POZ Community Forums
HIV Prevention and Testing => Do I Have HIV? => Topic started by: skysurf on October 01, 2007, 08:09:09 pm
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I can't say much for myself after posting on these forums after almost two years, but had a question regarding Oral sex. I know you guys receive a lot of questions on these and have read quite a bit on it to know that Oral sex is considered virtually zero risk.
One question on oral sex though: Is it considered low risk because the chances of the 'giving partner' bleeding in the mouth is low, or because inherently the act itself is low even if there may be some blood present in the mouth.
Here is the reason why I ask:
About 4.5 weeks ago I had sex with two prostitutes in Germany. The sex was always fully protected and no problems there. However, when I went to kiss one of the girls in the mouth, we kinda missed each other and my toof ended up hitting the girls gum on the top above one of her front teethf, rather hard. It obviously hurt her and she I could see the area around the spot on her gum slightly swelling up and getting very red due to the internal bleeding. She immediatly went 'owww' and started to put pressure on it with her finger, every now and then looking at her finger (I'm sure there was a little blood.) She also kept massaging the area with the front of her tongue. NO immediate worries came in my head at the time since I didn't see any profuse blood in her mouth though (nothing like blood running down her teeth or something.)
After a few minutes of her putting pressure and feeling the area with her finger, and massaging with her tongue, (and my apologizing of course,) she gave me a few minutes of unprotected blowjob, after which I put on a condom and finished with the other girl.
So I am wondering about the details of oral sex and hiv transmission when blood is involved. I am sure as due to the massaging of the injured spot with her tongue she had some blood, however little, in her mouth and tongue. Is a little blood mixed with Saliva viable for a high risk OF HIV transmission??
I had made a decision a while back to get a test done anytime after I become sexually active again to be responsible, and will take one next week (5.5 weeks after the encounter.) Meanwhile thought to check with the experts on this forum to get some more information regarding oral sex.
Thank you very much greatly!!!!
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You had no risk even if there was a little bit of blood in her mouth.
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No matter what spin you put on it, and please believe me we have heard so many variations of nicks, cuts, bleeding gums, bites and what have you, in the entire history of the epidemic there has never been a single documented case of transmission to a guy getting a blowjob. NOT ONE!
It's safe to say you aren't going to make history by becoming the first.
Take a breath and let go of this concern.
There's no need for worry or for testing.
Cheers,
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Hi Andy, RapidRod,
thanks for the reply. I took your information and advice and have let go of the concern.
I can't say enough thanks for you guys to show up on these forums and help WWs like me.
Thanks!!
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Good. I'm glad you found the responses to be helpful.
Cheers,
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Hi guys,
I can't say much for posting again here, but just thought you guys were the best place for advice! I just came to Germany and visited an FKK club (sex club,) last night. I went to the room with this prostitute (she was from Italy,) who insisted on anal sex, which I've never had done before. She put a condom on me and started with her on top with anal sex, which did not occur for very long. Just after about 1 to 2 minutes she stopped (while she was still on top,) realizing that the condom had broken, and pulled out, and sure enough I saw that the condom was broken. I don't think the condom was broken for more than 10 to 30 seconds while I was inside her, however I realize that this was a HIGH risk encounter being anal sex with a prostitute. Also I am uncircumsciced, which I understand increases the risk for HIV as well. She didn't seem too worried about it at all though, and put on a new condom and continued for another minute or so after which we switched to a handjob.
So although the condom breakage encounter with anal sex was very brief, (maybe only 10 to 30 seconds,) should I consider treatment for PEP? If so, would you know how, where I can get such treatment in Germany (I don't speak hardly any German?) I am in Germany for another month and won't be in the US until almost the beginning of April. What is the time frame when PEP should be started?
I really respect your opinion and consider you guys the experts, and will follow any recourse you guys suggest (the PEP or no PEP if needed.)
Thanks so much for your invaluable service and information that you provide, and I would appreciate any feedback!
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Please keep all your thoughts questions and comments in your original thread. (http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=16036.0) This helps us follow your story and give you the most accurate advice.
If you cannot find your original thread, please click the red link I have posted above. Alternatively you can use the "Show own posts" link which appears in the uppermost left hand column on any forum page.
Your questions will not be answered unless you return to your original thread
Please take the time to read our Welcome Thread (http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=220.0) and familiarise yourself with the posting guidelines.
MtD
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Hi Matty,
sorry, I think you misunderstood what I said in my first post above, this is my FIRST thread. What I meant when I said "I can't say much for posting again here," was that I am not too happy with myself, being back on this forum after four years and posting on a similar situation, (having sex with a prostitute,) again.
Again, this is my original, (first,) thread, and I would appreciate any advice you guys can provide!
Thanks!
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A review of your previous posts indicates this is not your first thread. (http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=16036.0)
You will return to your original thread or questions will not be answered. I should add that failing to keep your posts in your original thread may leave you open to disciplinary action by our Moderators.
MtD
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Hi guys, and Matty.the.damned,
Sorry I wasn't familiar with the forum posting guidelines and didn't realize that I should add any new issues and posts to existing posts, even if the existing post was completely unrelated and happened a few years ago. I have added my latest issue below to this existing thread (and changed the subject, it that is ok?) from a few years ago, please feel free to delete the other forum post.
I just came to Germany and visited an FKK club (sex club,) last night again (I have not had sex with anyone since my last posts above a few years ago.) I went to the room with this prostitute (she was from Italy,) who insisted on anal sex, which I've never had done before. She put a condom on me and started with her on top with anal sex, which did not occur for very long. Just after about 1 to 2 minutes she stopped (while she was still on top,) realizing that the condom had broken, and pulled out, and sure enough I saw that the condom was broken. I don't think the condom was broken for more than 10 to 30 seconds while I was inside her, however I realize that this was a HIGH risk encounter being anal sex with a prostitute. Also I am uncircumsciced, which I understand increases the risk for HIV as well. She didn't seem too worried about it at all though, and put on a new condom and continued for another minute or so after which we switched to a handjob.
So although the condom breakage encounter with anal sex was very brief, (maybe only 10 to 30 seconds,) should I consider treatment for PEP? If so, would you know how, where I can get such treatment in Germany (I don't speak hardly any German?) I am in Germany for another month and won't be in the US until almost the beginning of April. What is the time frame when PEP should be started?
I really respect your opinion and consider you guys the experts, and will follow any recourse you guys suggest (the PEP or no PEP if needed.) That is my main question, whether you would recommend PEP for this incident (according to this page on aids.org, http://www.aids.org/atn/a-302-01.html, it seems they would recommend PEP for such an incident. I will test for HIV and other STD's in three months, but just wanted your advice on PEP.
Thanks so much for your invaluable service and information that you provide, and I would appreciate any feedback!
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OK, I have merged your topics here. Please keep all furture entries in this same thread. Thanks for your cooperation.
If PEP is to be used it must be started within 48-72 hours after a risky incident. However, I don't consider the very brief broken condom incident which you experienced to be something that warrants starting PEP. You had a single and very brief incident. If it is present, HIV is significantly more difficult to transmit from female to male than the other way round. In the past we have never had a single instance here in which a broken condom resulted in a positive test result.
As a precaution it is recommended that you get tested at 13 weeks to confirm your negative status. You can do an initial test if you wish at 6 weeks. Assuming you test negative at that point, it is very, very likely that you will continue to test negative.
For future reference make certain you are using condoms which fit you properly and that you use a water-based lube to facilitate easier entry whether vaginal or anal.
I do expect you to come out of this ok. If you decide you do want to do PEP, you will take it for 28 days. The countdown for testing is from when you complete the PEP regimen. Any AIDS service organization in Germany or any hospital ought to be able to put you in contact with a source for PEP. English is widely spoken in Germany so your not speaking German should not be a problem. I am mentioning all of this simply as an option.
The choice is yours of course to make, but I don't see PEP as being necessary in this instance.
Cheers.
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Hi Andy,
thanks so much for your feedback. It did make me feel better and less anxious last night, however the anxiousness does seem to revert back and I am still having trouble sleeping.
I hate to sound anxious and obsessed (I guess to be honest I am a little,) but just wondering the low risk of female to male transmission is valid for anal sex? I mean, a rectum is a rectum (sorry, no pun intended,) right, regardless of it being a man's or a woman's, and should carry the same risk (high risk as I understood,) for both genders? One final question I have, I also took some pills of Cialis, Viagra before the sex, and was just wondering if the blood vessels dialation in the penis would increase the risk of the transmission (once again, I am really sorry to sound paranoid, and this would probably be my last question to bother you on this topic!)
Anyways, I found the website of the local clinic here in Germany which does immunology, called them and briefly explained to them the situation. They said they can see me first thing in the morning, and I am seriously considering PEP just on the precautionary note, although they mentioned that it is very expensive. It has been about 50 hours since the condom breakage event, so I am still withink the 72 hour time frame as long as I start the PEP regimen by late tomorrow night. I feel it at the least I can be responsible and discuss the condom breakage situation with the prostitute, further with the physician, and get their input on the situation.
Meanwhile, lastly, I would really be thankful for your feedback!
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Sky,
PEP guidelines do not recommend PEP for the insertive partner following a condom break. You're highly unlikely to become infected from this one brief incident. Unprotected anal intercourse is more risky for the receptive partner, not the insertive. For the insertive it is a much lower risk. Taking Viagra or similar drugs will have no bearing on your risk level.
I've yet to see the insertive partner end up positive over a condom break and I do not expect you to be the first.
As Andy said, you should test at three months for a conclusive result. You can also test at six weeks for a good indication of your status. The vast majority of people who have actually been infected will seroconvert and test positive by six weeks, with the average time to seroconversion being only 22 days. A six week negative must be confirmed at the three month point, but is highly unlikely to change.
You need to know that if you do go ahead and take PEP, your testing window period will be extended by one month. You can't get a conclusive result until three months after your last dose of PEP, and PEP must be taken for one month. So that's four months after the incident occurred.
Ann