Properly removing a condom

[ginseng52]

Here is my situation:

I live in Bangkok Thailand. On July 3rd 2008 I had sex at a massage parlor. I do not have any STDs and am circumcised. The woman performed oral sex on me without a condom. We then had insertive vaginal and anal sex. There were massage lotions used which I understand can damage latex but to my knowledge this did not get on the condom. After we finished I glanced at the condom and it appeared it did not break nor was damaged though some type of microscopic tear is possible.

From what I've read here and elsewhere I most likely do not need to worry about the unprotected oral sex. If the condom was not damaged in any way I don't need to worry about our vaginal and anal sex.  However I have two concerns. One is that here in Thailand HIV subtype E is the prevalent strain. this is much more virulent then the subtypes found in most of the western world, it is easier to catch and leads to death sooner. I have read on some message boards people speculate you could even get HIV from this strain via receptive oral sex but have not seen that on any reliable medical sites.

The second concern is 2 weeks after this possible exposure I came down with a very bad sore throat and my right armpit gland was swollen. This went on for two weeks, my armpit felt better but I then noticed I had ulcers going all the way down my esophagus. I have had cold sores before but never in my throat. I then went to a doctor on July 30th. After looking at my throat he asked if I had HIV to my horror. I told him about what I have just stated here. He ordered an HIV test which came back negative. He then cauterized the ulcers which were taking a very long time to heal and soon after they healed. He said modern tests are almost always conclusive after 6 weeks. So to test again in a month. Two weeks ago I developed two large ulcers on my lower lip. I have had ulcers before but given the circumstances I am scared this is a sign of acute HIV, these also appear to be healing very slowly. I just tested again on August 30th and the test again came back negative.

This provides me with some relief but I will not begin to feel confident until I've tested after 3 months. My anxiety level is getting very high so I'm trying to figure out what could have caused the ulcers in my throat other than HIV. I have thought possibly mono though I never had a fever or any headache, nor fatigue. I have had no other symptoms than my sore throat and pain under my arm. I understand testing is the only way to be sure but I'm merely trying to manage my anxiety by knowing my odds.

I read another thread on this site about members experiences seroconverting and a few people did mention ulcers that were slow to heal, I've also seen esophogeal ulcers mentioned as a sign of acute HIV. I don't know what to think. I'd really appreciate everyone's feed back and will be testing again 09/30/08.

[jkinatl2]

You had no risk if you used a condom for penetrative sex.

Of course, there is no risk for receptive oral sex either.

I am sorry your anxiety level is so high. Please understand that yours is in no way an HIV risk situation.

If you feel you need to test for peace of mind, obviously you will. But it is not necessary.

[ginseng52]

jk

If the condom didn't break then I agree but I unfortunately cannot be 100% sure there were no breaks. Do you or any others have any opinion on what could cause the throat ulcers? If it weren't for them I would not be so anxious.

[jkinatl2]

Unfortunately, we cannot and do not diagnose symptoms online. To do so would be inacurrate and unethical.

If you are having symptoms that trouble you, I urge  you to see a doctor.

[ginseng52]

Ok thanks for your help. I have learned a lot from this site and being able to get solid information has been helpful.

[RapidRod]

ginseng52, DO NOT post in any threads other than your own. Please take the time to read the posting guidelines found in the "Welcome" thread.

[Andy Velez]

Ginseng, actually you can be certain the condom didn't break. When that happens it's not about there being a teeny weeny little hole as some people fear or imagine. No, it's very evident because it ends up giving way and becoming like a fringed hoop on your penis. So yes, you can be certain your condom didn't break.

Cheers,

[ginseng52]

Rapid,

Sorry about posting on the other forum. I read the rule and now understand not to post in other threads in this forum.

Andy,

You often state "The average time to seroconversion is 22 days. All but the smallest number of those who are going to seroconvert will do so within 4-6 weeks after an exposure to the virus. So if you want you can test at 6 weeks. Assuming you get a negative then, you should still re-test at 13 weeks."

Do you have any idea about what percentage seroconvert after 22 days? I also still sometimes hear a 6 and even a 12 month window is needed for 100% certainty. Is there any truth to either of these other time frames or nowadays is 13 weeks considered conclusive? I tested negative after 55 days. I realize from reading other posts that my odds are good but I will feel best after I test again at 13 weeks which I think is 10/11/08

Thanks

[Ann]

gin,

Your negative result is not going to change. You had no risk. There's no point in discussing seroconversion with you - it's not going to happen as a result of your massage incident.

Ann

[ginseng52]

gin,

Your negative result is not going to change. You had no risk. There's no point in discussing seroconversion with you - it's not going to happen as a result of your massage incident.

Ann

I will be very happy if you are right. I agree given what I actually did I should be at no or almost no risk. the only thing that caused all of this anxiety for me is I can't find any other reason for a breakout in throat ulcers other than acute HIV. It was the timing of this, about 2 weeks after my possible exposure that started me on this course.

However I understand your point of view and know ultimately only a negative test will put my mind at ease. I am not here  looking for psychiatric consoling so I won't keep going with this.

thanks again and this is a really great site. A few positive things have come out of this. I now know I'm not comfortable with any level of risk and I have a renewed hope for life. It's strange how only when something is threatened to be taken away do you really see it's value.

[Ann]

gin,

Take your ulcers to a doctor. They're nothing to do with hiv. As I said, you had no risk and your negative result is not going to change.

Ann

[ginseng52]

I just had another HIV antibody test today at the 9 week mark. Negative. I am starting to finally believe I'm going to come out of this clear. I realize others and even myself think my risk was negligible but being really convinced I have HIV has been a huge huge wake up call. I have never endured something so mentally trying in my life. I never felt so helpless and afraid like this. I am fortunate my wake up call occurred when I can take action to prevent ever catching HIV and think about what is really important in life. Risky sex or my well being. I admire the courage of those who do have HIV and live an optimistic forward thinking life. I pray we see a cure to this virus and the suffering it causes in our lifetimes.

[Ann]

Gin,

Keep using condoms and you'll be fine where hiv is concerned. Really.

While I appreciate your comments about those of us who deal with hiv on a daily basis, remember, we're just like you. We're ordinary people.

I do not expect your negative results to change and neither should you. After all, you had no risk.

Ann

[ginseng52]

I have posted on this site once before. Here is a new question. After one has had intercourse be it anal or vaginal if you took off the condom touching it with your hands than accidentally touched the tip of your penis would this put you at any risk? How soon after removing your penis can the HIV virus live on the outside of the condom if present?

What is the right way to remove a condom?

Thank you

[RapidRod]

You weren't at risk in the situation you've provided. HIV does not stay active outside its host.

[Ann]

gin,

I've merged your new thread into your original thread - where you should post all your additional thoughts or questions. It helps us to help you when you keep all your additional thoughts or questions in one thread.

If you need help finding your thread when you come here, click on the "Show own posts" link under your name in the left-hand column of any forum page.

Please also read through the Welcome Thread so you can familiarize yourself with our Forum Posting Guidelines. Thank you for your cooperation.

As Rodney says, touching your penis after removing a condom is not a risk for hiv infection. Read through all three condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use them with confidence.

Ann