and down.

More important would be to start treatment regardless of CD4 counts, are you facing any barriers to starting treatment? Also, what's your Viral load like? 

https://i-base.info/ttfa/section-1/9-interpreting-cd4-results-cd4-count-and-cd4-percentage/
https://www.poz.com/basics/hiv-basics/understanding-lab-work-blood-tests
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Offline wcasv5

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2020, 08:55:36 am »
vl = 1150. my cd8 cells increased from 762 to 983. I think i might have some sort of coinfection. i am very very concerned about the 6% drop. That seems like a lot to me.
I don't understand how cd4 count can rise but the percentage go down. Are there other cells that affect the percentage other than cd4 and cd8.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2020, 09:09:34 am by wcasv5 »

Offline Jim Allen

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2020, 09:09:41 am »
Hiya,

The CD4% can also go up and down, it's just tends to be more stable and better indicator over a trend compared to absolute count. Not that it matters, and the CD8 can be out of wack, not surprising at all.

More important would be getting on treatment to supress the virus before and to limit both measured and unmessured damage done to you. When were you dignoised and have you spoken to your doctor about starting treatment?
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Offline CR2016

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2020, 04:41:43 pm »
Hi Wcasv5.
as Jim mentioned most important is to be on medication. proportion in all your lymphocytes are moving maybe by the increassing on your VL. Regardless of whether your VL is in low numbers or not, you must start treatment. share us why you have not started for understanding if there is any troubble external to you.
regards and hugs!

Offline wcasv5

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #7 on: July 16, 2020, 08:59:02 am »
Thanks for your replies. Actually i was only diagnosed a few weeks ago. I did these test on my own. I don't have a doctor yet. I guess what I'm asking is this. If i add the total cdr 4 count and the total cd8 count together, that does not equal the total lymphs. So are there other types of lymphocytes not included on the report that have an affect on percentage. For instance my cd4 percentage is 35, My cd8 percentage is 37. That doesn't equal 100%.

I have another question that is sort of off topic but im scared about it anyway. And that is the topic of resistance.

Once I do get on a regimen im worried about developing resistance. Ive read so many things and cant seem to find a concensus. If I have an undetectable viral load and am consistent with my meds every day, can resistance still develop over time. I don't see how it can since it cant replicate itself. But I have read where this is possible.

Also, I know my doctor, when i get one, will do other tests but is there a drug/s that you feel is better than others.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 09:02:22 am by wcasv5 »

Offline CR2016

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #8 on: July 16, 2020, 10:55:45 am »
yes: %CD4 is relative between CD4/Total number of lymp.
All this doubts and maybe fears about how your system is gonna work we all have felt at the beginnin. All current medication offered as ARV are so good for HIV control. There are different med combinations available for you, depending on your initil lab tests is wich you will take. dont be affraid, trust on your body, resisntance is not as easy for developing; dont care so much about side effects at the beginning please. Maybe Jim or another member could help better for this info. I just can tell you not to feel fear about that, must to trust everything is gonna work well. heve you planned when to see your doctor for oredering your general lab tests or something?
excuse my english, i hope you feel better,specially mentally.
Hugs! regards

Offline Jim Allen

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2020, 12:50:14 pm »
Hiya,

I think you are worrying about things that are not really relevant and I don't say that to be dismissive, it's normal I suppose at first, most people do that.  ;)

These are also questions to run by your Doctor. Before I forget for the moment I am going to ask you to post only in this one thread until you have had labs confirmed by your doctor.

Quote
is there a drug/s that you feel is better than others.
I could tell you my meds are great but they might be totally unsuitable for you.

What treatment you will start with, will depend on many things like your HIV resistance profile, other medical needs, conditions or medications, viral load when starting treatment and for some meds a hypersensitivity test is needed. It's not something to stress or worry about though as your doctor will test these things and that will help them determine what meds will suit you.

https://www.poz.com/basics/hiv-basics/starting-hiv-treatment

Quote
I have another question that is sort of off topic but im scared about it anyway. And that is the topic of resistance.

Once I do get on a regimen im worried about developing resistance. Ive read so many things and cant seem to find a concensus. If I have an undetectable viral load and am consistent with my meds every day, can resistance still develop over time. I don't see how it can since it cant replicate itself. But I have read where this is possible.

Resistance, can HIV drug resistance can happen, yes, HIV still mutates and exsits in the tissue, however most cases new resistances cases is linked to virologic failure from poor adherence this is within your control, or things like poor absorption, drug-drug interactions, other illnesses and of course pre-existing resistance.

Plenty of people take the same drugs for many years, decades even and only switch because newer drugs are available. Keep that in mind and that adherence is within your control.

https://www.poz.com/basics/hiv-basics/hiv-drug-resistance
https://aidsinfo.nih.gov/guidelines/html/1/adult-and-adolescent-arv/15/virologic-failure
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4839839/



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Offline virgo313

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2020, 12:51:23 pm »
Hello & Hi,
Like others, I too would encourage you to start medication & worry the “if” later (if any). The benefits of starting medication are:-
- Avoid possible of getting opportunistic infection when immune is low
- decrease viral load
- having to take additional medication like antibiotic

It could be too early for you to understand fully “CD4, 8, %” now. For info on myself, I have not have any Of those result taken for almost 2 years as Dr is just looking at my VL only. I mean, it will come to a point that u know those results is not very important as long as your VL are undetectable. 
RVD Nov 2015. VL --> Log 5.32 HAART on 23/11/15
TDF+FTC+EFV / Chemo KS - 25/11/15 - 20/01/16.
CD4 - 4 (3/11/15) / VL - 225,000

Offline wcasv5

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Re: understanding labs
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2020, 05:25:15 pm »
Ok,

Thanks everyone for your replies. It is very helpful.

 


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