Author Topic: HIV and Traveling Abroad -- what can I do? (Read 12202 times)

moonlight5 · « **on:** October 28, 2015, 09:22:59 am »

(Sorry for the long post! It's hard to get my thoughts in order.)

I'm 22 years old, gay.
1.5 years ago I had a drug & sex lifestyle in Paris. When I left and got clean, my doctor did a test and didn't find any STD. Although while in Paris I got gonorrhea and took the meds for it, and at one point also had to take PEP.
I just ordered an OraQuick test and it showed positive.

I guess it can be wrong? but given what I did 1.5 years ago, I am not surprised.

My dilemma is, I have always dreamt about & have worked so hard for many years to move to Taiwan, Singapore or China. It's my life goal. In 2 years I am/was planning to move there. In fact, I already travel there for 30 days every 3 months, because some of my in-law family lives there (not directly related to me though, I'm not married).
However, it seems those countries have a ban on HIV+ entering the country, or at least won't grant any Visa, even for tourists.

I am wondering, what will happen if I take a conclusive HIV test?
I think the government will be notified, and they must tell it to a country when I want to go there, right?
So if I take a conclusive HIV test, I will never be able to even travel to my favorite countries as a tourist?

Now I have a very healthy lifestyle. I quit smoking, I haven't had alcohol in 1.5 years, I workout, I eat super foods...
I am wondering if I shouldn't take a conclusive HIV test.
I expect everyone here to strongly disagree with that, but please try to understand my POV. If I will never be able to go abroad, it is just as much a death sentence as the disease itself for me, if not more, because there is no "mediciation" for living in a place that makes me so unhappy.

Then I realized: if I want to actually work in those countries, they will get me to do a medical exam, and of course they will discover HIV, right? Unless maybe the viral load is undetectable but that sounds really risky and scary. And if they see it THEN, I will be black listed/deported.

So my only future is to only visit there as a tourist, right?
Unless they happen to lift a ban on HIV+ working visa in the next 10 years.
But if I get an HIV test, and I start taking medication, I won't be able to go as a tourist until they lift the ban?

What can I do in this situation?
I'm just really confused atm and on one hand I want to take a real test to know for sure, but on the other hand I am scared what the government will do if I do that. I'm pretty sure they don't tell you the results over the phone, so I will have to go there and give my info before I learn what's up.

PS: I am not in a place in my life where I can start taking medication at all. I am still very fragile & recovering from my drug & alcohol abuse period, my mother is very sick, I live with my parents, I don't have an income and I'm finishing my BA. So even if I prove to be positive, I won't start taking meds until maybe 2 years later when I live more independently and I can handle it.
And also right now I still feel a small chance I am negative. That would be destroyed if a conclusive test says I'm positive.
I am not sexually active atm so I have no chance at transmitting.

I found some info here: http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=34326.0

Jeff G · « **Reply #1 on:** October 28, 2015, 09:36:06 am »

Welcome to the forums . I moved your thread into the proper forum . Until you have been conclusively diagnosed as HIV positive only post in this one thread. False positive do happen so be sure to get your test confirmed before you worry too much about the future ... easier said than done I know.

Hopefully someone with experience will chime in on your travel issue .

moonlight5 · « **Reply #2 on:** October 28, 2015, 09:37:06 am »

Quote from: Jeff G on October 28, 2015, 09:36:06 am

Welcome to the forums . I moved your thread into the proper forum . Until you have been conclusively diagnosed as HIV positive only post in this one thread. False positive do happen so be sure to get your test confirmed before you worry too much about the future ... easier said than done I know.

Hopefully someone with experience will chime in on your travel issue .

Thanks. I hope someone can tell me what happens if I get a conclusive test. Who/what is notified, if I won't be able to travel anymore, etc.

To recap my messy rant,
I am very worried that if I get a conclusive test I will no longer be able to travel abroad.

In that case, I would rather not get tested for another year or two so I can still visit my family & friends in those countries. I really don't know.
Even if I do get tested, I just can't start medication now...

Jeff G · « **Reply #3 on:** October 28, 2015, 09:41:21 am »

Quote from: moonlight5 on October 28, 2015, 09:37:06 am

Thanks. I hope someone can tell me what happens if I get a conclusive test. Who/what is notified, if I won't be able to travel anymore, etc.

To recap my messy rant,
I am very worried that if I get a conclusive test I will no longer be able to travel abroad.

In that case, I would rather not get tested for another year or two so I can still visit my family & friends in those countries. I really don't know.
Even if I do get tested, I just can't start medication now...

Test at 3 months past any possible exposure ( unprotected anal or vaginal sex ) with another home test kit ... if it comes back positive you need to go get it confirmed right then.

moonlight5 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 28, 2015, 09:45:25 am »

Quote from: Jeff G on October 28, 2015, 09:41:21 am

Test at 3 months past any possible exposure ( unprotected anal or vaginal sex ) with another home test kit ... if it comes back positive you need to go get it confirmed right then.

I haven't had possible exposure since November 2014. :/

moonlight5 · « **Reply #5 on:** October 28, 2015, 10:22:27 am »

Sorry for the double post.
Am I not able to edit?

I want to edit my first post to have a one paragraph summary instead of that mess, but I find I'm not able to modify.

Jeff G · « **Reply #6 on:** October 28, 2015, 11:00:10 am »

We do not allow editing after a few moments so it’s OK as it is . If we able to edit at will it will lead to all kinds of problems so we limit the time one can edit a post.

moonlight5 · « **Reply #7 on:** October 28, 2015, 01:01:05 pm »

Quote from: Jeff G on October 28, 2015, 11:00:10 am

We do not allow editing after a few moments so it’s OK as it is . If we able to edit at will it will lead to all kinds of problems so we limit the time one can edit a post.

Sure, no problem.

I'm going to get an anonymous test done tomorrow, but if there's a positive result I have to "come in".
Fingers crossed I can get the actual result anonymously, too.

At any rate if I AM positive and have to get medication, does the government have to inform any foreign countries that I want to get a visa for that I am HIV+?
If the government actually tells them, I'm pretty sure your visa will be denied and you'll get blacklisted. To what extend does this happen? Or is HIV status and medication entirely confidential?
If the government doesn't inform them, then there is no opportunity for them to find out if you're simply traveling as tourist.

Unless you bring medication in original packaging, but I've been there many times while I was on Valium or other stuff, and I never get checked.

terrymoore · « **Reply #8 on:** October 28, 2015, 02:06:35 pm »

Hi,
I live in Thailand and travel quite often within the region to the countries you've mentioned. I didn't notice which passport you hold, but as far as i know, most europeans and north americans do not need a visa for SG. SG until recently officially did not grant work visa's to POZ people nor allowed tourists in. I know this law has changed for tourist but not sure for work visas.
PRC for sure requires visa, however, as a tourist, i was never asked to give any blood.
I am not sure what happens in Taiwan.
In any case, i do not believe your HIV status is shared between countries when applying for visas. If you are in Europe or North America, i believe passing this info would be illegal (i do not know this for a fact, but i am pretty sure).
In any case, i know people who just refrain from mentioning there condition whenever asked and no one notices. I travel quite often to China and SG and i have never disclosed my status nor have i ever been asked nor denied access.

moonlight5 · « **Reply #9 on:** October 28, 2015, 03:41:38 pm »

Quote from: terrymoore on October 28, 2015, 02:06:35 pm

Hi,
I live in Thailand and travel quite often within the region to the countries you've mentioned. I didn't notice which passport you hold, but as far as i know, most europeans and north americans do not need a visa for SG. SG until recently officially did not grant work visa's to POZ people nor allowed tourists in. I know this law has changed for tourist but not sure for work visas.
PRC for sure requires visa, however, as a tourist, i was never asked to give any blood.
I am not sure what happens in Taiwan.
In any case, i do not believe your HIV status is shared between countries when applying for visas. If you are in Europe or North America, i believe passing this info would be illegal (i do not know this for a fact, but i am pretty sure).
In any case, i know people who just refrain from mentioning there condition whenever asked and no one notices. I travel quite often to China and SG and i have never disclosed my status nor have i ever been asked nor denied access.

Thanks! Very useful reply.
May I ask if you have a Thai nationality or you're living in Thailand with a residency permit?

Also, do you travel with HIV medication? Do you keep it in original packaging or take it out and place it in something else?
I read somewhere that you might get expelled from mainland China or Taiwan if they discover HIV medication in your luggage.

I live in EU, I don't have to apply for a visa when visiting Taiwan. But they blacklist every HIV+, even from being a tourist, so I was worried about my country simply sharing the information with them when I want to go there. I'm glad to hear that's most likely not the case. =)

HK and Japan allow HIV+ to even work there, right?

One possibility I see is working in HK and simply visiting my family in China on a tourist visa, but that's thinking a bit too far ahead.

Jeff G · « **Reply #10 on:** October 28, 2015, 03:57:33 pm »

Quote from: Jeff G on October 28, 2015, 09:36:06 am

Welcome to the forums . I moved your thread into the proper forum . Until you have been conclusively diagnosed as HIV positive only post in this one thread. False positive do happen so be sure to get your test confirmed before you worry too much about the future … easier said than done I know.

Hopefully someone with experience will chime in on your travel issue .

moonlight5 · « **Reply #11 on:** October 28, 2015, 03:59:27 pm »

Quote from: Jeff G on October 28, 2015, 03:57:33 pm

Are you referring to my one post about poppers?

I don't see how that's directly related to being HIV + or not, and I have a good deal of experience with it, so I wanted to warn OP.

But sure, I'll stick to this topic.

Jeff G · « **Reply #12 on:** October 28, 2015, 04:00:43 pm »

That is correct . Please post in this one thread until you have been confirmed as HIV positive . Its not personal, just a rule of the forum.

moonlight5 · « **Reply #13 on:** October 28, 2015, 04:01:21 pm »

Quote from: Jeff G on October 28, 2015, 04:00:43 pm

That is correct . Please post in this one thread until you have been confirmed as HIV positive . Its not personal, just a rule of the forum.

Will do.

terrymoore · « **Reply #14 on:** October 28, 2015, 11:52:07 pm »

Quote

May I ask if you have a Thai nationality or you're living in Thailand with a residency permit?

Answer: I am a not Thai (from a Western country) and do not have permanent residency (very difficult to get in Thailand).

Quote

Also, do you travel with HIV medication? Do you keep it in original packaging or take it out and place it in something else?
I read somewhere that you might get expelled from mainland China or Taiwan if they discover HIV medication in your luggage.

Answer: Yes i travel with the medication ALL THE TIME - i must, since i must take it every day (twice a day in fact!). No exceptions - even JAIL (God forbid!). I do not keep it in original packing for short trips simply because i do not need that many pills with me. Normally i keep it in a small pill bottle for the amount of days i need + a few days extra in case business requires my trip to be extended. I also carry another "stash" of pills in a different bag (my computer case) with 2 days just in case of emergency. I keep those in a small Advil bottle with a few Advils and other allergy pills i normally have with me. For longer trips, i will use the original bottle. However, i remove the stickers/markings on ALL MY HIV MEDS before they come into my home since i keep my condition concealed from my kids (and anyone else that might snoop around). So my bottles are not marked. If i get asked, i will say that some are vitamins and some are for my "cancer" and hope for the best. In any case, i carry a prescription with me at all times as proof, just in case i am scrutinized more, and suspected of being a drug dealer or something. That will of course expose me. However, even if that happens, it does not mean that i will be banned. I have faith in people, and believe that the officer can "overlook" this piece of info if i make my case to him (i.e. i'm a businessman coming for work and will be in and out and not coming as a sex worker etc etc). I still have faith in mankind my friend (as a last resort of course!). If i ever DO get denied access, then i will have to deal with this - it will be a great burden for work for sure.

Quote

I live in EU, I don't have to apply for a visa when visiting Taiwan. But they blacklist every HIV+, even from being a tourist, so I was worried about my country simply sharing the information with them when I want to go there. I'm glad to hear that's most likely not the case. =)

Answer: If no Visa is required, then there is no reason for you to volunteer that info. Even if they ask on a form i would simply lie and say i misunderstood the question if caught. That is your choice of course and it is not my recommendation - just telling you what I would do. Again, countries do not share this sort of info especially pertaining to VISA's as far as i know - but i am sure you can check with your Ministry of Interior or Foreign Affairs or perhaps Ministry of Health.

Quote

HK and Japan allow HIV+ to even work there, right?

Answer: I am not sure, however i believe you are right. Here are a few references. I am sure you can find more http://www.unaids.org/en/resources/infographics/20150227_evolution_travel_restrictions or http://www.hivtravel.org/

Quote

One possibility I see is working in HK and simply visiting my family in China on a tourist visa, but that's thinking a bit too far ahead.

Answer: Getting a tourist Visa to China is pretty simple. Also a multiple entry one. If your family is in south china then commuting from HK to PRC is really simple (less than an hour depending where they live). Working in HK is great, but the cost of living in HK is VERY EXPENSIVE. I believe you can get very good treatment in HK if needed.

Regardless, seeing how concerned you are, i highly recommend you get tested! You seem to be putting the carriage in front of the horses. First see if you are POZ, and then worry if these restrictions apply. Frankly, IMHO your worries should be on getting treatment if you are in fact POZ (i pray you are not!). If detected early, treatment can get you undetectable and therefore reduce the risk of hurting your immune system (and keep your CD4 at normal levels). As well it will highly reduce the risk of infecting others. AND you will be allowed to post anywhere in this forum!

Not knowing your status and being POZ is what usually leads to new infections and also leads to complications later on when you will decide to start treatment.
Go get tested bro!

Grasshopper · « **Reply #15 on:** October 29, 2015, 12:45:56 am »

Regarding concealing HIV medication in containers other than the Original: the pills are embossed and colour coded. IF any customs officer is suspicious, they only need to consult Mr. Google (happened to me !.....however NO consequences for me because there were NO entry restrictions.)

Here the example of one pill database:

http://www.drugs.com/imprints.php?imprint=701

moonlight5 · « **Reply #16 on:** October 29, 2015, 05:37:39 am »

Thank you, Terry, your post is SUPER helpful! x

Going in later today for a test. Will post back here when I get the results.

Quote from: Grasshopper on October 29, 2015, 12:45:56 am

Regarding concealing HIV medication in containers other than the Original: the pills are embossed and colour coded. IF any customs officer is suspicious, they only need to consult Mr. Google (happened to me !.....however NO consequences for me because there were NO entry restrictions.)

Here the example of one pill database:

http://www.drugs.com/imprints.php?imprint=701

Ahh, shoot. The few Valium and Zolpidem pills I have aren't coded at all. <_<; Oh well, I'll cross that bridge when I get there.

moonlight5 · « **Reply #17 on:** November 06, 2015, 12:09:27 pm »

Well I tested positive for an STD so I'll come in on Wednesday for follow up test & to find out which one

But I guess it's pretty much confirmed I have HIV then, taking the quick test into account :/

Jeff G · « **Reply #18 on:** November 06, 2015, 05:43:17 pm »

Quote from: moonlight5 on November 06, 2015, 12:09:27 pm

Well I tested positive for an STD so I'll come in on Wednesday for follow up test & to find out which one

But I guess it's pretty much confirmed I have HIV then, taking the quick test into account :/

No its not pretty much confirmed until you have a confirmation test … so until you do thanks for only posting here .

moonlight5 · « **Reply #19 on:** November 06, 2015, 05:50:58 pm »

Quote from: Jeff G on November 06, 2015, 05:43:17 pm

No its not pretty much confirmed until you have a confirmation test … so until you do thanks for only posting here .

I did say "pretty much" confirmed, just not confirmed. I mean, what would the odds be that both OraQuick and the lab test me as HIV+ when I am HIV- in a first world country? :-P
And yeah sure, I will. You guys get a lot of false positives here?

terrymoore · « **Reply #20 on:** November 06, 2015, 08:46:14 pm »

you wrote you tested positive for an std - so not hiv? or...?
im confused.

moonlight5 · « **Reply #21 on:** November 07, 2015, 05:43:52 am »

Quote from: terrymoore on November 06, 2015, 08:46:14 pm

you wrote you tested positive for an std - so not hiv? or...?
im confused.

It's HIV and "maybe an STD", sorry for confusion, I'll just come back here to post proper details on Wednesday

terrymoore · « **Reply #22 on:** November 07, 2015, 06:43:16 am »

we are Xing our fingers for you. I hope you do NOT have HIV and i also hope that you do NOT have an std. Whatever the result, start treatment ASAP and you will be fine.

moonlight5 · « **Reply #23 on:** November 08, 2015, 04:05:55 pm »

Quote from: terrymoore on November 07, 2015, 06:43:16 am

we are Xing our fingers for you. I hope you do NOT have HIV and i also hope that you do NOT have an std. Whatever the result, start treatment ASAP and you will be fine.

Thanks

moonlight5 · « **Reply #24 on:** November 11, 2015, 11:30:10 am »

Yes, I am positive!

I can ask more q's and get verified info at the actual clinic, but:

1) The pills DO NOT have a label or text or code on the pills themselves, unlike what was posted here. Doctor can give a note that says you need it for "personal reasons".
2) Government does NOT share information about HIV status. That was like 30 years ago.

So travel should be fine!! No more work in Taiwan or China, but the pay there is low anyway so I am OK with switching my dream to working in Japan or HK... Hell I speak some JP anyway.

I feel a really strange sense of relief. I was singing all the way home lol.

(Watch me have a major meltdown at night or tomorrow lol)

moonlight5 · « **Reply #25 on:** November 11, 2015, 01:49:45 pm »

Quote from: Jeff G on November 06, 2015, 05:43:17 pm

No its not pretty much confirmed until you have a confirmation test … so until you do thanks for only posting here .

Told you it was pretty much confirmed. ;-)

terrymoore · « **Reply #26 on:** November 11, 2015, 07:57:16 pm »

japan is an amazing place!

moonlight5 · « **Reply #27 on:** November 12, 2015, 10:28:42 am »

Quote from: terrymoore on November 11, 2015, 07:57:16 pm

japan is an amazing place!

Yeah for sure.

zach · « **Reply #28 on:** November 12, 2015, 10:35:38 am »

creativity points for bypassing the boards terms of service, skipped right past the "am i"

i worked in aviation for years, best advice i can give someone traveling with meds

they stay in your carry on, within arms reach of you at all times... never in checked luggage

sure it's best to have them in original bottles with your name on it, but not required for domestic US travel, possible a much better idea for international travel

very few countries care, or have any laws restricting travel of PLWHIV... and there have been anecdotal reports even on this board of people freely entering some of those

hivtravel.org

Jeff G · « **Reply #29 on:** November 12, 2015, 10:45:31 am »

Moonlight ... you have had plenty of time to have an HIV test confirmed ... did I miss a post where you get conformation ? and if so what are your labs at this point ?

moonlight5 · « **Reply #30 on:** November 13, 2015, 07:51:05 am »

Will know CD4 etc. 10 December.

26 Nov have a meeting with a specialist to ask questions that I also posted here etc.

It's a pity my mom wasn't home when I got home from the test results or I woulda told her right away, because I was feeling quite good. Now it's gonna linger and turn into this uncomfortable thing that I HAVE to blurt out eventually or she's gonna see it on the health insurance anyway. Meh. Hope I'll feel good 26 Nov and I can just tell her then.

Quote from: zach on November 12, 2015, 10:35:38 am

creativity points for bypassing the boards terms of service, skipped right past the "am i"

i worked in aviation for years, best advice i can give someone traveling with meds

they stay in your carry on, within arms reach of you at all times... never in checked luggage

sure it's best to have them in original bottles with your name on it, but not required for domestic US travel, possible a much better idea for international travel

very few countries care, or have any laws restricting travel of PLWHIV... and there have been anecdotal reports even on this board of people freely entering some of those

hivtravel.org

In case your luggage goes missing or another reason?

moonlight5 · « **Reply #31 on:** November 13, 2015, 07:55:51 am »

Quote from: terrymoore on November 11, 2015, 07:57:16 pm

japan is an amazing place!

Terrymoore, do you carry your meds in carry-on luggage or checked in?

Checked in seems safer to me.
I had one too many Melatonin pills on me once when entering Taiwan and they opened my luggage right there in public and had me remove everything. Didn't ask questions, but embarrassing AND dangerous if it's HIV meds.

zach · « **Reply #32 on:** November 13, 2015, 08:24:53 am »

carry your unprescribed meds for your undiagnosed hiv where ever you think you'll feel comfortable on your unbooked hypothetical flight to somewhere

moonlight5 · « **Reply #33 on:** November 13, 2015, 04:24:48 pm »

Quote from: zach on November 13, 2015, 08:24:53 am

carry your unprescribed meds for your undiagnosed hiv where ever you think you'll feel comfortable on your unbooked hypothetical flight to somewhere

Go vent somewhere else please, I don't appreciate sarcastic murmur.

I have to admit, I feel this community is pretty unwelcoming, aside from terrymoore who has been very helpful to me. I thought this was a community to support each other.

I'm just gonna wait for terry's reply.

terrymoore · « **Reply #34 on:** November 13, 2015, 11:17:43 pm »

Hi Moonlight,

Quote

Terrymoore, do you carry your meds in carry-on luggage or checked in?

I do both! Normally i travel only with a carry-on so pills always on me in those cases.
I usually have 2 "stashes" besides the main bottle (unmarked) with me. Each stash has 2 days (in my case it is 9 pills/day). 1 stash in my computer bag in a small Advil where i also have real Advils and afew allergy pills. My second stash is in my toiletry bag. I keep them there in case my trip gets extended or for whatever reason i need extras.
FOr longer trips whenever i have luggage checked in, it will depend on whether there is a connecting flight or not. In cases of connecting flight - i divide the pills so that i have 4 days worth on me (besides my stash) and the rest checked in. If it is only one destination i check it in and do not worry (again, i always have my stash).
I figure if luggage gets lost, it takes 2-4 days to get it. If i cant cover my stay with my carry-on and my stash, i will shorten my trip. I once did that and rushed home from Europe only to find out that i had enough pills and panicked for no reason! With a less pill regiment, i would probably carry everything with me. If i get pulled over, i will say it is for my "cancer"...

Quote

Go vent somewhere else please, I don't appreciate sarcastic murmur.

I have to admit, I feel this community is pretty unwelcoming, aside from terrymoore who has been very helpful to me. I thought this was a community to support each other.

This community IS very supportive and an amazing place to get practical advice and real quality information. However, this forum has rules and people would ike to make sure that the rules are followed. You can imagine that those of us who have CONFIRMED HIV need quick responses when in a crisis. Those who have been responding to you read through 100's of posts per day and respond to those posts. Imagine the extra load put on them from people who are not yet confirmed? Before you write them off and are quick to judge, i suggest you ask yourself what has brought about the sarcastic humour you feel you are a victim of.

GOOD LUCK!

Jim Allen · « **Reply #35 on:** November 14, 2015, 01:51:51 pm »

Quote from: moonlight5 on November 11, 2015, 11:30:10 am

Yes, I am positive!

Quote from: moonlight5 on November 11, 2015, 11:30:10 am

I can ask more q's and get verified info at the actual clinic, but:

1) The pills DO NOT have a label or text or code on the pills themselves, unlike what was posted here. Doctor can give a note that says you need it for "personal reasons".
2) Government does NOT share information about HIV status. That was like 30 years ago.

What's the question ? I don't see any questions but just statements, with a random vague comment about 30 years ago.

Quote from: moonlight5 on November 11, 2015, 11:30:10 am

2) Government does NOT share information about HIV status. That was like 30 years ago.

Did the Doc tell you that? And your in the EU right ? In that case you Doc is trying to be nice but full of it, of course he/she and the lab have shared the information they have it's mandatory for them to do it.

Your information of the diagnosis is shared and will be reported and to the ECDC. The Surveillance data is collected at the European level by each member state. Each case of HIV must (Mandatory) be reported and there is a min required level of reporting data that must be submitted on each case. So to clarify the data is collected on each new HIV diagnosis from all 28 European Union (EU) Member States and two of the three remaining European Economic Area (EEA) countries (Iceland and Norway). Some member state in addition to the required information may also collect it's own additional data. Anyhow it's mandatory and kinda started with Decision No 2119/98/EC of the European Parliament. This in the years following such as 2008 - 2015 saw more standardized reports and mandatory data collection setup. The public edited side of the reports can be found on this site if interested : http://ecdc.europa.eu/

The ECDC may also grant data access to third parties but only upon request.
So the ECDC makes them say "Please first" so i'm sure it's fine.

Anyhow look if and when you travel I wish you the best of luck,take it easy.

Jim

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Author Topic: HIV and Traveling Abroad -- what can I do? (Read 12202 times)