POZ Community Forums
Meds, Mind, Body & Benefits => Lipodystrophy & Metabolic Problems => Topic started by: GSOgymrat on June 05, 2006, 02:28:18 am
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I've been asked to repost the link to my lipoatrophy page:http://home.triad.rr.com/lipoatrophy/My_Lipoatrophy/Page_1x.html (http://home.triad.rr.com/lipoatrophy/My_Lipoatrophy/Page_1x.html)
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:o
I have just been viewing your site. The results are absolutely fabulous and I am sure this will help others take a decision.
Jacques
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Hello Ford,
Thanks for reposting this....
Ray
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Very natural results. But you were handsome even with lipoatrophy. ;)
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Thank you so much for making your personal experience available for me to view. You have imazing strength and courage and you give me hope. I am going on 21 years "living" with the virus but recently found out I am resistant to 19 out of the 25 or so meds that are out there. So I start a new journey in my life, new meds, new side effects, and a new outlook . . . but a positive one. Thank you. ;)
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Here we go again...
As posted previously I went to Rio to have PMMA injections administered in my face and butt by Dr. Serra for lipoatrophy. The treatments I had for my face were on my cheeks and temples. I had told Dr. Serra I was also unhappy with the furrows between my eyebrows. He said he could not use PMMA in that area and recommended I see a doctor in the U.S. for silicon microdroplets. He said silicon is an excellent filler but is verboten in Brazil because of irrational fears from the days of silicon breast implants.
I was looking for a doctor who had experience with silicon and Doug3206 on this forum recommended Dr. Harvey Abrams in Los Angeles. I have friends in Los Angeles and decided to see Dr. Abrams for a consultation. When I saw Dr. Abrams I explained what treatments I had done, why I was interested in silicon and showed him my photos. He said he was going to be honest and direct with me and that in his opinion my brow was not the major problem. He said that my face, while obviously improved, was too flat and needed more filler. He pointed out areas where he felt I needed more filler.
Let me take an aside briefly explain how most of these fillers, including Sculptra, PMMA and silicon work. The fillers are tiny objects suspended in a fluid that are injected into your skin. Your body reacts to these tiny particles and produces collagen to protect the skin, similar to the way an oyster creates a pearl from a little grain of sand. This reaction creates the filling effect in your skin. With PMMA and silicon the particles stay there. With Sculptra the particles are absorbed by the body, which is why the effects of Sculptra are temporary.
The reason I describe this is because your body doesn't always react to these fillers evenly. I had recognized after my 2ND PMMA treatment had stabilized that I probably could have gone for a 3rd treatment because my cheeks were rather flat and I had a natural line on the left side of my face that didn't quite match the right. This took about a month the show up and frankly no one would have noticed it except me-- and a plastic surgeon.
My face looked fine to me, especially given how I looked before, and I wasn't going to fly to Rio again for a more filler. But here I was in Dr. Abrams office and he said it could be easily fixed. Of course he hit one of my insecurity buttons when he told me that people in North Carolina might not recognize my facial lipoatrophy but people in West Hollywood could.
So in a fit of vanity and indulgence I agreed to have silicon microdroplets added to my cheeks, temples and between my eyebrows. Unlike Dr. Serra, Dr. Abrams used anesthetic injections in my face which made the procedure relatively painless. The process went by very quickly since he didn't have to build my face up like Dr. Serra did. This treatment cost $800.
Afterwards my face felt very full and it seemed to take longer to go down then the PMMA injections. I was concerned because I had to return to work 2 days later and at that time my face was still obviously fuller than when I was last at work. No one knows my status and I wasn't looking forward to explaining my new face. So I pulled the same trick as when I had PMMA and shaved off my beard. People were commenting on how much younger I looked without the beard. One of my coworkers even commented on how it was amazing that just shaving my beard off made the whole shape of my face look different.
It's been 5 days since the treatment and I know my face won't stabilize for about a month. Dr. Abrams wants me to return for a follow up after a month. Right now my face is fuller and smoother than it was immediately after my PMMA treatments. Unfortunately my partner has been traveling out of the country and hasn't seen the results. I thought he would freak out when I told him I had my cheeks and temples done but he seemed to think it was a good idea.
Honestly I can see this silicon treatment is a definite improvement but I feel a little guilty about it. When I had PMMA I felt I was correcting a real problem and I had, and still have, zero regrets about doing it. With the silicon I feel like I didn't really need to do it. PMMA was about looking normal and silicon is about looking good and somehow I'm a little embarrassed by that.
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man, do not let yourself feel guilty whatsoever
if you feel better about yourself because of it, then it is a success, IMO
congrats...you look great...thanks for posting this...gives people suffering from lipo (or those afraid of getting lipo in the future) much better about the potential "fixes" to the problem
you look really good
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Hi and thanks so much for sharing your experiences! This helps a lot others who consider facial filler treatments. I have read everything on your site and also your last experience with silicone in the US and I would like to ask something I was confused about. You said on your page that dr. Serra did inject you with silicone in between your brows (which to your surprise wasn't painful) but now you say that dr. Sierra did not inject you with silicone and so you had it done in the US. I swear I am not trying to be hairsplitting here :-), I just didn't quite understand who did it in the end. Thanks for the clarification. Take care.
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WOW
Excellent site Gym
I am learning more and more about living with HIV more on this site than any other place. You look ALOT BETTER after treatment. You didn't look all that bad before the treatment but wow it is a difference. Your experience will help many of us here.
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Hi and thanks so much for sharing your experiences! This helps a lot others who consider facial filler treatments. I have read everything on your site and also your last experience with silicone in the US and I would like to ask something I was confused about. You said on your page that dr. Serra did inject you with silicone in between your brows (which to your surprise wasn't painful) but now you say that dr. Sierra did not inject you with silicone and so you had it done in the US. I swear I am not trying to be hairsplitting here :-), I just didn't quite understand who did it in the end. Thanks for the clarification. Take care.
Dr. Serra put a drop of silicone in my brow. He said microdroplet silicone is an excellent filler but he can't use it with his Brazilian patients because the government won't pay for silicone due to unfounded fears related to breast implants.
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As everyone else has stated...
Thanks for posting and the results are great!
Of course, when you're that sexy to begin with it makes the doctor's job pretty easy.
:P
Take care, Pip
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HEY FORD,
I ALSO SAW DR. SERRA AND FOUND HIM TO BE VERY CONSERVATIVE IN HIS ADMINISTRATION OF PMMA IN MY FACE. I DON'T WANT TO GO BACK TO RIO, ITS QUITE A HASSLE. I HAVE SEEN YOUR PHOTOS ON YOUR WEB PAGE BUT I'D REALLY LIKE TO SEE WHAT YOU LOOK LIKE AFTER YOUR SILICON TREATMENT BY DR. ABRAMS. DO YOU HAVE A PHOTO?
CHEERS!
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well i'm off to tijuana next friday for my "precise treatments " and i'm really excited this time since they will have a van pick me up at hte airport and take me directly to the clinic and then back to my hotel.i've been thru this before and the actual procedure wan' too bad but i did dread having to find my own way to the clinic.it can be a little scarey crossing the border .
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ARMANDO,
ARE YOU GOING TO CASAVANTES OR CLINIC ESTETICA? WHO DID YOUR PREVIOUS WORK? WERE YOU SATISFIED?
THANKS,
DARIN
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Dr. Abrams was also my Dr., same product, injected twice, nearly 4 years ago. Fine treatment.
8) -megasept
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darin,i had bio almid performed at CLINICA ESTETICA ABOUT 3 YRS ago and was very satisified but i never went back for a second treatment.I heard that they are now using PRECISE ,which is suppossed to give better results and it is PERMANENT!!!THEY ARE SO VERY HELPFUL AND THEY COMPLETELY PUT ME AT EASE AND I APPRECIATE THAT!!.I HAD SCULPTRA DONE ABOUT 4 YRS AGO AND THAT WAS A WASTE OF GOOD MONEY,IT ONLY LASTED ABOUT 6 MONTHS !!
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Dr. Serra put a drop of silicone in my brow. He said microdroplet silicone is an excellent filler but he can't use it with his Brazilian patients because the government won't pay for silicone due to unfounded fears related to breast implants.
Thanks for the clarification!
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Ford's site helped me chose PMMA to any other filler on or off the US market. Yesterday (March 3rd) was my second "tough up" session. I have the last one on April 14th. With my first invasive treatment last January 21st, I was happy with the results but the doc said let's make something good "perfect". My cheekbones were retouched to lift them a bit more and he worked this time from said bones towards the ear area. It always is painful in spite of the topical anesthesia he uses. This isn't easy people and you really have to be brave and tolerate pain. My pain toleration level is higher than normal people can take, even the doc said I was a warrior because bigger and stronger men have even cried and told him to stop the injections for a while. It is VERY uncomfortable. The results are amazing and you WILL forget about the pain after getting off the chair. The benefit about PMMA is that it is permanent and touch ups after the first 2-3 are not necessary unless you are obsessed with your face. My 3 fillings have a 6 week gap between each so I'm almost finished. I might post pictures but since we can't remove the pics after 48 hours I'm sort of afraid to put them for you all to see. I'm still thinking about it. I might just post them for a day and a half and then proceed to remove them but I really don't know when I will do that. Just be on the look out for the title which will be something like "Got my old face back" or "Catman's Facial Filling". It will be during a weekend because many do log in on those days. I will say that PMMA's cost will RISE when approved in the USA. In my opinion many money minded doctor's who use temporary fillers will not like the introduction of PMMA because people may lean towards a permanent solution to facial lipo and these docs will loose their opportunity to make more money out of the poor patients who really need this procedure. It's like a mechanic, they really prefer people's cars to keep breaking down for them to get that client back and charge them for another fix. Get it?
So far I've had 100cc's injected because my facial lipo was pretty serious in spite that my body weight was fine. My doctor is familiar with Dr. Sierra and they have met before. Even he says that Sierra is a genius in this matter. Ford made a wise choice in using PMMA and I back him up. Wish you guys could only see me in person. I even fooled MY personal doctor on my last visit. He had thought I gained some 7 pounds because it looks so natural! I didn't tell him about the filling but I will on my next appointment in May. He said "you're eating a lot , right?" I just giggled and said, "Uh, huh".
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HEY CATMAN,WHERE DID YOU HAVE YOUR PROCEDURE AND WHO DID IT?HOW MUCH MUCH DID YOU PAY FOR EACH CC?
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ARMANDO,
Thanks for answering my last question. i am trying to decide between going to casavantes or morales. i would love to see your photos after your trip to mexico.
thanks,
darin
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HEY CATMAN,WHERE DID YOU HAVE YOUR PROCEDURE AND WHO DID IT?HOW MUCH MUCH DID YOU PAY FOR EACH CC?
I had a very hard time finding a doctor who did such a treatment in P.R. I went to a Plastic Surgeon but he didn't work with any filler and the "WISE GUY" said he could do the same with collagen injections. Right, like if I was a dork and wasn't informing myself through other sources. I got out of there as quick as the wink of an eye. At the clinic where I get my meds my doc told me of another doctor who is really a Family Physician but who is building a great reputation by fixing the faces of hiv positive persons with lipo. Another person (who I had been chatting with on the Positive dating page) also recommended the doc because he had taken a girl friend of his. He offered to take me personally and off I went. I did trust my new friend and that is how I found this doctor. This Physician goes to many hiv/aids conferences and even gives conferences himself. He has studied lipoatrophy and knows quite a lot about hiv in spite of being a doctor in general medicine. He got his training in facial filling in France and his first practice student was his own male secretary. The guy is happy with his face. The doc was giving a reduced price to qualifying patients but those funds where frozen and now he has to charge as is. I bought mine ahead of time when those funds were still available and do think it was expensive even then but I needed quite a large amount of pmma. On my first session he used 70 cc's. On my second he used 30cc's and do not know if on my last session a little more will be used but everything is complete in my opinion. I'm just swollen because that's the nature of the product. This PMMA is bought in Europe and has less collagen than the one approved in the states and that reduces its price. My total treatment cost me $4000 so if you divide that among the amount of cc's used it'll come up to a moderate sum for each cc compared to the price it has reached now in the states. My doc does this only on Saturdays to hiv positive patients with lipo. From Mondays to Fridays he attends his regular patients. Last Saturday I was his only patient and he took his time and had no stress or rush on his back. He doesn't do this to everybody and does not promote it either. His reputation is getting around by his happy clients with their new faces. I was on a waiting list for a month before he had a space for me. I don't think he wants to get a hundred clients knocking on his door because his back really hurts him for the length of time a filling lasts and he IS standing or bending over most of the time. I'm going to send him an email to see if it's OK with him to post his information. Most of the time he's traveling to some aids conference anyways. He just arrived from Los Angeles the day before doing my face. We were talking about it during the session and even visited Dr. Serra's web page from Brazil. I'll get back to you as soon as I get a reply from him, OK? This doctor is in Ponce, Puerto Rico. That's about 2 hours from my home.
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hey dlno63,I decided on clinic estetica because i was so impressed the last time i went for the bio alcamid procedure about 2 yrs ago.The trip itself can be a little scarey but NOW they actually pick you up at the airport(van waiting for you)and they take you directly to the clinic or to your hotel,depends on when your appointment and then take you back to the airport or to your hotel.SO for me this solves all of my anxiety about the actual trip!!THE staff is great!!.doctor morales does wonderful work .I WISH i had know about "PRECISE"or 'BIO ALCAMID before.I had sculptra performed before at about 3000.00 and that was a waste of money,the results lasted only about 8 months.GOOD LUCK ON WHATEVER YOU DECIDE!!
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So that everyone knows....Casavantes will also send transportation to and from the airport.
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HEY FORD,
I ALSO SAW DR. SERRA AND FOUND HIM TO BE VERY CONSERVATIVE IN HIS ADMINISTRATION OF PMMA IN MY FACE. I DON'T WANT TO GO BACK TO RIO, ITS QUITE A HASSLE. I HAVE SEEN YOUR PHOTOS ON YOUR WEB PAGE BUT I'D REALLY LIKE TO SEE WHAT YOU LOOK LIKE AFTER YOUR SILICON TREATMENT BY DR. ABRAMS. DO YOU HAVE A PHOTO?
CHEERS!
This is a mug shot I took today. Other than cropping it's not been retouched. It's been a year since my second PMMA treatment and 5 months since seeing Dr. Abrams. I've not had any problems and I think I look like a normal 41-year-old guy.
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/165/422527317_e333df4057_m.jpg)
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You look great, you stud! ;) No overfilling, anywhere.
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This is a mug shot I took today. Other than cropping it's not been retouched. It's been a year since my second PMMA treatment and 5 months since seeing Dr. Abrams. I've not had any problems and I think I look like a normal 41-year-old guy.
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/165/422527317_e333df4057_m.jpg)
Ford,
If you think "normal" 41-year-old guys look anywhere close to as good as you do, you must hang out with an exceptional crowd. You look fantastic. Dr. Serra did a *great* job. And you're obviously doing your part to stay in shape despite the lipo. Congrats to both you and your plastic surgeon.
John
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Hi my name is Milker how are you ? :) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Dr. Serra and Dr. Abrams have done magnificent work. You look delicious. Thanks for the updated photo........it's an inspiration.
Good luck in the body building competion too!
xxx,
Mike
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I've been asked to repost the link to my lipoatrophy page:http://home.triad.rr.com/lipoatrophy/My_Lipoatrophy/Page_1x.html (http://home.triad.rr.com/lipoatrophy/My_Lipoatrophy/Page_1x.html)
Hey Gymrat,
Your post is one of the BEST I've come across. I read through the entire article and learned a lot. Thanks for sharing your experiences in this detailed and chronological manner.
Honestly, one of my biggest fears when I was first diagnosed, aside from dying was this issue. Anyways, I learned a lot from your story and wanted to say thank you for doing this.
And, for what it's worth I think you look fantastic. Your partner is a lucky man!
Much Respect,
Wesley
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Dear Ford
I can't thank you enough for what you do for us by positing all this info
sincerely,
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Ford, U should be on Oprah, a handsome and big hearted brave soul like U. ;)
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GSO, thank you very very very very much for posting your site! Like you I have been very skeptical of the ads I see from Plastic Surgeons with before and after results. You are right it is great to actually talk to people that have had work done. I remember ten years ago I went to see a Plastic Surgeon after the first one had messed up my nose. The second one did a good job. I asked why I never saw any advertisements in magazines etc. from him. His response was that he was so good he didn't have to advertise . He said he had more than enough business by word of mouth. He was right he is right in downtown DC and booked up for months. I just don't know his expertise in this procedure though. I will have to check.
You are right though when patients are happy they tell others which brings business back to the doctor. I am sure your Docotor in Brazil is doing very well with referrals. He sounds great. Thanks again I definitely appreciate your doing this and also the links. Very helpful!
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WOW.....they really did a great job GSOgymrat. ticks me off u have to go to a foreign country to get this work done......
anyway.....can u put a final dollar figure or <do u mind telling> on the entire teatment process?
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WOW.....they really did a great job GSOgymrat. ticks me off u have to go to a foreign country to get this work done......
anyway.....can u put a final dollar figure or <do u mind telling> on the entire teatment process?
Thanks. The total cost of treatment was $2257. That was two treatments for face and butt. I would do it again in a heartbeat.
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GSO, is that inclusive of other costs like hotel and air fare or strictly the net cost for just the treatments alone? ??? Thanks.
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That is just the two treatments. My partner is a flight attendant so I didn't have to pay for the flights. I had to pay for hotel and food but I made the trip a week long vacation, so I don't really consider that a treatment expense.
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Ford,
I never saw this the first time you posted and want to say that it is quite brave orf you and to be applauded for putting yourself out there as you have.
I'm very impressed and awed by this site of your.
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Ford,
Thank you for the information. Ignorant is bliss, I was not aware of this side effect of HIV.
I appreciate all the information you have posted and shared.
God Bless & you look very attractive for a 41 year old. Look quite normal to me.
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So in a fit of vanity and indulgence I agreed to have silicon microdroplets added to my cheeks, temples and between my eyebrows. Unlike Dr. Serra, Dr. Abrams used anesthetic injections in my face which made the procedure relatively painless. The process went by very quickly since he didn't have to build my face up like Dr. Serra did. This treatment cost $800.
Ford,
Any idea about what it might cost to do someone's entire face? Your treatment was $800, but I assume that was because you didn't need a lot of filler and that therefore it didn't require a lot of the doctor's time. I've gotten Sculptra treatments, and they've worked fine, but the idea of getting this done once and being finished is really appealing. Any price info you might have would be appreciated.
John
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Ford,
Any idea about what it might cost to do someone's entire face? Your treatment was $800, but I assume that was because you didn't need a lot of filler and that therefore it didn't require a lot of the doctor's time. I've gotten Sculptra treatments, and they've worked fine, but the idea of getting this done once and being finished is really appealing. Any price info you might have would be appreciated.
John
I'm not sure how much he would charge. Here is their website and contact information: http://www.wilshireaesthetics.com/index.cfm (http://www.wilshireaesthetics.com/index.cfm) You could call or email a photo and they should be able to give you an estimate.
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Damn, Ford, you look absolutely fantastic!
Between the filling they would have to do - on both ends - and the parts that would have to be cut or suctioned out, I would have to remortgage my house.
SIGH.,
Mark
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I'd love to get my face done if not for the airfare & hotel stay in Rio, not to mention going back again for the second touch treatment. Those costs alone would kill me. So getting back my happy cute face versus being dead broke...hmmm...I'm with u Mark...sigh.. :P
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HI all.
In Novembers issues of Poz Magazine, there will be an article about Lipodystrophy..
The article will be about me and Lipo..They are going to show my photo, even though I told them I dint have a full body shot of myself, only from the neck up, and they said fine..
They will be using my name and posting it with my photo..
Who ever didn't know that I was hiv pos..will surely know now.
But if my voice helps, then its all worth it to all of you as well as myself. ;)
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Both Gymrat (Ford) ? and Ubotts, I commend you on your valiant efforts. It says a lot about your character!
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I am so excited.
I was initially scheduled to go the the Tijuana clinic on Dec. 22nd. I happen to be in Brasilia this week with a flight via Sao Paulo. I called up Dr. Serra's office in Rio and to my surprise learned that he is also in Sao Paulo on certain days of the week at a collegue's office and can meet me this Saturday in Sao Paulo!
His secretary spoke english and both were very service oriented in reponding to this "opportunity window" that I had. The cost does seem to be about half that of the Clinnica Estica in Tijuana.
Got me a room at the Mercure, Times Square in Moema SP for Friday.
Many thanks for your post. You gave me alternatives. Dr. Serra is indeed a leading world reference in lypodystophy. Everyone can google Dr. Marcio Serra and get his coordinates. His english is very good.
Wish me all well on the journey.
Pep
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Hey Pepino,
That sounds great! Please, please post about your experience with Dr. Serra. I'm thinking of heading to Rio in the spring, and would love to get your take on him. Personal experience is the best background check there is.
Good luck and enjoy your trip.
John
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This is a mug shot I took today. Other than cropping it's not been retouched. It's been a year since my second PMMA treatment and 5 months since seeing Dr. Abrams. I've not had any problems and I think I look like a normal 41-year-old guy.
(http://farm1.static.flickr.com/165/422527317_e333df4057_m.jpg)
normal 41 year old guy my ass. i'd totally hit that. oh, sorry, you look great. thanks for posting these pics, i come back to this thread occasionally and am amazed by the results.
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Fuck....I am so mad. I wrote you guys a very detailed ...AND FABULOUS....experience with Dr. Serra in Sao Paulo....only to be "Timed out" by this website system and have all my work erased.
I don't have another two hours....sorry guys....I will try again later...maybe...HELLO I.T?????
Pep.
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Hi Pepino,
I, for one, would be satisfied with just the highlights if you don't feel like writing such an extensive post again. Glad to hear that you had a great experience, though. Hope to hear more about it later.
John
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thanks again for posting this. I am wondering about the PMMA. What are the long term effects? Why hasn't this been approved in U.S. yet? How are your results now. Thanks again for sharing. Sorry if I am asking questions you have already answered?
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Hey DCGuy,
Well, handsome, to answer one of your questions, the stuff has been approved here in the U.S. under the brand name Artefill. The only problem is that it's obscenely expensive. I think the material itself goes for something like $1,200 to $1,400 per vial, and most people will need a hell of a lot more than one vial. So for the price of a few vials, you can: (1) fly to Rio, (2) stay in a nice hotel near the beach, (3) and receive a complete treatment from Dr. Serra, who appears to be a pioneer at using this stuff and is one of the world's leading experts on PMMA. To me, it's a pretty easy decision.
John
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ok thanks for the information :)
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After reading many posts on the Net and Gymrat’s experience on his web page, I really wanted to address my lipo. I did just what Gymrat did and investigated current practitioners around the world along with their prices. After getting estimates from several sources outside of the States, I visited Dr Serra’s clinic in Rio de Janeiro for treatment with PMMA.
Gymrat’s web page really is the experience I had, too. The clinic and staff were just as he described, and Dr Serra was personable and patient with my questions.
The procedure did have some pain, and the after-effects did bruise a little, but frankly, I have experienced worse pain from infected molars.
I ended up with 20 cc of PMMA in my face and another 78 cc in the butt cheeks. Costs: $4400. I took a fabulous room looking over the ocean – I have never done such a thing, being a Super8 Hotel kind of person— so with airfare, meals and hotel, the total was about $7000 for a 7-day trip and vacation.
I went with a group of people who all met up there in Rio de Janeiro to address their lipo issues with Dr Serra. I was so grateful for the help of the organizer of the trip since I do not speak Portuguese and he was very helpful orienting all of us to the city and the clinic, too.
Even though the Puritan in me said I should not pay to have plastic surgery (Vanity!), I did not listen. I was just too self-conscious after receiving many comments about my face as well as discomfort while sitting at my job all day. This was very worth it to me. So much so that I am returning January 08 for my second treatment and (if the exchange rate does not change much) will cost less since less product will be needed and I will take a cheapo hotel room this time.
I did this in October of 2007, BTW.
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How are your results now. Thanks again for sharing. Sorry if I am asking questions you have already answered?
I'm still very happy with the results. I've not had any complications and my face is still full. The best part is I don't feel self conscious anymore and don't think about having lipoatrophy.
Hartiepie, I'm very glad to hear you had a good experience, both with Dr. Serra and as a vacation. Going with a group must have been fun. I hope Dr. Serra is doing well.
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Ok I feel better now..:)
I met with Dr. Marcio Serra in Sao Paolo 10 days ago on a Saturday morning. He practices 2 days a week at a collegues office. Both of them are leaders in this field in Brazil.
The SP clinic is totally clean and cool. 50 metres away from Hotel Mercure - Times Square in Moema (10 minutes from congognas airport).
13.5cc cost me 850$. No bruising in my case. Pain was minimal as he first applies local anestesia. Certainly no worst than Dental work can be.
Immediately you see the results. The product is Metacryl. Produced and approved in Brazil. No animal collagen content ....all synthesized.
Collagen builds up over 3 months at which time I will go for tune up. Honestly ...it may not even be necessary.
I am REALLY happy with the result.
Pep
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Your post has given me hope. I hate looking in the mirror and seeing my face without body fat. Will look further into this process.