Author Topic: I am super scared, pretty sure I got infected (Read 38095 times)

mecch · « **Reply #50 on:** October 16, 2009, 12:15:17 pm »

What a messy story.
Hope your wife is negative and that you'll do fine as well.

Paul E · « **Reply #51 on:** October 16, 2009, 12:35:20 pm »

Komnaes, why do you have to be so aggressive and give ridiculous interpretations to what I am saying?

Who said anything about self-medication or over the counter drugs?

I only said I was reading the drug lessons on the website to educate myself on the treatment options and what is the best time to start treatment. I would like to know a little bit before I talk to the doctor and follow a particular drug regime that he/ she will recommend, especially about the side-effects and the resistance.

I never mentioned anything about self-medication or over the counter drugs, perhaps you will be kind enough to explain how you concluded I want to take over the counter drugs?!!

With regards to PN, I am not a heavy drinker, no diabetes and tested negative to hepatitis C in July, However, allow me to correct one statement you have made: there are studies that show that AIDP, a form of PN can develop during acute infection.

Finally, I am going through a really rough time and you are not helping at all by giving your own interpretations to everything I say and keep insulting me. I am looking for answers on how to cope with my new condition, the stress, etc by learning from the lessons and listening to the others who go through the same thing.

Paul E · « **Reply #52 on:** October 16, 2009, 12:46:05 pm »

sdguyloveslife thanks for the advice. There are studies that show that AIDP, a form of PN can appear during seroconversion. PN is diagnised based on the pacients symptoms and during the last 2-3 weeks I had severe burning / pain ( " needles " ) in my arms, legs and upper body and also severe numbness. I could not sleep during the night because of the pain and I already scheduled a visit to the neurologist.

As for the family, i dont think its crazy to think of them and hope they are OK. Why do you think its drama? I am newly diagnosed and I am just hopiing my wife is OK, we used protection, so she should be, but its human nature to still worry until you know for sure.

komnaes · « **Reply #53 on:** October 16, 2009, 12:52:03 pm »

Quote

Komnaes, why do you have to be so aggressive and give ridiculous interpretations to what I am saying?

Because your story is NOT credible. Let's let aside all those gaps and low risk incidents you've reported.

Why don't you enlighten us - when did you get tested? As of 7 Oct you said "it's 11 weeks since my exposure" and on 8 Oct you said "I am preparing myself mentally for the worst when I go and test again at 13 weeks". So? Today is only 16 Oct?

sdguyloveslife · « **Reply #54 on:** October 16, 2009, 01:22:27 pm »

Quote from: Paul E on October 16, 2009, 12:46:05 pm

There are studies that show that AIDP, a form of PN can appear during seroconversion. PN is diagnised based on the pacients symptoms and during the last 2-3 weeks I had severe burning / pain ( " needles " ) in my arms, legs and upper body and also severe numbness.

LOL!! I knew you would go out and find a "study" that proves your point!! All you've proven is that you're good at internet searches...you can do that with just about anything!!

Paul, I really want to give you the benefit of the doubt, but I have concluded that I agree with Komnaes and the others...your story just doesn't add up. There are way too many holes and inconsistencies.

Also, I also did a little confirmatory research on my own...

Your "western blot tale" is the dead give-away. When you first go to test, they draw blood for an Elisa - test it, and when it shows up positive -- they draw blood AGAIN to do the Western blot - ensuring that it's a completely separate sample. They NEVER use the original blood sample to "confirm" a positive result!! This is Standard Protocol because if by chance the first "tube" or sample got mixed up and wasn't actually your blood, they would just be repeating the same error. Therefore, there is no medical facility or lab in the world that can give you your elisa and WB results in the fashion that you tell us they were given to you.

So, I'm sorry to say, I don't believe your story. I'm checking out...I don't wish to participate any longer in keeping this phony thread going.

komnaes · « **Reply #55 on:** October 16, 2009, 01:31:42 pm »

Quote from: sdguyloveslife on October 16, 2009, 01:22:27 pm

Your "western blot tale" is the dead give-away. When you first go to test, they draw blood for an Elisa - test it, and when it shows up positive -- they draw blood AGAIN to do the Western blot - ensuring that it's a completely separate sample...

That was MY trap...

Oh well, might as well, he ran. Hope he does go get some help though, in whatever form that is appropriate for his "condition".

Paul E · « **Reply #56 on:** October 16, 2009, 01:33:47 pm »

komanes, I find this insulting, but I will respond although its not a happy memory - 12th of October at a private clinic ( I am not in / from the US ). The result came back positive, I could not believe it, I asked for a re-test / confirmation.

Re-tested again ( they told me with HIV DUO ) and the result came back positive to both tests in the HIV DUO the next day, 13th of October, they told me its conclusive. What else do you want to know?

komnaes · « **Reply #57 on:** October 16, 2009, 01:55:14 pm »

You just won't give up won't you.. the same pattern. So what DID you have? An ELISA and a Western Blot as you mentioned or now a whatever followed by a HIV DUO?

HIV DUO looks for antigen first so it's usually ordered within a month after reported exposure. The incident that allegedly concerned you most happened back in August, so why took a DUO test now?

So was the first test that you had?

Assurbanipal · « **Reply #58 on:** October 16, 2009, 01:58:51 pm »

Paul
Welcome to the Forums. Sorry you are not exactly "feeling the love" yet. Just so you understand though, there are some reasons. You see, what you've told us so far is that you were: (1) likely infected through a very unusual set of circumstances, (2) have a very rare early onset of PN and (3) are afraid that you have infected your wife through an unlikely method of transmission.

Any one of these items would be highly unlikely and the combination seems really improbable. That doesn't mean it is impossible; but it does cause one to wonder if there might be a different explanation. And there is one that we see a lot here. That is that, when faced with a potentially positive HV test result, people can panic and go into overdrive. A recent example was a guy named Prayerblue.

Prayerblue got a false positive ELISA after some fairly improbable theories of transmission. But by the time he finally got a definitive western blot test he had 123 posts and had asked for help on about 6 different topics. Now he seemed like a nice if confused kid, and we are all happy that he tested negative in the end, but after folks respond to one or two of those panics they tend to be a little wary of further emotional investment when another poster with a potentially similar list of improbable issues comes along.

So, just as a suggestion, you might want to spend a little more time talking about your test results – exactly which tests you took, when and how you’ve interpreted the results you got back. Folks on the forums (including some of the ones who have already responded in this thread) can be very helpful in interpreting those results on the off chance you’ve overlooked something. And it might help you get a better overall response too from some of us who are holding back a bit.

Of course, you need not do anything different, this is just friendly advice.

I’m hoping that perhaps you have overlooked something. But if not there’s a lot of valuable help available on this website. It sounds like you have already found the lessons. (http://www.aidsmeds.com/articles/Introduction_4702.shtml) They are a great resource. Of course, the most important resource, if you are infected, is to develop a good relationship with an experienced doctor who treats a lot of HIV patients. If you need help finding a doctor (and are in the US) you might want to start by looking for members of the American Academy for HIV Medicine (directory at www.aahivm.org)

Best wishes to you
Assurbanipal

Paul E · « **Reply #59 on:** October 16, 2009, 02:54:21 pm »

Thank you Assurbanipal it is refreshing to see such a balanced and polite post like yours following the ones I had so far.

So lets focus on the tests ( once again I am not in / from the US, if it makes a difference ):

- I could not wait for 13 weeks, so I went to a private clinic and asked for an HIV test. told them the whole story, they told me they can do an antibody test, with results in a few hours, but it's not 100% sure as its less than 3 months post exposure. Took that, came back positive. Panicked and asked to re-test/ reconfirmation
- they told me HIV DUO is an accurate and conclusive test and it looks both for the virus in the blood and the antibodies and they would recommend that as a re-test / confirmatioon. Took that, results back positive for both.

Is this not conclusive ? Is this not the same as Elisa + Western Blot? Shall i doubt my test results?

Assurbanipal · « **Reply #60 on:** October 16, 2009, 04:35:05 pm »

Paul

Others are more knowledgeable than I on testing, but ithere are certain things that do seem problematic and you should check out.

First, antibody tests (ELISA) do give false postive results. So your first test only told you that you MIGHT be infected. A follow up Western Blot is the usual confirmation test, not the DUO test.

Second, it does not take 13 weeks to get a followup Western Blot or an ELISA. The whole 13 week issue refers to how long it takes for antibodies to potentially show up in your blood after infection, not to how long the test takes. Most people that are infected have antibodies earlier anyway (at six weeks).

But at this point it's been 3 months since your last risky exposure. So the whole 13 week waiting period is moot anyway and I don't understand its relevance to you.

My understanding is that the DUO is a replacement for the ELISA test, designed to give earlier results, but not a final confirmation of status. I believe the "DUO" refers to the combination of a regular antibody test wth a p24 antigen test, which can pick up potential infection earlier. But since you already tested (potentially) positive on an the ELISA you didn't need another screening with the DUO. Instead, you need a Western Blot test.

Best wishes
A

Edited just in case the above was not clear

Is this not conclusive ? No

Is this not the same as Elisa + Western Blot? No

Shall i doubt my test results? You should get a Western Blot

Paul E · « **Reply #61 on:** October 17, 2009, 03:56:47 am »

Assurbanipal, you gave me a little hope again !!!

I will go to the clinic on Monday and ask specifically for a Western Blot test. My understanding from what they explained to me was that the second test they performed is similar to Elisa and Western blot and it is conclusive ! if this is not true and there is hope, I will go and test again ! I am but confused now, could it be all a big mistake??!

Ann · « **Reply #62 on:** October 17, 2009, 04:21:07 am »

Quote from: Paul E on October 16, 2009, 01:33:47 pm

komanes, I find this insulting, but I will respond although its not a happy memory - 12th of October at a private clinic ( I am not in / from the US ). The result came back positive, I could not believe it, I asked for a re-test / confirmation.

Re-tested again ( they told me with HIV DUO ) and the result came back positive to both tests in the HIV DUO the next day, 13th of October, they told me its conclusive. What else do you want to know?

Paul,

Assurbanipal has already given you accurate answers and I just want to support what he's said.

First off, you need to find somewhere else to test, because the place you've been going to doesn't know what they're talking about.

The Duo test does NOT test for the virus itself. It test for antibodies and the p24 antigen. The p24 antigen is only present in the first couple weeks following infection. You'd know this if you ever bothered to read the Am I Infected Welcome thread like you're supposed to, and followed the testing information link provided there.

If you'd bothered to do read the Testing Lesson, you'd know that any antibody or p24 positive result MUST be followed up by a Western Blot before hiv diagnosis can be made. False positives are common with antibody tests. Conditions that can cause false positive results are pregnancy (not your problem) and underlying auto-immune diseases.

And guess what, your symptoms could well point to an auto-immune disease. So, instead of chasing an illness you could not possibly have (you haven't had a risk for hiv infection), why don't you go see a doctor, instead of an hiv testing clinic, and find out what is really wrong with you?

Until you've had a positive WB result, you are NOT considered hiv positive.

Go to a clinic that knows what they're doing and re-test. If you get another positive antibody, make SURE they follow it up with a Western Blot.

Ann

PS - you posted while I was typing. Please, do what I suggest and go to a different clinic. The one you're going to is wrong about the tests.

Paul E · « **Reply #63 on:** October 17, 2009, 04:33:00 am »

ann, thanks for the advice, It is now clear what I need to do:

1. go to another clinicand re-test. I will ask for Elisa and if positive ask for Western Blot to confirm
2. Go see another doctor and find out what else might cause my symptoms.

Many thanks again for your patience and for taking the time to respond to me.

Ann · « **Reply #64 on:** October 17, 2009, 04:52:58 am »

Paul,

You're welcome and good luck with the testing.

As you are not yet confirmed as hiv positive, I'm going to merge this thread back into your original thread in Am I Infected. If you do get a positive confirmation (which I doubt), you can start a new thread in Just Tested.

Ann

Ann · « **Reply #65 on:** October 17, 2009, 08:38:14 am »

Paul,

I re-read your entire thread earlier today out of curiosity about a few things. Something struck me when I noticed you said you started having symptoms four days after your yellow fever vaccination. That got me thinking about things I've read about possible links to vaccinations in general and autoimmune problems, so I started doing a little bit of research. I found lots of things, but one of the most lay-man friendly was this:

http://www.patient.co.uk/doctor/Yellow-Fever-Vaccination.htm

Scroll down to the "adverse reactions" section and read. You might want to make sure any doctor you see knows you started having symptoms a few days after receiving this vaccine. There might not be any link at all, but then again, there might, especially in light of the fact that autoimmune problems can cause false hiv antibody tests. I want to emphasise that I am not a doctor. I'm just giving you something to discuss with a doctor face-to-face.

And before you ask, don't freak out if you read the contraindications section. Even if you are hiv positive, this would not have anything to do with you as you would have only been recently infected. So ignore that. Besides, it's highly unlikely you've had anything other than a false positive as you had no risk.

Ann

Paul E · « **Reply #66 on:** October 17, 2009, 09:01:46 am »

Many thanks Ann, I will definetely mention this to the doctor. I hope you meant " other than a false positive " in your post

( not a false negative )

I also thought of the yellow fever vaccine and also the Ofloxacin pills I took for two weeks in August but my " auto-immune " disease symptoms ( mainly neuropathy) developed 2 months after takiing the vaccine and one month after taking Oxoflacin. there is still a therotical possibility and I will discuss it the doctor.

Ann · « **Reply #67 on:** October 17, 2009, 09:08:03 am »

Paul,

Sorry, I did mean false positive. I usually catch when I do that before I post.

It could still be an underlying autoimmune problem even without the vaccine. Some can have intermittent symptoms... and you were having unexplained symptoms earlier this year. You wouldn't be the first here to have a false positive due to an undiagnosed autoimmune problem. And sometimes, false positives just happen. Who knows, with the ignorance that clinic has shown about how to confirm a positive result, maybe they were reading the tests wrong. It wouldn't surprise me.

Hang in there an find a new testing center.

Ann

Ann · « **Reply #68 on:** October 17, 2009, 09:14:00 am »

Oh, and by the way, one of the case studies I read today concerned a young man who didn't start having problems until quite a few weeks after his YEL jab. Please don't ask me to dig it back up for you... my head was spinning by the time I got through all the links.

Ann

Paul E · « **Reply #69 on:** October 17, 2009, 09:24:47 am »

Thank you Ann for taking your time to look into this, it's really touching.
There are many possible causes for what I am going through, I will take it step by step, HIV re-testing is the first thing I will do ( this time with Elisa and Western Blot ).

Regardless of the outcome, you, Andy and other people on this site have been wonderful and patient with me, thank you all for everything.

Ann · « **Reply #70 on:** October 17, 2009, 09:27:44 am »

Paul,

I have to admit I was kinda irritated with you during your time in Just Tested - for the same reasons others were irritated with you (and that's why I was staying out of that thread). However, I understand now that you were given incorrect information by incompetent people, so I feel a little more compassion for you.

Good luck with the new testing center and good luck with the testing.

Ann

Assurbanipal · « **Reply #71 on:** October 18, 2009, 10:08:07 am »

Paul

I see that you posted a question to my last post, but that Ann addressed your concerns. So I just wanted to log on and wish you well.

Reading the whole combined thread it does seem quite unlikely you have any HIV infection. But do remember to stay safe in the future.

Best wishes
A

Paul E · « **Reply #72 on:** October 18, 2009, 10:24:38 am »

Thanks Assurbanipal,

Re-tested again today at a different clinic, insisted for the " classical " Elisa test, will go an pick up the results in two days. I explained to the doctor the whole history,the symptoms, etc, he said we should wait for the test results. He didn't give me much hope for a good result unfortunatelly... He explained to me that a Western Blot will be done if this comes back positive.

So this time, the proper procedure should be followed. I am going mad, but I cannot do anything else other than wait. Thank you for your encouraging words and the time spent to respond to me.Regardless of the outcome, I will allways appreciate what you guys have done for me in the last months.

Ann · « **Reply #73 on:** October 18, 2009, 10:36:13 am »

Paul,

Thank goodness you found a doctor who knows about the need for a Western Blot! I understand you're in a country that probably doesn't have a lot of hands-on experience with hiv, but it's still really no excuse for the ignorance you've previously encountered when testing. Diagnostic tests should be common knowledge amongst medical practitioners, no matter what the prevalence is of the illness being tested for. Especially when it comes to something like hiv testing. It isn't exactly rocket science, after all!

I suspect this doctor also has some ignorance surrounding hiv transmission (because he should have recognised you had no risk) but at least he knows the testing procedure. If you get another positive antibody and it's disproved by the WB, please do make sure you're investigated for a possible autoimmune problem.

Keep us posted.

Ann

Paul E · « **Reply #74 on:** October 18, 2009, 10:55:03 am »

Thanks Ann,

the doc also ordered tests for syphilis, gonorhhea and chlamydia. We had a long chat, he mentioned that if any of these were present than it could have increased the risk of HIV transmission. In other words a combo of syphilis and HIV in an infected person, might increase the risk of HIV trasnmission to another individual. I am not going to comment on this, just what he told me. We will wait and see.

tonn23 · « **Reply #75 on:** May 13, 2010, 02:34:03 am »

im sorry ann for posting here... but is this really possible??? whatever happened here?

RapidRod · « **Reply #76 on:** May 13, 2010, 04:42:17 am »

Quote from: tonn23 on May 13, 2010, 02:34:03 am

im sorry ann for posting here... but is this really possible??? whatever happened here?

 Only those Moderators and members who are authorized to answer questions in the Am I Infected? forum are permitted do so. Unauthorized responses may be deleted without permission of the poster. Repeatedly posting replies of this nature may result in a Time Out or permanent ban, at the discretion of the Moderator Team.

alan74 · « **Reply #77 on:** May 13, 2010, 06:48:35 am »

I was also keenly following this story. I notice that the last login date from Paul was Nov 24 while his last post regarding collecting results was October 18th.

Hopefully everything turned out well for Paul and his HIV tests results were proven to be negative.
Im guessing if they were positive he would have confirmed this to us.

Sorry Rod for replying. As you can imagine its a interesting thread for worried folk with similar risks.

RapidRod · « **Reply #78 on:** May 13, 2010, 07:00:26 am »

Quote from: alan74 on May 13, 2010, 06:48:35 am

I was also keenly following this story. I notice that the last login date from Paul was Nov 24 while his last post regarding collecting results was October 18th.

Hopefully everything turned out well for Paul and his HIV tests results were proven to be negative.
Im guessing if they were positive he would have confirmed this to us.

Sorry Rod for replying. As you can imagine its a interesting thread for worried folk with similar risks.

No sorry to it. Did you think you were special? Read the posting guidelines of this form.

Andy Velez · « **Reply #79 on:** May 13, 2010, 09:28:53 am »

Alan, you need to follow the rules of this site. Only those who are authorized to do so are permitted to write in threads of other members. You need to stick to your own thread.

Not doing so can get you Time Out or even banned. Please take note and don't do it again.

madmax09 · « **Reply #80 on:** May 30, 2010, 08:10:25 am »

Hi, is there a chance I can talk to you Pour, can anybody tell me how can I reach this guy, I have a very similar story with him I wanted to contact him,

I would highly appreciate ur help..

All the best

Ann · « **Reply #81 on:** May 30, 2010, 08:16:35 am »

Quote from: madmax09 on May 30, 2010, 08:10:25 am

Hi, is there a chance I can talk to you Pour, can anybody tell me how can I reach this guy, I have a very similar story with him I wanted to contact him,

I would highly appreciate ur help..

All the best

So you decide to post directly under a post where one of our moderators has just admonished another member that they are not authorised to reply to any thread but their own?

If you have questions about hiv transmission or testing, create and ask them in your own thread.

And make sure you read our posting guidelines - and abide by them - before you post anything else.

Ann

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Author Topic: I am super scared, pretty sure I got infected (Read 38095 times)