Newly Positive

[Greg01]

Hello,

I’m a 55 year old gay male, and started having sex with men at the age of 16, or in 1977.  In 1978/79 I was in San Francisco, back when it truly was the gay capital of the United States, and had unprotected sex then, too.  This was all BEFORE we knew about the importance of safe sex, or about HIV and AIDS.  It wasn’t until shortly after we first started hearing “rumors” about a gay cancer, or “grid,” as it was called back then, that was claiming the lives of gay men.  No one knew how this new disease was contracted, or transmitted.  People started dying, gay men, often times alone:  Friends and family were afraid to visit them for fear of catching the disease; health care workers came into hospital rooms wearing gowns, face masks and gloves!  There was no research, and no hope of any research being conducted.  People were in a panic, and it was thought by many that we were getting what we deserved for choosing to live an immoral lifestyle.  Our President at the time, Regan, would not even say the word, let alone acknowledge the disease, or put federal money into funding and research.  Many people I knew and cared about died in the 80’s — it was a profoundly sad and scary time to be a gay male.

When we found out what caused AIDS, and the first drugs became available everyone pretty much still died.  AZT didn’t save many lives.

Somehow, I managed to live in this turbulent time and remain HIV negative, and I feel truly blessed!

Later, when we learned what caused HIV people started practicing safe sex, well at least I did.  Decisions were made by some in relationships for them and their partners to get tested before making decisions about having unprotected sex.  Back in those days there were no rapid tests.  You had to go into the clinic, where they assigned you a number to be tested.  They drew your blood, and you came back a week later with your number to get your results.  Getting tested was a terrifying experience back then, when so many people had died, people you knew, and it was all fresh in your memory.
 
The first time I was tested, I went in with my domestic partner, at the time.  We had been together for a year.  We had been practicing safe sex.  Neither of us had been tested before, and we decided to go together.  We both waited on pins and needles for the results of those tests.  When the day came for us to get our results, they called my number first.  I went in and they told me I was HIV negative.  I asked if I could share the results with my partner, who was with me, out in the other room, and was told that I could bring him into the room and tell him in the presence of the HIV counselor, and show him the results myself, but that they could not share the information.  I invited my partner in the room and shared my results.  I left the room, and he remained to get his results.  Soon my partner called me into the room.  I was expecting it to go like it did for me, but it didn’t.  I can still hear my partner, his words were, with tears in his eyes, “they were just telling me that  I am HIV positive.” 

We were faced with a huge crisis.  One thing I knew, immediately, is I was not leaving my partner, my soul mate, my heart.  We left that day feeling afraid and lost, really not knowing what to do.  We were living in Chicago at the time, and it was me who did research and reached out to the very best immunologist at the time, and made an appointment for my partner.  This doctor was to become by partner’s physician.  I remember our journey, as if it were yesterday.  Waiting for the first medicines to be approved.  Trials my partner participated in.  The first therapy, and the side effects of the medication.  Over a few years, I watched this disease claim the life of my partner, and I was alone, devastated, and still HIV negative.  A part of me resented being negative.  I was so depressed, and watched so many of my friends get sick and die, and watch my partner get sick and eventually die.  I wanted to die, too.  I even asked him to have unprotected sex with me, and thankfully, he wouldn’t 

I’ve been around to see this disease progress, from the beginning.  Eventually, as research, treatment and education advanced I felt safe again, not just for me, but for the millions of LGBT people out there, knowing while we still had the virus it was no longer a death sentence, and that people could manage it and live quality lives.  I began to see myself as a warrior.  Someone who was extremely knowledgable.  Someone who knew how to live in a world where this virus was present and remain negative.  Or so I thought.

Fast forward a couple of decades.  I was in a new relationship, practicing safe sex.  And, as I had done in all previous relationships, after a few months, when we realized we were serious, I brought up the idea of going in to be tested with my partner.  He told me it was not necessary to go in together, saying he had a similar idea, and had gone and got tested two weeks ago, and he was negative.  All that was left was for me to go in and be tested, and so I did.  I was happy to be able to tell my partner, after receiving my test result, that I was HIV negative. 

As a result of our test results, we had unprotected anal sex three times.  I am versatile, and on two of those occasions I was the bottom. 

Imagine my surprise then when one day when I picked my partner up for a date he got into my car crying. “What’s going on, are you okay, honey?”  He replied, “I have something I have to tell you, and I am afraid.”  I assured him that whatever it was he could tell me, and that is when he told me, “I lied to you about my HIV result.  I was afraid to tell you the truth because I was afraid if I did that you would stop seeing me.  After I lied to you and you wanted to have unprotected sex I didn’t know how to tell you I lied, so I did it.  But, you need to know I did lie, and I am HIV positive.”  It gets worse:  He had not been taking his medication, or seeing his doctor, for the past three months, because he could not afford it, according to him!

So, here I am, again, trying to arrange for someone else's health care.  There is simply NO REASON why people need to go off there medication and stop going to their doctor over a lack of an ability to pay, at least not in the area I live in.  He was new to the area, having moved here six months prior, and didn’t know about what resources were available.  So, I, knowing this information, hooked him up with the necessary social services to get him back on his medication and back into treatment.  I was with him, in his doctor’s office, when his first blood work came back that revealed his CD4 count and viral load.  He wasn’t with me though when I went to be tested and learned I was HIV positive.  He still doesn’t know.  I don’t trust him with that information.  I told him that he needed to learn to take better care of himself, and that I could not do that for him, and that frankly, my trust in him had been destroyed as a result of the way he had deceived me, putting me needlessly at risk, and that I didn’t want to be with him any longer, regardless of what the outcome of my test was.  I blocked him on Facebook, blocked his e-mail and changed my phone number, and that was that.  Before changing my number I blocked his, but he took to stalking me, continuing to call from other numbers, after I told him I no longer wanted to deal with him. 

I must accept some responsibility for being HIV positive.  I was not raped, but it emotionally feels like I was.  I was deceived, badly, by someone I should have been able to trust. I understand why our activists are against criminalizing  infecting others with HIV.  However, in some situations I disagree with this.  In my state knowingly lying to someone about your HIV status and infecting them is not criminal behavior.  In some situations I think it should be, and this, perhaps, is one of them:  Although, if I could file charges against him I don’t know that I would.

So, I am alone, and considering the circumstances that is for the best.  I’m traumatized, but not nearly as traumatized as I would have been had I received this news several years ago.  Now, I get to learn what it is like to navigate in the world as an HIV positive person, and it is going to take time.

Of course, I immediately started treatment.  After having my HIV positive rapid test confirmed with a blood draw, I went right in to my doctor.  I agreed to do the blood work, and went back to receive the results of drug resistance, CD4 count and viral load.  I started Triumeq five days ago, and so far have no side effects.  I have become still, for a moment.  I’m focusing on my treatment, improving my diet and just trying to figure out what this means for me, and what I want the journey ahead to be like for myself.  I don’t feel afraid, but I do feel very sad and alone.  I’m grateful to have somewhere to come and share my experience.  My ability to trust others, and to trust myself to know who I can and cannot trust, has been greatly impacted. 

[Ptrk3]

Greetings, Greg01:  I'm sorry to read of your ordeal, but am glad you found these forums and, also, that you shared your story with the forum.  Please continue to use these forums for support and enlightenment.

Similarly, please continue to be active here, as you have a wealth of life experience and have much to offer that can be of use to your peers.

You have an excellent attitude, which will provide you the strength to begin your new journey.  With your perspective of the virus, it's good to know that you fully understand that health can be attained and maintained, and that being HIV positive is vastly different than it was 35 years ago (and even 10 years ago).

I wish you the best and look forward to your continuing contributions to this forum.

[Greg01]

Thank you!  I am going to be okay.  In sharing my experience, what I wish for those newly infected, that perhaps don't know the history of this virus, is that we have advanced to a point in science and treatment that we are ALL going to be okay.  If nothing else, I hope my experience can give someone who is newly infected and afraid the inner security of that peace 

I also hope that people will learn the importance of adhering to treatment, and of communicating, honestly, with those they are sexually intimate with. 

Finally, what happened to me is a reminder that even inside relationships we must still be cautious in matters as important as protecting our health.  One thing I didn't do, and I don't know why, was to go on PREP.  At the time, I did not believe my risk warranted taking the medication, but in reality, if you are going to have unprotected sex with anyone, even someone you trust, then I would now say the risk warrants the protection of taking PREP.

Best,

Greg

[Ptrk3]

Well said:  hear, hear!

[CaveyUK]

Hi Greg

Sorry to hear your situation but pleased you found us, and thank you for that very well written introduction.

As I was reading it I suspected it was going to be a tale about how even a HIV negative test only reflects the situation some weeks (or even months) previously, and cannot be relied upon in itself, especially if there is a vague chance of your partner still having multiple partners.

But then you dropped the shell shock of him knowing his status and still choosing to engage in high-risk sex, and that must have been truly devastating for you and I can fully understand the reasons you have completely cut him off.

Even more amplified by your experience of HIV throughout the years, and your prior efforts to keep yourself protected.

I know you have the right attitude now, and it's very much a case of it 'is what it is' and all about how you deal with it, and from what you have said I think you will be absolutely fine. You understand the condition, and know the current comparatively 'rosy' outlook compared to the early days.

Anyway, not much more to say really. Welcome to the community.

Cavey

[Greg01]

Hi Cavey :-)

Thank you for reaching out to me!

I am looking forward to being a part of the community. 

Greg

[Hito]

Hello there sir,

Having read your story I feel that you made the right choice in blocking your previous partner.

I know that you are very familiar with the virus and the stigma that surrounds it, but here you will find so much love and support.

Keep up the fight!

[Jim Allen]

Hi

Sorry to hear that you had problems with you ex partner and had to take measures to block him, its a shame some people are like that and can't move on.

Jim

[Wade]

Hi Greg,
I'm sorry to hear how that went down for you, it truly sucks.
I lived in Key West during those early years and my experience with the hospital and my friends dying at home was much the same as yours...horrible. It had a large gay population that dwindled by the day .
I an 62 and was infected some time early on, not quite sure when , I was very promiscuous so who knows. I was not diagnosed till 95. 

To have gone through all that you have only to be betrayed by some one you trusted must have devastated you. I hope he is leaving you alone and giving you some peace. You have a great attitude and I hope you will be able to trust again.
Good luck with your treatment and welcome to our community.

Hugs, Wade

[Greg01]

Hi Wade,

Thanks for your support 

Weren't we all promiscuous back in those days.  Unprotected sex was the standard then for all men.  The thought on condoms, back then:  They were for sale in gas station bathrooms in vending machines attached to the wall, and  they were used to prevent pregnancy, and since we gays had no possibility of that happening there was zero interest in condoms.

You mention Key West changed as a result of the crisis, so did San Francisco, and it never fully recovered to what it once was.  When I visit San Francisco today it is a shadow of what is was pre HIV/AIDS crisis.  I travel extensively for work, and in my opinion, the best LGBT community we have in the USA today is Boystown, in Chicago.

In so many ways, our community, and especially our fight for civil rights, was set back as a result of the crisis.  Finally, those who had an objection to LGBT people, back then we just called them Gay rights, lol, had something they could sink their teeth into to push us back down.  Pre HIV/AIDS crisis, who remembers Anita Bryant?  The former Miss America that was the spokes person for a well known orange juice commercial, who came out against us in Miami/Dade in our fight for equality, and as a result you could not buy a screwdriver in any bar in San Francisco at the time, because the bars stopped selling orange juice, and all the drinks that were made with it!  We sure shut her down.  Our community has developed, and in great ways I never imagined possible, (like marriage equality), but I am still grateful for having gotten to experience what it was like pre crisis, back then it was a world all of its own.

Our early fight for treatment, research, drugs and respect, it was not waged by government, or corporations  -- they were content to let us all die.  It was waged by activists, and then Elizabeth Taylor, and everyday LGBT people who fought hard to get us what we have today.  Today HIV may still be a stigma, but no where near what it used to be when it was an automatic death sentence.  We have come such a long way!

Best,

Greg

[Matland]

Hi Greg

I would prefer not to write here due to my poor language ability but everyday i read the posts sent on this forum. And today i saw yours and decided to express my support as much as possible.

Well, your story really touched me though i am on the other part of the world. You cannot know what the life brings to you in this journey. You are an example of that. There is no excuse of what your ex boyfriend but it is very nice to see someone like you. I wish i had power and strength and understanding at least 1% that you have. What an amazing attitude that you put that person in treatment again instead of leaving him as just he is. Wow! i respect you. And you are a man who deserves much better really.

Well, welcome to the community again, and it is my pleasure to greet someone like you.

[Greg01]

Matland,

Thank you so much for those kind words of encouragement.  You are doing a great job expressing yourself, despite any language barriers, by the way.

Regarding my ex, yes, I got him back into treatment before leaving him.  That is a reflection of the type of person I want to be, and he does not get to change me or define me into something I don't want to be as a result of what he did to me 

Best,

Greg

[Tonny2]

        OJO      HELLO GREG, WELCOME...WELL, I'M GLAD YOU WERE NEGATIVE FOR ALL THOSE YEARS, EVEN DURING THE DIFFICULT TIMES WHEN THIS VIRUS WAS DISCOVERED. I'M SORRY THAT YOU GOT IT, BUT, I THINK, YOU GOT TO FOVUS IN YOUR DIAGNOSIS, GETTING TREATMENT FIRST...WELL, I WONDER HOW YOU COULD POSSIBLE BELIEVE IN THIS PERSON WHEN HE TOLD YOU HAVE HAD BEING TESTED, IF YOU MENTIONED YOU WENT TO THE CLINIC, TOGETHER, WITH YOUR PREVIOUS PARTNERS?, ALTHOUGH, THERE IS NOTHING YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT NOW, IT IS WHAT IT IS, NOW YOU ADQUERED, NOW YOU TREAT IT...FOR YOUR PEACE OF MIND, YOU HAVE TO TAKE RESPONSABILITY FOR YOUR ACTS AND MOVE ON, FOCUS IN DIGESTING AND TREATING THE NEWS, ON YOURSELF, THEN, WITH A COLD HEAD, DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH YOUR EX, WEL, IF I RECALLED, YOU MENTIONED IT'S NOT ILLEGAL IN YOUR STATE NO DISCLOSING..I'M SORRY YOU ARE HERE, I'M HAPPY YOU FOUND US, YOU ARE NOT ALONE ANYMORE...CYBER HUG                    OJO

PS. I JUST READ YOUR POST, NO THE REPLIES

[Greg01]

       ALTHOUGH, THERE IS NOTHING YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT NOW, IT IS WHAT IT IS, NOW YOU ADQUERED, NOW YOU TREAT IT...FOR YOUR PEACE OF MIND, YOU HAVE TO TAKE RESPONSABILITY FOR YOUR ACTS AND MOVE ON, FOCUS IN DIGESTING AND TREATING THE NEWS, ON YOURSELF, THEN, WITH A COLD HEAD, DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH YOUR EX, WEL, IF I RECALLED, YOU MENTIONED IT'S NOT ILLEGAL IN YOUR STATE NO DISCLOSING..I'M SORRY YOU ARE HERE, I'M HAPPY YOU FOUND US, YOU ARE NOT ALONE ANYMORE...CYBER HUG

Hi Tony,  Thanks for your post.  I think there are things you missed, possibly due to a language barrier.  I have started treatment.  I have already decided what to do with regard to my ex, and done it.  I also take responsibility for the decisions I made.  That said, you are right, it is legal in my state to non disclose but that does not make it the morally right thing to do to someone.  Also I believe there is a difference between non disclosure, which simply means not telling someone your status, and actively lying about it and stating that you were tested negative when you weren't, and then knowingly actively engaging in non protected sex with them knowing there is a strong possibility you will infect them because you are not taking your medication and the virus is replicating in your body.  I was victimized by my ex in a horrible way, by someone I should have been able to trust, and that was wrong, more than wrong, and I will never change my perspective on that.  If the feeling is that simply because some states have decriminalized non disclosure that it is an okay practice, an acceptable thing to do to someone, then perhaps people should lobby their legislature for a change in those laws, because it really isn't okay.  Do you think it is an okay and acceptable practice?  The right thing to do to someone?  If you don't, why are you defending it or minimizing it?  It is really victim blaming, and  I do not accept what you are saying to me.  I tried to take all the right precautions to protect myself.  I asked about his status.  I asked for the testing.  I went and got tested, and I trusted when my partner told me he was tested and negative that it was the truth.  I accept responsibility that trusting someone else was a bad idea, but really, it is a sad fact that it is apparently unreasonable to trust those we should be able to trust in our most intimate relationships, this was not just some trick, a one night stand, or casual sexual partner.  I will forever believe I had the right to have expected the truth from him, and that given the nature of our relationship it was not completely unreasonable of me to have trusted him.

Greg 

[Jim Allen]

Greg.

If you don't, why are you defending it or minimizing it?  It is really victim blaming, and  I do not accept what you are saying to me.

I read Tonny post and he is not victim blaming or defending what happen or minimizing it.

I accept responsibility that trusting someone else was a bad idea, but really, it is a sad fact that it is apparently unreasonable to trust those we should be able to trust in our most intimate relationships, this was not just some trick, a one night stand, or casual sexual partner.

Simply truth is the trust was broken and sadly that happens in relationships.
End of the day you did not protected yourself sufficiently, you took a known risk and contracted HIV and nothing you can do will change that now. That does not mean anyone is condoning what your partner did or victim blaming. I agree with Tonny you should focus on moving forward, staying on treatment and moving on with your life.

Jim   

[Greg01]

Jim I don't think that either you or Tonny get to define anything for me.  If taking a "known risk" is having unprotected sex with your partner, AFTER you were tested and he assured you he was tested also and negative, then yes I took that risk.  I believe I have taken reasonable and responsible actions upon finding out I was positive, and before in trying to protect myself.  It was not anymore unreasonable for me to have trusted my partner than it is for millions of other people that trust those they are most intimately involved with every day:  I should have been able to safely do that, and it isn't unreasonable for me to be deeply affected upon learning that I couldn't and to have some intense feeling about that, or to discuss those feelings.  And, I didn't blindly trust him.  I asked the important questions and got the testing done BEFORE engaging in any unprotected sex.  I also disagree, I feel, if it was intended or not, that the comments were victim blaming.  Finally, a part of "moving on" is healing.  I was badly betrayed, and healing takes time. You are an administrator here, it is too bad you can't see that.  I thought this might be a supportive and safe environment to heal and move forward in. I can see this group is not for me, so I won't be participating any longer. 

[Jim Allen]

Hi

We are not defining you in anyway, however Tonny is not victim blame or defending what happen.  You may disagree with him that's fine, end of the day its a forum and you will have different points of view.   

My own point of view is a simple one you look you took a known risk, it did not pay off well and you became infected and I am sorry to hear that. That does not take away that yes what you partner did was wrong.

I can see this group is not for me, so I won't be participating any longer.

Look if you were expecting everybody to agree with only your view of the world  than yes its the wrong forum for you.

Whatever you do I wish you well and hope the future is happier and better for you than it has been in recent times.  I mean that.

Take care

Jim

[Greg01]

Look if you were expecting everybody to agree with only your view of the world than yes its the wrong forum for you.

No, I wasn't expecting everyone to agree with me.  But, I was thinking, perhaps, people here would be sensitive enough not to blame me, and to understand what I experienced and realize I have some legitimate and deep feelings about it.  From my perspective, the prevailing thought here is: Get into treatment, take your medicine, and accept that you are responsible for what happened to you, and be quite about that, or be reminded and blamed for the risk you took, without any deeper consideration for what the person is experiencing.  The messages here about the importance of seeking and adhering to treatment are important ones I agree with.  The insensitivity to what people experienced as a result of becoming positive, and failure to validate those feelings, instead telling them to just move on is not what one expects to find in a supportive environment.

[Greg01]

look you took a known risk

Getting tested, and trusting your partner who said he was tested and negative also is a "known risk?"  Where is it we advise people don't trust your partner?  We advise them to talk to their partner and be tested.  I did that!  I can't agree I took a "known risk."  I acted in a responsible way and did what advocates advise and was betrayed by someone I should have been able to trust.  It is unfortunate you can not see or appreciate that.

[Jim Allen]

Nobody has blamed you.

Yes, its was your own choice, and you acknowledge your responsibility a few times in the thread as well. It does not not take away from the betray of trust and I do understand the context of the choice you made.  Its heartbreaking when trust is broken  in a relationship

Getting tested, and trusting your partner who said he was tested and negative also is a "known risk?"  Where is it we advise people don't trust your partner?  We advise them to talk to their partner and be tested.  I did that!  I can't agree I took a "known risk."  I acted in a responsible way and did what advocates advise and was betrayed by someone I should have been able to trust.  It is unfortunate you can not see or appreciate that.

You like many others here took a known risk based on trust in a relationship, people do this all the time and when you are working on a long term partnership that is what you do build trust and it was broken.

I feel for you man, but it has happened, you can't change it all you can do is learn from this and move forward and I am glad you are on treatment, i'll be honest I am glad to hear the ex out of your life as he sounds like he has his own problems he needs to deal with.

Let me be clear nobody here has blamed you for what your partner did or did not do.

Sad truth is your story is not that unique, unprotected sex is a know risk for STI's and HIV, trusting someone in a relationship is a choice.  People cheat and people lie and too many of us are sadly members here because of it.

Where is it we advise people don't trust your partner?

Unprotected sex is a know risk for STI's and HIV, trust does not prevent HIV.

You are newly diagnosed, you are hurt and what happened to you sucks and it is a shitty thing for anyone to experience.

Look we both have different views on this, I am really sorry that your trust was betrayed and I am upset that the partner did not disclose to you. However I personally do not have additional sympathy for you over someone who as example was in a one night stand.

I do hope you do well and that better times and a more happier time is ahead of you. 

and failure to validate those feelings

Overall the other members have been very supportive for you and that is great.
Sorry that you don't see that.

Jim

[Tonny2]

           OJO         @GREG01

I'M SO SORRY FOR CAUSING YOU MORE PAIN, YOU ARE ALREADY DEALING WITH THE PAIN OF YOUR DIAGNOSIS AND THE BETRAYL OF YOU EX, IT WASN'T MY INTENTION....YOU ARE RIGHT, IT MIGHT BE THE BARRIEL OF THE LANGUAGE, ENGLISH IS MY SECOND LANGUAGE, I'M SORYY I DIDN'T EXPLAIN MYSELF.

THIS IS PRECISLY WHAT I MEANT ABOUT FOCUSING OB YOUR TREATMENT AND MOVING ON, AT LEAST, UNTIL YOU HAVE THE VIRUS UNDERS CONTROL. RIGHT NOW, YOUR BODY, IS GOING THROUGH A LOT OF STRESS, AND YOU ARE ADDING MORE STRESS TO YOUR BODY BY FEELING BAD ABOUT THE BETRAYAL OF YOUR PARTNER, AND NOW, LIKE I SAID, IT WASN'T MY INTENSION, NOW YOU HAVE MORE STRESS BECAUSE OF ME. NOW YOU MAKE ME FEEL BAD.

YOU ARE NOT THE ONLY ONE WHO HAS DEALT WITH LIES AND BETRAYAL, THDRD ZRD Z LOGT OF MEMBERS IN HERE, WHO TRUSTED THEIR PARTNERS. MY ADVICE FOR THEM HAS ALWAYS BEEN TO FOCUS IN WHAT WE HAVE CONTROL OF FIRST, AND THAT IS, TAKING CARE OF US, THEN, WE CAN DEAL WITHH WHAT WE DON'T HAVE CONTROL OF, IT IS WHAT IT IS, WE HAVE A VIRUS, WE TREAT IT, FORTUNALLY FOR ALL OF US, AS YOU KNOW, HIV IS NOT A DEATH SENTENCE ANYMORE...DO NOT GET ME WRONG, YOU ARE ALLOW TO CRY, SCREAM, FEEL SORRY FOR YOURSELF, WE DO FEEL BAD FOR ALL OUR NEW MEMBERS, THAT'S WHY WE TAKE OUR TIME IN REPLYING TO THEIR POSTS, BUT, AFTER YOU HAVE GOTTEN RID OF THE FRUSTRATION, WE HAVE TO THINK FORWARD, IT'S THE ONLY OPTION FOR A BETTER AND HAPPIER LIFE, BECAUSE THERE IS LIFE AFTER AN HIV DIAGNOSIS.

IT TAKE TWO TO TANGO, THE FASTER YOU REALIZED THAT YOU DIDN'T PROTEC YOURSELF (IT DOESN'T MATTER HOW YOU ADQUIERED THE VIRUS) THE BETTER FOR YOU TO CONTINUE WITH YOUR LIFE...THERE IS ANOTHER MEMBER, LIKE YOU, THAT JUST POSTED A SIMILAR STORY, GOT INFECTED KNOWLONLY, BY HIS PARTNER, WE DO FEEL BAD FOR HIM TOO, AND WE DISAPROVE THESE GUYS BEHAVIOR *YOUR AND HIS EX PARTNER), I THINK THEY DESERVE TO BE IN JAIL, BUT THAT'S ANOTHER SUBJECT. I TOLD THIS MEMBER THE SAME AS YOU, I HOPE HE DOESN'T GET UPSET TOO...MY PURPOSE ON THESE FORUM IS TO SUPPORT YOU GUYS, YOU CAN READ SOME OF MY REPLIES TO OTHE POSTS ON THIS FORUM, MY PURPOSE IN THESE FORUM IS TO SHARE MY 22 YEARS EXPERIENCE AND SUPPORT OTHERS. I APOLOGIZED IF I MADE YOU FEEL BAD.

I KNOW THAT PEOPLE WHO GOES FOR SUPPORT TO AA, THE FIRST THING THEY HAVE TO SAY IS, "I'M JOHN DOE AND I'M AN ALCOHOLIC", THIS IS THE SAME PURPOSE OF THAT GROUP, WE HAVE TO GET ON HERE AND SAY, "I'M JOHN DOE, I HAD UNPROTECTED SEX AND NOW, I'M HIV+", IT DOESN'T MATTER HOW YOU GOT IT, WE HAVE IT, AND WE ARE HERE TO SHARE EXPERIENCES, BE COMPATIONED, UNDERSTANDING, BECAUSE WE ALL WENT THROUGH THE SAME SITUATION AS YOU (GETTING THE DX), SOMTIMES WE DON'T HEAR WHAT WE WANT TO HEAR, BUT, THERE IS NOT DOUBT THAT THIS IS A SUPPORT GROUP AND I THINK IT HAS HEKP A LOT OF PEOPLE, INCLUDING MYSELF, EVEN AFTER 22 YEARS OF ME, LIVING WITH HIV, I LEARN AND GET SUPPORT WITH PEOPLE LIKE YOU.

MAY I ASK YOU, HOW LONG WERE YOU WITH THIS GUY BEFORE YOU DECIDED TO HAVE UNPROTECTED SEX WITH?...I REPLIED TO YOUR POST BASE ON YOUR ORIGINAL POST, AS I SAID BEFORE, I DIDN'T READ THE REPLIES BECAUSE IT'S DIFFICULT FOR ME TO READ ALL OF THEM, IT TOOK ME A WHILE TO READ YOUR ORIGINAL POST DUE TO MY VISION PROBLEMS...IF YOU WANT TO KNOW HOW UNFFAIR LIFE IS, LISTEN TO MY STORY...GOT HIV VIA BLOOD TRANSFUSION, FIVE YEARS LIVING WITH AIDS DUE TO TREATMENT FAILURE, LEGALLY BLIND DUE TO CMV AND HELP FROM TWO BAD SURGEON, AND STILL, I THINK I HAVE A HAPPY LIFE BECAUSE I DECIDED TO TURN THE PAGE, I DECIDED TO TAKE CONTROL OF MY LIFE AND NOT BLAMING LIFE FOR WHAT HAPPENED TO ME...I INVITE YOU TO DO THE SAME IF YOU WANT TO LIVE A HAPPY LIFE...JUST A THOUGHT...HUGS AND PLZ FORGIVE ME                                                                                               OJO

PS. BY POSTING YOUR STORY, YOU ARE, ALREADY, HELPING OTHERS, SO, PLEASE DO NOT LEAVE THE FORUMS, OTHERS MIGHT NEED YOU

BEAR WITH ME, ENGLISH IS MY SECOND LANGUAGE...COMPRENDE?

[Greg01]

Tonny,

Thank you for your reply.  Despite anything that may be lost through language barriers, your care and compassion come through loud and clear.

Clearly, it is a crisis for every person who learns they are HIV positive, regardless of how they were infected.  In some situations people do not need to assume any responsibility at all for how they got infected, yourself, for example, who was infected thru a blood transfusion.  People who are raped is another example.  It is true, that no matter how we were infected that once we are it is an unchangeable fact that we will live with, if we like it or not.  That said, being HIV positive is something we have to come to terms with, and it takes time.  The strongest message I get from this group is the message:  Get into treatment and adhere to it.  This is extremely important advice for everyone who becomes HIV positive, and I strongly support that message.

I also agree, that to find happiness we eventually all have to come to some form of acceptance that we are infected, and that is a part of moving forward so we can live a happy life.  For some of us that is going to happen sooner than others.  Having a safe and supportive place where we can discuss and vent our feelings is an important and valuable part of healing.

I do accept responsibility for being infected.  There are choices I could have made differently that would have resulted in a different outcome for me.  Not taking my ex partners word that he had been recently tested and was negative is one thing I could have done differently.  Going on PREP before having unprotected sex with him is something else I could have done.  Had I done those things I do not believe I would be in the position I am today.  I am angry about that.

I also have strong feelings about what my partner did to me.  I do believe I was exploited and victimized by him, and badly.  He clearly knew he was positive, and additionally off his medication, which means the virus was not undetectable in his body, and was in fact actively replicating in his body.  It is as my close friend told me, "It takes a person with a really black heart to knowingly do that to someone." 

I was trying to do the right things, and make good decisions to remain negative.  I am someone who has been around since the beginning of this virus, and did an excellent job of protecting myself.  I didn't go out and engage in obviously careless behavior that resulted in my becoming positive.  Had I done that owning the consequences would be easier for me, if I could say that is what happens when you casually go around having unprotected sex.  I strongly feel I should have been able to trust my partner.  I do not believe that was an unreasonable expectation.  I also believe that there are more people who would have been truthful with me under those circumstances than would have deceived me.  It takes a really broken human being to intentionally infect others, and while some people indeed are infected in this way, I do not believe that the majority of people are.  For example, people who go out and willingly and casually engage in unprotected sex with strangers are assuming a very high risk that they are solely accountable for.  Personally, I believe that is how a lot of people are infected, (not that this makes their infection any less of a crisis), but they do not have to deal with the real and legitimate pain of betrayal at the same time they are dealing with learning they are newly positive.   Also, many people who assume that risk are infected by people who do not know they are positive.  I have always believed what is responsible for the highest rates of infection comes from people who are positive but do not know their status, in those situations viral loads are high, and they can easily, frequently and unknowingly infect others.  This is why I have never been a strong supporter of criminalization, because I believe a lot of infection results between people who do not know their status and people who knowingly take risks like casually engaging in unprotected sex with people they do not know.  With people in my situation, I am coming to believe that, perhaps, criminalization should be an option.  When someone is trying to make good decisions and they are intentionally lied to and betrayed by someone who is knowingly positive and not in treatment, the individuals who practice this form of deceit deserve to face accountability for their actions and the harm it creates to those they infect.  There is no good, moral or valid reason to knowingly infect someone else, ever!

I am personally very distraught about what happened to me, and I believe my feelings are legitimate and that as a part of moving forward I must deal with them, which includes discussing them, when I want to, and where I feel safe doing it.  I thought this would be that type of environment.  For me, the message, take your medicine and suck it up and move on because now that you are positive it doesn't matter anyhow, and remember you are responsible for making yourself positive is harsh and insensitive.  To me that seems like victim blaming or victim shaming, if it is intentional or not.  Make no mistake about it, I was badly victimized and betrayed by someone I should have been able to trust.  I have feelings about that.  It is reasonable that I would have feelings about that.  I want to be in an environment where I can discuss that without being blamed or essentially told you did this to yourself so accept that and move on because your feelings don't matter and what does matter is that you get treatment and take your medicine.  My feelings do matter and so does treatment.  As a part of healing and moving forward people do have to process all that happened on their journey to becoming positive.  Personally, if I had been out there casually engaging in unprotected sex with people I did not know it would be a lot easier for me to say, I did this to myself and I would be able to move forward a lot faster. 

There is something to be learned form all situations.  In some cases it is don't practice casual unsafe sex with people you don't know.  Don't engage in high risks.  Those are important messages.  Another thing EVERYONE could learn is KNOW your HIV status, because many infections result from people who do not know their status and are positive.  In my case, perhaps, the message is if you decide to have unprotected sex with a partner do not take their word they are negative without seeing the result with your own eyes, and get on PREP because even if they are negative infidelity does exist within relationships, and so does the potential for infection. 

I feel I did assume a risk, but a lower risk.  I was betting against the betrayal of someone I loved and trusted, and expecting them to be honest with me. A great many people would have responded to that differently than my former partner did and would have been honest.  It is as I said in my initial post, I don't know who I can trust anymore, and this situation has caused me to doubt my own ability to determine who I can trust.  I am very hurt and angry about being betrayed right now, but even that feeling has been tempered because before leaving the relationship, which I think was an excellent move, I did get my former partner back into treatment.  If that scumbag of a human being had demonstrated even half the empathy and compassion that I displayed for him after learning he betrayed me I would not be in this position.  So, please, the last thing I want to hear right now is that it does not matter how I became infected, or that I am responsible for my own infection by engaging in known risks.  For me, it isn't that black and white, yet.

In closing, I'd like to say to you that I believe you did not intentionally try and be insensitive towards me, and I appreciate you taking the time to respond to me.  This is all new for me, and perhaps I am still a bit overly sensitive.  The last thing I want is for you to feel bad, and you mentioned my message had caused you to feel that way.  I want to apologize for my reaction to what you were trying to say to me.

Best,

Greg 

 

[mecch]

 Greg I think you are feeling vulnerable and confused. 

The misunderstanding here is based on interpretation of language, only.  Nobody is faulting you for trusting someone.  The point made was that the act of trusting involves risk.  Its perfectly human to trust.  The guy who lied to you did so in a VERY low and unexpected way. A real louse, yep.  How could you have anticipated that?  Its a story as old as the hills. Its not just about hiv and disease.  We want to trust certain, important, people in our lives.

Sadly, many of us will encounter a number of major deceptions and betrayals in life. The lucky ones, less of them.

So then people like to talk about human nature. Some people are more sanguine that in fact, many humans are flawed and will betray others.  Other people - that fact - that people can be shits - really doesn't sit well at all with them.  You are currently in the latter group.

Maybe its about experience or maybe its about personality - where someone falls.  Some people forgive easily and are more Lâcher prise and practical about the shitty experiences in life. Others really get shaken and stirred. 

[mecch]

Maybe try not to transfer meaning from this liar's actions onto your own identity. It wasn't an action taken because of you, for you, to punish you, etc etc. The message is, you were totally uninvolved and collateral damage for someone who has a screw loose.  Live and learn? Turn the page, and don't let the HIV destroy you or your identity going forward.

[Jim Allen]

For me, the message, take your medicine and suck it up and move on because now that you are positive it doesn't matter anyhow, and remember you are responsible for making yourself positive is harsh and insensitive.

Nobody told you to just suck it up and remember you are responsible.

What happened to you is crap, that is the truth. I think we have all expressed that to you.  Your trust was betrayed and you took a risk based on this trust, its sucks and it happens too often that people cheat and/or people lie and other people get hurt because of it.

What your ex did was terrible, unfortunately nobody can't change that and we feel for you and I hope you can lean to move forward in life, don't let this hold you back or bog you down.

To me that seems like victim blaming or victim shaming, if it is intentional or not.  Make no mistake about it, I was badly victimized and betrayed by someone I should have been able to trust.  I have feelings about that.

No one is shaming you or blaming you, nobody is saying or has said or suggested that your feelings about what has happened are wrong or incorrect, they are your feelings nobody here is telling you how you should feel or not.

However some of your posts are an over the top reaction towards people who are trying to help at times such as suggesting that they are defending what your ex did to you / what happened to you.  Its outrageous suggestion and to be honest the only reason why you have me after my initial nod back in your thread.

I get that you are hurting right now and I wish you well.

Jim   

[Greg01]

However some of your posts are an over the top reaction towards people who are trying to help at times such as suggesting that they are defending what your ex did to you / what happened to you.  Its outrageous suggestion and to be honest the only reason why you have me after my initial nod back in your thread.

Hi Jim...I see you are making judgements concerning me.  Some of my posts are "over the top," I made an "outrageous suggestion."  You quote me but fail to notice that I myself apologized in the same post you are quoting from, saying:  "This is all new for me, and perhaps I am still a bit overly sensitive.  The last thing I want is for you to feel bad, and you mentioned my message had caused you to feel that way.  I want to apologize for my reaction to what you were trying to say to me."  So, in light of that my question to you is what is the point you are trying to make?  Can't you leave well enough alone?  I'd like to ask you if you could kindly do me a favor:   Could you please just get out of this discussion, altogether.  It is about me, on a thread I initiated, and I'd greatly appreciate it.

Thank you,

Greg

[Jim Allen]

Greg

Apologizing in the same post does not excuse your behavior or what you said.
And ill remind you one of your first actions on this forum was to judge another poster.
 
Anyhow its simple you only have my attention for one reason. All you need to do is cut that out and you will no longer have my attention. Its your thread keep it civil that all you need to do.

Jim

[Tonny2]

       OJO       HELLO GREG01...I JUAT WANT TO TELL YOU, PLEASE, IF YOU CAN'T HANDLE THIS SITUATION IN YOUR OWN, SEEK PROFFESIONAL HELP...I TRIED TO GIVE YOU MY SUPPORT, AND YOU GOT IT THE WRONG WAY, AND READING YOU REPLYING TO THE MODERATOR, YOU ARE STILL IN A POSITION, WHER I THINK, I CAN'T OFFER YOU MORE SUPPORT...I WISH YOU THE BEST OF LUCK AND  I'M SENDING YOU A BIG HUG, I THINK YOU NEED IT    OJO

[Greg01]

And ill remind you one of your first actions on this forum was to judge another poster.
 
Anyhow its simple you only have my attention for one reason. All you need to do is cut that out and you will no longer have my attention. Its your thread keep it civil that all you need to do.

Jim

I felt judged, and still do.  My comments are "outrageous," "over the top," I need to "keep it civil," I should seek "professional help."  I wrote you privately.  Please, if it is at all possible, remove my thread.  I go in peace.

Best,

Greg

[Ptrk3]

Without getting into any of the back and forth, I do hope you decide to stay involved with the forums, Greg01. 

Your contributions are insightful and articulate.  I think your involvement in the forums will improve them.

[awakening]

I've been involved in this forum since middle of 2016. This forum has provided me with great comfort and reassurance during times when I worried greatly about my well-being and future. The emotional support and practical advice have helped me move forward in a positive direction.

I see some of what happened in this thread involves some misunderstandings and communication gaps, but there also seems to be an emphasis by some members of the forum on making sure that the world knows and believes that the only people who contract HIV are those who engage in "risky" behavior (unprotected anal/vaginal sex and sharing needles). The tension in this thread seems to have started when members of the forum pointed out to the OP that he took known "risks." While this may be true on a statistical level, I don't see the support value for the OP in emphasizing this fact.

When I first joined this forum I shared the fact (and it is a fact) that I contracted HIV despite consistent condom use. I will never know if a condom failed or if I contracted it another way, regardless we all know that no method other than abstinence is 100% effective. So in that sense, by participating in sexual activity at all I was taking risks, but they were considered statistically negligible risks. When I first shared my experience with the group I was essentially told by one or members of this forum that I was either lying or in denial and that 'people don't contract HIV that way.' And warned me that I was going to get the "Am I Infected?" people all worried. I think that was a very telling observation.

Perhaps members of this group want HIV-negative people to feel comfortable to be with them sexually (or otherwise) and this is understandable. I certainly do. The research shows that when on treatment and UD we are not infectious (statistically speaking). But I do have to wonder if constantly pointing out in these forums that only those who take "risks" get infected, members are in part trying to reassure the negative community that it's not dangerous to be with us as long as they avoid the "risky behaviors.' If my story worries the "Am I?" community, so be it. The OP knows how he got infected. He doesn't need anyone to tell him what happened or categorize it for him. One member summarized the issues in this thread:

The point made was that the act of trusting involves risk.

Perhaps this is true, but I struggle with seeing how pointing this out to a newly infected individual is a supportive angle to be coming from.

I have an HIV-negative partner. I would love to be able to give him 100% assurance that he will not get infected by being with me if we follow "safe sex" practices. I followed safe sex practices and it failed me. The chances are good that he won't have the experience that I did, but there are no guarantees in life.

I was ready to leave this group as well after that initial exchange about how I came to be infected, but I decided to stay and move on as I saw the value of what I could gain from the community (and give) as being stronger than the negatives about having my story be accepted. But it has been a bitter taste that lingered, that was revived by reading the OP experience here. I was enjoying reading the posts from the OP and could see clearly he had a lot to offer this group not only in terms of his experience, but in terms of the support he could offer others. I am saddened by the way this exchange went downhill.

I understand there is a role this forum plays in educating the world community about HIV. I also appreciate the fact that the forum is run by volunteers who dedicate a good part of their lives to helping others. They are volunteers and not necessarily trained therapists and everyone is doing the best they can with whatever skill sets they bring to the table.

I suggest we move the focus away from using the I Just Tested POZ and Living with HIV forums from tying to educate a wider audience and return the focus to providing the emotional and practical support and compassion that HIV infected individuals need.

I am not looking for responses nor a rebuttal to my statements, I just would like my voice to be heard. I understand it's a free forum so respond if you are so moved.

[Ptrk3]

Thank you, awakening, for your thoughts and worthy perspective on this matter.

Your point that the forums should support the individual rather than a wider audience is eminently reasonable and valid.

These forums are a safe space for everyone to put forward their thoughts in a supportive and positive manner.

Discussion and different opinions serve to make these forums a better place, though sometimes misunderstandings and miscommunications get in the way, and this is sometimes unfortunate.

I do hope that Greg01 continues to be involved and I also thank Jim for his ongoing dedication to making these forums viable (they would not exist without his dedication).

[Jim Allen]

It is unfortunate what was said here and particularly behind the scenes in the PM's & complaints on the thread.

Without going into detail accusations and complaints where made resulting in mod involvement on a thread that I myself in particular did not want to be moderating at all.  Free debate and discussion is encouraged and the "I just tested positive" promotes support, there are however limits in what people can say towards each other and it has to be a fair balance for all the members.

I do hope Greg remains, this has been made clear however he has asked for the thread to be removed something we don't.  I however do the next best thing and  lock it and if he wishes to participate it has been make clear he is more than welcome to do so.

Jim

(EDIT)
I know locking is not popular move, and we try to avoid it as much as possible in this section.