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Author Topic: <200 again WTF  (Read 2220 times)

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Offline MadDog125

  • Member
  • Posts: 103
  • Not today,
<200 again WTF
« on: April 19, 2019, 12:16:59 am »
OK so just got another round of results back.  Under 200 again on the CD4 count.  This is the lowest count I've had since before I started my drugs.  WTF?  I already sent a message to the Doc. I'm kinda hoping I don't have to go back on prophylactic antibiotics.  Everything I've read and or been told says numbers get better in the first two years.
DX 28DEC17, cd4 112, VC 63000
13FEB18, cd4 215, VC 156
14MAY18, cd4 260, VC 31
23AUG18, cd4 298, VC 61
03OCT18, cd4 300, VC 35
21NOV18, cd4 259, VC <20
18JAN19, cd4 284, VC 24
17APR19, cd4 157, VC <20
24MAY19, cd4 340, VC <20
12AUG19, cd4 304, VC 51
30DEC19, cd4 385, VC <20

Offline MarkintheDark

  • Member
  • Posts: 142
Re: <200 again WTF
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2019, 02:08:06 am »
Oh man, sorry to hear about this.  I only broke 200 last year for the first time since 2001, iirc.  Worked my way up to the mid-high 200s, albeit interrupted by a hospital stay that tanked me again.  What I'm saying is that I understand the disappointment and that those of us with low CD4s can be hypervigilant about those kinda results.  I know I am, despite some prevailing wisdom.  Guess that's just human nature.

Looking at your results, I see you remain UD...and for several years I've had that result despite the <200 CD4.  Maybe you can at least hang on to that little glimmer.

What I've taken in stride is the necessity for me to get on Bactrim when I'm <200.

One thing I'll add that numbers can be affected by time of day the draw is taken.  For the past 8 years I've made sure it's always first thing in the morning.  That's perhaps a factor you might consider.  Also, are you coming off a recent illness?

Hang in there, bro.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2019, 02:11:02 am by MarkintheDark »
HIV dx - 02/93
AIDS dx - 07/01
Rilpivirine/Cabotegravir guinea pig since 01/17

Offline leatherman

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  • Posts: 8,593
  • Google and HIV meds are Your Friends
Re: <200 again WTF
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2019, 06:42:56 am »
One thing I'll add that numbers can be affected by time of day the draw is taken.  For the past 8 years I've made sure it's always first thing in the morning.
getting your lab work done near the same time of day is a way to have a much more accurate stable accounting of your numbers; but you have the time of day wrong. Cd4 are higher in the evening and lower in the morning
actually your cd4s can vary by up to 100 pts a day. (so, basically 350 and 450 are in the same range, with no statistical difference if you are only viewing two cd4 test results. more on this in a moment) They are lower in the morning (10a) and highest around in the evening (6pm). Exercise lowers the count in the first hour; but afterwards, your cd4s will temporarily increase. Cigarette smoking will also give you a temporary increase (very limited in increase and duration); but which is nothing compared to the damage from the cigarettes to your general health).


Under 200 again on the CD4 count.  This is the lowest count I've had since before I started my drugs.
112, (+113) 215, (+45) 260, (+38) 298, (+02) 300, (-41) 259, (+25) 284, (-127) 157
finally to the point I mentioned earlier, Cd4 counts never matter as one-off numbers. it's only the trend of 3 tests, before you can begin to really see the state of an immune system. cd4 numbers vary too much for one test to mean much.
looking at your numbers, I can offer a bit of advice along with a question. Actually your cd4 numbers have varied very little. The amount in the parenthesis is the change amount from the last test. Only twice did your numbers vary by more than the possible 100 points a day, and the amount different is very small. If you graphed all these numbers out your numbers did go up slightly from the starting point and basically held there. So my question then is what is your cd4% number? Anytime you're under (or near) 200, looking at that number from the last few tests can help explain whether you are holding steady, increasing slightly or decreasing slightly.

I'm kinda hoping I don't have to go back on prophylactic antibiotics.  Everything I've read and or been told says numbers get better in the first two years.
if you had ever had PCP pneumonia you wouldn't say that. LOL Trust me, you would much rather take those antibiotics than be hospitalized with PCP/AIDS. I was <200 for a decade (I started on a lot of older meds back in the early 90s) and even though I was slightly allergic to bactrim (stayed itchy and slightly red) I kept on taking the med since I had almost died of PCP twice.

Everything I've read and or been told says numbers get better in the first two years.
ah! and there's the rub. Numbers getting better in the first years of treatment is what normally happens ---- but that's not what happens with everyone. Lots of people never rise very much or take a long time to rise to better levels. Many of these people are people who had a very low cd4 count when starting treatment. while it's hard not to worry about your cd4 number, try to remember that this number is only a quantitative number (the amount of how many cd4s you have) and not a qualitative number (how strong/effective) your cd4s are.
leatherman (aka Michael)

We were standing all alone
You were leaning in to speak to me
Acting like a mover shaker
Dancing to Madonna then you kissed me
And I think about it all the time
- Darren Hayes, "Chained to You"

Offline MadDog125

  • Member
  • Posts: 103
  • Not today,
Re: <200 again WTF
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2019, 08:52:46 am »
True, as a bonus the percentage has been fixed at 14%.
DX 28DEC17, cd4 112, VC 63000
13FEB18, cd4 215, VC 156
14MAY18, cd4 260, VC 31
23AUG18, cd4 298, VC 61
03OCT18, cd4 300, VC 35
21NOV18, cd4 259, VC <20
18JAN19, cd4 284, VC 24
17APR19, cd4 157, VC <20
24MAY19, cd4 340, VC <20
12AUG19, cd4 304, VC 51
30DEC19, cd4 385, VC <20

Offline harleymc

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,524
Re: <200 again WTF
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2019, 06:20:52 pm »
It's not nice when our lab results don't follow the dominant discourse of rapid a d sustained improvement.

I'm chugging along with cd4s that haven't cracked the 200 mark in seven years or treatment. But for all that I'm in good health, working and with  lots of physical activity in my hobbies such as cycling and dancing.

There's nothing you or I can do about ourcd4s so we just get on with having a fabulous life.

Offline Mindless

  • Member
  • Posts: 362
Re: <200 again WTF
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2019, 02:14:46 am »
There's nothing you or I can do about ourcd4s so we just get on with having a fabulous life.

I consider myself lucky cause I didn’t find myself in that situation so far (lowest recorded CD4 count was 320, before starting meds) but I really like the way you put it down.


M
Dx Feb. 2018, CD 320, %14

- Atripla Feb/18 -->
- Complera (generic) 2019 -->
- Dovato (generic) 2021 -->

 


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