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Author Topic: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?  (Read 2155 times)

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Offline SASA39

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  • Posts: 690
SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« on: February 17, 2007, 03:28:16 PM »
What do you think about supllementary therapy led by :

1. Nelson Vergel  ( Michael Mooney ) at the
    www.medibolics.com                 and

2. Dr Jon Kaiser
    http://www.jonkaiser.com/

    http://www.jonkaiser.com/micronutrients/Micronutrient-Formula.pdf

QUOTE :

"Though long term stability in my patients has always been the rule, I can now definitely say that the progression of HIV disease in my practice is an extremely rare event. This experience, which has encompassed the care of over 500 HIV(+) patients during the past five years, allows me to make the following statements:

Not one patient who has come to me during the past six years with a CD4 count of greater than 300 cells/mm3 has progressed to below that level.

 Not one patient who has come to me during the past six years with a CD4 count of greater than 50 cells/mm3 has become seriously ill or died from an HIV-related illness.
This extraordinary level of good health and stability does not come without hard work. My patients follow an aggressive program of natural therapies to support their immune systems. They have also benefited tremendously from the new drugs, lab tests, and other recently released treatment options. What a difference a few years has made!................."





   


   
Oct.     `06.  CD4=58  ?    %       VL not perform. ?!?
25.Dec.`06.         203       14        VL= 0
29.May.`07.    broken device        VL=1363
20.June`07     broken device        VL=0
25.Dec `07  CD4=582                  VL=70
14.May `08  CD4=448
29.July `08                                  VL=0
26.Nov `08  CD4=674                    VL=179
16.Mar `09  CD4=554                    VL=0
19.Jan`10 CD4=715               
03.Mar`10                                    VL=0
24.Aug`10 CD4=524                     VL=0
04.Dec`10 CD4=626                     VL=0
15.Sep`11                                   VL=93
17.Nov`11                                   VL=0
05/26 .Jul`12 CD4=713                 VL=0
28.Nov`12 CD4=916                     VL=0
09.May`13                                 VL=0

Offline bear60

  • Member
  • Posts: 4,104
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2007, 03:44:26 PM »
This is what Ann replied to a post about Jon Kaiser:
Quote
Conclusions: Micronutrient supplementation can significantly improve CD4 cell count reconstitution in HIV-infected patients taking HAART. The micronutrient supplement tested was well tolerated and may hold promise as an adjuvant therapy in the treatment of HIV. Further investigation is warranted.
Ann:
It really wicks me off that these types of studies always seem to be "in patients taking HAART". Why do they never do studies on people NOT yet on HAART? I'd like to see some conclusions as to whether or not nutrition has any bearing on being able to maintain without HAART. I'm not discounting the importance of studies for people who are already on the meds, but what about the rest of us already?

Just ranting.

Ann
Poz Bear Type in Philadelphia

Offline SASA39

  • Member
  • Posts: 690
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2007, 04:15:50 PM »
It is known that a HIV/AIDS burn a body much more faster and that one of side effects of a HAART is mitochondrial toxicity with a great productions of free radicals...............
In  a light of all this I suggested all of you to take some sumpllements............some or all in a small or a greater doses it depends of your income......................AND IT HAS NOT TO BE BY THE MANUFACTURERS RECCOMENDED BY Kaiser & Vergel neccesarry............
Oct.     `06.  CD4=58  ?    %       VL not perform. ?!?
25.Dec.`06.         203       14        VL= 0
29.May.`07.    broken device        VL=1363
20.June`07     broken device        VL=0
25.Dec `07  CD4=582                  VL=70
14.May `08  CD4=448
29.July `08                                  VL=0
26.Nov `08  CD4=674                    VL=179
16.Mar `09  CD4=554                    VL=0
19.Jan`10 CD4=715               
03.Mar`10                                    VL=0
24.Aug`10 CD4=524                     VL=0
04.Dec`10 CD4=626                     VL=0
15.Sep`11                                   VL=93
17.Nov`11                                   VL=0
05/26 .Jul`12 CD4=713                 VL=0
28.Nov`12 CD4=916                     VL=0
09.May`13                                 VL=0

Offline bear60

  • Member
  • Posts: 4,104
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2007, 04:23:59 PM »
Thanks SASA....I think most of us DO take supplements.  Everyone has his own set of standards for WHAT supplements to take.  I take fish oil supplements as well as multi-vitamins.  But I only get off the shelf products at my drug store. And I always look for sales.
Poz Bear Type in Philadelphia

Offline ms_stress28

  • Member
  • Posts: 8
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2007, 05:27:33 PM »
I have read a few articles stating the mineral selenium may be helpful for our infection


Here's a good read
http://www.i-sis.org.uk/AidsandSelenium.php
-Stress

Offline RapidRod

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  • Posts: 15,194
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2007, 07:27:38 PM »
I don't take any supplements. I'm sure I would if my blood tests indicated I should and the doctor would advise me to.

Offline poodlelover

  • Member
  • Posts: 44
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2007, 12:41:23 AM »
I  do not take an kind of supplements but my husband takes at least 8 different ones a day.  My bloodwork is always better than his except for the cd4 count.  I stay in the 700 to 900 range and he stays in the 1000 to 1200 range.  As far as the chemical panel, cbc I have him beat.  I'm just not sold on supplements as of yet.
Connie

Offline Miss Philicia

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  • Posts: 23,577
  • celebrity poster, faker & poser
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2007, 12:57:29 AM »
I used to take a wide variety of suppliments. Way before they were so in vogue.  Everything from boxwood extract crap from France (pricey!) to blue green algae, tumeric, accidopholis, Q-10 blah blah blah.  I stopped all that insanity about five years ago after doing it for 8 years and spending hundreds of dollars monthly.    Now I only take a multivitamin and fish oil and GUESS WHAT, my numbers are better.

I did however notice big selenium displays at my pharmacy last week.  Someone's really promoting it $$$$$$.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline poodlelover

  • Member
  • Posts: 44
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2007, 01:04:13 AM »
I believe alot of the hype comes from the makers of these supplements making promises that aren't true just like the magic diet pill, yea right.  My mom took supplements for years and selenium was one of those and she got cancer twice.  Lung removed then breast removed.    Guess this is one reason i don't buy into all the hoopla about these.
Connie

Offline ms_stress28

  • Member
  • Posts: 8
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2007, 09:43:30 AM »
I agree supplements have no direct effect or guarantees of treating any ailment- but I do believe that you should take a multi-vitamin daily to assist the body in this struggle.

I have an undetectable VL of 56  ( no meds ) and cd4 ranges late 700's- late 800's. I have always taken vitamins even b4 diagnoses. But since then I have moved to the following supplement regimen taken daily b4 bedtime
1000 mg of vitamin C - ($8.00) - Vitamin E with selenium ($18.00) and this is a 3month supply !

I say fuel your body ! Most people with our condition has some sort of vitamin deficiency anyway !
-Stress

Offline Miss Philicia

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  • Posts: 23,577
  • celebrity poster, faker & poser
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2007, 09:53:47 AM »
I'd definitely at least take a multi-vitamin.  I have always done that for my 14 years since being diagnosed.  In fact, my state ADAP throws them into my monthly prescriptions for free, though it's just some cheap CVS brand.

Doctors used to give me monthly B-12 shots too, but that was back in the 90's and I've not been offered it since then.  Perhaps this has more to do with my lab numbers going up.

Oh, and if you take vitamin C tablets I was always told to only buy the ones that are labeled "Esther-C" because otherwise you just piss it all out.  Not sure if that's still the advice given these days.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline ms_stress28

  • Member
  • Posts: 8
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2007, 10:03:21 AM »
I had no Idea about difference in Ester- C, But I will read up!  TKS

Has anyone taken the K-Pax vitamins ? That seems like a waste of money !

-Stress

Offline Florida69

  • Member
  • Posts: 428
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #12 on: February 20, 2007, 10:15:22 AM »
Thanks SASA....I think most of us DO take supplements.  Everyone has his own set of standards for WHAT supplements to take.  I take fish oil supplements as well as multi-vitamins.  But I only get off the shelf products at my drug store. And I always look for sales.

My doctor suggested that I start with the Fish Oil, I also take a multivitamin and cranberry pills. I do the same as you Bear, but I am also on HAART.  See ya, D
Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race.
Calvin Coolidge

Offline Sky

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  • Posts: 225
    • Myspace
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #13 on: February 20, 2007, 11:55:20 PM »
My first year being positive I was all about 'em, however, going into year 5, still no meds, and an almost undetectable viral load I say f 'em...I don't have the money right now and haven't taken them in over 3 years.
Poz since 2003.

Offline randym431

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,106
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2007, 07:04:03 AM »
A friend, once with a cd4 of 80, takes some 17 suppliments almost every day. After 10 years, his cd4 is now 900 and % is in the 30's. He's been on meds for over ten years too.
I just take a multi vitimum, omega3 and just started eating a few Brazil nuts (high selenium) a few times a week.

I also quit the cocane, pot, herion, meth, and m&m's...   ;D  (just kidding)

Offline med forum

  • Member
  • Posts: 76
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2007, 06:24:52 AM »
For many people, supplements do help......the best thing to do is talk with your doctor and see
what he/she says and go from there. I've been coming across a lot of talk about selenium and that it
in fact does help. I know that my boyfriend includes that in his daily regimen and he says that he does dee a difference. Each person is different...see what works for you
Peace & health

Offline fondeveau

  • Member
  • Posts: 425
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2007, 07:03:58 AM »
I can recall a discussion during 9th grade science class.  The teacher's opinion was that vities  and supplements basically give you "richer urine."  In other words, a complete waste.  But, since the cost is modest, I take a variety of supplements on the chance that I'm somehow getting something my body needs that my admittedly poor diet may lack.

Offline Miss Philicia

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  • Posts: 23,577
  • celebrity poster, faker & poser
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2007, 12:06:04 PM »
I'm sure most of it DOES come out in your urine.  When I used to take a lot of supplements my urine was very dark.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline fondeveau

  • Member
  • Posts: 425
Re: SUPLLEMENTS - DO WE NEED THEM ?
« Reply #18 on: February 23, 2007, 02:54:39 PM »
Strange, nowadays my urine is lighter in color and now that I'm not smoking I can actually smell it while pissing! LOL.

 


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