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Author Topic: Dutch trends on insurances reveals the estimated life expectancy of hiv patients  (Read 2400 times)

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Offline zeb

  • Member
  • Posts: 172
Today i called with my financial planner.
I was talking about life insurances and mortgages, she told me the following good news:

Nowadays it's becoming more and more possible for positive enhanced folks in the Netherlands to get a life insurance for a period of 30 years. The fee you have to pay is affordble (comparable with that of heart patients): it was similar to 'like you are 15 years older' but it will soon become 'like you are 5 years older'.

More and more HIV is becoming a manageable disease and more and more insurance companies are regarding hiv infected people as a serious market where they can make real profit.

The figures are based on how treatment care works for hiv infected people in the Netherlands.


Offline unknownsir

  • Member
  • Posts: 5
this certainly seems like a very positive step foreward, especially coming from an insurance company.

I just changed a term life insurance policy to extend it longer and was worried about them asking that one question or deciding to do bloodwork.  They did in fact ask if i have recieved an AIDS diagnosis, but did not mention HIV at all.

Offline zeb

  • Member
  • Posts: 172
Hi unknownsir,

Well i don't know where you are from. Over here they ask for aids and hiv as well. And not all the insurers are ready yet. But some of the major players in insurance land are willing to provide an insurance. In case you are hiv positive they contact your doc to ask how you respond to the meds.

In case you are not on meds yet they ask your doc about health status. When you have a past of shooting up heroin for example, you have a problem. But when you're doing well it becomes more and more possible to get insured.

In your case i don't know what they really want to know. I mean having hiv is not like having AIDS. But are they really aware of that?


Offline kellyspoppi

  • Member
  • Posts: 153
hey zeb & unknownsir,
as someone who has sold life insurance(32 yrs) in the states for a major insurance company, this is the first i've read anything about companies offering to those of us infected. i sure hope it makes its' way to this side of the atlantic.
as for unknownsir and his term policy, any person living with hiv/aids who has a guaranteed conversion privledge is allowed to convert that term policy to a permenant policy without evidence of insurability. the only questions that are asked during conversion are:
are you currently totally diabled?
whom do you want to make beneficiary?
if the term policy had a wavier of premium rider, once you are considered totally disabled for 6 months the carrier will begin paying your premiums, and if you convert, they have to pay the new conversion premium as well. please be aware that most term policies only allow conversions to take place up to so many years of the term (ie. up to the first 7 years of a 10 year term). 
most company group term insurance offered by your employer will allow for a conversion upon termination/retirement, however the amount will be for far less than what you had while emplyed. most conversion amounts are for $10,000 to $20,000 and the premiums are based on your attained (current) age. 
many of you who may have purchased term policies in the states since the mid-80's may have noticed on your proposals from the agent a column entitled guaranteed maximum premium. this was a hedge life insurance companies built in to allow a chance to recover for huge losses they may have taken on had aids
continued to be the killer it was back then. now that we are living longer many companies have revised these products so that they could reduce rates, but to be safe, have left the guaranteed maximum hedge in place.
i strongly urge any people living with hiv who had/have private(purchased through an agent) term policies in place prior to being infected/post infection to contact their agents about converting these policies before that option runs out. a permenant policy, although more expensive, will last as long as you live. you can convert most term policies for any amount up to the term policy limit, except decreasing term policies, which reduce coverage over the period of the term. the sooner you convert those policies the more coverage you will be offered to convert to. many of these type were purchased to cover mortgages or other loans. however, mortgage/loan company term policies purchased through the bank/lending institution usually don't allow for conversion.
many young people may not be aware that they or their parents purchased a whole life policy on them when they were young with a rider attached called the guaranteed insurability rider/guranteed purchase rider before they were infected.
this rider allows you to purchase additional whole life policies at ages 25,28,31,34,37,40,  whether you are insurable or not, for usually up to the face amount of the initial policy. now that you are infected, it is imperative that you check to see if that was done on your behalf, or if you purchased the insurance and don't recall that rider being purchased as well. most agents would sell this option to protect your insurability for future needs. basically, what this means is at those ages you can obtain the policy without being asked any medical questions, or submitting to any blood tests or other medical tests.
if you have any other questions, please feel free to ask.

Offline bocker3

  • Member
  • Posts: 4,101
  • You gotta enjoy life......
Hey kellyspoppi,

Thank you very much for this information -- I've been struggling with whether doing a conversion makes sense.  I bought my term policy when my partner and I bought our house (not through the bank, but through an actual insurance company - it's not tied to the mortgage).  The reason was that my partner could not afford the house without my income.
I guess, I'm going to look more seriously at this conversion.  It's just that I have a pretty good term policy right now -- 150K for 23 a month.  Of course, getting that policy in 2001 was the last negative test I had.

Atripla - Started 12/05
Reyataz/Norvir - Added 6/06
Labs - Pre-Meds
Sep05 T=350/25% VL98,559
Nov05 288/18%  47,564
Current Labs
May2015 969/28% <20

Offline kellyspoppi

  • Member
  • Posts: 153
glad i could help mike.
have your agent show you proposals on universal life and participating (pays dividends) whole life. sometimes you can purchase more universal life than whole life for the same amount of money and still have a permenant policy. there are also investment life products which combine mutual fund investments with the cost of life insurance. UL &WL have guaranteed rates of 3 to 4% where investment life doesn't. if you believe in the power of the stock market an investment life product has the potential to earn greater returns in a shorter time than WL & UL. the problem is that just like in year 2000 when the market went south, you can also see your earnings vanish quite rapidly. if you are in it for the long haul (20 to 30 years), investment life makes a valid choice. if your health is very scary these days WL is most secure choice. depending upon your age you could convert $25,000 to $35,000 for the same price as the $150k. on whole life, use your dividends to purchase paid up additional insurance, which will buy you more coverage over the lifetime of the policy at no cost to you. if you want to have more converted you will need to pay a higher premium for the permenant coverage. the key now is to know how long your term coverage will last and when is the last year you can convert. also, remember that many companies will allow you to convert a portion and keep the rest term. this will allow you a chance to keep the coverage at $150k and the premiums reasonable. read your policies conversion privledge before making that call. every companies terms are different. ie. a 20 year term policy may only allow 10 years to convert. 
it can be difficult to read, but the policy will spell it out for you. again, conversion means no medical turndowns, and you are now extending the life of your policy for the amount you convert to. if you choose to convert a portion, find out from the agent if you are keeping the balance in term, how long you have left to convert the balance, just in case you come into a increase in pay that allows you to convert more.
any other questions, let me know.


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