So two of my friends are dead.

[thunter34]

Found out about one of them a few weeks ago.  Just learned of the other a few minutes ago.  Josh was more of an aquaintance.  I knew Joseph better.  A very sweet man, but I could tell for some time that he was slipping psychologically.  It was sometimes difficult to hold any kind of conversation with him.


http://www.sovo.com/2007/2-23/news/localnews/6539.cfm


Felt like I should post something about them.  And it seemed timely in regard to the other threads on here currently.

[Longislander]

so sorry to hear this Tim. Lots going on by you. Please take good care of yourself.

I just read the story,what a shame~

[Nadine]

Tim, 

This saddens me deeply.  I'm at a loss for words.

(((HUGS)))

[bear60]

Its so hard when friends pass away. I'm sorry Tim.  I am still not over the death of my friend Jim this past December.  I hope you will be able to remember your friend in a good way.  Not for the pain and hurt.
When our friend Jim was admitted to the hospital they did drug tests and I did hear that he tested positive for crystal meth.  But at this point it doesnt matter anymore.  What I find so upsetting is that he was the baby of our group and now he too is gone. He was only 39 when he passed away. We had his memorial service on his 40th birthday.
Tim, I know how hard it is for you to accept his death. We want to ask ...shout....WHY!!!!!  But of course there is no adequate answer. The answer is too complicated to make it all about drugs or all about his self worth or if he was rejected by his family.

[Life]

Tim, I am sorry that you lost your friends to this thing... 

[Alain]

Sorry Tim for your loss, it's very sad.

Take care of yourself.

Alain.

[ScooterTrash]

I know that they will find the peace which all of us seek.

((((((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))))))

[Miss Philicia]

Tim, I'm so very sorry for you losses.  Keep you head up above the clouds if you can this week.

That article you linked raises a prime point, the underlying cause for overboard drug useage must be addressed in the gay community, not just the drug because I've seen that change over time.  Every friend I know who ended up with an addiction (one to meth, the other to heroin -- fortunately both are clean now) had some serious underlying psychological flaws BEFORE they started doing drugs.  Sadly mental health is not a valuable commodity in our non-nationalized healthcare system.  Gay men go through so much stuff just growing up as teens and early adults, that seriously more of them need some therapy.  And I'll lump myself in there too.  I didn't go to a psychologist until much later than I needed to.

[Lis]

very sad.... May they find peace..   

[Ihavehope]

Sorry to hear about your loss. Meth is evil.

[JohnOso]

Very sorry to hear of your loss.  I know it's tough....and i'm thinking of you.

John

[dtwpuck]

My deepest condolences.  It is a terrible thing to lose a friend, and even more terrible still to lose one to an addiction.  How very terribly sad.  My heart goes out to you.

[poet]

Tim, I, too, am sorry about this loss of friends, especially from meth.  I hope that Peter sees this or you might even p.m. it to him since he waded into this arena in NYC and tried to get attention to it.  Best, Win

[fondeveau]

I have a friend who is suffering, too.  I haven't lost him yet, but the fear of that helps me sympathize with your loss. 

[Boo Radley]

Tim,

I offer my sincere condolences on the losses of your friends. 

In my own safe little womb-world I was unaware meth use is still a big problem, and that scares me because of my ignorance but mostly because meth (as opposed to prescription amphetamines) has been in use since the 80s (at least) and it's always been bad news.  I mean, how long ago did Peter place his posters in NYC?  At least a year.

Meth is one of the nastiest drugs around and people get hooked so easily.  Looking at those 2 young men's pictures is saddening, thinking about the lives wasted in this epidemic. 

Boo

[mjmel]

Hope they released from their pains or confusions and are having some wonderful out-of-the-body adventure.
xxx,
Mike

[Dachshund]

Sincere condolences my friend, take care.

Hal

[budndallastx]

Tim, deepest condolences on your loss ...

Tom



In Memory of Those Who Died

In memory of those who died
We weep and walk away.
Tears run into swollen streams.
No trace of us remains.
Even those who grieve are gone,
And those that grieve who grieve,
And those whose lives are ravaged by
A frantic urge to be,

And those who wander silently
Among the empty rooms:
Immortality is theirs,
Though they must vanish, too.

We bear astonished witness to
The passage of the soul.
No bridge exists that can connect
Our passion to the whole.

[Fosbery]

 Hey Tim

Sorry to hear of your losses, our thoughts are with you here in Canada.

Garret.

[RobT]

Tim-
So sorry to hear about ur loss. My sincerest condolences...

RobT

[jkinatl2]

Condolences for your losses, Tim.
 

[RAB]

TH:

Deepest sympathy goes out to you. 

RAB

[RapidRod]

Sorry for your loss.

[tsw923]

Tim,

I am so sorry for the loss of your friends.  I hope that you can find some peace for yourself in this.  Please let me know if you need to talk.

Ty

[Teresa]

So sorry for the loss of your friends. You are in my thoughts and prayers.

Hugs
Teresa

[koi1]

Sorry to hear about your loss. I hate how our people are prone to these abuses. I wish there were more help out there for people with these addictions. My deepest sympathy.

rob

[Queen Tokelove]

Sorry for your loss, Thunter.

[Nico]

Tim,
Take time to remember the good times, time to reflect and time to yourself. 

Thinking of you.
Roger

[fearless]

That's such sad news. Sorry for your losses, Tim. Peace.

[skeebo1969]

  Sorry for the loss of your two friends Tim.   

[aupointillimite]

I am so sorry, Tim.

[Andy Velez]

Condolences and hugs, Tim.

Thinking of you, buddy.

[David_CA]

I can't think of much to say, but I'm thinking of you.  Take care.

David

[sweetasmeli]

Oh Tim, I'm so sorry for your losses. My condolences to you and your friends' loved ones.

Hugs & thoughts
Melia x

[Bucko]

Tim-

As one who has lost friends to drugs, I commiserate. I'm so sorry for your loss.

<hug>
Brent

[DanielMark]

My condolences, Tim.

Loss is hard enough. Saying goodbye to friends is one of the worst kinds.

Daniel

[heartforyou]

Dearest Tim,

By writing about your friends on here, you have paid tribute to them amongst people who know what it means to loose friends.

It is sad in a way, that they had meth kill them.

Take time to grieve and go out in nature a lot.
It helps tremendously in grieving.

Hermie

[anniebc]

Dearest Tim

Such a sad loss, sending you thoughts and prayers from NZ.

((((Hugs))))
Jan

[Moffie65]

Thinking of you Tim and wishing you peace in your time of loss.

Love.

[thunter34]

Thanks to everyone for the responses.  I appreciate the words of support (as always).  I have some more to say on this whole thing, but it will have to be later tonight or tomorrow.  I'm still feeling a little under the weather, but we are supposed to be celebrating my middle sister's birthday this evening.  I think it may be just the thing to help me shake some of the blahs that I have been feeling.

[ACinKC]

So sorry timmy. Remembering them is the greatest way to keep them alive in your heart.

[GSOgymrat]

I too am sorry for the loss of your friends. Thanks for including the link to the article.

Ford

[mjmel]

thunter34,
I don't mean to be crass here because this thread is of a sympathetic nature. Maybe you have had the blahs lately because
you are identifying with the wrong character here lately.  Oh no! not Hyacinth.
How about that Sheridan?

Well,....maybe you know best. I hope your sisters party does the trick.
Best Regards,
Mike

[indyguy]

My thoughts are with you during this time. I have lossed 4 friends in the last 6 years. 3 from suicide and often find myself thinking about them wondering what if. Do your best to focus on the good times and move foward although its hard I know. Very sad at such a young age. God BLess.

[Javicho]

Tim, I'm really sorry for the loss I hope you are ok let us know how you are doing, I will pray for your friends and for you as well...
Love you 

Javier

[cmhjeff]

Tim,
So sorry to hear about your friends. I often think the only good from PML is that I no longer do drugs. I never tried Meth but I can only imagine what would have happened if I did.
Take care of youself
Jeff

[marc11864]

Hello Tim. I am very sorry for your loss. All I can say is there but for the grace of God go I.

That was one of the more insightful articles that I have read on this issue.

Mr Brown makes a hugely valid point when he makes the statement that, "...any efforts to address crystal meth use among gay men will be frustrated and off-target if they don't look beyond the latest drug du jour and address the pervasive personal struggles that spur some gay men to cope via different forms of instant gratification, according to some who attended the forum."

I lived in SF for most of the last ten years where I would argue that meth is at least as pervasive an issue as HIV. It's where I absorbed both into my life. Sadly, I kept screaming as loud as I could about issues that no one cared to hear which were affecting my life as a gay man. My words continued to fall upon ears deafened by the thump of the disco beat and an overwhelmingly passive acceptance that if people shit on you, you should just learn to turn the other cheek and roll with it. Eventually, many will make a choice as did I, to deaden the pain of personal obscurity through the use of drugs and or alcohol. I would go out on a limb here and say that, meth really isn't the problem so much as it is yet another symptom. If we truly want to arrest or at least curtail the abuse of anything, we must start to define and address the real problems that cultivate and nurture this kind of behavior.

[LatinAlexander]

I am sorry... Fuck, it must be painful.

Alex

[allopathicholistic]

Hope you're okay. We should call up our old friends from time to time
((HUG((

[thunter34]

As I said, the truth is that Josh was more of an acquaintance than friend.  Joseph was the one I knew the most.  I hadn't seen him face to face since last spring or summer, I think.  Talked to him online (sort of) a time or two since.  I say sort of because I had not been able to really carry on anything resembling a conversation with him during any of the last few exchanges we had.  His speech was nonsensical and completely disjointed. 

The last few times I saw him, all I could think in my head was:  Who is with you right now?  How did you get here?  Does anyone know that you are here now?  Is anyone missing you right now?  Do you need me to get you somewhere?  Like home?  And where is home for you these days?  ...and those kinds of things.  I tried to ask those questions some, but couldn't make sense of his responses.  I ran into somewhere in town (can't remember right off where exactly) and we had one of these little chats.  We separated for a couple of minutes.  Saw him again, and it was as if he was seeing me for the first time in months- like he didn't remember at all that he was talking face to face with me 5 or 10 minutes before.  It was pretty crazy.

For some reason, it is Josh that is weighing most heavily on my head right now.  He didn't OD.  He hanged himself after a new year's binge.  As it may have mentioned in the article, he had been on and off the recovery wagon before.  Had left the city to get clean.  He came back and fell in again.  There's no opportunity for me to throw up my hands and say, "How?  How could this have happened?  If only I could have reached them!"  Why?  Because I had tweaked with both of them.  Granted, I had never supplied them with anything...but I can't hold myself up as any great beacon that could have lighted them to safety.  I might not have been the source of the problem, but I can't claim to be a part of the solution either.  I met Joseph originally through my gym at the time.  It's so strange for me to think of the contrast between who he was then and who he was just a few short years later.  He looked like a Tom of Finland picture come to life, but with the sweetest voice and smile.  I was actually kind of afraid to talk to him at first because he looked a bit intimidating...until his eyes lit up and he smiled.  I felt at ease immediately, and we talked on our stair-steppers for the next half-hour.  That became a regular chat time for us for some time after that.  Fast forward to a few years later, and I can't make sense of hardly anything he says.  I am rambling here, I know.  Sorry for that.  The thing is, Joseph was in a distressed state and it was obvious- yet so disjointed you couldn't make heads or tails of it.  And he would just appear- POOF!  on the scene, and then disappear as immediately.  You'd just be left to think, "What the heck was THAT?"  With Josh, it was another story.  It was less obvious, yet more so.  He wasn't bouncing off the walls and talking nonsense.  It was calmer, quieter.  If Joseph was an explosion, Josh seemed like a quiet snuffing out of a candle.  There was a sadness behind his eyes and in his voice- and I knew it.  I can't say that I knew that he would do what he did, but I could tell.  I can't even continue typing on this right now.  Sorry.  I am just saying that I could tell that he was being snuffed out inside.  That he was not who he wanted to be.