POZ Community Forums
HIV Prevention and Testing => Do I Have HIV? => Topic started by: concerned1980 on March 05, 2012, 12:49:10 pm
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I had an encounter with a female that was unprotected vaginal sex on Dec. 4, 2011. Her status is "somewhat unknown". After having other STI symptoms, I notified her and she got tested, coming back negative for HIV antibody. She said it had been three months before me that since she had been with anyone else. I don't know her, so I am not sure whether or not to trust this info. She sent me a copy of her lab results to prove her results were negative, although this still doesn't mean that she could have been with someone shortly before me and just not be telling me. I have tried to put faith in her negative test, but have my doubts about her honesty of being with other men shortly before me.
Since then, I have had a 7 week negative HIV RNA PCR, several negative ELISA antibody tests before the 3 month window, a 10 week negative HIV RNA and DNA PCR, and finally a negative ELISA antibody test right after the 12th week post exposure (86 days to be exact). With these results,
1.Can I rest assured that I am negative?
2.Any way the virus could be "hiding" and not in my blood yet for PCR tests and possibly have not developed antibodies yet?
3.Should I be restested at 6 months, or is that an old guideline?
4. Are there any other reasons for late seroconversion besides IV drug use, Chemotherapy, or other immunosuppesant infections? Even at this point, wouldn't the PCR tests still show some viral load at 7 and 10 weeks?
5. How many actual cases of late seroconversion have been documented to your knowledge, and any recently?
6. Are you aware of anyone who has had a 3 month negative antibody test, that has later shown a positive antibody test?
Thanks for all your help and knowledge into this subject as I am very concerned.
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Your ELISA test is conclusive, you are HIV negative.
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Is there any way you could provide some insight into my other questions? It would be greatly appreciated. Thank you
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There is nothing further to add. You have a conclusive test result.
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are the pcr test resulst reliable as well?
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PCR-RNA test have to be used in conjunction with an antibody test
PCR-DNA tests are not approved tests to diagnose HIV.
Your ELISA antibody test taken 3 months post exposure is conclusive.
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my 10 week RNA PCR was used in conjunction with antibody test-they were both negative. so does that make it a reliable PCR?
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If you are not willing to answer my other questions, is there anyone that will?
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I have been looking for a place to ask these questions and I thought this would be a good place
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How do I know I am not in the 3% of people that are late seroconverters? would my 10 week negative pcr rule this out? what causes late serconversion?
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Because you aren't on chemo, you haven't had an organ transplant and you are not a chronic IV drug abuser.
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This is not a chat room. It is a message board. It might take several hours before your question is addressed by one of the volunteers who come in when they can, from around the world.
In addition, your ELISA test at the three month period is conclusive. You do not have HIV.
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You are worrying needlessly. You have reliably tested negative for HIV. You are HIV negative. Period. End of story.
None of the indications for testing out to 6 months apply to you.
Stop creating unnecessary drama. HIV is not your problem.
But you do need to learn from this experience and stop having unprotected intercourse. You can have intercourse with anyone you want to. But you need to do it the safer way which means always without exception using condoms everytime you have either vaginal or anal intercourse. No exceptions.
Now get on your way because HIV is not your problem. Stop with the what ifs and that 3% nonsense. Really.
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Hello there,
Would you consider a 12 week negative antibody test conclusive or does it have to be 90 days? I am hearing two different guidelines
Would you consider a 10 week negative RNA and DNA PCR with combined negative antibody test conclusive?
Thanks for your help with this
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■Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result, or no-risk situation will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.
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geez, sorry...I was just wondering if there was a difference between 12 weeks and 90 days and if this made any difference? I am trying to become educated and you have seemed very frustrated with my questions from the beginning from your first short reply.
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After you being told by 3 different people that you are conclusively HIV negative there is no need for any further question. YOU DO NOT HAVE HIV. End of story.
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Concerned,
I deleted the other thread you started. You should have read the Welcome thread before posting, like you're supposed to.
I've also removed your PM privilege. Again, if you read the Welcome Thread (http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=220.0) before posting like you're supposed to, you will have read the following posting guideline:
Do NOT use Private Messages to question other members about any transmission, testing or symptom issues. These issues must be discussed in the public forum. Misuse of the PM function in this manner will result in your PM privileges being removed without warning.
There is no difference between a twelve week negative, a thirteen week negative and a 90 day negative. They are all conclusive.
You do not have hiv.
Wise up and start using condoms in future.
Ann
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just out of curiosity and for my own hiv knowledge I have a few questions. I am fully aware that I cam conclusively negative with my 86 day negative ELISA.
1. Is the reason that RNA PCR is not used for diagnostic purposes have to do more with the high rate of false positives and expense? Aren't these tests extremely precise at detecting HIV virus? Are there other reasons why these tests are not used?
2. I see that some of you are in New York and was wondering about the new six week guideline I have been reading about. Is that something that is used frequently there? and why has this not been implemented across the nation?
3. Have you ever seen someone come back negative within a few weeks of the "three month window" and then show up positive. I have seen many specialists say they have never seen this happen, just wondering if you knew of any documented cases.
4. Have you ever seen an RNA or DNA PCR "miss" the virus with early infections after the "window period" for detecting the virus with this method?
5. Is the CDC the most conservative when it comes to time frames with testing for HIV? From what i have read, they seem to be much more conservative than Australia, or the UK, and many other places. Is there a reason for this or have they just not updated the guidelines?
Thanks again Andy and Ann for all of your helpfulness in answering these questions. Again,I am only asking to further my knowledge of HIV, especially the testing methods and the varied opinions which is the only reason I ask. I would love it if someone could answer these five questions.
I KNOW I AM CONCLUSIVELY NEGATIVE. PERIOD. END OF STORY.
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just out of curiosity and for my own hiv knowledge I have a few questions. I am fully aware that I cam conclusively negative with my 86 day negative ELISA.
1. Is the reason that RNA PCR is not used for diagnostic purposes have to do more with the high rate of false positives and expense? Aren't these tests extremely precise at detecting HIV virus? Are there other reasons why these tests are not used?
2. I see that some of you are in New York and was wondering about the new six week guideline I have been reading about. Is that something that is used frequently there? and why has this not been implemented across the nation?
3. Have you ever seen someone come back negative within a few weeks of the "three month window" and then show up positive. I have seen many specialists say they have never seen this happen, just wondering if you knew of any documented cases.
4. Have you ever seen an RNA or DNA PCR "miss" the virus with early infections after the "window period" for detecting the virus with this method?
5. Is the CDC the most conservative when it comes to time frames with testing for HIV? From what i have read, they seem to be much more conservative than Australia, or the UK, and many other places. Is there a reason for this or have they just not updated the guidelines?
Thanks again Andy and Ann for all of your helpfulness in answering these questions. Again,I am only asking to further my knowledge of HIV, especially the testing methods and the varied opinions which is the only reason I ask. I would love it if someone could answer these five questions.
I KNOW I AM CONCLUSIVELY NEGATIVE. PERIOD. END OF STORY.
1. Due to the scincitivity issues causing false positives. They can be used for diagnostic purposes as long as they are used in conjuction with an antibody test.
2. There is no new guidelines. The guideline is 3 months post exposure to obtain a conclusive negative test.
http://www.cdc.gov/globalaids/Resources/pmtct-care/docs/TM/Module_6TM.pdf
Page 11
#4
In an adult, a positive HIV antibody test result means that the person is infected, a person with a negative or inconclusive result may be in the “window for 4 to 6 weeks but occasionally up to 3 months after HIV exposure. Persons at high risk who initially test negative should be retested 3 months after exposure to confirm results
3. No
4. PCR-RNA tests are not stand alone tests. PCR-DNA tests are not approved for diagnostic use for HIV.
5. The CDC doesn't make the testing guideline, testing guidelines are made by the manufacture of the tests and approved by the FDA.
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Con,
1. It's the DNA PCR tests that are very prone to false positive results. They can happen with RNA as well, but not as often. RNA tests should only be run when there is a clear and present danger of infection. Not only are they more expensive than antibody testing, but they also typically take up to two weeks to return results. Additionally, ANY RNA result must be confirmed with antibody (and Western Blot if necessary) testing.
2. The window period remains at three months to catch the rare person who take a little longer than six weeks to seroconvert and test positive.
3. No, and I'm not aware of any documented cases with the newer tests. If they're out there, they're rare.
4. Some people are what's known as "elite controllers". They can control the virus on their own without meds and therefore have no viral load (PCR testing is viral load testing). This is another reason why ANY PCR result must be confirmed with antibody testing.
5. Yes, they're more conservative. I blame the conservative/religious politicians in the States - you can blame who you want.
6. It's high time you got on with your life, remembering to always use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, so you can continue to avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple!!!
Ann
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thank you both for your responses as this can be a very confusing subject and some clarity is always nice for my knowledge. some questions about "elite controllers".
1. If you are an "elite controller", is your viral load undetectable usually from day one, or does it take the antibodies built up to control this? Could you test negative for antibodies and have no detectable viral load? , or would you at some point have a detectable viral load and then it gets under control from your antibodies? will you test positive for antibodies if you are considered an "elite controller"?
Again, I AM MOVING ON WITH MY LIFE, this information is good to know for EVERYBODY, positive or negative. and I thank you for all of your responses.
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Con,
I'm not aware of any studies following elite controllers from "day one". However, I would imagine that even elite controllers would have a detectable viral load at some point in primary infection.
However, because not many people are diagnosed so early and elite controllers are quite rare, it's difficult to pin-point exactly when their body gets the hiv under control to the point where it is not detectable in the blood. It will vary from person to person anyway.
Yes, elite controllers will test hiv antibody positive and will also have a positive Western Blot result. (Positive antibody results must be confirmed with Western Blot testing.) They will test positive within the same time frame as anyone else - usually by four to six weeks after infection has taken place.
The fact remains that any PCR test result must be confirmed with antibody testing. There are no short cuts to hiv diagnosis, nor are there any short cuts to ruling hiv infection out.
Hmmm.... I see I never gave you my "talk" on how to avoid hiv negative, so just in case you haven't read it in another thread, here it is:
You need to be using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, every time, no exceptions until such time as you are in a securely monogamous relationship where you have both tested for ALL sexually transmitted infections together.
To agree to have unprotected intercourse is to consent to the possibility of being infected with an STI. Sex without a condom lasts only a matter of minutes, but hiv is forever.
Have a look through the condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use condoms with confidence.
ALTHOUGH YOU DO NOT NEED FURTHER HIV TESTING OVER THE INCIDENT THAT BROUGHT YOU HERE, anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care check-up, including but not limited to hiv testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.
If you aren't already having regular, routine check-ups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine hiv tests to return with negative results.
Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than hiv.
Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple!
No more questions, ok? You know what's important; you are conclusively hiv negative and you have learned how to remain hiv negative as well.
Ann
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I have read where anal fissures can be caused by HIV. Is this usally observed during early or acute infection, or with later infection? Just curious as the info on this is very confusing. I know that I am HIV negative
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I have read where anal fissures can be caused by HIV. Is this usally observed during early or acute infection, or with later infection? Just curious as the info on this is very confusing. I know that I am HIV negative
You left all the other possible causes, such as just by simple bowel movement.
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Yes I did leave out the other causes because this is an HIV site, not a bowel movement site, hence why I only asked about HIV. I am just trying to learn as well as share information with others on this site by asking questions about HIV. So.....is anyone aware if anal fissures are linked more to acute/early infection or later infection? Thanks for any responses to this question.
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Yes I did leave out the other causes because this is an HIV site, not a bowel movement site, hence why I only asked about HIV. I am just trying to learn as well as share information with others on this site by asking questions about HIV. So.....is anyone aware if anal fissures are linked more to acute/early infection or later infection? Thanks for any responses to this question.
Anal fissures have zero direct link to HIV infection.
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below is a recent quote from Mayo Clinic:
More common causes of anal fissure include:
Large or hard stools passing through the anal canal
Constipation and straining during bowel movements
Chronic diarrhea
Inflammation of the anorectal area, caused by Crohn's disease or another inflammatory bowel disease (IBD)
Less common causes of anal fissures include:
Anal sex
Cancer
HIV
Tuberculosis
Syphilis
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another quote from CIGNA HEALTH:
During an exam, a doctor can also find out whether another condition may be causing the fissure. If you have several fissures or have one or more in an area of the anus where fissures usually do not occur, you may have another condition such as inflammatory bowel disease, syphilis, a suppressed immune system, tuberculosis, HIV infection, or anal cancer. Most fissures occur along the midline—the top or bottom—of the anus.
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You misunderstand the purpose of the Am I Infected? forum.
This forum is designed for people with personal concerns about HIV transmission and testing to post questions and receive informed responses.
We have addressed your concerns. We will not engage in idle or speculative discussions about anal fissures or anything else.
It is time you moved on.
MtD
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Con,
How many times do you have to be told that you do not have hiv? How many times do you have to be told "no more questions"? How many times do you have to be told to move on with your life?
We're not here to answer every single health related question you have that has some slight, spurious link to hiv.
I'm giving you that time out you've been warned about. Do not attempt to create a new account to get around your time out because if you do, you will be permanently banned.
Ann