Author Topic: Late Seroconversion? (Read 23494 times)

Mexican · « **on:** June 12, 2007, 10:59:10 pm »

Hello there! and greetings from Mexico!
First of all, let me say what a wonderful work you’ve been doing here, I want to congratulate and to thank you all for your big help. It has been a great help reading through this forum.
I'll just jump straight to my story......I'm a 28 year old heterosexual male from Mexico, married 8 months ago. I've never had any oral, vaginal or anal sexual relations besides with my wife (we dated 9 years before getting married and she’s never had sex with anyone else but myself), I’m not a cancer patient and I’m not an IV drug user, never used any kind of drugs before. But a few days before my wedding, my friends decided to throw me a bachelor party at a friend's ranch. At the ranch, they told me that they were going to bring strippers over, and I asked them not to force or push me to do anything that I wouldn’t want to do. And they did so. I did not have any lap dance what so ever, but after a while, I thought that there was no harm in dancing with the stripers, not as an erotic lap dance, but just dancing with them as how you would dance with a friend at a party, apart and separated from each other. I was a bit drunk (not totally wasted, but I did have had a few drinks) and since I was at a ranch, it was hot and therefore, I had my shirt unbuttoned half way down, and one of the strippers I was dancing with, started to feeling my chest. I thought there was no harm in that and I didn’t want to make a big fuzz about it and make the stripper feel bad, I thought that as long as we kept on dancing separately, it was no big deal, but suddenly, that’s when my whole ordeal happened. The stripper bit my nipple for like 2 seconds as part of some sort of bite play in a flirty kind of way, I mean 2 seconds, because as soon as I felt her teeth pulling my nipple, I pulled away and immediately ran off to the bathroom to wash my nipple with water. In the bathroom, I checked and examined my nipple really carefully and looked really closely for any traces of blood, I just found a small red dot close to my nipple which I first started worrying for, because I thought it could have been a small drop of dried blood from a very small cut in my nipple, which turned out to be a small freckle because its been 8 months past, and I still have that really small red dark dot in my nipple. But the day after, I noticed a small scratch under my nipple with a bit of live (raw) skin, and that’s when I started panicking.
I tested Negative HIV 1 & 2 ELISA test at 3 months and retested recently Negative ELISA HIV 1 & 2, as well as for Hepatitis A, B & C at 8 months.
I guess my questions are:

1. Was I at any risk from this exposure, any remotely theoretical risk at all? Has there been any proven documented cases in which HIV has been transmitted through a human bite?

2. Is an 8 months Negative ELISA test 100% conclusively HIV Negative? My question is, lets say I told you that I had unprotected gay sexual relations with a known HIV+ partner, if I tested Negative at 3 months and retested negative at 6 months, would you say I would be conclusively HIV Negative from that exposure? My question regards to the fact that the CDC says that most of the persons (97%-99%) would test positive from an exposure at 3 months and in VERY RARE cases (as you guys have stated before: due to cancer treatment, etc.) it may take up to 6 months to test positive, meaning that nobody would take longer than 6 months to test positive after an exposure, but in your Welcome HIV Testing Lessons says that “It's extremely rare for seroconversion to take more than six months to develop detectable antibodies”. Does this means there could be some persons that could take longer than 6 months to test positive? Has there been any documented case in which a person has tested Negative at 6 months and then turn to positive at 12 months? Or a few years later? (with respect to that same exposure)

3. The reason why I’m asking for testing time is because I want to be 100% absolutely sure that my tests at 3 months and 8 months Negative are conclusive, since as I told you before, I got married about 8 months ago and my wife wants to start a family and she wants to start having kids, but before getting my wife pregnant, I need to be 100% absolutely sure that I’m OK and that I’m really HIV Negative. With this tests, can I consider myself 100% conclusively HIV Negative and go on with my life? Can I safely get my wife pregnant and start having kids?

4. After reading through many people’s postings, I read that somebody had shifted its worries of HIV to HTLV, I’m not sure what it is, but believe is some sort of ancient HIV virus or something like that. I researched for it in all STDs web sites, and nothing would show up about this HTLV thing. Is this maybe because its not an STD? Is this something to worry about? I asked my clinic about this HTLV thing, and they told me that they considered this as some sort of HIV and that it would show up in my HIV test if positive with this. Is this correct? Is this something to worry about?

Thanks so much for everything my friends!!
Thanks for your time and attention!

Matty the Damned · « **Reply #1 on:** June 12, 2007, 11:04:59 pm »

Mexican,

HIV cannot be transmitted by human bite. You were never at any risk of HIV from dancing with a sex worker or having your tit bitten. Saliva contains substances which inhibit the virus.

Your HIV ELISA test results are 100% conclusive. So too are your hepatitis tests results.

You don't have HIV.

Please take the time to read our Welcome Thread which contains links to our lessons on HIV transmission and testing.

MtD

Ann · « **Reply #2 on:** June 13, 2007, 03:16:48 am »

Mexican,

1. No, you were not even remotely at risk.

2. Even if you had unprotected anal sex with a known hiv positive person, your THREE MONTH test would have been conclusive. The conclusive window period is THREE months.

3. You were conclusively hiv negative at three months. You could have taken a test the day after the biting incident and it would have been conclusive because you didn't have a risk.

4. HTLV has nothing to do with hiv. Human T-lymphotropic virus causes a type of leukemia and is closely related to the bovine (cattle) leukemia virus, not hiv. You don't need to worry about HTLV either in this incident.

As Matty has said, you weren't at risk and you are conclusively hiv negative. Now go make some babies.

Ann

Mexican · « **Reply #3 on:** June 13, 2007, 07:14:54 pm »

Thank you very much guys!! Your answers have been very helpful! REALLY!! I REALLY appreciated!!

I only have one more question:
I just went to get a haircut and was cut on the lower part of the back of my ear with the electric clippers (the kind they use to buzz your hair low). I felt it right away but didn't think much of it until later on when I noticed a very small drop of blood in the back of my ear. Is this something of risk for HIV or Hepatitis? How long does this viruses live outside the body? What if the guy who got a haricut before me had HIV or Hepatitis and got cut as well? Is this any risk at all? Should I get tested for this?

Thanks again!

Matty the Damned · « **Reply #4 on:** June 13, 2007, 07:35:38 pm »

Mexican,

You cannot contract HIV from being nicked by the clippers or scissors at your hairdresser. HIV is a very fragile virus which has to be transmitted inside the body.

I would remind you to read our Welcome Thread and visit the HIV transmission lessons which contain all the information you need to know about how the virus is and is not spread. We're not going to dole out piecemeal answers to you everytime you think up a new scenario.

Regards,

MtD

Andy Velez · « **Reply #5 on:** June 13, 2007, 07:51:09 pm »

Before you come up with yet another totally non-risk event to ask us about. how about reading the lesson on Transmission as was suggested to you earlier. You get all the basics there that you need to know.

Cheers,

Mexican · « **Reply #6 on:** July 23, 2007, 11:50:31 am »

Hello There!
I have a couple of questions regarding to late seroconversions and therefore, testing timings.
A while ago, when I had a doubt about a possible risky incident, I took 2 HIV (I & II) tests at the 3-month and 8-month marks. But when I took the 8-month test, I read through your Forums and saw that some people tend to ask their testing labs for testing timings, and read that in some cases their labs would say to recommend retesting again at 12 months. When I called the two different labs (the one where I took the 3 month and the other lab where I took the 8 month test), they both said that the lab couldn´t assure any conclusive testing timing because in some individuals late seroconversions may take up to several years (even up to 9 years!), and when I told them that maybe they were confused with the timing for AIDS effects to appear in a person (which may take up to 10 years or more), the Head chemist at the lab said no, they were not confused, that they were talking about late seroconversions and that they even had one case in their lab in which they detected HIV in a person after 9 years. And they also said that experts have the 3 month mark as a window period because that is what it USUALLY takes in general, but not in all 100% cases, and that there are a few people who may take longer than that, even a few years!
But then I thought, maybe this case was of a person which was not tested at all or maybe the test was done too early during its window period to be detectable and when he came in for retesting 9 years later, the person was detected HIV+ 9 years later, and therefore, for the lab records, this was a case of detection of HIV 9 years later but if the person would have gone for testing by the 3-6 month mark period, the test would have been positive for sure?
Its a bit odd and confusing that all HIV experts that I could find like you guys, the CDC and even the CONASIDA (the equivalent institution of the CDC in Mexico) say that a 3 month HIV Negative test is conclusive and that just these two labs that I called (which they are not the HIV experts, they only give HIV tests and say if it comes out positive or negative) say that all individuals are different and some may take up to a few years to seroconvert, but I can´t stop thinking in what these labs told me, so I have a couple of questions:

1. The CDC states that it may take up to 3 months for people to seroconvert and that in VERY RARE cases (like cancer tratment patients, etc.) may take up to 6 months to seroconvert, but no longer than that? Do all 100% of HIV infected persons (cancer tratment patients or not, etc.) if they take the HIV test by the 7 months period would be HIV positive for sure in all 100% infected persons?

2. Has there ever been a single case in HIV history in which a person has taken longer than 6 months to seroconvert? or even longer than 12 months to seroconvert?

3. I read somewhere in the internet, that there had been some cases of people having developed AIDS, but in their HIV tests said that they are HIV Negative and that these people even died from AIDS while still being HIV Negative in their test results. Is this true? Or maybe I read it wrong and missunderstood?

4. Is a test later than 6 months from the risk exposure a 100% conclusive test no matter what? Regardless of the body and current defense system situation of the person, is a 6 month Negative result a 100% conclusive no matter what? even in the rarest of cases?

Thank you very much for your time, patience and knowledge.

Best Regards,

RapidRod · « **Reply #7 on:** July 23, 2007, 12:33:50 pm »

Please keep all your thoughts and questions in your orginal thread. Do NOT start new threads.

Ann · « **Reply #8 on:** July 23, 2007, 12:43:49 pm »

Mex,

I've merged your new thread into your original thread - where you should post all your additional thoughts or questions. It helps us to help you when you keep all your additional thoughts or questions in one thread.

If you need help finding your thread when you come here, click on the "Show own posts" link under your name in the left-hand column of any forum page.

Please also read through the Welcome Thread so you can familiarize yourself with our Forum Posting Guidelines. Thank you for your cooperation.

You've already been told that you were NOT AT RISK for hiv when you got bit. You are conclusively hiv negative. Period, end of story.

If you cannot accept your negative results, please get yourself into counseling so you can learn to deal with your unfounded anxieties. We can't help you with that here.

Ann

Mexican · « **Reply #9 on:** July 23, 2007, 02:22:29 pm »

I´m sorry about posting on a new thread. From now on, all my postings will be through this one. Sorry for the trouble.

I know that my previous incident does not constitute a risk, but regardless of my incident, out of general knowledge on the matter, could you please comment on my questions I posted before on late sero conversion?
Thanks again!

Mexican · « **Reply #10 on:** July 23, 2007, 06:43:46 pm »

Andy,
Do you have any comments on my late serconversion questions?
It would really help if you could give me some of your thoughts on them.
thanks!

RapidRod · « **Reply #11 on:** July 23, 2007, 06:48:30 pm »

If you were a person that would have to worry about late seroconversion, you wouldn't be here posting on the internet.

Mexican · « **Reply #12 on:** July 23, 2007, 07:10:21 pm »

What do you mean?
Has there ever been a single case in which someone has taken longer than 6 months to seroconvert?

Ann · « **Reply #13 on:** July 23, 2007, 07:27:59 pm »

Mex,

Late seroconversions are rare. The person would have to be in terrible health to begin with - which is what Rodney means when he says if you were a person who had to worry about it, you wouldn't be posting on the internet. You'd likely be in a hospital bed.

The vast majority of people who have actually had a risk and have actually been infected will seroconvert and test positive by six WEEKS, with the average time to seroconversion being only 22 days. It is a rare person indeed who would take longer than three months to test positive.

This is all irrelevant where you are concerned. You didn't have a risk so you're not going to seroconvert at all, let alone late.

Ann

Mexican · « **Reply #14 on:** July 23, 2007, 10:10:48 pm »

Thank you very much Ann.
Has there ever been a single case of late seroconversion later than 6 months? or later than 12 months?
Andy, with all your years of experience in this, do you have any thaughts on this?
Thanks again!

Andy Velez · « **Reply #15 on:** July 23, 2007, 10:20:40 pm »

A seroconversion beyond six months is not just rare. Personally I don't know of single such confirmed case. You are worrying needlessly. Really.

I can guarantee you that if you surf the net for material to fuel your worst fears you will find it. All to no good purpose of course so I suggest you call a halt on this right now.

Enjoy your negative status and protect it by always, ALWAYS using a condom for intercourse.

Cheers,

Mexican · « **Reply #16 on:** July 23, 2007, 10:24:27 pm »

Thank you very much!
Best,

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Author Topic: Late Seroconversion? (Read 23494 times)