Oral on female

[fandango]

I am a returning member although my old username and password no longer work (i think I remember them correctly) i started a new account with the same username i thought I used to have (fandango)

this crazy story relates to having rectal mucus (that could resemble cum) after douching anf having receptive anal sex. is that common?

I recently had protected receptive anal sex for the frst time. The person I was with used a condom but when they pulled out they got tissue paper and covered the condom to take it off (I figured they were being being clean)

about 2 hours later, I went to the bathroom and squeeed out a mucus type of substance. wiped it with tissue and examined it. to me it looked a lot like semen, had the same consistency (kind of sticky viscose)

I imeadiately went to the emergency room to see if it was semen if so to maybe start a dose of retroviral just to be safe.

the sample on the tissue had completely dried up, but the nurse put a swab up my but and put the swab along with the tissue in solution and sent it to the lag to be analysed. the results came back negative to semen (they could not find any semen) but the nurse said hat honestly did not know if they would have been able to find anything from the dried sample.

the next day I got back in touch with the person that penetrated me. they thought it was all quite funny because they claim to have never even cum. the person asked me if I had douched before the sex, yes I had, then they said that it is very common that if you douch and the have anal sex, afterwards you will secreate some mucus which is nothing more than the natural mucus membrane of the colon. seeing as I had never done this before, I took their word for it... everthing made sense. the person also saif that the reason they had covered the condom with tissue was so that I wouldn;t see that they hadn't cum. apparently he was loosing hi erection and just wanted to be done.

It all made perfect sense. I felt so aleviated.

however, today I started doing research on this supposedly common mucus leakage and could not find any information on it. i started to get worried.

so I thought I would write my story and see if more experienced people might be able to shed a little light on the situacion.

thank you

[Andy Velez]

The bottom line in all of this is that the insertive partner used a condom. That means you had protected intercourse.

If the condom had broken or otherwise failed it would have been very apparent.
When a condom breaks it's not a subtle event. It's very clear what has occured.

As far as I can tell from what you're reporting you have no cause for concern about HIV transmission. 

Since it was your first time having an anal receptive experience, perhaps that has raised some anxiety in you about being vulnerable to HIV specifically and vulnerable in general? Just wondering.....

There's no need for testing and whether pitching or catching in the future, just make sure the condoms are handy and one is used everytime.

Cheers,

[fandango]

Thanks Andy,


right on point and helpful as ever. you guys really are amazing, I cannot say enough good things about this site and the people that work everyday to support it.

I am definitely overly paranoid about HIV transmission, the slightest thing (like thinking what came out whas semen despite any direct reason to suspect it) will set me off.

another thing I thought about to make me feel better, is tha i would imagine that the receptive partner can feel when someone cums, even if it is through a condom. wouldn;t you feel the heat? i never felt anything like that. (speculating here, to alude my fears)

anyway, as you say, it was with a condom, and I have no reason to think that the other party ever took it off or that it broke. also, the fact that thw ER didn't find any traces of semen also makes me feel very reassured. (i imagine that even if the sample has dried up on the tissue, they would still be able to tell if it was semen, no?)

out of curiosity, does anyone know what I am talking about regarding the mucus? colon's natural lubricant? residue from douching? a viscose, sticky substance?   the person I spoke to said that theyhave in the past had large secreations when they had multiple receptive encounters in one day.   how come there is no mention of this anywhere on the web?

oh well,

Andy, thank you very much. I can put it all behind me now.

[ACinKC]

It is most likely residue of lube and the cleaning you gave yourself.  It happens sometimes.  Its not spotless up there ya know!! 

[fandango]

I thought i was in the clear, until i broke out with some very strange symptoms on Monday - 4.5 weeks since possible exposure  (same date on month later)

had a few drinks on Sunday (oscars) - about 4-5 scotch - i was buzzed, but not wasted

around 5am monday morning, woke up with chronic diarea (liquid)
then proceeded to throw up violently and continue having chronic diarea.

for the rest of the morning, anything i drank went straight through me. obviously i wasn't feeling very good, but i don;t think i had a significantly spiked fever.
I took 2 imodiums and rested on my couch, by midday i was feeling a little better.

that afternoon, around 5:30pm i crashed. felt exausted, got the chills all over my body and could hardly stay awake. I turned the heat on and put on a sweater stayed up to watch 24. by the end of the show, my face was flushed and hot and i felt pretty out of it. (i remember not wanting to admit that i had a spiked fever because I wanted to beleive it was nothing more than fatigue from chronic diarea)

that night i sweated a lot in bed and woke up the next day feeling fine, except that my head was constantly pounding (as if swelled with blood, as if i was constantly up side down) and i had horrible body aches in my neck, shoulders, elbows, arms, lower back.

the next day the body aches were much better, but my head was still the same, coughing made it feel like it was exploding, bending down made it swell with pressure.

Today, i woke up and feel fine.    despite how much i want to forget about it and make myself beleive that it was nothing, i really really fear the worst. I have taken responsibility for my actions and i am trying to make myself mentaly ready for what may come.

my first instinct was that what came out of my ass was semen, i didn't want to trust my instinct and desperately wanted to beleive anthing that allowed me to put this in the past. the crazy thing is that I had the opportunity to take hiv drugs te night of my exposure but i didn't because i convinced myself that i was over reacting......

today I am going to go and get blood drawn to get DNA test done.my results probablywon'tbe back till next week.

I wish I had known about the DNA testing sooner, (results 3 days after exposure) i wouldhave gotten tested a long time ago.

i am scared
very very scared

[Andy Velez]

Am I missing something here or are you (mis)connecting this recent bout of sickness with your January episodes in which you had protected receptive anal intercourse? And at this late date imagining you have semen in your anus (from protected intercourse) from a month or more previously? Uh, tell me it ain't so.

Did you have some other sexual incident since the previous ones discussed?

I can say that if you are having troubling symptoms you should be discussing them with your doctor.

Please clarify. As of this moment I don't see any basis for concern about HIV.
 

[fandango]

I am connecting these recent symptoms with the protected sex i had at the end of January.   

(is it crazy to think that symptoms can manifest themselves as late as 4.5 weeks later? I hope so...)

i know it was protected sex, and I knowthat the partner told me that i had nothing to worry about because they supposedly didnlt cum and claim to have been tested negative in June 2006.

BUT (here comes the fear)

I don't trust the person i had sex with and they have now dissappeared, i called them 3 seperate times after the exposure and they kept saying i was fine but that I had to take responsibility for what I had done and stop bothering them. on the last call tey threatened me never to call again and then they dissapeard...

The night of the exposure, I was personaly convinced semen had come out of me (it felt very similar)... which if true makes the person a liar - making me paranoid about why they would lie.

i cannot explain my symptoms, diarea, chills, extreem fatigue, night sweats (after 4-5 drinks? of my favorite drink? makes no sense)


am I missing something that completely takes away any concerns I should have? is 4.5 weeks completely too long for symptoms?  is it so inconceivable that something went wrong and semen did come out of my anus?   I really hope so, I wish there was something that I could point to as to why I MUST be 100% wrong. Wow would that make me feel better.

what do you think Andy?

[RapidRod]

You didn't have an exposure, you had protected sex. Your symptoms do not have anything to do with having protected sex.

[thunter34]

With all due respect, I am not that suprised that this person you had sex with has disappeared.  If I was getting called again and again with something like this, I would have pulled a vanishing act also.

[ACinKC]

I agree with Thunt and Rod.  Protected sex is just that... PROTECTED.  You didnt have a risk.  If you want to drop your dime on a test then go for it. 

[fandango]

I must admit, everyone telling me that I must be wrong does make me feel much much better.   on this topic i love nothing more than coming to the realization that I must be a complete idiot...

However, i am still scared, and i will still get tested at some point, if for nothing else than my own sanity. I honestly still beleive I am at risk, all be it a low risk.

to reply to the two posts:

1. yes it was protected, BUT imagine you had potected receptive sex and when you get home you wipe what you are sure is semen from your asshole. even if 1000 people tell you it wasn't, you know that they never saw the substance in question, and you know that in your opinion it looked and felt a hell of a lot like semen. sure, there is no smoking gun explanation (evident broken condom) but there is also no irifutable proof that it was not semen - hence I think you too would be pretty scared

2. yes, i woud also want to break ties with someone who was stalking me about HIV....  BUT, I called the person 3 times over the course of 2 weeks. i do not consider that stalking. and the person got so emotional and was so reactive (to threaten me) that it honestly makes me paranoid that they had something to hide.   If I were in their shoes, I would have been much more clear about the incident and tried to lay the fears to rest, not try to intimidate the person into not calling me anymore after just 3 polite phone calls....  (am i crazy for taking this opinion?)

still no one has given me a definitive reason why i have absolutely no need to be worried. Yes it was potected, BUT, yes i really think semen came out of me....

[ACinKC]

Then go test.  We cant help you any further as you have said.

[thunter34]

Man, this person already was polite and clear and all that to gently try to put your fears to rest.  At the point of multiple calls, you have careened well into the stalker zone- so, yes...I would also be flipped out and probably taking a threatening tone with you about it.  I'm just answering you honestly.  And I would be regretting the hook up BIGTIME.

The phrase "rue the day" comes to mind.

You need to leave this person ALONE.

If I was this other person and was negative....if I kept getting someone calling me over and over like this, I would start thinking "mental health issue...MENTAL HEALTH ISSUE!" in my head at this point.  And I might even start thinking, "I wonder if this is this weird person's way of trying to tell me he might have exposed me to something?"  I'd be thinking all kinds of things because you would have freaked me the heck out by this point. 

[fandango]

lol, perhaps you are right. it feels good to laugh at myself on this... i guess i too would be freeked out. everything has been so internalized for so long that it is wonderful to be able to speak to people about what i have been going through. what an amazing resource this website is.  hiv fear is such an alienating and lonely place to be, there is literally no one for people to reach to in their everyday lives.

I know that HIV is my weakness. i should really just become monk and avoid ever being scared again...  close family members of mine passed from hiv with me at their bedside before Heart was introduced to combat the disease. ever since i have been very aware of the disease and the thought of me getting the same thing i have witness people suffer from puts me in knotts of guilt, anguish and torment. clearly there is a lot of irrationality...I admit that.

having received such a strong (positive) reaction from people on this site, I now want to just put this behind me and try me best to forget about it. getting tested is really scary to me and if I can be convinced that I don't need to do it, i would rather not face up to it (i know i am coward about it)

But i know that this feeling of freedom wil only last a few days and then my fear/ guilt will get the best of me again and i will start to lose it - again.

i know symptoms should never be used to diagnose risk, but don't my symptoms sound similar - bad diarea, chills, body aches, night sweats.

Is 4.5 weeks to lengthy of a period of time for there to be any concerns?  


lastly, I live in Los Angeles - west side.  does anyone know of any same day 'finger prick' or 'Ora-Quick' clinics?   (should I make this question a new post)


thank you everyone for your honesty. it really means the world to me to have a place where i can communicate about this.

[RapidRod]

Your symptoms sound like a million and a half other issues unrelated to HIV, inwhich you never had an exposure.

[411]

fandango
The gastro tract has a huge mucosal surface that needs to be constantly moist to properly perform its function. When its irritated it can respond by increasing the moisture in the form of secretions similar to what you are commenting on.

I honestly wouldn't get unnecessarily worked up about this as it can explain what happened in your case. Protected sex means that you weren't exposed to HIV even if your partner was HIV positive. While the secretions may not occur regularly they can occur for a variety of reasons such as diarrhoea, illness or even something you ate.

Mucosa secretions usually are of a thick consistency, can be relatively clear or tinted slightly and when I read your post that was my first immediate thought.

regards

[fandango]

I am going to get tested today. i just can't keep my mind off the topic long enough for me not to go through with this test. the fact that experts on this site have told me i don't even need to get the test at all, definitely makes me feel more confident, but never the less, i am still very scared...

I wante to give a special thank you to 411 for his post. i have done research and the fact that I have not found anything anywhere about a secretion resembling what i thought was semen, has made me very nervous and led me to think the random partner i was with was lying.

I i focus on te fact that it was protected and that the person told me aftewards that they had been tested 9 months earlier (negative) and that the person told me they didn't even cum. Then obviously feel confident.

However, when I think about what i looked at in the tissue, the fact that I don't know or trust the person in question, the reaction of the person telling me to stop bothering them and take responsibility for my actions, the fact that 4.5 weeks later I broke down in chronic diarea, extreem fatigue, shivers and sweats. then I get extreemly nervous and scared.

i am going to call a company that comes to your house and provides results to an oral test within 20 minutes.  hopefully they will be able to come today.

all morning long i have been going back an forth on the issue, wondering if I should just let it go, try to suppress the fear, believe everyone on this forum and jut have faith that i am negatve so I don;t have to face the test.  I still feel like I want to back out now. I don't know if I am ready/ prepared for the possibility of bad news.

I will call soon.  I really hope today turns out to be a fantastic day and not the worst day of my life.

[fandango]

turns out the tsting company has run out of tests in california...

they won't have anymore until next week.

i don't know whether to put this all behind me and try to forget about it, or wait another anguish ridden week, or take a day off and go get a blood test somewhere. (I really wanted to oral test or at least finger prick test, but cannot find anywhere in los angeles that provides it.)

I guess i will just have to sit things out for a week... 

[411]

Hang in there and collect what I believe will be a negative result. I understand your concern, particularly when its linked to something that is unusual for you but I'm still convinced that what you experienced was a sort term natural response to the stimuli or some other irritant.

[fandango]

Thanks again, 411

I am so so scared.

I woke up today and started doing a little reseach. needless to say after reading the symptons for seroconversion, I completely paniked. I am now almost certain that I am infected and I am absolutely terrified of getting tested, although i know my sanity wil require me to do it ooner rather than later.

i wanted to ask, can the secretion of th mucus be a resullt of douching. I had never douched before, and i cleaned myself out pretty thoroughly. i am hoping that the only explanation is that either what I secreated was left over fluid from the douch or mucus from my colon re-coating itself?

it is still almost too strange that i would have the secretion less than an hour after having the receptive intercourse.... it really would make much much more sense if what was secreted was semen.... even though i do not have a direct explantion for how it would have gotten there - although, i was face down and couldn't see what was going on, how should I know.

the strange thing is, I now rememer that at the very begining of the intercourse i thought i felt something inside and i remember wondering if perhaps I had not cleaned myself with the douche well enough. i now wonder if what I felt was cum. i have no way of knowing.

i have never been so scared in my entire life. i am absolutely terrified.  i kee thinkin about my chronic diarea, my chills, my night sweats, and the dry cought that I had for about a week before, during and after my diarea episode.  i didn't even know that dry cough was a possible symptom until I looked it up today. i check every single box in the symptms list...   i feel like it would be too cruel of a coincidence for this not to be hiv related.

honestly, who am I kidding. lying to myself that it was not semen, lying to myself that my symptoms were randomly caused and unrelated, lying to myself that i was protected so I don't need to get tested.   i can't help but feel that they are all lies to allow me to cope with the situacion. although in reality i know the truth.

i am so so scared. i want to crawl up into the fetal position and close my eyes and wish it would all go away. i wish I could trick my mind into forgeting about the whole thing. i don't know what to do. i don'y know if i am readyto face my results yet. i am fucking paniking.

thanks everyone for all your support,

[Andy Velez]

Fan, you aren't doing research. You're doing an exercise in self-torture. It would be big favor to yourself to stay off of surfing the net for "research" purposes. All it will do is fuel your worst fears and of course without giving you an answer.

I still agree with what others have said to you that you're going to test negative.

Between now and the time you do test you will help yourself best by staying productively busy.

And yes, keep all of your questions and your comments in this same thread. That way readers can best follow the conversation.

And once again, I do expect you're going to test negative.

Cheers, 

[411]

i wanted to ask, can the secretion of th mucus be a resullt of douching. I had never douched before, and i cleaned myself out pretty thoroughly

That's one of the possible reasons, as I said earlier, there is usually an identifiable reason and now that you've offered that up I'm not surprised at all. In attempting to offer support here I'm teetering on the brink of suggesting a diagnosis, which cannot be done via the internet. However, I do see a clear cause, effect relationship which is more than likely a suitable explanation to your concerns.

If anything, I'm more convinced that you are fine.

[fandango]

Thank you, Andy and 411

I woke up this morning in completely the opposite frame of mind as yesterday - convinced that I must be negative and in a moment of (what was hopefully) clarity realizing that my mind has been twisting this into paranoyia and fear. I even wonder if what I am actualy scared about is the idea if being positive, not the likelyhood. the thing that is so scary is that it is all so ambiguous - one day I am sure I am fine due to having been protected, the next day I am terrified because my symptoms would be sufficient evidence of ars if (somehow) i tested positive and i keep going back to 'what the hell came out of my ass?...'

anyway, this new found confidence has allowed me tell myself to stop being so ridiculous, go get tested and finally put all this mess behind me.

I have scheduled an apppointment with my doctor for tomorrow.  it will be a blood test, the results will take a few days, and it will not be annonymous, but i kind of take some reasurance in placing myself in the hands of a doctor.

these next few days are going to be tough, but at least the end of not knowing is in sight.  Amazing how my mind can switch from confidence to paralizing fear - i am now getting really scared again....

oh well, the appointment is made. my results will be forthcoming. I will of course keep you informed.


thank you everyone for the support and knowledge you have imparted.

[fandango]

well,  today is the day I go to get tested

I could hardly sleep last night. I realized that i completely unprepared for the possibility of a bad result. i really want to not get tested and try to suppress the whole experience.

if everyone tells me that I am fine and that i don't even need to test, then surely I can just forget about this and move on.

I am going into the doctor's office convinced that I am getting a negative result just for the sake of moving on. however, if i get a bad result i am going to wish that I hadn't gone in yet. i am not ready for that kind of news, my life is too happy and good for me to suddenly get that kind of news.

I am really really scared again. i hope i have the courage when in the doctors office to ask for the blood test. i honeslty might not

It was just so strange for me to suddenly have that vomiting & diarea spell. out of nowhere. what could cause such a strange outbreak. and then the dry cought that lasted 3-4 days. i cannot help but think that i am infected. that the condom broke and the person lied to me to avoid confrontation of responsibility. i am an Idiot for not taking the retroviral pills when i had the prescription in my hand. i wanted to beleive so badly that i was fine.   oh god, i am so scared.

oh well, everyone has to face the music.

[ACinKC]

Just test and be done with it.  I'll put my whole years paycheck on you being negative.

[Andy Velez]

I STILL expect you to test negative.

Good luck and awaiting your test result.

[411]

oh well, everyone has to face the music

What, you have a deck chair on the Titanic?

My paycheck isn't worth betting but you can have my empties if its anything but negative.

[fandango]

Thanks for the encouragement everyone,

I did it,

got tested.

awaiting results, might know by Friday, more likely on Monday/ Tuesday

God I hope I am negative.

i must admit i feel really good about having tken the test. still fucking terrified, but my mind isn't playing as many tricks on me, i am in a constant state of just not being sure, which is a hell of a lot better than constantly swtching between believing I am fine and knowing I am infected...

I think my sanity would have required me to get tested one way or another, but i sure wouldn't be doing as well as I am now without all the knowledge and support of everyone on this site.   whatever happens, thank you all very very much


I will keep you posted...

[fandango]

so, there is the possibility that I will get my results today. although more likely Monday.

I am in the frame of mind that I would prefer to get them monday so Inhave a few more days of normalcy before the worst case scenario.

i had a laspe of confidence this morning and started to get really scared again. I guess these lapses are unavoidable until i get the conclusive results back. 

Generaly though I am optimistic about it. i have faith that I will test negative. possibly because now that the results are pending, i cannot really bare to honestly contemplate the alternative.

i keep thinking back to the tissue with the semen-like (or just Semen) on it. why o why o why didn't I just take the retroviral drugs. i wanted to believe everyone that told me I was ok so badly that I may have just lied to myself.

Interesting - a doctor told me that they looked up a statistic for what % of people would be infected from having receptive sex to completion with an HIV+ person (with cum inside them)  the statistic said that 5 out of 1000 people be infected from such an exposure.   
first I wondered how in the world could such a statistic be created,
then I wondered, how/ why is such a statistic readily available for doctors to look up - where do they look such stuff up?

thought that might be interesting to you.

wish me luck & courage. i need both

[thunter34]

Dude, you just hit it on the head without realizing it:  How does such a statistic get created?  Out of thin air, that's how.  The numbers in the study I think you are referencing were created arbitrarily. 

Contrary to your wishes, I would rather you get your results today so you can have a kickin' weekend and be over this already.  You'd call what you are experiencing now "normalcy"? 

[fandango]

i don't even know anymore.

i do kind of wish now that I could get the results today, but if i have to spend one last weekend before knowing, that isn't too bad either. all depends on whether i think i will be + or -  and my thoughts on that change like the wind.

i don't know if it is more amazing to me that such statistics are created and made available to doctors, or that Doctors would put faith in the statistics and wuote them to patients as fact.  this was when I was in the emergency room the night of exposure, I got the impression that the doctor told me those figures to make me think that I was over reacting... very strange.

anyway, I am off topic.   bottom line is that I am still terrified and keeping my fingers crossed till Monday.

thank for the support thunter. it is nice to know that people expect me to be -

[SouthSam7]

Fandango:
Regarding the fever, the chills, etc, don't worry.  Gay men get sick just like everyone else.  Something like what you describe has been kicking everyone's ass in this town for the past two months.  Stomach virus, 24 hour flu, hey it's winter!  This is when people give each other every germ possible.  Relax. 

Glad you're on top of it but don't create unnecessary worry. 

Sam

[fandango]

Hi Everyone,

Today is the day I should be getting my results.

I didn't get much sleep last night.

somehow i feel pretty good, I am very confident that I will be -  I am still very very nervous, but there is no point getting all wound up when results are iminent.

I just have to be negative, I have to be, I absolutely have to be.

[ACinKC]

Id bet LARGE sums of money you are.

[fandango]

I am kind of freaking now. i still didn't get any results

I left the house for 3-4 hours in the afternoon and when I got home around 5pm, I didn't have any messages. I got scared that maybe the doctor had called but chose not to leave a message because he had bad news. I mean, if he had good news, wouldn't he have just left a message?

I guess it isalso possible that he just didn't call, although i was told that it would be possibly Friday, most likely Monday...

tonight is going to be tough. not sure how I will get any sleep.

I have felt great all day. I was on a high earlier, as if i got my result, because I was so sure the result would be good that I was amost looking forward to getting it.... now i am kind of terrifed again.

[thunter34]

how often have you come across anything medical that happened right on time?  just curious...because i never have that i can recall.  they probably just didn't get it in today afterall or just didn't call yet.  if they got the results late in the day, you could just about bet you wouldn't get a call til tomorrow.  heck- call them if you haven't heard by noon tomorrow.

and forget about that "they didn't leave a message because it was bad news" business.  in fact, quite the opposite.  if there was any "bad news", they would be wanting to alert you as soon as possible to discuss the situation with you. 

jeez...you can really do a number on yourself mentally, can't ya? 

[fandango]

Yes, I am quite skilled at pulling a number on myself mentaly...in fact, It might be what I do best!


this latest experience has at times made me question if i should have therapy if i get through all this ok.


these are very stressful times for me. to say I am on edge would be the understatement of the year. I want this all to be over with, but at the same time, I am terrified of facing the results...that combination has a way of 'pulling a number on people's minds'

One more day i guess.

thanks for the post.   you are most likely right, i need rathional thought right now, because i am pretty much a walking mess.

[thunter34]

I'd venture to say that the therapy thing might not be a bad idea.  I'm speaking as someone who has made use of it myself. 

Also speaking as someone who IS HIV + (an AIDS diagnosis, in fact):  It's no picnic to deal with AIDS, no.  But facing a reality and dealing with it still wasn't as bad for me personally as battling mental and emotional phantoms I had made up and magnified over time.

I fully expect you to be fine from your test.  Consider the therapy thing.  Might be doing yourself a huge favor.

[fandango]

thank Thunter,


my problem is that I saw my mother pass from aids when i was a teenager, before heart was created (just before...). you can probably imagine, if i have reason to be scared about exposure, the ramifications that has for me are huge. how, having witnessed it first hand before there were effective drugs, could I fall prey to the same thing.

i do a number on myself mentally, because i have so much reason for anguish. then i start freaking about destiny and i get really messed up....

i really do want this whole thing to be over, but if i get a bad result, i might just fucking lose it.

anyway, thank you for being there, it is SO important to have somewhere to talk about this..

[thunter34]

well, that certainly sheds a new light on your anxiety.  and it furthers my support of going to some sort of therapy.  that's the type of thing you should probaby talk out with someone- whether you have an exposure incident yourself or not. 

[fandango]

Yeah...might be a good idea.

but, one thing at a time, lets first focus on getting that negative result.

after all, if it is anything but negative, I wil need a hell of lot more than just therapy....i might need an asylum

[411]

Fand
Its probably not something you want to hear right now but it can take upwards of a week to get results, especially from a blood draw. Anytime those feelings of deep anxiety take hold try and realize them for what they are, feelings.

You've submitted for a pretty serious test, who wouldn't get worked up and I suspect the fact that you've tested is having a role in your feelings, sort of like validating your fears.

Keep in mind the facts and let the responses you've received here help keep your feelings in check and try to stay busy. I understand that is a mission in itself given your mind tends to drift back to those what ifs but you've tested and I'm still of the opinion you're working yourself up needlessly.

You'll have those results sooner than you think and Thunter is right, no news can't be inferred to be bad news.

[Andy Velez]

Fan, this waiting time can really work the nerves. I just want to remind you again that I still expect you to test negative.

Keep yourself productively busy. It really helps.

Awaitng your results,

[fandango]

thanks everyone,

it means a lot that people expect me to test -

i must admit i have been gradualy losing faith recently.

i have tons of work to do which should be good to keep me productively occupied, but i just cannot seem to focus or concentrate. instead i find it easier to do mindless stuff like build ikea furniture or play free cell or solitaire until my mind goes numb with inactivity.

hopefuly i will get the results today. i feel now like the results could easily go either way. i would be equaly surprised by a + or - result, either one would make perfect sense.

thanks again everyone,

[fandango]

the moment of truth is upon me.

it has been over a week since I got blood drawn and 5 minutes ago i called the doctor to give him a 'reminder' that i am waiting for results...

i got a little scared ysterday thinking that maybe the docytor is waiting till friday to give me the bad news (aways tell people bad news on Friday) or maybe he has been putting off telling me as much as I have been putting off hearing about it... (very young inexperienced doctor)

the last coupld of days I have been able to forget all about this and spend quality time with fam, i must admit i have enjoyd that past coupld of days so much, that i found myself wishing that I had never gotten tested...just live in blissful ignorance  (i know i know, i did the right thing, but GOD do i wish i could have tricked my mind into forgeting about the whole thing)

i expect to get my results today.  i am getting all twisted inside and mentally again.

wish me luck

[ACinKC]

Stay busy.  Labs can take time.  It only took 48 hours for me to get a positive result so don't read anything into how long it takes you to get them back.  It has nothing to do with your tests outcome.

My money is still on negative!

[SouthSam7]

I've never heard of a doctor telling you over the phone.  They are supposed to make you come in even if you're negative so you have someone to talk to. 

Make sure you go to a friendly health clinic or Aids Service Organization so there's no judgement, etc., which often happens when you do it through a private doctor.  Keep us posted!

Love,
Sam

[SouthSam7]

I used to get rectal mucus when I was using a lot of illicit drugs.  You didn't say (and you don't have to), but if you were under the influence of meth, for example, when this occured then I'm sure that's what caused it. 

[fandango]

thank you EVERYONE for all your kindness, knowledge and support.

it has all being invaluable during these past few weeks.

turns out the doctor had thw worng phone number listed in his records.

we got that strightened out and he called to say i am negative! 


thank you everyone again.

[411]

Glad the place helped you out, any negative is a great thing.
Rest easy and catch up on some sleep.
Congratulations Fandango, odd thing, that mind of yours eh.

Take care of yourself

[fandango]

I thought that performing and receivig Oral was safe....  The saliva has an effect on the virus which makes it almost impossibleto be infected.

i performed and received oral sex - 69 while on a business trip. i thought nothing of it since I thought oral was as safe as you can get. I never have any symtoms of seroconversion.

I did brush my teeth about an hour before the oral so I am thinking maybe there were little cuts on my gums? although my mouth was not bleeding...

anyways, after my business trip I return home and have sex with my girl. Exactly 13 days later she comes down with a serious fever, bad body aches, nausea, dizziness, sharp localized pains in her head, and generally feels very weak. She equates the body pains to a very very bad period where her whole back in flaring up. She is in bed for a couple of days, whenever she gets out of bed she gets dizzy and nauseus and has to go lay down again. On the third day the fever is almost gone but she now has diarea, her body is flushing something out. On the fourth day she is 90%, everything is returning to normal.

I feel practically suicidal. if I had developed any symtpoms I would have been tested before any chance of passing it along. I am frankly in shock at the likelyhood that i got hiv from performing oral sex.

I have contacted the person with whom i had oral and they claim that they are negative and got tested 5 months ago. I am sceptical because they are a pro so i feel like even if they knew they were poz they would not want to admit it because then they should not be working... in fact they even said on the phone, "I am definitely clean, otherwise I would not be working"....


can someone explain how this happened?    how did I get get and pass on hiv through oral sex?   

[Andy Velez]

Fan, please keep your comments in one thread. I've merged the one you just began with your previous entries. Thanks for your cooperation.

So tell me, do you have some magical built-in HIV tester so that you know your gf is HIV positive? If so, that's pretty impressive. What it really is -- is nonsense.

Let's get the picture here. You're a dawg and you went straying on your girlfriend. You come back and she comes down with whatever she's come down with and you decide in your infinite wisdom that 1) you are now HIV positive and 2) have passed it on to her and she has quickly manifested evidence of same.

Naw, ain't gonna happen, Fandango.

You weren't at risk in this latest incident. This is just your mind going at you for going wandering on your gf. She should be seeing a doctor for her symptoms if they persist. As for you, I don't see any need for testing unless you are going to inflate this drama and hold on to it. In which case get tested at 13 weeks and collect the inevitable negative result. This is NOT an HIV situation. Really.

[fandango]

Andy,

thank you for the no-nonsense truth. It is what I need.

Believe me when I say that I REALLY do not want to hold onto this one. I want to be able to let it go.

My only concern is that when I was performing oral I am pretty sure I tasted a little pre-cum because afterwards there was a bitter taste in my mouth. i have read that there is a Small risk from giving blow jobs.  Please can you elaborate on what risk is and why I should not be worried about it.

I know the rules, focus only on the exposure, never on the symptoms, always use a condom for insertive & receptive sex, and you are in the clear.

I have been trying to do this, but the combination of guilt, paranoia, fear and (what to me appears to be textbook symptoms) is making it difficult for me to let go.

[fandango]

also, sorry about the new post. I didn't think about my old one and wasn't aware I should add to it for a new topic.

Hopefully I will not need to ever remember that again..

[Ann]

fan,

Transmission occuring through giving a blowjob is more theoretical than anything. If it happens at all, it's pretty rare. It's highly unlikely that your girlfriend's illness has anything to do with hiv. The bottom line is - if you're in doubt, test. I'd fully expect you to test negative, given your circumstance.

Ann

[fandango]

ok,

I am going to trust in the experts and put it all behind me.

if you guys say i am in the clear then I must be (you have proved to me before that you know much better than me...)

if I am still feeling paranoid about this in 2 months I will test but hopefully this will be forgoten by then.

thank you all very much.

[Andy Velez]

You're welcome.

Hopefully you will just let this go. And as you said, if you can't do that, then test and collect the inevitable negative for your collection.

Cheers,

[fandango]

I am having a very hard time letting this go. i cannot help but think that it is highly irresponsible for me to let this go when there is glaring evidence that i might be infected and that I have infected the person closest to me.

the spiked fever, chills in bed, painful body aches, diarea, weakness, fatigue, acute headaches, for 4 days (but not the flu because no congestion, no caugh). what are the chances that someone would randomly come down with those symptoms exactly 2 weeks after having sex with me? how is it possible for me to simply overlook all that and assume that it must have been some unknown random illness that just happen to exibit exactly the symptoms of seroconversion...

what do you mean by infection through giving oral is theoretical?  does that just mean that you do not believe the people who claim to have been infected this way? I sometimes have gingevitis, i brushed my teeth before hooking up, maybe I had little cuts in my mouth or around my gums. why is it so improbable to be infected this way? 

I put this behind me most of the time and then suddenly I remember that there is strong evidence to suggets that I am +. i then panizk, get hot, sweat, my heart rate rises and I think that I must do something. I must get tested, I must disclose what happened, even given the consequences...





 

[Andy Velez]

the spiked fever, chills in bed, painful body aches, diarea, weakness, fatigue, acute headaches, for 4 days (but not the flu because no congestion, no caugh). what are the chances that someone would randomly come down with those symptoms exactly 2 weeks after having sex with me? how is it possible for me to simply overlook all that and assume that it must have been some unknown random illness that just happen to exibit exactly the symptoms of seroconversion...

YOU CHEATED AND YOUR MIND IS DRIVING YOU CRAZY. THAT'S WHAT THIS IS REALLY ABOUT WHETHER YOU BELIEVE ME OR NOT. NONE OF THOSE SYMPTOMS ARE REMOTELY HIV SPECIFIC. AND THE CHANCES OF THEM HAPPENING IN THE EVERYDAY WORLD ARE VERY COMMON INDEED. WHETHER YOU BELIEVE IT OR NOT!

 
what do you mean by infection through giving oral is theoretical?  does that just mean that you do not believe the people who claim to have been infected this way? I sometimes have gingevitis, i brushed my teeth before hooking up, maybe I had little cuts in my mouth or around my gums. why is it so improbable to be infected this way? 

THEORETICAL MEANS IT COULD. BUT WE KNOW FROM THE REAL WORLD OF HIV SCIENCE THAT OFTEN SITUATIONS ATTRIBUTED TO SUCH AN ACTIVITY UPON MORE SCRUPULOUS EXAMINATION TURN OUT TO HAVE OTHER RISK ELEMENTS INVOLVED EITHER THEN OR IN THE PAST.

AND AS FOR YOUR MAYBES, YOU CAN SELF INDULGE IN ALL OF THAT "STUFF" YOU CHOOSE TO AND CONTINUE TO DRIVE YOURSELF CRAZY TO NO GOOD PURPOSE.
 
I put this behind me most of the time and then suddenly I remember that there is strong evidence to suggets that I am +. i then panizk, get hot, sweat, my heart rate rises and I think that I must do something. I must get tested, I must disclose what happened, even given the consequences...

THERE IS NO SUCH STRONG EVIDENCE. IT'S ALL IN YOUR HEAD, FELLA.

THIS IS ABOUT GUILT.

[fandango]

Oh Andy, how I hope and pray that you are right.

This thing really has me scared. It is far worse to be worried about what you may have done to someone else than to worry about yourself. i am not religious but if I made her + i surely deserve to burn in hell.

the crazy thing is that I only performed oral for less then a minute but that bitter taste in my mouth make me think that there must have been pre-cum, and that is what is worrying meso much. I know that when I analyse the risk of exposure I am very lo risk but then i think about my girl and get panicked...

thanks for your help

[fandango]

I remember thinking when she forst got sick, 'this is not hiv'  'the exposure is impossible', 'don't freak yourself out', 'this is iompossible!' but then the symptoms seemed to be so unlike anything else.

The body aches especilly have me worried. I thought that they were very common symtoms of seroconversion and i cannot think of anything else that causes body aches all over.

she also works out regularly, and is in good shape, that makes me think that the virus would manifest itself faster (i.e. 13 days) and that maybe her bosy would have a greater reaction to it - i.e. bed ridden, high fever etc..

the fact that I never experienced any symptoms at all gives me a slight sense of optomism, although I know that it shouldn't.

yet again I am going to try and put this behind me. hopefully this latest effort will last longer than one day...

thank you SO much for your patience. you are like my patron saint of sanity...

[fandango]

Got tested today and it was negative.

I am sure none of you are surprised but I wanted to be thorough and close out the story.

thank you everyone and especially Andy.

happy halloween!

[fandango]

Hey guys,

I am trying to give advice to a friend that had a strange incident. I have said there is nothing to worry about but I thought I should check with the experts.

Protected sex with a pro in thailand. Aparently the condom or sex was very tight and the little sperm collector at the top of the condom become stretched out over the top of the penis. Nothing broke, but the friction caused by the little cap around the tip of the penis caused the circular cut/ firction burn around the very tip (surrounding the eye).

The condom never broke. When the sex was done the masseuse/ pro removed the condom and commented on the cut.

I am sayingn that having used a condom there is no risk and that HIV is very fragile and does not survive in the air. But my buddy now has one very swollen gland and a hollow cough and is freaking out about the possibility of juiced from the outside of the condom coming in contact with the open cut/ burn on his penis.

I keep saying that glands get swollen all the time and that even if there was contact, he would be safe but I am not 100% sure.

Any advice would be welcome.

thank you,

[Matty the Damned]

No since the sex your "friend" reports is not one where HIV would be transmitted. "He" wore a condom and therefore the sex was protected.

MtD

[fandango]

Thanks Matty,

This is genuinely not for me this time. (if it were i would be much more of a spaz are per all my other posts...)

Just wanted to check my facts before giving advice.

[Matty the Damned]

Yeah, well this is the last time I answer questions for your "friend" in your thread. If your "friend" wants to ask us a question he can apply for his own account and ask them himself.

MtD

[fandango]

sure thing, Matty.

didn't mean to offend or break any rules. I did not refer this site because I was embarassed about all the information I have posted on here. I would not want a close frined to link my user name to me and learn of all the devience I have done. very selfish and wrong I know, but I tried to make up for it by giving as much advice as i can.

I appreciate your position and can only apologize for the position I took. Again I do not mean to offen I love this site and everyone that works on it.

thank you,

[fandango]

Hi everyone,

I think (hope) I just need a little confirmation that I am ok.

I was at a bachelor party, everyone was way too drunk when we went to a strip club. At the club a worker gave me a private dance where she bent over and stuck her crotch in my face. being too drunk to know any better I started licking, eating and probing her with my tongue. after the 3 songs I felt disgusted with myself and went to the bathroom where I rinsed my face and mouth and gargled with listerine.

Also, I am a non smoker but that night i must have smoked over 15 cigarettes in the space of 4-5 hours...

I got home and threw up, rinsed with water and passed out..

the next day my throat felt a little irritated but that went away with breakfast. Also, in the afternoon of the following day i noticed that the little flap of skin that attaches the tongue to the underside of the mouth was irritated at the very bottom. felt a little raw, that made me worry that maybe it had been raw enough to warrant exposure to HIV while performing cunnilingus?? (although the i don't remember feeling any discomfort during the night in question, or when I gargled with listenrine, which would have probably made it sting if it was irritated?. I want to believe that the caused the mouth irritation the day after, although I don;t know if I am kidding myself)

2-3 days later my glands on my throat swelled to the size of golf balls and they are both really tender to the touch. My throat has also progressively gotten more sore to the point that it now hurts considerably to swallow (it is now 4 days since the incident which happened thursday night)


I know that the smoking is probably largely to blame for the throat irritation, and I known that oral sex is considered almost entirely safe, but the fact that my glands are the size of peaches has made me worry to the point of writing for advice/ reinforcement/ support.

I would really appreciate it if an expert could tell me if there is any medical reason for testing (other than for my mental benefit) or if I should stop worrying and put the whole thing behind me.

A million thank yous!!

most respectfully,

Fan

[Andy Velez]

Fan, you can relax about HIV on this one. Nothnig you did put you at risk for HIV transmission. If you haven't alreadly read our lesson on transmission you ought to take some time and do that. You get the basics there. There's a link to it in the Welcome thread which opens this section.

As far as your symptoms are concerned that is something to discuss with your doctor. They have nothing to do with HIV. Leave your swollen glands alone. Squeezing and bothering them can create a problem where none exists.

You need to remember for the future that mixing excessive drinking is a very dangerous thing to do. It impairs the judgement and when it comes to sex you need to have a clear head. We also recommend that anyone who's sexually active ought to regularly have a full STD panel done. Other STDs are much easier to acquire than HIV so doing that at least annually is a good idea.

This time out you have nothing to worry about as far as HIV is concerned.

Cheers,

[Ann]

Fan,

I've merged your new thread into your original thread - where you should post all your additional thoughts or questions. It helps us to help you when you keep all your additional thoughts or questions in one thread.

If you need help finding your thread when you come here, click on the "Show own posts" link under your name in the left-hand column of any forum page.

Please also read through the Welcome Thread so you can familiarize yourself with our Forum Posting Guidelines. Thank you for your cooperation.

Going down on a woman is not a risk for hiv infection. Take your swollen glands to your doctor - it's nothing to do with hiv.

Ann

[fandango]

Andy,

As always, my deepest thanks for your reassurance. I have read the lessons and know the rules, but I got freaked out by the severity of the swollen gland s. I have never in my life experienced such painful and and enormously swollen glands. Both glands were swollen to the point of my ear canal feeling pressure and I was reduced to barely being able to swallow for the pain...

seeing as the symptins came on so strong after having performed oral sex on a stranger, I became worried and thought I should seek advice.

Thank you again.

Take care and stay healthy.

Most respectfully,

Fan

[fandango]

Guys,

I admit that after reading your very straigh forward reply about having nothing to worry about I feel a little foulish writing again, but I must admit that I am have been felling rather worried again recently...

I just keep going to back to the fact that my glands have never reacted to severely before... 2-3 days after performing oral sex my left gland swelled like a balloon and then in the next day or two my right gland followed suit only even more inflammed than the right. As I have noted my ear cannal felt pressured from the swelling, my neck felt bruised to touch, I couldn't swallow without pain. after 2-3 days it gradually went away. I felt normal again about 8 or 9 days after performing oral.

I know i should focus on the exposure, and I have been worrying about the fact I don;t have the best dental hygene in the world. Everytime I brush, my gums do bleed a bit. if I remember I had not brushed that morning because I was traveling. I think that my mind is looking for possible ways I could have been exposed (like bad gums) in an effort to validate the swollen glands... (I know that sounds crazy but I also know that I have an unatural fear of HIV and my mind plays tricks on me when I get scared)

I have also been thinking about the exposure in terms of me performing. I am sure I did not do anything that would not be considered oral sex, but I did get quite busy down there with my tongue.. probing all the way in, licking the whole area, sucking etc..is there anything to be worried about?

[RapidRod]

You did not have a risk. End of Story..

[Ann]

fan,

You did not have a risk for hiv infection.

However, you may have picked up some OTHER infection. You should see your doctor. In fact I'm surprised you didn't go to your doctor in the first place, if your glands were as bad as you say.

Whatever is/was going on, it has nothing to do with hiv. See your doctor.

Ann