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Author Topic: Can somebody tell me!  (Read 5550 times)

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Offline rodeo99

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Can somebody tell me!
« on: March 16, 2007, 07:11:33 PM »
I'm not sure if this topic has been covered to death or not, but I think it is still a bit of a mystery.  If someone can help me out I would appreciate it.

A friend of mine is really worried, he hasn't found this site yet and I wanna try to ease his fears.  He's worried about an activity he feels has put him at risk.  Two weeks ago, he gave another guy a blow job to the point where the guy ejaculated.  He says the guy came all over his own chest not in my friend's mouth.  However, my friend did continue a little bit after the guy ejaculated and was sure he tasted a little bit of cum.  I told him this is a lower risk activity but still not without risk.  My personal opinion is that it is possible to get infected through oral sex and maybe it depends on a lot of other variables too.

This site has a lot of good information presented by a lot of well-informed people. I am hoping I can get some thoughts about what to tell him.  My friend just developed a chest cold two days ago.  I'm a little scared for him.  How long does it take for symptoms to present themselves?

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Can somebody tell me!
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2007, 09:02:25 PM »
Giving head has a very, very minute risk if any at all of contracting HIV. His symptoms came on to quick to be related to HIV. Symptoms or lack of is no way of diagnosing HIV. HIV has no specific symptoms.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2007, 09:11:50 PM by RapidRod »

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Can somebody tell me!
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2007, 10:27:54 PM »
There have been some very few anecdotal reports of transmission of HIV through giving a blowjob. A blowjob in which ejaculation takes place orally and/or in which there is bad oral health care (bleeding gums) in the mouth of the giver may make the person giving the blowjob more susceptible to transmission.

But there is much more evidence through longterm studies of sero-discordant couples who used condoms for anal and/or vaginal intercourse consistently and no protection for giving oral to support no risk for giving oral. Not one of the sero-negative partners became infected.

So this is something about which each person has to decide what level of risk is acceptable for them.

I don't see this as a situation which requires testing although anyone who's sexually active would be wise to regularly have a full STD panel done. At least annually.

If your friend's symptoms persist he should discuss them with his doctor.

Andy Velez

Offline rodeo99

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Re: Can somebody tell me!
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2007, 09:39:18 AM »
Thanks for your input guys. I will definitely be keeping a careful watch on my friend however.  I'm still not convinced.  I sometimes have to question how much we really know about oral and the possibility of transmission.  I'm not sure if the study Andy quotes is enough to say for sure.  How many sero-discordinant (sp) couples would actually risk ejaculating in their spouse's mouth? Also, I've been thinking when HIV is diagnosed in men who have had sex with other men, chances are they did more than just oral and so the actually cause may be chalked up to intercourse and not specifically to the oral sex they had.  And finally in bi-sexual men, especially married ones, how likely are they to admit performing oral on another guy and swallowing a load as the cause of their infection.  They are more likely to say they got it from a woman whom they didn't know right?  So my point is, I'm sure its very difficult to rule out oral sex as a means of transmission or even speculate as to the actual risk level as we wouldn't have concrete data on it.

I'm sure if this site conducted an informal poll as to how many people thought they got infected through oral sex with ejaculation, the results may surprise us.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Can somebody tell me!
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2007, 11:25:47 AM »
Rodeo, you're of course free to have as many speculative opinions as you like about what might be so about transmission.

And it's all speculation as contrasted for instance with lengthy and well documented studies of both gay and straight sero-discordant couples.

Andy Velez

Offline jkinatl2

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  • Doo. Dah. Dipp-ity.
Re: Can somebody tell me!
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2007, 04:00:24 PM »
The quajtification we use at AIDSMEDS is based on three distinct and separate studies conducted over the course of two decades with serodiscordasnt couples. We do not rely on anecdotal evidence insofar as HIV transmission is concerned, especially not now, where the current state of the scientific and epidemiological art is as advanced as it is. With more people living longer and healthier lives, a large enough collection of serodiscordant couples has finally emerged to create blind studies where HIV transmission routes can be studied with scientific quantification.

Here are some of the  scientific findings.

No incident HIV infections among MSM who practice exclusively oral sex.
Int Conf AIDS 2004 Jul 11-16; 15:(abstract no. WePpC2072)??Balls JE, Evans JL, Dilley J, Osmond D, Shiboski S, Shiboski C, Klausner J, McFarland W, Greenspan D, Page-Shafer K?University of California, San Francisco, San Francisco, United States

Oral transmission of HIV, reality or fiction? An update
J Campo1, MA Perea1, J del Romero2, J Cano1, V Hernando2, A Bascones1
Oral Diseases (2006) 12, 219–228

AIDS:  Volume 16(17)  22 November 2002  pp 2350-2352
Risk of HIV infection attributable to oral sex among men who have sex with men and in the population of men who have sex with men

Page-Shafer, Kimberlya,b; Shiboski, Caroline Hb; Osmond, Dennis Hc; Dilley, Jamesd; McFarland, Willie; Shiboski, Steve Cc; Klausner, Jeffrey De; Balls, Joycea; Greenspan, Deborahb; Greenspan

Page-Shafer K, Veugelers PJ, Moss AR, Strathdee S, Kaldor JM, van Griensven GJ. Sexual risk behavior and risk factors for HIV-1 seroconversion in homosexual men participating in the Tricontinental Seroconverter Study, 1982-1994 [published erratum appears in Am J Epidemiol 1997 15 Dec; 146(12):1076]. Am J Epidemiol 1997, 146:531-542.

Studies which show the fallacy of relying on anecdotal evidence as opposed to carefully controlled study insofar as HIV transmission risk is concerned:

Jenicek M. "Clinical Case Reporting" in Evidence-Based Medicine. Oxford: Butterworth–Heinemann; 1999:117

Saltzman SP, Stoddard AM, McCusker J, Moon MW, Mayer KH. Reliability of self-reported sexual behavior risk factors for HIV infection in homosexual men. Public Health Rep. 1987 102(6):692–697.Nov–Dec;

Catania JA, Gibson DR, Chitwood DD, Coates TJ. Methodological problems in AIDS behavioral research: influences on measurement error and participation bias in studies of sexual behavior. Psychol Bull. 1990 Nov;108(3):339–362.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

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