Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
October 17, 2017, 11:21:22 PM

Login with username, password and session length

  • Total Members: 31648
  • Latest: Die
  • Total Posts: 720832
  • Total Topics: 58464
  • Online Today: 321
  • Online Ever: 1421
  • (August 13, 2016, 05:18:44 AM)
Users Online
Users: 6
Guests: 232
Total: 238


Welcome to the POZ Community Forums, a round-the-clock discussion area for people with HIV/AIDS, their friends/family/caregivers, and others concerned about HIV/AIDS.  Click on the links below to browse our various forums; scroll down for a glance at the most recent posts; or join in the conversation yourself by registering on the left side of this page.

Privacy Warning:  Please realize that these forums are open to all, and are fully searchable via Google and other search engines. If you are HIV positive and disclose this in our forums, then it is almost the same thing as telling the whole world (or at least the World Wide Web). If this concerns you, then do not use a username or avatar that are self-identifying in any way. We do not allow the deletion of anything you post in these forums, so think before you post.

  • The information shared in these forums, by moderators and members, is designed to complement, not replace, the relationship between an individual and his/her own physician.

  • All members of these forums are, by default, not considered to be licensed medical providers. If otherwise, users must clearly define themselves as such.

  • Forums members must behave at all times with respect and honesty. Posting guidelines, including time-out and banning policies, have been established by the moderators of these forums. Click here for “Am I Infected?” posting guidelines. Click here for posting guidelines pertaining to all other POZ community forums.

  • We ask all forums members to provide references for health/medical/scientific information they provide, when it is not a personal experience being discussed. Please provide hyperlinks with full URLs or full citations of published works not available via the Internet. Additionally, all forums members must post information which are true and correct to their knowledge.

  • Product advertisement—including links; banners; editorial content; and clinical trial, study or survey participation—is strictly prohibited by forums members unless permission has been secured from POZ.

To change forums navigation language settings, click here (members only), Register now

Para cambiar sus preferencias de los foros en español, haz clic aquí (sólo miembros), Regístrate ahora

Finished Reading This? You can collapse this or any other box on this page by clicking the symbol in each box.

Author Topic: Transmission and being undetectable.  (Read 2470 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline sunseeker

  • Member
  • Posts: 124
Transmission and being undetectable.
« on: October 22, 2007, 10:14:31 PM »
I was at the doctor the other day and he told me that I was undetectable which is great news.  My doctor also said that there has been studies done that show its harder to infect a negative person when you are undetectable.  I am trying to get information so that I can let the negative guy that I am dating read about it so he is informed in all areas before making the choice to be intimate.  Thanks for any help and information.

Offline Bucko

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,947
  • You need a shine, missy!
    • The Spin Cycle
Re: Transmission and being undetectable.
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2007, 10:20:02 PM »
You're not gonna hear much different from conventional wisdom around here. Use a condom for anal and/or vaginal sex. Read the thread on oral sex and judge for yourself.

Good luck and happy sex-

(Who enjoys a healthy sex life)
Blessed with brains, talent and gorgeous tits.

The revolutionary smart set reads The Spin Cycle at least once every day.

Blathering on AIDSmeds since 2005, provocative from birth

Offline LACboi

  • Member
  • Posts: 72
  • AMG member since June 2005
    • FaceBook
Re: Transmission and being undetectable.
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2007, 11:40:18 PM »
Hello Sun,

Only about 5% of the virus is in the blood so when you are undetectable that is only testing the blood. So use a condom when having intercourse vaginal, or anal.


Offline MOONLIGHT1114

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,918
  • Cheech 2.2.94 - 4.23.10 We miss you so much!
Re: Transmission and being undetectable.
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2007, 11:45:22 PM »
Hi Sun~

The guys are right.  VL testing only tests what's in the blood, while other body fluids could differ.  You should always be using protection for intercourse - ALWAYS.

Congrats on the good lab report!

~ Cindy
HIV+ since '93, 1/12 - CD4 785 and undet.   WOO-HOO!!

Offline newt

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,896
  • the one and original newt
Re: Transmission and being undetectable.
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2007, 05:55:10 AM »
Viral load a key factor in transmission risk. Blood and semen viral loads are generally well matched when undetectable, perhaps 1 log higher, and yes you are less infections. If you are an "average" undetectable person virus wise your semen viral load will be somewhere between <50 and 1,500.

There are studies in steady straight couples with different HIV antibody status which show 0 transmission for people with viral loads under 1,500 or so, condoms or no condoms. One or two of these studies are nearly big enough to be sound at a population level.

But not everyone is average. People have ended up HIV positive in exactly this situation, there is still a risk of transmission.

The persuasive studies are, by and large, on straight couples. No-one has bothered to look at this for gay (anal) sex properly. << why?

Several people I know in steady monogamous relationships, gay and straight, with different HIV antibody status have ditched condoms always/sometimes for anal/vaginal sex, a decision partly informed by the HIV positive partner having a long time undetectable viral load. They's got well dissed for doing so. In my view it's their choice/risk assessment. These aren't casual shags, they's open with each other and have taken time to reflect on the decision << interestingly when it's time for a viral load test the condoms tend to go back on...hmmm. 

But these freinds are by no means the majority. Most people I know in serodiscordant relationships stick with the rubbers, regardless of undetectable viral load.

But, but, would I, undetectable as I am, go rubberless with my HIV negative man?...no. Would my man with me?...yes. Does my HIV negative man draw comfort from my undetectable viral load?...yes. Does he still worry about acquiring the virus?...yes.

- matt
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline BT65

  • Global Moderator
  • Member
  • Posts: 10,785
Re: Transmission and being undetectable.
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2007, 06:03:20 AM »
In my last two relationships, both guys refused to wear condoms.  They have both consistently tested negative.  And I don't feel one iota guiltly about going rubber-less.  It's their choice to not protect themselves.  I can only offer.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Condom and Lube Info http://www.aidsmap.com/Condoms/page/1044833/
Please check out our lessons on PEP and PrEP. http://www.poz.com/factsheets/fs_2014_09_prep.pdf


Offline Dragonette

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,190
  • Spring symptoms
    • NotPerfectAtAll
Re: Transmission and being undetectable.
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2007, 07:42:04 AM »
Hi Sun

I think what you are getting at, is the question that if you are undetectable and there is a condom break or slip, it is not a sure infection, and in fact very low chance of it, and in this sense you are right. I know a lot of negative people have this idea that if a condom breaks they will almost certainly be infected, which is a fear that prevents them from having sex with poz people or enjoying it.

The very first time I had sex with my BF (which was actually the first time I had sex as a knowing poz with a neg) we had this kind of accident, I was already undetectable, and the doctors told me not to worry, that the chance of infeciton is extremely minimal. After 1 year when we had already forgotten about it he tested negative.

So yeah, use a condom, prevent it from breaking/slipping, and know that the odds are very much in your favor that is there is a problem, you will not transmit HIV to your partner.

All the best,
"If you keep one foot in yesterday, and one in tomorrow, you piss all over today". Betty Tacy


Terms of Membership for these forums

© 2017 Smart + Strong. All Rights Reserved.   terms of use and your privacy
Smart + Strong® is a registered trademark of CDM Publishing, LLC.