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Author Topic: 48 million viral load during acute hiv with fever and moderate flu like illness  (Read 17355 times)

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Offline gpapadop91

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Good morning Jim , Good morning Dave.
Thanks for this , I really needed it...
Yes it's difficult to digest this but more this waiting for something really bad is killing...

Anyways. Guys can I ask you something?
We are more susceptible to cancers and lymphomas despite the use of ART and suppressed virus??

Hematologist two months ago , she told me it was usual for PLHIV to develop lymphomas with older treatments. Now it's rare and they don't see this usually because of highly active ART.

Also Jim. Generally I told this about sleep, nutrition and exercise because... You remember I'm close to 250 cd4.
Last month I was in a position that my son had brought to home kids flu from school, wife caught it , also in same car with colleague at work with covid finally...

But drinking a lot of water, plenty of fruits, veggies , milk fat free and chicken and green leafs... I think helped my body fight and I didn't catch a cold/flu/covid. Is this a sign that immune with highly active ART works well so it can be able to fight infections and growing cancers??

Please who has some medical knowledge to answer this too to me..my grandfather died of cancer at 56 pneumonscancer because was smoking all day from his teenage..
Grandmother 80 from cancer at pancreas , she was really badly eating all life (sweets and fried everything)

Mom's parents.
Grandmother at 80 because of holis removal surgery but she caught bacteria inside hospital and died.
Grandfather 86 cancer in kidney.

Is my gene to have cancer anyways?

I mean they didn't all have cancer and at mid age!
My dad now 61 , my mom 67. They do fine.

If I'm careful I hope to reach just 60 and if I have then cancer maybe they have better treatment and save me to enjoy 1-2 or more grand children..

Is my thought correct? Will they find some lymphomas better treatment and for cancers too soon ?

What about this treatment of 54 yo who stayed off treatment with better suppressing vl OFF TREATMENT for a year from Enochian Biosciences?

Do we have some hope? Or is my desire for hope only? Is objective or subjective hope??

Food morning

Ps. Is my small pains around my good kidney which also threatens me all the time .. hope about this kidney project will become a reality soon.

Due to my low level of English language , I think I cannot some better and more accurate info about when it's about to roll out this GOD machine ...
Can someone If you have the knowledge tell me if this kind of bioartificial transplantable kidney will be able to remove ART effectively from body or it will be for general population only?

"""At best, dialysis replaces a tiny fraction of the function of a healthy kidney. For example, what do you like to eat? Steak? Potato chips? Pizza? Maybe you are a little more health conscious. Fresh tomatoes. Grapes. An orange? A dialysis patient cannot eat any of these these. The dialysis procedure cannot get rid of the wastes until it is time for the dialysis session, and during the time between the meal, the levels of waste products can rise high enough to be dangerous.""""

https://medsites.vumc.org/thekidneyproject/kidney-project

Offline gpapadop91

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Any comment here please? 🙏🙏

Offline gpapadop91

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Offline Jim Allen

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Also .. about this...

https://www.enochianbio.com/enochian-biosciences-announces-the-successful-completion-of-an-fda-pre-ind-for-a-potential-cure-for-hiv-the-second-pre-ind-in-1-month/

It's not a potential cure.

It's a potential effective long lasting treatment.
Correct?

One guy, shady details from an announcement from the companies own site... not even sure where to start but in short, I am doubtful at this stage it will be either a cure or a treatment.

We have seen people stop ART and VL drop and remain UD for months or even longer before rebounding and that's without any novel treatment like this guy had, far more and controlled data is needed to even confirm this might work. 

I would be might be more interested or take more notice once there is a peer-reviewed study published, not a company announcement and at phase 3 trials, with at least a few hundred people but that's presuming they ever even get past a phase 1 and most of these things don't.

Here is the thing, if I spent my time thinking or reading and focusing on these one-hit wonders over the years, as there seems to be one every year or so, I think I would get nowhere in life as they do happen and then they later on fall flat on their faces against control data or when repeating the results in larger and controlled environments. 

I think Dave gave a good answer to your other questions and it's worth repeating.

Hi, sorry to see you are still struggling with your diagnosis. It takes a while to absorb the news, some a short while, some longer.

Don't wait for the cancer to come, or the dementia, or Parkinson disease. Or any number of other conditions that are out there that affect anybody, not just us. Nobody living with HIV wanted to be in this position. Nobody wants any form of cancer or degenerative disease, unfortunately it happens. This is the hand we have all been dealt, we just have to play that hand the best we can.

Live healthy, important thing to do, but more importantly is to just live everyday. The biggest cause of death in the world is being born. But we have to be born to enjoy a life.

Relax and enjoy yours. Believe it or not, there are people out there who are in a worse position than you. People who would swap whatever disease they have for HIV so they could take the pills and live.

Take care, Dave



Quote
We are more susceptible to cancers and lymphomas despite the use of ART and suppressed virus??

As a group, there are medical issues that happen to us in somewhat greater numbers, although most of them reduce with ART and overall as a group it brings our lifespan to near normal. 

The other issue is "group" data. Most of these studies are lacking or include everything, a real-world example, I am an ex-smoker, alcoholic and generally don't exercise, so I have high blood pressure, had a touch of cancer and a few other health issues.

Are my issues HIV related, no, yet will some if not most studies record my data into our "group" data, yeah. Yet it simply doesn't apply to you, unless you are also a 40-year-old, with drinking problems going back nearly 20 years, high blood pressure and did not take ART for a decade + for various stupid reasons.

Finally.

There is no point in focusing on the factors we can't control. I have a feeling reading your thread a lot of the things you seem stressed about or at least raise as a concern are mostly hypothetical worries, i.e “What ifs, that have not happened, don't apply to you or things you mostly you can't change"

Good news, there are things you can control, factors like quitting smoking, reducing excessive drinking, better-balanced diets, quitting IV drug usage and more exercise. Next, is to attend your check-ups so they can detect and treat issues early, something our negative peers don't benefit from.

The sad news is you will die of something, someday and yes, this could be cancer or simply a fall down the stairs. 

Anyhow, links and references are already provided within this thread so not going to repeat them.

I do understand that you are having a hard time and I wish you well. I also know that having this diagnosis during a pandemic is a double hit and also means attending face to face support such as peer support groups is not possible in Greece but have you discussed one to one therapy/counselling options with your doctor to help you prehaps digest the diagnosis?

Best, Jim

« Last Edit: October 19, 2021, 01:52:57 pm by Jim Allen »
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Offline Jim Allen

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Sorry if I sound harsh, it's not intended.
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Offline gpapadop91

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No friend , you were not harsh. You were direct and straight. And I'm thankful and grateful to you for this.

This is true.

But to make a long story short , my concern is exactly this of Dave.... ""Nobody living with HIV wanted to be in this position. Nobody wants any form of cancer or degenerative disease, unfortunately it happens. This is the hand we have all been dealt, we just have to play that hand the best we can.""

I'm watching in this... What is the best we can do as being a member of this group to lower chances to die from hiv related illnesses..

Because I don't know if I'm thinking correct or not, even if suppressed VL , However there is the reservoir that can increase the odds of having hiv related cancers like lymphomas??

I mean , ART and suppressed VL does or doesn't mean equal chances like negative peers of same lifestyle to have hiv related issues??

And one more question similar to this if not the same... Even if they find treatment to make VL undetectable for us....even though not sterilising, but undetectable, we still have hiv related chances of serious illnesses? I.e we need only sterilising cure to be negative again or a functional cure will protect us as well from immune ageing???

Offline gpapadop91

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Jim... Also my gf left Greece unfortunately last week , and maybe she will have job in Dublin soon .. she has cousins there ..I miss her but maybe I will live with less stress and demands....

Hope to see you someday there for a beer...
Have a nice night bros...
Bye

Offline Jim Allen

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Quote
What is the best we can do as being a member of this group to lower chances to die from hiv related illnesses..

Well primarily, take your meds, suppress the virus.

Suppressing the VL and the proven better health outcomes for PLHIV, (reduction of issues and early death), is part of the reason after the START study in the mid-2000's healthcare guidelines and recommendations changed from waiting with treatment to starting treatment as soon as possible. It's currently the gold standard.

Hence in the sticky thread, I included a lot of information on this and also on managing controllable factors.

https://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=2276.0

Quote
even though not sterilising, but undetectable, we still have hiv related chances of serious illnesses?

As a group there remain certain increased risks, although many are negligible increases and we have regular reviews of our health to detect issues early for best outcomes.

To add, as said earlier what are your other factors and co-mobilities? If you are a 20 a day smoker and drink like a fish, the odds are you will have problems or problems sooner than someone who doesn't.

So again, it depends and you can focus on the controllable things in your life if you wish. Just don't get stuck on things that are uncontrollable and/or rather irrelevant as it's pointless.

Quote
I.e we need only sterilising cure to be negative again or a functional cure will protect us as well from immune ageing???

Well, we can debate the definition of a functional cure, I already have one from my own perspective, that is; A pill a day keeps AIDS away.

Anyhow, if you are thinking something like no longer having to take meds with a fully suppressed VL, I expect it's going to be a mixed result. End of the day nobody knows, if and when we have this type of functional cure we can find out, I suspect it will be like with current treatment depending on what damage has already been done.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2021, 07:52:30 am by Jim Allen »
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Offline Jim Allen

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Quote
I also know that having this diagnosis during a pandemic is a double hit and also means attending face to face support such as peer support groups is not possible in Greece but have you discussed one to one therapy/counselling options with your doctor to help you prehaps digest the diagnosis?

Not sure if you got back on this point, but if you have not considered it, I would recommend it.
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Offline gpapadop91

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As a group there remain certain increased risks, although many are negligible increases and we have regular reviews of our health to detect issues early for best outcomes.
Certain increased risks?? Like for what?

A pill a day keeps AIDS away.
I hope my 3 pills a day will keep aids away.

Quote
Anyhow, if you are thinking something like no longer having to take meds with a fully suppressed VL, I expect it's going to be a mixed result.
What exactly do you mean by "mixed results"

Quote
I suspect it will be like with current treatment depending on what damage has already been done.
Meaning? Can you please provide me with a bit more detailed answer of your thought?

Thanks 👍
🙏

Offline Jim Allen

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Quote
Certain increased risks?? Like for what?

Well plenty examples given in the sticky thread, but another example and it also talks correctly about lifestyle choices being a factor.

https://www.contagionlive.com/view/people-living-with-hiv-at-higher-risk-of-other-diseases

Quote
What exactly do you mean by "mixed results"
Meaning? Can you please provide me with a bit more detailed answer of your thought?

Sure currently some (too many) people still start treatment late, some people start too late  :'( and others only start after problems have already occurred.

I suspect this will not change and that their outcomes statistically will remain somewhat behind those that start treatment early.

However, I also clarified my thoughts on a functional cure and the outcomes, this I will repeat:

"End of the day nobody knows, if and when we have this type of functional cure we can find out, I suspect it will be like with current treatment depending on what damage has already been done"

You should really read the sticky thread. No point wondering how well a function cure will impact long term health though until we have it and that might be never or next year, who knows.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2021, 12:21:15 pm by Jim Allen »
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Offline gpapadop91

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Hellooo can I ask something again?
Last days again I have discomfort to my good performing kidney.. so I was searching and I read this... After I have solution for my kidney problem , then I have to be careful of managing th chronic inflammation only...

https://pharm.ucsf.edu/kidney/device/faq
Please see question 7.

Asks about if some polycystic patients will be candidates for the new bioartificial implantable kidney...

So my wondering nature challenges me to ask..
If this becomes a reality soon, will HIV patients be eligible candidates to take and implant one to themselves??

Offline Matths

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What happened to you talking to a psychotherapist?

Offline gpapadop91

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What happened to you talking to a psychotherapist?
Good morning at first ..
Why do you ask me such question here?

Offline Matths

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Good morning. I was asking this question because you may recall that we talked about the obvious huge stress that emerged when you started your conversations here in this forum. You had brought up and keep bringing up many reasons why your future could be early “terminated” by numerous medical problems that could arise because of the HIV diagnosis. I believe to remember that you had, not surprisingly because it happens to most, if not all of us in the situation of being diagnosed with HIV, that you experienced anxiety and multiple fears and distress. And at that time several people here, including myself, had suggested that you may benefit from seeking professional psychological help to mitigate your anxiety.

Since then you have made many contributions to this forum all of which have medical problems as topic. The for me noticeable omission was any mention of psychological support that you may or may not have at this time of your life. That’s why I was asking and was curious to hear if you felt it is helpful (in case you have psychological support). Best Matt

Offline gpapadop91

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Hellooo I'm here for giving and taking support... At this early stage after my diagnosis I need more talk and confirmation from all you and medical maybe persons here...
That we will succeed to have some good quality of life until 60-70.
Now I have these kidney pains hoping to soon have this artificial kidney.

But nobody knows or answers me this...
We , plhiv , will we be candidates for taking one when it comes?

Offline Grasshopper

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@Matths: I agree, I made the same suggestion quite a while ago.

@Gpapadop91 : I have been on antivirals for like forever....and I am doing just fine.

"Enjoy life today, because yesterday is gone and tomorrow is never promised"
« Last Edit: October 22, 2021, 10:07:50 am by Grasshopper »

Offline virgo313

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Hello Gpapadop91,
No one can correctly answer to you regarding ur kidney pain. Only a dr can answer what may cause these pains only after they check u.
Here u get support but no one here can give your your proper “medical report”.

Don’t get us wrong that we don’t support but there are limit what we can advise. Example: your actual health conditions. That part has to come from your own Dr.

Visit your Dr for ur kidney pains & share with us what ur Dr think it is.
Tks
RVD Nov 2015. VL --> Log 5.32 HAART on 23/11/15
TDF+FTC+EFV / Chemo KS - 25/11/15 - 20/01/16.
CD4 - 4 (3/11/15) / VL - 225,000

Offline Jim Allen

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Look I think at the start of this thread you mentioned pre-existing kidney issues and pains, we did mention you need to talk to your healthcare provider about this discomfort.

As for the device, I don't see why you need it and by the time you might, it could be obsolete already, however, the doctors currently providing you with care for your renal issues might know the answer to your question. I know in the thread we already covered that transplants are also possible nowadays between people living with HIV.

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Offline CircularNatural

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Good morning there.

Even with a better (seem to..) immune now, I have this oral thrush for a week already today... Should I worry for some precancerous condition or is it something that will be resolve itself???

It's only 1-2 sq cms between cheek and gums ..
Should I go to dentist, stomatologist?
Or to my hiv clinic?

Maybe it's from ART?

Here in Argentina, oral thrush (candidiasis) is generally treated with a Nystatin 100.000 IU solution that you gave to keep it in your mouth and make gargles with it for about 5 minutes and then spit it. This is meant to be done every 6 hours for at least 5-7 days.
Did your MD give you treatment for it?https://www.webmd.com/drugs/2/drug-8893-8206/nystatin-oral/nystatin-suspension-oral/details
🇦🇷 "Hope is the only thing stronger than fear."

Offline CircularNatural

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Hellooo I'm here for giving and taking support... At this early stage after my diagnosis I need more talk and confirmation from all you and medical maybe persons here...
That we will succeed to have some good quality of life until 60-70.
Now I have these kidney pains hoping to soon have this artificial kidney.

But nobody knows or answers me this...
We , plhiv , will we be candidates for taking one when it comes?

You need to see an urologist for your pain. They will probably go for an ecographic scan and see if you have any calculi or "sand". You can get treatment for this afterwards such as ultrasound to break the calculi.
You need to organise yourself first, though.
Continuing with HAART and ID doctor's advises is top priority.
But you also need to get help with your health and generalized anxiety issues. We all understand these are hard times for you, you are also facing some personal / relationship issues as well, so going for psychotherapy and/or psychiatric appointments would really help you out. We really mean this well, please take it into account.
Take care
🇦🇷 "Hope is the only thing stronger than fear."

Offline gpapadop91

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Hi Circular..
I'm on ART exactly 4,5 months.
Tomorrow, in 8 hrs,  is my tests for after a three month period.
And then I will have again in 6 months from now.

Need cure... I'm too stressed. I don't wanna this fucking virus inside me.. such a science and nothing?
I'm fine but I want to delete this from ourselves.

Guys... Good night to all.
Hugs and sweet dreams

Offline gpapadop91

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Ηi.. they just took me blood for tests...

Can I ask you something?
You all here are my hope.
My doctor is good
But today along with my doctor there were students doctors and after I finished the other immunologist doctor who teaches them...after I was ready to leave something told to students doctors, showed something on my paper and then they looked at me.. don't kid with me...but I know to translate behaviours..it's my job for 16 years. She told them something like looking at me like soon I'm going to die soon, like poor boy, like something strange... I understood and I asked them IS IT SOMETHING I SHOULD WORRY ABOUT??
She then told me , No I just show the initial Viral load..

Anyways. My question to all. You here..is...
I am crazy or them??? Why? Because if it's something bad they should tell me to know...

Anyways. They saw example previous week with someone 9 cd4.  They talked like miracle that he lives yet. Still.

So if really they looked at me like poor because I had so high viral load 48 millions , isn't logical that I'm stressed s bit? Should I forget them and think this what you all told me here?
I mean that if I am undetectable so early from 48 millions , everything will be fine?
With these meds I really feel safe and better than the moment I first wrote here 4 months ago.

Have a good day.

Offline Jim Allen

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Quote
They saw example previous week with someone 9 cd4.  They talked like miracle that he lives yet. Still

Why would it be a miracle?? Happens all the time, I'll post some numbers for the EU & Greece later today.

Quote
IS IT SOMETHING I SHOULD WORRY ABOUT??
She then told me , No

You already have the answer.

No point stressing about how students still wet behind the ears react to pretty standard stuff.




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Offline Jim Allen

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Did you talk to your doctor about these ongoing fears and stress?? Did you talk about getting support in that area of your health??
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Offline gpapadop91

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Getting wet... Hahaha

Just to tell you something..
Because my doctor visits the yearly conferences about HIV.

It's usual last years that patients (he told in absence of ART) decrease faster their cd4 count than what it was a decade ago...

It's something he pointed out , explanation still doesn't exist.

About my health issue meaning the mental...
I'm living all my life with almost one kidney.

I did stupid things in past with proteins , creatine's in bodybuilding.

Now I'm taking ART. One of the most long run side effects is kidney disease.

Shouldn't I worry?

However he told me he foundme now a bit better than before.

And should I tell you all something here?

It's pity because I was doing well in my life. Success was close .. I could see some siblings even envy my family and my progress .. it's pity to think that with my illness I will make them happy.

Yes I shouldn't care. But..

Offline gpapadop91

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All had low-level viral loads below 80 copies/ml and none met the criteria for resistance testing. Five of the seven people with virologic failure had a high viral load (above 100,000 copies/ml) at baseline. Only one additional participant experienced virologic failure between weeks 48 and 96.

So me having 48 millions...at baseline...
Shouldn't I worry more than normal that I will not achieve a viral suppress on the long run , that I will have failure if they find a functional cure , that I will have some cancer soon????

https://www.aidsmap.com/news/oct-2020/islatravir-plus-doravirine-remains-effective-96-weeks

Offline Jim Allen

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Hiya,

Quote
Shouldn't I worry more than normal that I will not achieve a viral suppress on the long run , that I will have failure if they find a functional cure , that I will have some cancer soon?

Short answer, no and I don't see the relevance of the doravirine link, it's not meds that you are taking.

Anyhow, this is something we also discussed on the first page of this thread.

You had a viral load, it's not special, you started treatment and the viral load is now suppressed. Keep taking the meds, keep going for check-ups to monitor.

Quote
that I will have failure if they find a functional cure

I don't see why, but let them first find a functional cure and after that, we will see. The type of functional cure you have in mind might never happen.

Jim
« Last Edit: October 25, 2021, 12:36:53 pm by Jim Allen »
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Offline gpapadop91

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Ιt will happen... This from Einstein institute or the Crisprs ..
Meaning a functional cure Jim to avoid taking daily ART to save money kidney on the long run.

Even this with lenacapavir injected twice a year it will be fine.

But let me first show you why I'm worrying. Of course this article doesn't refer to my meds.
But many articles about studies refer to baseline VL.
So with me , that I had maybe from the highest vls ever seen, shouldn't I worry that everything will be a disaster?

Today famous politician woman died from cancer at 55 years.
I want to be protected from cancer...

I'm scared after today's talks with each other between doctors.

Guys...what is my baseline? Because almost everyone in acute phase had thousands at least viral load if not a handful millions. Was mine really 48 millions? So how it could be suppressed within a month of art initiation??

Offline Jim Allen

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Quote
I want to be protected from cancer...

I think most people would like that regardless of HIV status. However, no such protection exists to my knowledge.

You can try to make better lifestyle choices ect, but that's about it.

Quote
Ιt will happen...

Maybe, maybe not. We will see but until it's a reality no point in betting on it or worrying about it.

Quote
So how it could be suppressed within a month of art initiation??

With ease, many of us started with counts in the multiple millions as we waited for our CD4's to deplete or our health to decline to the point we would (finally) start treatment.

It wasn't until the mid-2000's that they figured treating at diagnosis regardless of the numbers was best and it took a lot longer for nations to adjust treatment guidelines.

Quote
So with me , that I had maybe from the highest vls ever seen, shouldn't I worry that everything will be a disaster?

You don't have the highest ever seen, mentioned this on the 2nd page of this thread and no your baseline does not mean everything will be a disaster. 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4680573/

Quote
I'm scared after today's talks with each other between doctors.

Do you mean the students talking to each other and the doctor who explained to you it was nothing to worry about? It's nothing to worry about.


Quote
Today famous politician woman died from cancer at 55 years.

Yeah, that's sad, nothing to do with you.

On the 14th of October, my ex passed away aged 37 years old, the news hit me like a brick, I only spoke to them the night before it happened.

We will all die someday of something, just because someone died at 37 or 55 does not mean you will or I will, that said I could fall down the stairs tomorrow and you could have a heart attack from the stess/anxiety that you don't have under control. 

Quote
Did you talk to your doctor about these ongoing fears and stress?? Did you talk about getting support in that area of your health??

?

« Last Edit: October 25, 2021, 01:53:59 pm by Jim Allen »
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Offline Grasshopper

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@Jim:
"On the 14th of October, my ex passed away aged 37 years old, the news hit me like a brick, I only spoke to them the night before it happened."

WHAT ?????
My condolences
And your kids are with you now ?

Ik schrik hiervan, en je hebt er nergens over gerept
Sterkte


Offline Jim Allen

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@Jim:
"On the 14th of October, my ex passed away aged 37 years old, the news hit me like a brick, I only spoke to them the night before it happened."

WHAT ?????
My condolences
And your kids are with you now ?

Ik schrik hiervan, en je hebt er nergens over gerept
Sterkte

Thanks and I also apologize, I should have mentioned in my comment that it's not the ex I have the kids with, but the ex before her.

Funny enough the three of us were friends for many years and remained friends. So were all hurting at the moment.
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Offline Grasshopper

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Oke, relieved that she was not the mother of your kids. Nevertheless a big loss.

Offline gpapadop91

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My heart full condolences to you Jim .. wish you have a long life to remember her ..🙏🙏🙏🙏
Wishes for a good day...

Offline gpapadop91

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Jim...as for the article that you sent me with the link above about Viral Load  ...
It's written inside..

Viral loads of over 100 000 copies/mL at the start of ART are linked with a greater likelihood of disease progression.

So , I am 480 fold higher at the stray of ART .. so???

Offline Jim Allen

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Quote
Viral loads of over 100 000 copies/mL at the start of ART are linked with a greater likelihood of disease progression.

So , I am 480 fold higher at the stray of ART .. so???


No, you are focusing out of context. 

That comment relates to a 2002 publication, a lot has changed since this although it supports the treat sooner changes that happened after newer studies in the mid-2000s found that to be the better outcome instead of waiting as they did in the years before and below I copied out the section that the comment is in. 

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12126821/

Quote
Baseline HIV-1 viral load was associated with a higher probability of progression only if 100,000 copies/microL or above. Other independent predictors of poorer outcome were advanced age, infection through injection-drug use, and a previous diagnosis of AIDS. The probability of progression to AIDS or death at 3 years ranged from 3.4% (2.8-4.1) in patients in the lowest-risk stratum for each prognostic variable, to 50% (43-58) in patients in the highest-risk strata.

Interpretation: The CD4 cell count at initiation was the dominant prognostic factor in patients starting HAART. Our findings have important implications for clinical management and should be taken into account in future treatment guidelines.

You are relatively young, don't have an AIDS-defining illness, you are not using injection drugs, you are taking modern ART with a fully suppressed VL with an increasing CD4 count now above 200 copies.

Now, nobody can predict the future, but all in all, things look good from that perspective for you.  See the sticky thread with the relevant links.

Take your meds, and if you want to live healthier you could cut out any bad habits, eat well, exercise and look after your mental well being.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2021, 03:35:51 am by Jim Allen »
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Offline gpapadop91

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Thanks Jimm..

But this..???

"""Baseline HIV-1 viral load was associated with a higher probability of progression only if 100,000 copies/microL or above'""

So? Does it mean if you leave it and not start ART?
Or Regardless the use of ART it will progress anyways because it was 480 * this number!!!!????

Again stressed.
I had started taking it easy last period...

What the f@k?

Offline Jim Allen

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But nothing, you need to stop this.

You already know that more modern studies show near-normal life expectancies, that lifestyle choices and co-mobilities are a factor and what you can do to lead a healthier life if you so wish.

Yet you are focusing on a single line of text out of context, from a review in 2002 over past studies so at the time data from the mid 90's when treatment and treatment guidelines had only just started.

The data is over 25 years old and even at the time, the context was that with treatment, lifestyle choices, AIDS-defining illnesses when starting treatment and other co-mobilities were also a factor in the survival rate. These things are still factors but we can treat health issues better and screen for them as well, also treatment for HIV itself has vastly changed.

Sadly, there are always going to be people who start treatment too late and there will always be a % who die young with HIV. 

There is no logical reason to believe you are one of those and we have discussed this as much as I can.

Many forum members have told you their stories to help you digest your situation and I have provided you with more up-to-date resources as reassurance. You need to talk to your healthcare provider about these ongoing or repeating fears and get professional mental & emotional support to help you cope.



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Offline gpapadop91

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Article from WebMD.com

What the Results Mean
A high viral load is generally considered about 100,000 copies, but you could have 1 million or more. The virus is at work making copies of itself, and the disease may progress quickly.

My clear answer that I'm so desperately want is this...

The above statement is true regardless the successful ART?
Does it mean it will progress sooner or for sure to AIDS and that although art is successful now , sometime my hiv type/system combination will make my disease progress sooner and overtake the benefits of my pills?

Offline gpapadop91

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Jim I am really grateful to all you. Today my wife told me she admires me how easily I have taken this. And that she would have suicide if she was in my position.

But I have not clear information to do my program and choices. Believe me I had good life. Fought hard but I mean I enjoyed my life well and still doing...
I have not problem to die young. I don't want to die from cancer melting on a bed and lose my self esteem and respect.

Also if I know that my disease will progress soon , I will make different choices. I will spend all my time with family.
But if I know it's nea data and new studies show different tngs , I'm continuing to create for my family , work, have dreams etc...

So it's important to know...

So I'm confused. That's why I'm asking.
All this is old and outdated info??

But someone to know if baseline HIV is more strong even than modern effective art ???

Offline Jim Allen

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You have really clear information, access to first-line treatment and healthcare.

You are just focusing on outdated stuff or out of context text, stressing about students who know nothing, and sadly the few % of people that even with access to treatment indeed don't live that long but again you are doing this out of context and feeding your fears.

Stop reading up on stuff because you are not gaining any wisdom or insights from it, instead see your healthcare team and consider talking to a qualified therapist about these fears.

Quote
The above statement is true regardless the successful ART?

No, the short answer is that successful HIV treatment suppresses the viral load and halts its progression, and the immune system starts to heal.

The slightly longer answer is HIV treatment does not address all aspects, this is true. An example, ongoing inflammation that may result in some generally manageable conditions coming up earlier in PLHIV lives than seen in their negative peers. 

https://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=2276.0

« Last Edit: October 26, 2021, 04:36:58 am by Jim Allen »
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Offline Jim Allen

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I don't want to die from cancer melting on a bed

Nobody does, but we all have to die from something at some time. In the meantime, all we can do is make the best lifestyle choices we can where possible to reduce our risks.
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Offline gpapadop91

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Ok.
But why do you think a therapist can help me?
Only a specialist in HIV can help me.
And I don't know if you are specialistbin hiv but you indeed helped me a lot.

A question please. Why some people even with access to art die soon? What are the explanations about this?

Offline Jim Allen

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Why some people even with access to art die soon? What are the explanations about this?

You know the answer, I've posted it half a dozen times in this thread.

Late diagnosis when damage is already done, AIDS-defining illnesses, co-mobilities, drugs, drink, lifestyle issues etc, etc. 
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Offline Jim Allen

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But why do you think a therapist can help me?
Only a specialist in HIV can help me.

Why do you think only an HIV specialist can help you? They are done, you are on treatment, VL is suppressed, they will only monitor your checkups, and they are not going to help you with the mental aspect of your HIV diagnosis and learning to cope/live with this.

P.S I am not the only forum member to have suggested this. We're suggesting this because we care and mental health and well-being is a huge aspect of coping with a diagnosis and living with HIV.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2021, 05:10:06 am by Jim Allen »
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Offline gpapadop91

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I only want them to help me with true prognosis based on new studies , the new art meds I take , my data ...

Not with mental health...

Jim... I think I found what I needed...

In the same article later on....

Look..
Talking about cd4 counts. All is said below...
IF ART IS NOT INITIATED
Quote
Your test results help your doctor know how much damage has been done to your immune system and what's likely to happen next if antiretroviral treatment  (ART) is not initiated.

_____

Then .. here....
Quote
A viral load that can't be detected -- less than 20 copies -- is always the goal of HIV treatment. This doesn't mean you're cured. Unfortunately, the virus is still able to survive in various cells in the body.  But maintaining an undetectable viral load is compatible with a normal, or near-normal life span.  Continuing to take your medicine as prescribed to keep the virus undetectable is very important..

Offline gpapadop91

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Finally my tests on this hospital have reference limit the 20 not the 40,50 or 100.

Makes sense I had less than 20??


So my last to worry about is my cd4.
Because I read on multiple articles , and I think you told me too... The most important is the cd4 ability to rise again on suppressive virus....
Correct?

If I still have 200-300 ... I should stop hoping for long lifespan...
Let's see...

Offline Jim Allen

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Glad you have the answer, we provided all of this already within the first few pages of this thread.

Anyhow, I still would encourage you to speak to a psychotherapist. You could find it very helpful and gain some perspective & coping skills.

Quote
The most important is the cd4 ability to rise again on suppressive virus....

Not really, again context. Anyhow, in short, CD4 count is not a measurement of health and as your count is above 200 (14%) and your VL is suppressed, it's rather irrelevant going forward.

This was also discussed in the first few pages of this thread so ill just reference that.
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Offline Jim Allen

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Finally my tests on this hospital have reference limit the 20 not the 40,50 or 100.

Makes sense I had less than 20??

Yup, most modern labs will have a threshold of 50 or 20 nowadays.

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Offline gpapadop91

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Again here..
Good evening how are all you?

I had before contracting the virus some two small lymphs touchable in my left side of neck...and one small but bit bigger than each on the left...

Now they are a 10% bigger , all three, touchable , not seen and not as big as they were during my acute phase in May.

Should I think it will become a lymphoma sometime ?
Because even before , it was always there...last ten or 12 years..

Forgot to inform you that during seroconversion I had some pain when moving my eyes totally left or right to the end and not see well from there .. maybe it was associated with the latent CMV that I had before contracting this.

Guys  ,see you and good night.
🙏🙏🙏🙏 God bless you all.

I have to tell you that without you all here I wouldn't be so well... Maybe you hear me not well but it's only six months having this with scary numbers ... So I need time.
But you cannot imagine how much you offered to me.

Before I take my 1st months results , I cannot explain how I kept myself from suicide , I was totally panicked and couldn't believe that my viral load could ever fall undetectable.

Jim , Matt, Mike , Leatherman grasshopper all of you sorry if I forgot someone , you saved me.

After experience, my lesson is this now..my knowledge I mean.
I lost my life wondering and worrying so much the first month, finally.

Guys , I thought a question now..
All these stories from your that give us a hope...
Is the exception of the rule not the rule, correct?
Or is it the rule with the modern meds.?

Bye guys...
Good night

 


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