POZ Community Forums
Main Forums => Living With HIV => Topic started by: tednlou2 on February 25, 2012, 12:01:10 am
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Now, this is very disturbing. I don't even understand how prosecutors can make a case in a situation like this. This isn't just "backward Americans" doing these prosecutions. I hope this doesn't create precedent and we start seeing people prosecuted here, when they didn't even know their status. I'm having a hard time even understanding how he was prosecuted. For "should have known he was probably carrying the virus"?? Knowing he was probably poz, but just too scared to test? It is very troubling. The article says there is no public info proving their infections came from this man. And, even if they did prove they shared the same virus, it is still wrong, in my opinion. This is taking criminalization to a totally different level. So, in this case, we all could have been prosecuted for sex we had prior to learning our statuses.
http://www.poz.com/articles/france_hiv_transmitting_virus_1_21974.shtml
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Utterly ridiculous.
I read the article and I feel that it didn't portray the full picture. It seems like there's more to the story.
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Did you read the AIDSMAP article?
There is more info in it. It does seem like a horrible trial and a very stupid verdict and two rather jerky "victims", not to mention the bad behavior of the "criminal".
(Oh, and the French newspapers, like other countries, casually interchange AIDS and HIV - its pretty pathetic.)
In the French report the prosecuter explained her successful argument as such:
À l'audience, le procureur Catherine Doustaly avait requis trois ans de prison pour « un comportement suicidaire pour lui et criminel pour les autres, réitéré sur plusieurs années ».
What I understand is that the case was made that he lived several years with his head in the sand "knowing but not knowing" that he was likely HIV+ and swearing to partners that he wasn't. What people are asking is - what about the two victims responsibility to protect themselves - and especially with causual partners for that matter. The (now) criminal was lying to get the sex he wanted and the "victims" were doing the sex they wanted against all advice to the contrary about safersexrules. They even had the CHUTZPAH to claim that they were especially disappointed in the "criminal" because the were in health fields and would have known to get PEP after the sex if it had been risky. HUH????? So if they were in health care didn't they know the SSRs?!!! And they claim to have lost their jobs because of the seroconverion..... In particular, one was a nurse and claims to have lost his job. Maybe he should have sued his workplace... Not enough information in reports to understand everything that went on here.
What the case shows once again is that the existence of these laws allow for a travesty of justice.
http://www.aidsmap.com/resources/law/Blog/page/1736432/?url=http://criminalhivtransmission.blogspot.com/2012/02/france-untested-gay-man-found.html
"In this current case, several things appear to have gone against Christophe. First, after one of the men accused him of infecting them, he apparently emailed him a falsified HIV-negative test (although this is not the same as showing a falsified test in order to obtain unprotected sex under false pretences.)
Second, both men testified as to the negative impact of having HIV on their health and career.
Today, Julian is on triple therapy. He had to give up being a nurse in pediatrics and settle for an administrative job in a Swiss hospital. Pierre-Yves, too, had to give up his career as a caregiver, he now works as a car salesman.
What seems incredible about this case is that two gay men would consider themselves victims under such circumstances. Until recently most prosecutions in France were of heterosexual men. It seems the concept of shared responsibility for HIV prevention for gay men has now well and truly disappeared.
Finally, the shorter article on this case, in Le Point, also states that another man has also recently been found criminally liable for HIV transmisison (although I imagine this man was diagnosed HIV-positive before having sex with the complainants). It states that on February 14, a 38 year-old bus driver was sentenced to six years in prison for infecting two partners (gender not specified), one of whom subsequently committed suicide."
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Ostriches with their heads in the sand and bums in the air all round then...
It seems rum that a key part of the argument was that the accused should have known he was HIV-positive because of his past risky behaviour but the accusers had no obligation to consider they might become HIV-positive because of their current risky behaviour.
As for the French police finding all the sexual partners the men had had before and after Christophe, damn efficient them French uniformed chaps. << a complete list given, found, tested, the truth, the whole truth and nothing but, I am sure
- matt
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This is a pretty sad state of affairs. Although I was under the impression he did NOT infect the "victims". Which is ultimately worse.
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This is a great illustration why, no matter how many "justified" prosecutions exist, that the totality of the HIV community suffers because of these laws.
I will never, never ever ever, support them. And I am afraid that my empathy for those who do is becoming more and more limited.
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This is a pretty sad state of affairs. Although I was under the impression he did NOT infect the "victims". Which is ultimately worse.
How do they know that they caught it from this guy and how do they know they didn't give it to the guy themselves? Alot is missing from this story.
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When I read this I was a bit disappointed as well. Makes me remember we have a long way to go and decriminalizing transmission is still an important task.
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Yes, this made me so sad. This kind of thing really has to stop.
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Independently of this fact, this kind of thing only happens with HIV and don´t help to decrease stigmas around it...