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Author Topic: Just needing some aclarations  (Read 1564 times)

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Offline juan246810

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Just needing some aclarations
« on: August 05, 2019, 12:27:37 pm »
Hi
I had sex with a girl at the start of January (6th), I used a condom but it broke while my penis was inside. I continued pushing as I was still aroused, after some minutes I pulled out. Long-story short, a flu with sore throat, fever and headaches started two weeks later. After searching my symptoms on google I went to the doctor and tested on the 29th, negative. Then on March 1 and finally on May 31 on the fifth month, all negative. I wished I was okay mentally but the thing of testing at six months scared me still, I wish I knew that it's just outdated protocols now because I've found horrible cases of late seroconversions, just around 20 cases, I know theses cases had very specific medical conditions and I'm 19,my only medical condition is some episodes of asthma and I'm really aware that almost nothing stops the production of antibodies. My mom always used to tell me cases of teens around 15-18 having unprotected sex and testing positive on less of a month.
Currently, physically I'm doing okay, I have lost some weight but everything seems to be associated to this severe case of anxiety, I'm a very anxious person and this was one of the worst cases of anxiety I had. I noticed some small red dots appearing on my hands but I had one since last year so I'm trying not to get too obsessed with it.
Mentally, I'm not doing too good nor too bad, I can actually sleep now, I'm receiving psychological help and working with my ocd (I was scratched by a person on my face on May 15th, it bled a little but it wasn't a gaping wound that needed stitches and I just disinfected it and added some cream, I spent the rest of May and June believing I had to get tested, I even called a medical phone line and they told me "It's possible, what if she had blood on her fingernails?" Screw that supposed doctor, but just in case, is that considered a risk? I know that the virus dies rapidly once outside but I'm still a little "shocked" after that attack, after googling and passing through many medical forums, many confirmed doctors stated that no one gets scared from a scratch as its not a way to get infected.
I've seen people get their negative after 3 months, cheering and then moving on in just some minutes, I wish I was one of them, there was this user in other forum saying "iN sCiEnCe 2+2=5, everyone should get tested yearly for years and years" I know that every sexually active person needs to get tested yearly for every std but this person claimed that everyone should get tested for years by just one exposure and linked to a medical page that showed the case of a person that took 4 years to generate antibodies, this person in just some months already was in aids state, I'm not going to link it because I get terrified by just finding the page, it's "A case of long-term seronegative hiv infection for 4 years" I don't remember it very well but I think it was that. I don't know if he had anything in particular but from what I know is that he was around 35 and was healthy, and that terrifies me. He quickly advanced to aids state so I guess that happens when a human body doesn't generate antibodies. He was on the ER many times and it's been already 7 months and I'm doing "fine". On quora one guy said that it "Was possible to seroconvert after 7 or 8 months" And proceed to link to the same case of the 4 year guy. But, he also said that this was extremely rare and that no one should get anxious around it, but the damage was already done. I'm trying to move on, but knowing all this just doesn't help, I know maybe some of them lied, or they had some specific medical state, or maybe some of the cases occurred on the 90's or 80's. I just need some help, maybe someone could clear everything up, show me the full picture or something I missed about all this "late seroconversion" topic, what Dr. Hook said on another forum, "late seroconversion is an internet based myth".
Please Help.

Offline Jim Allen

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Re: Just needing some aclarations
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2019, 12:37:14 pm »
Hiya,

I wish you well, I hope you know this and, I read your post 3 times. Hard to digest what the issue is but I get the gist of this situation I think.

Unless you have had continued exposures or live in the past you are HIV negative and need to move on with your life. Stop looking for an issue you don't have, stop reading dated rubbish or stories online out of context and thinking it's fact or that it applies to you, it does not. Now if you can't control this behaviour then seek face to face support.

Here's what you need to know in order to avoid HIV infection:
Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, every time, no exceptions.  Consider starting PrEP as an additional layer of HIV prevention going forward.

Keep in mind that some sexual practices which may be described as safe in terms of HIV might still pose a risk for transmission of other far easier to acquire STI's, so please do get fully tested regularly and at least yearly for all STI's including but not limited to HIV and test more frequently if unprotected intercourse occurs

Also, note that it is possible to have an STI and show no signs or symptoms and the only way of knowing is by testing.

Kind regards

Jim

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Offline juan246810

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Re: Just needing some aclarations
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2019, 08:06:08 pm »
Thanks for the reply, yeah I'm already been seeking support for my mental health as I'm still struggling to move on and well, my problem was basically that, learning to move on. I knew I had a risk and I tested negative after three months. I'm just saying the same here, but that was my problem, I felt confused after finding all those "rare cases" I'm 18 and I don't have any special medical condition, so I suppose my immunological system would've reacted normally AKA producing antibodies. But there's all this people that say otherwise, some user on Facebook told me to take a test at twelve months because "no one produces antibodies at the same time", even a supposed doctor online said "Unfortunately I can't tell you that your result is reliable, take a test at 6 months and at 12 months, the good thing with fourth generation tests, with more negatives you collect, bigger is the possibility of you being actually negative" I don't know what passes through this people minds, maybe it's just a troll but I saw his other answers, he knew a lot about other medical things. Not even in the 80's they told you to take one exam at a year after an encounter, maybe he guessed I was sexually active and just said that to scare me, my mom that's a nurse told me that they just recommend another test at a year so the patient gets scared, restraints themselves of having other risks and get them controlled. I'm not sexually active and that was just my first and last sexual encounter, I know the exact date so I guess that doesn't apply to me. I'm just confused and scared of happening the worst. There's even this guy in quora saying "for completeness of information, there have been seronegative cases of people hiv positive testing negative after 3 months with third generation tests but they're really rare" completeness of information my ass, the only thing they do is scare people off and keep them from moving on. Even a granny said that she had a friend that tested positive after testing negative after 12 years after a knife wound incident, that last one I'm completely calling it bs and dismissing it, I guess she was naive enough to believe her friend, they're doing no good scaring people like that, if her friend tested negative but was hiv positive I guess he would've noticed somehow, or he just was sexually active and had guilt so he just straight up lied to her. I just see that case completely ridiculous and I'm not getting scared by it, at least now, the first time I read that I completely panicked. I'm just venting here, sorry for that.
My other concern was the scratch on my face I received, was that a risk? It bled a little, it wasn't a gaping bleeding wound, and it didn't need any stitches.
Sorry for wasting your time, I'm just another paranoid guy struggling to move on, I just have 2 final questions, I'll save my third post for the future.
1-does the face scratch I got considered a risk? Assuming she had blood on her fingernails or constantly bleeding from her fingers? The scratch wounds weren't deep enough to need stitches or medical intervention. Is it considered a risk? Should I test?
2-Im scared of having hepatitis c and not knowing it, I only tested for hiv the same day the first day, the thing is, I read on a page that a co-infection of hepatitis c and hiv might extend the window period up to 12 months, my question is as I don't know if this is dated information or something like that but, is this real? Is it possible? I mean, can hepatitis c affect the window period of hiv? Is there anything that affects the window period, besides being in chemotherapy treatment? From what I read, being in antiviral treatment for hepatitis c is what may affect the window period but it's not from having hepatitis itself. I hope this is true because I'm really confused, please help.  I'm sorry for asking again.

Offline Jim Allen

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Re: Just needing some aclarations
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2019, 11:17:38 pm »
Hiya,

I already said stop reading dated rubbish, CYA (Cover your ass) or stories online out of context that simply doesn't apply to you to begin with. A lot of what you are posting about would be relevant or fact if you were still somehow living in the 1980s or pre-1996

Approved HIV antibodies test today are mostly 3rd or 4th generation, with this most people, will produce antibodies at levels detectable by any approved blood-drawn test within 22 - 28 days, some tests that are more sensitive may pick up on infections sooner than that, however, the rare outliers & rapid tests do take longer but no 6 months or a year,  post any exposure conclusive remains 3 months

Delays in antibodies testing post the 3 months are more myth than fact, and hep c is not one of them. The rare cases have mostly been linked/tracked to either testing too soon, incorrectly home test users (As it totally messing it up) or people with serious underlying medical conditions such as cancer and undergoing chemo, and/or long term IV drug uses, and people who where critically ill i.e dying or dead etc, even taking all of this into account its still a freakishly rare at 0.1% and you don't belong to people in those categories

A scratch is not how HIV is transmitted, so no risk there and unless you have had continued risk exposures you simply don't have HIV.

Move on with your life and if you can't I would recommend speaking to a therapist, whatever you do stop relying on old case studies, stories or social media for information.

Jim

Generation 1/2/3

Pilcher CD et al. Performance of Rapid Point-of-Care and Laboratory Tests for Acute and Established HIV Infection in San Francisco. PLOS ONE, 2013.

Branson BM State of the art for diagnosis of HIV infection. Clin Infect Dis 45:S221-225, 2007

Coombs RW Clinical laboratory diagnosis of HIV-1 and use of viral RNA to monitor infection. In Holmes KK (editor), Sexually Transmitted Diseases. New York: McGraw-Hill, 2008

Maldarelli F Diagnosis of Human Immunodeficiency Virus infection. In Mandell, Douglas and Bennett’s Principles and Practice of Infectious Diseases (sixth edition). Philadelphia: Elsevier Churchill Livingstone, 2004

Parry JV et al. Towards error-free HIV diagnosis: guidelines on laboratory practice. Comm Dis Pub Health 6:334-350, 2003

3rd gen testing accuracy Perry KR et al. Improvement in the performance of HIV screening kits. Transfus Med 18:228-240, 2008

Generation 3 & 4
2015

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25033879
(Blood drawn tests)
Abstract
Patients typically want accurate test results as soon as possible while clinicians prefer to wait until the probability of a false-negative is virtually nil. This review summarizes the median window periods for third-generation antibody and fourth-generation HIV tests and provides the probability of a false-negative result for various days post-exposure. Data were extracted from published seroconversion panels. The median (interquartile range) window period for third-generation tests was 22 days (19-25) and 18 days (16-24) for fourth-generation tests. The probability of a false-negative result is 0.01 at 80 days' post-exposure for third-generation tests and at 42 days for fourth-generation tests.

June 2016 write-up
http://i-base.info/guides/testing/appendix-1-different-types-of-hiv-test

Generation 4

https://www.cdc.gov/hiv/testing/clinical/index.html
2018
CDC recently published research findings that estimate the window period for 20 U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA)-approved HIV tests. The study showed that laboratory testing using antigen/antibody tests detects HIV infection sooner than other available tests that detect only antibodies. If a person gets a laboratory-based antigen/antibody test on blood plasma less than 45 days after a possible HIV exposure and the result is negative, follow-up testing can begin 45 days after the possible HIV exposure. For all other tests, CDC recommends testing again at least 90 days after exposure to be sure that a negative test result is accurate.

Bentsen C Performance evaluation of the Bio-Rad Laboratories GS HIV Combo Ag/Ab EIA, a 4th generation HIV assay for the simultaneous detection of HIV p24 antigen and antibodies to HIV-1 (groups M and O) and HIV-2 in human serum or plasma. Journal of Clinical Virology, S57-S61, 2011

Nick S Sensitivities of CE-Marked HIV, HCV, and HBsAg Assays. Journal of Medical Virology, S59-S64, 2007

Eshelman S Detection of Individuals With Acute HIV-1 Infection Using the ARCHITECT HIV Ag/Ab Combo Assay. Journal of Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndromes, 121-4, 2009

Speers D et al. Combination assay detecting both Human Immunodeficiency Virus (HIV) p24 antigen and anti-HIV antibodies opens a second diagnostic window. J Clin Microbiol 43:5397-5399, 2005

Ly TD et al. Evaluation of the sensitivity and specificity of six HIV combined p24 antigen and antibody assays. J Virol Methods 122:185-94, 2004

http://www.bhiva.org/
Testing guidelines bhiva "British HIV association" : Although fourth generation tests shorten the time from exposure to seroconversion a repeat test at three months is still recommended to definitively exclude HIV infection.


2015 WHO http://apps.who.int/iris/bitstream/handle/10665/179870/9789241508926_eng.pdf;jsessionid=1F192FECF734A0DE7E2520864984AE63?sequence=1
In many settings post-test counselling messages recommend that all people who have a
non-reactive (HIV-negative) test result should return for retesting to rule out acute
infection that is too early for the test to detect (in other words, in the window period.
- 3 months) However, retesting is needed only for HIV-negative individuals who report recent or ongoing risk of exposure. For most people who test HIV-negative, additional retesting to rule out being in the window period is not necessary and may waste resources.












 
« Last Edit: August 23, 2019, 11:40:52 pm by Jim Allen »
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Offline juan246810

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Re: Just needing some aclarations
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2019, 09:36:18 pm »
I wanted to reply on my previous topic but I got this message: "Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 60 days.
Unless you're sure you want to reply, please consider starting a new topic." And well, I wanted to get a reply since I haven't touched my previous post months ago (August). Sorry for any inconvenience, this is my last free reply/post so I'll try to ask everything I have in mind. My last test was a negative after 5 months but we'll, thanks to my hypochondria and bad googling I've convinced myself this bad phase of my life wasn't ending yet. I had protected sex with another male and I have some questions. Despite being 18, pretty healthy before all this happened at the start of 2019, my questions are:
1-) Can I lose weight by just having anxiety/being anxious? I'm not planning of googling anytime soon, I'm not doing exercise either and well, after being very aware of my body I've noticed I'm very skinny. From what my psychologist says, I look the same and yes, I can lose weight after having a very bad case of anxiety. I just want to know if you agree with that.
2-) From the encounter (that was protected sex with another male) I remember that I did cunningulus, I don't remember very well the name of it but the thing is that I stick my tongue in the anus of my partner, can I get hiv from that practice? My gut tells me that no, but I still want to be sure. P.S: my tongue wasn't like practically inside his anus, it was basically outside and just touching very awkwardly the outside of the anus. I'm not even sure of it was actually touching the anus as I felt more the ass cheeks walls touching it.
3-) Thaks to Jim's advice that hepatitis doesn't affect the window period and doesn't extends it to a year, why some pages say that type of thing? Old guidelines? Just pure CYA (cover your ass)? That page was telling some of its users to talk to their doctor to test at the year mark of they believe they might have an hepatitis infection with hiv also, that kinda terrify me. Why they do that?
4-) We jerked off together, I jerked him and he to me. I know that practice is not an hiv risk but when he came, I took some of his semen and had it on my hands for several seconds, then I put some of it on my mouth, is that an hiv risk?.
5-) Similar to question 4, after tasting some of his semen, he took some of mine and put it on his mouth too, I took more of his cum and put it in his mouth, after some minutes we started having very tongue deep kisses, is that an hiv risk too? (The part of putting semen on his mouth and then kissing) I read that once outside hiv "dies" or just is unable to infect anymore but what if I reintroduced on the mouth of other person and then we had the deep kisses, is it possible to the virus to kinda die outside but regain it's ability to infect once it's inside the mouth? I don't remember very well if I had any kind of  "injuries" in my mouth but I'm just assuming I had just to see if it was any risk. I really hope any experts here understands this last question as its the one that's been killing me emotionally and mentally, I hope this one gets a "detailed answer" as it's the one that scares me the most and a "no" would probably not calm me as my anxiety would create more questions. I just want a detailed answer explaining why my reasoning doesn't make any sense that it was not a risk. I'm sorry if I sound a little rude.
At the end, my last test after 5 months was negative anyway, I protected myself and the practice that I had was no hiv issue anyway (but my mind says otherwise), so basically I'm "free to go" and move on but I just this last doubts to be answered, I'm sorry if I'm making any expert lose any of their time but my anxiety can bring the worst of my fears. Thanks in advance.

Offline Jim Allen

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Re: Just needing some aclarations
« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2019, 03:20:55 am »
Hiya,

You had no HIV risk from this recent encounter and as for the previous one you tested negative.

I wish you well but keep working with your psychologist in regards to your HIV anxieties, it's not something I can help you with here.  Keep using condoms for any intercouse, consider PrEP as an additional layer of HIV prevention and test out of standard routine at least yearly for STI's & HIV like every sexually active adult should.

Quote
1)  Can I lose weight by just having anxiety/being anxious?

Already answered correctly by your psychologist

Quote
2-) From the encounter (that was protected sex with another male) I remember that I did cunningulus, I don't remember very well the name of it but the thing is that I stick my tongue in the anus of my partner, can I get hiv from that practice? My gut tells me that no, but I still want to be sure. P.S: my tongue wasn't like practically inside his anus, it was basically outside and just touching very awkwardly the outside of the anus. I'm not even sure of it was actually touching the anus as I felt more the ass cheeks walls touching it.

It's not cunnilingus, this is "rimming" or analingus and it's not an HIV concern.

Quote
3)
Asked and answered already

Quote
4 & 5) We jerked off together
Quote
had it on my hands for several seconds, then I put some of it on my mouth

Not an HIV risk

6)
Quote
is it possible to the virus to kinda die outside but regain it's ability to infect once it's inside the mouth?

HIV is fragile and difficult to transmit, so much so that nobody has been infected by HIV sexually once it's been exposed outside the human body. HIV has an outer protein/receptors that are needed to remain infectious and they corrode once exposed outside the body as small changes in temperature, pH/moisture levels and air as well all damage the receptors rendering it unable to infect you.

Nothing you do with your mouth will undo the damage to HIV, it has no "healing or reactivation" powers, in fact your mouth is a hostile environment towards HIV as saliva contains has a neutralizing effect on HIV by damaging the receptors needed to infect human cells, not that it matters because whatever was on your fingers was not an HIV concern to start with.

Move on with your life!
« Last Edit: November 20, 2019, 04:15:36 am by Jim Allen »
HIV 101 - Everything you need to know
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Transmission and Risks:
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PEP and PrEP

 


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