POZ Community Forums
HIV Prevention and Testing => Do I Have HIV? => Topic started by: RllyWorried on November 20, 2008, 08:10:29 am
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About 10-12 weeks back , I had sex with a CSW. Unfortunately i made a big-big mistake of using 2 condoms [one on top of the other]. At the end of the act ,I fouund that there was no leakage from the bottom of the condoms . But i did not check the edges of the condoms whether they had developed any cracks etc.
Is it obivious that i would have known whether the condom had broken ?I had worn 2 condoms so it is possible that i did not realize the condom failure[scratches / cracks ....].I mean does a non-leaking condom imply condom is intact?? .
I am really scared .
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Yes, it's very obvious when a condom has broken because it ends up looking like a fringed hula hoop on your penis.
One fresh latex condom is all you need to use. Doubling them is actually a mistake because it can cause breakage. Fortunately that didn't happen with you. Just use one. That'll do the job very effectively.
You are worrying needlessly. It's good to know you're thinking condom. Keep doing that, but only one at a time.
Cheers.
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Rlly,
I agree with Andy that you had NO RISK as the condoms didn't break.
Please read through all three condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use them correctly and with confidence.
Ann
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Thank You Andy and Ann for your quick replies. Your support for people like me is really very very important .You mean to say that even if had worn 2 condoms and assuming that they had broken, I would have realized it ? I did test myself at 10 and 11 weeks after the exposure .Though the tests are negative, I am really scared to go in for the test at the 12 th week mark. Do I really need to go for this test? Coz I feel that somehow the condoms might have developed cracks or even broken and due to the double bagging ,I would not have realized it.
Yes Ann I will surely read the links you specified. Through surfing the net [I know i should now stop this surfing],I did come across some sites saying that sometimes it may not be realized that the condoms broke.
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If you continue to indulge in surfing the net you absolutely are going to find fuel to feed your fears unnecessarily.
You would have known if the condoms failed.
You never needed to test about this incident. The average time to seroconversion is 22 days when there has been a REAL risk, which you didn't have. All but the smallest number of those who are going to seroconvert will do so within 4-6 weeks after a REAL risk. Which you didn't have. So a negative at 11 weeks means you don't need to test any further because YOU DID NOT HAVE A REAL RISK.
This is all about feelings and not any facts based in HIV science.
Give it up and get on with your life. Really.
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Rlly,
You can test again at twelve weeks if you want, but it would be a waste of time, money and resources. The result isn't going to change, you ARE hiv negative.
You definitely CAN tell if a condom has broken. Some websites just like to scare people silly. They don't want people to have sexual relations outside of a man/woman monogamous marriage. You get the real deal here, with no moral judgements.
You didn't have a risk. You don't need further testing. You ARE hiv negative.
Keep using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple. Make sure you're using them with ANYONE, not just sex workers. Hiv doesn't discriminate and neither should you.
Ann
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Thanks again Andy and Ann for your reassuring words.
I will certainly follow your instructions. I will get back to you if i do have any doubts.Just one more question.
There has been some swelling on my left hand [just below where i put my watch near the elbow]. I thought that it was swelling of Lymph nodes due to the HIV . But from your posts , I now feel that it is CERTAINLY NOT due to HIv. Am I right?
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That's right. It has nothing to do with HIV and you should discuss that with your doctor to diagnose the REAL cause of the problem.
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Rlly,
No, your swollen wrist/arm/hand has nothing to do with hiv. You don't have hiv, remember?
If it keeps bothering you, see your doctor.
Ann
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Thank You Ann and Andy [names swapped this time ;)]. You have really got off the tension from me. Will get back to you i I do have any concerns.
I thank you for the service you are doing for us all .You may not be knowing its significance but I can tell you that your replies can and DO influence a lot of readers.
Wishing you all the best.
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You're welcome. Now get on with your life.
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Andy/Ann,
Today I got tested for HIV using Elisa test at approx 85 days and the result was negative. Is this test conclusive? Should I get tested again at 6 months interval? I know as per Andy , I just had no need to test , but it was hard convincing myself and my mind . So is a 6 month test recommended for any individual ?
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What part of, "YOU DIDN'T HAVE A RISK" is it that you don't understand? Yes the test was conclusive.
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Thank You RapidRod for your reply. Ya i did know that I really had very low risk . Seriously speaking it were the previous comments from Andy and Ann which really helped build a confidence in me for testing . Had they not replied to my previous comments, I really had no GUTS to even go to the testing center. Thanks to their assurances that I could muster enough courage and finally visit the testing center and wait for the results [I swear it sucked with a host of questions/thoughts coming to my mind]. Thank you guys once again .
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Rlly,
You didn't have a "very low risk", you had NO risk! Really and truly!
Anyway, as a sexually active adult it's good that you were tested. It's something you should be doing at least once a year. As long as you're using condoms (and using them correctly, now that you've read my condom links and know the score), you can fully expect your routine hiv test to return with negative results.
You don't need to test again for at least another year - provided you're sexually active in the meantime.
You ARE hiv negative. Keep using those condoms and you'll stay that way.
Ann
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Sorry but could not help but ask this question.
What part of the penis must be actually covered to prevent a HIV transmission? If the Base of the uncircumscised penis is not covered and say only the Head part [say 1/4 part] is covered is it safe?Is it not possible for the fluids to enter from the base /cracks in the condom[ r'member i am saying condom covering 1/4 of penis] and flow right upto to the head of the penis?
Also why does the CDC specify to test at 6 months after exposure for surety ? Even the center where i had tested asked me to test again at 6 months.
Also what the cases and how common are those that ppl seroconvert after 3 months test?
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The head of the penis including the foreskin needs to be covered.
The CDC only recommends 6 months in certain circumstances such as IV drug use, organ transplant, treatment for cancer, etc. They adopted 3 months as a reliable testing point several years ago because of the increased sensitivity of tests now in use.
Otherwise 6 months is a long outdated measure for testing. It's not our mission to explain why unfortunately those who ought to know better by now are handing out incorrect information about testing.
It is extremely rare for someone to test positive after 3 months other than in the abovementioned circumstances.
You didn't have a risk. If you keep coming back here with more anxiety-provoked questions you're going to end up getting a time out. You have no cause to be concerened about HIV. Period.
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I am really sorry Andy. I am still coming to terms. And believe me, I am trying hard to get all this stuff out of my mind .But sometimes I do get scared about the foolish incident and I try to clear my misconceptions. I tried hard to stay away from the internet but the suggestion from my testing center to test again at 6 months really scared me a lot.I then startes surfing the net looking for cases which tested positive after 3 months negative and was really Terrified to find several such cases. I know you all are busy handling so many queries but I just could not help it. Really sorry again . Everytime I think that I should move on with life that I find some information on the net that scares me off.
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/466354_side2
This and several sites also mentioned that it is possible for the condom to break without either partner realizing it.
Also there are several sites specifying the 6 month period for testing
I promise I will try my best not to bother you any more unnecessarily .
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Man, it is beyond our abilities to quell your fears, particularly if you continue to search the web. As long as you are doing that you absolutely are going to find fuel for your fears.
We've told you and I will tell you for the LAST time, you were never at risk in this incident. You are HIV negative as your test has reliably confirmed at a reliable testing point. If you choose to ignore that and continue the drama about this, well, that's your choice.
Read this again: you are reliably HIV negative. Period. End of story.
And if you come back again with more handwringing "buts" and "what ifs" you are going to get a time out. Consider yourself warned.
Get on with your life.
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I Really Thank You Andy and all others for your reply and supporting me through out.
Wishing you All the Best
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You're welcome. Now get on with enjoying the gift that your life is.
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Sorry Andy for this post , but just could not help.
Just when I was trying to move on [I swear I tried hard], I happened to speak with Aids-Hiv counselling here in India. I asked them what are the chances that the condom had failed and I did not realize it.To my horror they replied that it was quite possible and not uncommon . So the foundations of by belief have been shaken by them. Then I asked them about the 3 month window period here in India and I swear that their reply was not satisfactory. In fact they did claim that they had come across several cases which were tested positive post their 3 month Hiv negative test [Is it possible that these ppl had not subjected themselves to some risky activity again ?] . That was a shocker and I just could not sleep whole night.
Since I am alone I do try to engage myself in some productive work but these comments from a reputed counselling [Govt approved NGO] really shook me up.
Thereafter I read several previous posts on this site and found several cases of condom broken and the user not realising it and suggestions from you all to that post.
Are these window period of 3 month approved through scientific basis or solely on the study carried out on people ?
Also what should I consider the comments from such a reputed counselling to mean? What is the probability of me testing positive after a six month test ?Is it ABSOLUTE 0 ? I promise I haven't engaged in any sexual activity since then.
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Rlly,
Look. You used two condoms. If either or both had broken, you WOULD have known. I promise you.
You don't need to worry about the window period because you don't need to test. You didn't have a risk.
I'm giving you that time out Andy warned you about. There's nothing more we can do for you here.
Ann
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Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 60 days.
Unless you're sure you want to reply, please consider starting a new topic
Andy/Ann i am getting this message . Shall I post a new topic ?
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Rlly,
No, you should keep all your posts in this thread. If you'd read the Welcome Thread (http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=220.0) like you're supposed to, you'd know this.
Ann
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Yes Ann i have read the posting rules. Only got confused because of the warning.
Andy/Ann your previous replies helped me a lot. [Infact I was waiting for you come online all day].
Now that you are online , I wanted to ask you a question.
I had another exposure with a CSW in which I just licked her breasts. and rubbed my ***** in between her breasts till ejaculation. I did use protection for this act. There was no penetration at all because I was thorougly scared after the first incident I had reported to you.
Now the problem is I observed cuts on her breasts. And I licked those. As far as her nipples were concerned ,I am not sure of the cuts/sores. Is PEP essential for this exposure ? I need your reply because several sites I observed that this is not a risk if there are no sores /cuts.
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Rlly,
You certainly don't need PEP because you didn't have a risk. You didn't even need a condom for tit-fucking. Seriously.
Licking her breasts and sucking her nipples wasn't a risk, even though she had cuts, because saliva contains over a dozen different proteins and enzymes that damage hiv and render it unable to infect. You'd have to drink a huge quantity of blood before you would put yourself at risk.
You need to be using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, every time, no exceptions until such time as you are in a securely monogamous relationship where you have both tested for ALL sexually transmitted infections together. To agree to have unprotected intercourse is to consent to the possibility of being infected with an STI. Sex without a condom lasts only a matter of minutes, but hiv is forever.
Have a look through all three condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use condoms with confidence.
ALTHOUGH YOU DO NOT NEED TO TEST OVER THIS INCIDENT, anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care check-up, including but not limited to hiv testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.
If you aren't already having regular, routine check-ups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine hiv tests to return with negative results. Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than hiv.
Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple!
Ann
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So is testing TOTALLY ruled out for this incident ? Or is there a need for testing at 6 weeks and then at 3 months?
Also how many people have been infected this way , if you have any ideas?
A doctor I visited has asked me to get tested at 3 months for this exposure.
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Rlly,
You don't need to test over this incident.
NOBODY has EVER been infected through doing what you describe.
Your doctor obviously doesn't know the first thing about hiv transmission. Hiv is NOT transmitted through any of the activities you list.
You did NOT have a risk and you do NOT need to test.
Ann
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Andy/Worker,
Any suggestions from your side?I am not disbelieving Ann's suggestion at all, but your suggestion would help me certainly in making a decision. I am still in 72 hour period and can start PEP if you recommend. Ann has mentioned about hostile nature of the mouth/saliva for the virus. But what about my lips and cuts on them. They for sure provided Direct Blood to Blood contact.Also is saliva capable of destroying millions of the virus-particles which I might have come in contact with?
I am not freaking about the protected rubbing part of my exposure. That doctor's comments have added to my anxiety.
Also Could infection with cough virus and std's on her increased my possiblity?
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That's a no-risk situation. No matter how you cut it...DON'T do PEP for that!
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Andy/Ann,
Not going to waste much your time .
I wanted to verify if this is true for risk from open wounds:-
For any sort of risk to be present, you needed a FRESH wound which had to bleed PROFUSELY and should have been a gaping wound now that had to come in contact with the blood from other infected person.
Small paper cuts/ cuts which are not bleeding PROFUSELY do not pose a risk.
Though i dont know how this is true because any wound is directly connected to our blood-stream and even a small amount of virus from other infected persons wound can gain access directly into the blood-stream via this path. There is no Environmental barrier in such type of contact, to destroy the virus.
I read all the transmission risks in Ann's pages but such Direct Blood - Blood contact risks are not mentioned at all.
Believe me, several other pages i read mentioned that this is no risk IF YOU DONT HAVE CUTS.
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Rlly,
If you were in a car accident with a positive person and you both had fresh, deep, bleeding wounds and you got some of the positive person's blood into one of your deep cuts, then you might become infected.
Hiv quickly becomes damaged and unable to infect when it is outside the body, even if it's ON the outside of the body.
But these cuts on the sex worker's breasts were not any kind of threat to you. None whatsoever.
Situations that aren't mentioned in the transmission lesson aren't mentioned because they are not transmission risks.
Do you remember reading the following when you read the Welcome thread?
Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result or no-risk situation, will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.
Keep posting about this latest NO RISK incident and you will be given a time out. Please consider yourself warned.
Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple!
Ann
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Ann/Andy,
This is the FINAL doubt I have regarding my last exposure. I realise that others risks I mentioned above [rubbing and cut on her breasts] are No-Risks as per you .
A couple of days ago, I was discussing this issue with a friend of mine. I understood that unbroken skin is a barrier for the virus, But then he asked me that if the csw had put the condom on me and she was the one who had removed my penis from my boxers. So her hand was in contact with my erect penis for that period and she fondled it a bit. It was dark and he said if she had cuts from blade/needle etc suffered at that moment , I mean fresh , which had escaped my eyes , then this blood had come in direct contact with my Urethra/ bottom of foreskin which are high risk areas. I had not thought of this possibilty.
I tried to think rationally over this issue and realised that I would have known if she had Big bleeding cuts as they would be obvious to my eyes . But what about the small -bleeding cut she might have suffered Couple Of Seconds before fondled my penis. It was in contact with my urethra, bottom of my foreskin and glans.
Is above Ann's view about large volume of blood applicable for Blood- Urethra/below foreskin contact too?
I am really stressed and dont want to be banned because of this query but I swear I am unable to sleep properly [Hopefully you understand my stress] since last 2 days because of above possibility. PLEASE dont give me a Time Out because of this query , as I havent posted regarding the NO RISK exposure you had mentioned below .
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Rlly,
If you'd had the remotest possibility of infection, we would have told you.
I'm giving you that second time out you've been warned about. Do not attempt to create a new account to get around your time out because if you do, you will be permanently banned.
Ann
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Ann,
I got tested for the exposure [CSW touching my penis with possible blood on her fingers.]
7 week Rapid Blood Test , 9 week Elisa generation unknown and 11 week Rapid Blood test.
The doctor has asked me to come over for a test at 13 weeks. He said that foreskin mucuos membrane may provide a path for virus on blood on her hands. But I am really scared to do it. Some questions for you:-
1. How much confidence can I take in my 11 week negative test ?
2. Though you may say that testing may be not necessary , but the doctor is insisting on one at 13 weeks. What shall I do ? I am really scared to test. I am approaching 13 weeks .
Forgot to add that I am having heavy cough since almost two weeks. Is this related ?
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Move on. At no time were you at risk of contracting HIV.
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Rlly,
Your doctor obviously doesn't understand hiv transmission. Otherwise, he would not have you test again over this NO RISK incident. Test if you want, but don't be surprise by another negative result. YOU DO NOT HAVE HIV.
Keep posting about this NO RISK incident and you will be permanently banned. Yes, that's right, permanently banned. You've used up your time outs.
Consider yourself warned for the very last time!
Ann
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Yesterday I had a very high risk behavior with CSW. It started with she putting condom on me. Then I started rubbing my penis in between her bums in doggy style. While rubbing I am not sure if I penetrated her. Then we changed the pose. I was rubbing my penis on outside of her vagina and I got soft.I continued rubbing with soft penis and did not realize whether I penetrated her or not. When I started leaving , I saw that my penis was soft and the condom was very wet. I checked that the condom was not broken from bottom near penis head. But I think that the sides of the condom might have been damaged as it was soft when I was rubbing / penetration not - known her . Would the condom appear as hula skirt even if the condom was wet and broken on the edges ?
Last time when I had penetrated [1 st exposure mentioned in this thread] I did not feel as if I had penetrated . So I guess I would not have known this time too whether I had penetrated her or not.
After the activity , my penis was very wet. Could this be the vaginal fluids entering my condom ? Or else what wetness could this be ? When do I get tested for this? Though the soft condom was covering the 3/4 of my penis could some vaginal fluids have entered it from the top or from the damaged edges ?This is actually what is worrying me.
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This is more of what ifs and no real risk, just your fears about what MIGHT HAVE happened.
You're on the verge of being banned from the site.
Given your history here it seems to me that before you have sex again you might give thought to seeing a therapist or other professional to discuss your repeated and unwarranted concerns about what you're doing sexually in relation to HIV.
This is not an HIV situation and you're not going to be permitted to return again and again about it.