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Author Topic: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time  (Read 5127 times)

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Offline Boo Radley

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Quote
... But then again, I knew when I was infected and I read a thread from some of these people advocating going for years etc.   I noticed none of them post their numbers and most were only speculating when they were infected.   To me that was not very comforting.

The quote is from another thread about starting meds and I didn't want to hijack it.  I didn't include the author's name because it's irrelevant.  I respond because the assumptions made are snide, dismissive, and wrong, IMHO. 

How many of us know exactly when we were infected?  For those infected in the early 80s there weren't even tests until the mid-80s.  Many people opted not to test because 1) there was no treatment and 2) if you were practicing safer sex there was no need to know.  Even for many infected in the 90s and past it's hard if not impossible to target the exact time of infection in many circumstances.  The time of the infection doesn't even matter since each infected person goes through a slightly different experience.  The trends in CD4 count and viral load are the real indicators for initiating HAART.

As one of those people who advocates "going for years" before treatment I have valid reasons for advocating conservative approaches to initiating HIV chemotherapy.   My beliefs and recommendations are consistent with current HAART initiation guidelines.   

I've posted my numbers from time to time but not as regularly as some.  Sorry.  I can only speculate about when I was infected but that's not uncommon or a reason to dismiss the experiences of people who have been infected for many years, not 2 or 3.  I'm sorry the writer isn't comforted by our experiences and sad he apparently fails to see the other side of the argument about initiating HAART but guess what, boys and girls?  We still lack definitive data to know the answer. 

Current CDC HAART initiation guidelines:

Panels Recommendations (Table 5):
Antiretroviral therapy is recommended for all
patients with history of an AIDS-defining illness
or severe symptoms of HIV infection regardless
of CD4+ T cell count (AI).
Antiretroviral therapy is also recommended for
asymptomatic patients with <200 CD4+ T
cells/mm3 (AI).
Asymptomatic patients with CD4+ T cell counts
of 201350 cells/mm3 should be offered
treatment (BII).
For asymptomatic patients with CD4+ T cell of
>350 cells/mm3 and plasma HIV RNA >100,000
copies/mL most experienced clinicians defer
therapy but some clinicians may consider
initiating treatment (CII).
Therapy should be deferred for patients with
CD4+ T cell counts of >350 cells /mm3 and
plasma HIV RNA <100,000 copies/mL (DII).

The previous guidelines used 500 or lower CD4 count as the HAART starting point.  The current guidelines went down to 350 on the assumption the immune system is still intact in most people in the 350 - 500 range.  These are still unanswered questions about the optimal time to begin HAART so no one can claim to know "the" answer, at least not yet.

The logic behind a conservative approach to initiating HAART is simple.  Past and current HIV chemotherapies are toxic and no one knows how long someone will be able to use the drugs to control HIV without the toxicity causing its own problem(s).  PIs have been in use for fewer than 15 years.  Several NRTIs and NNRTIs are known to become toxic in some people over time and the older ones have been in use about 20 years.  HIV is the first disease in history that requires a commitment to life-time chemotherapy.   When there are a much wider variety of drugs and other treatments I'll be more optimistic about living 30 or more years with HAART.   I've seen enough people go through every drug available and die from AIDS. 

Boo

P.S.  If anyone read this far I'm amazed.
String up every aristocrat!
Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!





Everything I do, say, think, excrete, secrete, exude, ooze, or write 2007 Sweet Old Boo, Inc.

Offline dtwpuck

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2007, 08:20:34 PM »
Seeking comfort by pinpointing the moment of seroconversion is not something that really computes. 

Some of us can only speculate.  Some of us know.  And, as with all major illnesses, the treatment varies from person to person.  In my opinion, the purpose of a thread like that is to hash out various experiences and then make the choice for yourself, don't you think?

 
Floating through the void in the caress of two giant pink lobsters named Esmerelda and Keith.

Offline AustinWesley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2007, 08:36:08 PM »
Boo, by taking my words out of context you are making the point completely irrelavent.   In the thread in which I made this statement it had to do with the relevance of statistics from point of infection until point of treatment.

It wasn't meant to be snide at all.

I was merely pointing out a fact.   I'm making no judgements about when or how anyone was infected, especially in your case when those tests weren't even available.   However, those of us who have been more recently infected and know when we seroconverted are merely seeking answers.

I don't think calling my statement snide is at all fair especially as you have taken it completely out of context.

As we have all read it's clearly a very confusing situation trying to figure out when to start meds or to delay them.   However, when doctors and people on here are telling me they've gone for 10 years etc.   Yeah, I'd like to have those numbers and so would others seeking to make the best choice possible for treatment and the timing of it. 

Your particular case is more unique considering the time frame in which you were infected.   The portion you have quoted taken out of context has nothing to do with your own situation or you personally. 

It was merely an observation on my part that many of those advocating delaying meds don't have that information that those of us who are told to wait are seeking!

Diag. 3/06  Infected aprx. 2 mo. Prior
Date        CD4   %      VL
4/6/06     627    32    36,500     NO MEDS YET!
6/7/06     409    27    36,100
8/23/06   408    25     22,300
1/2/07     354    23     28,700
2/9/07     139    30     23,000  Hep A Vaccine same day???
2/21/07   274    26     18,500 
3/3/07    RX of Truvada/Sustiva Started.
4/5/07    321     27      Undectable 1st mo.  
5/16/07  383     28    Undectable 2nd mo.
8/10/07  422     32   UD <48 on new scale!

Offline fondeveau

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2007, 08:45:59 PM »
Difficult to pinpoint and of limited use, but fascinating for me.  My PCP told me I had tested HIV+ on 9/7/2006 and I saw the ID specialist two weeks later.  I had tested negative in Jan. '06 and had had yearly tests.  I had gone to the doctor to get some vicodin and while there I mentioned that lately my feces seemed soft.  This lead to the suggestion that I get another test.

I hadn't found this site and knew very nothing about seroconversion etc.  So, there I am with the ID specialist and I'm apologizing because it seems I had caught a cold as I was displaying all these flu-like symptoms.  My temperature that day was 98.4.  Bloodwork that day showed CD4 385 and VL of 30k.  Speculation is that I was in some stage of seroconversion.  ID doc anticipated much higher VL, but thinks it may be that my immune system was awfully robust in its reaction.  Otherwise, ID doc said my CD4 and VL would suggest infection 3 to 5 years prior.  Treatment was offered and I agreed.  One reason for me is that knowing my body, I felt that infection was recent and wanted to limit damage as much as possible and I knew that I reacted extremely well with medication.

I think there definitely is a "generational" differentiation similar to all that we read about boomers, Gen-X, Y and are we up to Z?  Same differences with HIV+ people.  Those who remember the early years had to "walk ten miles in snow up past their waists"  while those of us of more recent vintage years rode the yellow bus.  As dtwpuck points out, its the various experiences that drive the thread.


Offline Jeff64

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2007, 09:53:00 PM »
I do not remember seroconverting.
I have always been heathy and strong like bull.

I have had a couple colds in my life, but have never missed work because I felt funny.

Jeff

Offline Boo Radley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2007, 10:11:57 PM »
I reread the post I quoted from and think the words stand on their own outside of the post.  However, I don't feel like arguing about it, so I'll call truce if it's OK with you. 

Boo
String up every aristocrat!
Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!





Everything I do, say, think, excrete, secrete, exude, ooze, or write 2007 Sweet Old Boo, Inc.

Offline Jeffreyj

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2007, 11:30:28 PM »
I have been on drugs since 1984(minus 2 or 3 months total of vacations) I am certain I was infected in late 1984 cause I got sick as hell and missed a week of work.

I was diagnosed at that time with "HTLV111" since HIV had not existed yet.

I had KS in 1995, chemo got rid of it. I had a legion in my small intestine and one on my wrist.

I sleep allot and am fatigued often. I have PN really bad, probably caused by Zerit.

I am happy I have lasted this long, as I begin my 23rd year of this wild and wacky journey.
Positive since 1985

Offline AustinWesley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2007, 12:18:09 AM »
I'm sorry the writer isn't comforted by our experiences and sad he apparently fails to see the other side of the argument about initiating HAART but guess what, boys and girls? 

So, in these 2 decades you don't have the test result numbers from even let's say the last 5-10 years?

That is what those of us who are newly diagnosed look for so that we can see patterns and try to determine what is the best plan of action.  At least that is what I've attempted to do.

Without any data to back up what you're saying it just seems like aimless rambling to me.

Diag. 3/06  Infected aprx. 2 mo. Prior
Date        CD4   %      VL
4/6/06     627    32    36,500     NO MEDS YET!
6/7/06     409    27    36,100
8/23/06   408    25     22,300
1/2/07     354    23     28,700
2/9/07     139    30     23,000  Hep A Vaccine same day???
2/21/07   274    26     18,500 
3/3/07    RX of Truvada/Sustiva Started.
4/5/07    321     27      Undectable 1st mo.  
5/16/07  383     28    Undectable 2nd mo.
8/10/07  422     32   UD <48 on new scale!

Offline Boo Radley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2007, 12:30:19 AM »
So, in these 2 decades you don't have the test result numbers from even let's say the last 5-10 years?
Without any data to back up what you're saying it just seems like aimless rambling to me.

I've provided an outline of my CD4 and vl trends on more than one occasion but I don't have exact numbers for each blood draw.  I know what they were and it's the trend that's important, not individual test results.

My CD4 stayed in the 500 - 600 range from approximately late 1989 until late 2001, when I contracted chronic hep. B.  The CD4 dipped immediately and consecutively by 100 into the 400 range until mid 2004.  My highest viral load ever was about 30K.  In October of 2004 my CD4 was at 169 so I began HAART.

Might my credentials as an HIV+ person now be acceptable?

Boo
String up every aristocrat!
Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!





Everything I do, say, think, excrete, secrete, exude, ooze, or write 2007 Sweet Old Boo, Inc.

Offline AustinWesley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2007, 12:43:54 AM »
Boo, that's a great start although a lot of gaps there.   If you could direct me to one of these posts in which you indicated a thorough list of your counts I'd be most grateful.

No one is discounting your experiences.

I just believe it would be helpful if we could see a clear list of those counts from whatever point semi complete and accurate records actually exist.

I understand from what you are saying here that from 89- 04 or so you say your counts were at a certain range.   Then, you contracted the Hep B which caused your counts to go down, but then what?  Surely, you didn't go from keeping track all those years to an AIDS diagnosis overnight.   At least I hope not. 

Anyways, I do hope you are doing very well on the HAART treatment and it's clear you are a survivor.

« Last Edit: February 11, 2007, 12:45:29 AM by AustinWesley »
Diag. 3/06  Infected aprx. 2 mo. Prior
Date        CD4   %      VL
4/6/06     627    32    36,500     NO MEDS YET!
6/7/06     409    27    36,100
8/23/06   408    25     22,300
1/2/07     354    23     28,700
2/9/07     139    30     23,000  Hep A Vaccine same day???
2/21/07   274    26     18,500 
3/3/07    RX of Truvada/Sustiva Started.
4/5/07    321     27      Undectable 1st mo.  
5/16/07  383     28    Undectable 2nd mo.
8/10/07  422     32   UD <48 on new scale!

Offline ademas

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2007, 01:14:59 AM »
Hell...I don't keep track of my numbers. 

I have mid '94 to Aug. '98.  Since then, it's been 2 small steps forward, then 1 small step backward, but definitely always on an upward trend (both CD4's and ratio).  Viral load has been undetectable for years, except for a couple blips where it came in at 75 or 100 copies.  Nothing to worry about.

I might keep track of them again if something drastic happened.  (I actually have my last 4 lab results, but only because I started a new medication for arthritis, and I have to fax them to my rheumatologist.)

I'm not sure how my specific numbers are going to be of any use to anyone but me (and my doctor).  Everyone's results are so different.

Offline Boo Radley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2007, 01:19:33 AM »
Boo, that's a great start although a lot of gaps there.   If you could direct me to one of these posts in which you indicated a thorough list of your counts I'd be most grateful.

What gaps? I covered from late 1989, when I tested poz, until October, 2004, when I began meds.  That post was probably the most comprehensive one I've made since you're the first person to ever ask me to qualify/quantify my experience with HIV so thoroughly.

Quote
I just believe it would be helpful if we could see a clear list of those counts from whatever point semi complete and accurate records actually exist.

You'd like a "clear list" of my CD4 counts from 1989 until today because without this data you're unable to accept my information as accurate?  Do you realize how long that list would be?  Do you realize how useless that list would be to me given that my counts followed a predictable pattern of high 400, 500, or 600 CD4s from 1989 until 2001, then the count dropped to 400 and under after I contracted hep B 10/2001.  Between then and May of 2004 my CD4 range was mid 400s and high 300s.  In October of 2004 the CD4 count was 169, the absolute lowest it's ever been.  I don't even remember what my vl was because it's always been ludicrously low.  Since 10/2004 my CD4 went up to the mid 300s but dipped to 220 last month.  My vl has been undetectable since December, 2004.

Quote
Surely, you didn't go from keeping track all those years to an AIDS diagnosis overnight.   At least I hope not. 

No, I went from approx 350 in May, 2004 to 169 in October, 2004.  I procrastinate.  It wasn't overnight but it was only 5 months between "healthy" and "unhealthy."  At that point I decided to jump on the bandwagon but I could have waited for another blood draw in 4 - 6 weeks to be sure 169 wasn't a blip.  Even if it had been a blip, though, the next CD4 count would have to have been pretty high to change my mind about starting meds.

Wesley, it's great you are keeping detailed records of your blood work because it obviously helps you maintain confidence or stamina or something knowing the exact numbers every 3 months.  I've been getting blood drawn for 18 years.  I kept a spreadsheet of CD4 counts for several years until I realized it was a waste of time to keep strict track because the numbers from draw to draw were in a reasonable range, slowly getting lower over time but at a fairly slow rate of decrease.  For over 11 years my CD4 count never went below 490 and went as high as the mid-700s after I had to stay at home for a month from work taking vicodin every few hours due to a nasty accident with me on my bicycle and a young woman swinging her BMW door into my oncoming right leg. 

Could you possibly want to know anything more?  I am a goddamn survivor of HIV and will be until the day they zip the body bag over my head.

Thanks for your concern.  I'm doing very well. 

Boo
« Last Edit: February 11, 2007, 01:22:09 AM by Boo Radley »
String up every aristocrat!
Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!





Everything I do, say, think, excrete, secrete, exude, ooze, or write 2007 Sweet Old Boo, Inc.

Offline Elizabeth

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #12 on: February 11, 2007, 09:31:59 AM »
Hell...I don't keep track of my numbers. 

LOL. 

I was reading this thread and trying to remember what mine were back in November.  If I can't remember 2.5 months ago, I know I will never remember the last 10 years, nor do I worry about it. 

As long as I keep my CD4s above 200 and my viral load close to undectecable, I'm happy.

Not all who wander are lost.

Offline Ann

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2007, 09:58:34 AM »
I seroconverted in May of 1997. I didn't know it then, I only knew I'd never been so ill or in so much pain in my life. I wasn't diagnosed until February 22, 2001, but with hindsight being 20/20 and whatnot, I know for sure what happened to me and from where the infection came.

My initial counts (in 2001) were CD4 490, VL 80,700. I practically begged my doc to put me on meds straight away because I wanted to be doing something about the situation. He told me I wasn't anywhere near needing meds and we'd monitor my counts for some time before coming to any decisions. I can't tell you how happy I am now that he took this approach.

During that first year I had my VL come back as high as 96,200 and as low as 25,700. My CD4s ranged from a high of 660 to a low of 350. I don't have the percents from that year.

In April, 2002, I started the treatment for hep C. By the end of the treatment, my CD4s had slipped into the 300s, but my VL was also way down and it was only 6,940 at the end of the hep c treatment. (treatment lasted one year)

For the next couple years, my viral load stayed pretty much below 10,000. My CD4s shot up into the 6 and 700s, with the occasional blip, such as when I had shingles and they plummeted down to 281, 23%. Three months later they were back up to 460, 27%.

It wasn't until January 2006 that my VL went firmly back over 10,000 (but below 20,000) and my CD4s crept down from 787, 32% to 628, 29%, to 550, 26% and 447, 26%. Just when I was starting to think I was on that slippery slope, January 2007's results came back at 567, 26%. So much for the slope. My percent is stable at a good number and I'm happy.

This means that I am one of those lucky people who will be fortunate enough to reach that ten year med free ideal that we always hear about. I often wonder if there aren't (or shouldn't be) many more people who could reach that time-frame, but are encouraged to start meds because of one poor set of numbers. If my doctor were so inclined, he could have recommended, on one set of results, that I start meds a total of five times so far. We've always waited for the next set three months down the line and so far they've always bounced back.

I'd like to add at this point that I firmly believe if I hadn't been treated for hep C when I was, I'd probably need the hiv meds by now. It seems that getting the hcv under control allowed my body to concentrate on keeping my hiv VL down and therefore helping to keep my CD4s high.

My experience is why I always recommend that people don't jump the gun and start treatment on just one bad result. (an obvious exception would be someone diagnosed with very low CD4s - under 200 - and high VL)

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Razorbill

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2007, 10:01:04 AM »
AustinWesley,
  You're distilling again.  You will never accurately predict your own HIV future.  However, I have been in contact with Miss Chloe.   She says your numbers will bounce around for a while (or not), then settle down (maybe), then you'll start to die (sadly) when your numbers plunge and you'll start meds.  All this will happen in the next ten years (give or take a decade).  The future is predicted - do you feel better?  That'll be $4.99 for the call and 10 cents a word.   ;D
Razorbill

Offline Cliff

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #15 on: February 11, 2007, 10:02:28 AM »
It was merely an observation on my part that many of those advocating delaying meds don't have that information that those of us who are told to wait are seeking!
The information is available.  Check out the CDC's HIV webpage.  It provides a comprehensive guideline for treatment and even gives the pros and cons of being more or less aggressive in treating HIV.  There aren't any easy answers here.  Starting treatment early comes at cost (burning through options, dealing with side effects unnecessarily, subjecting your body....liver and kidneys in particular, to the meds) but it also has its benefits (mainly reducing your chance of getting an OI).  Delaying treatment also has its cost and benefits.  

The guidelines take into account all the information known to date about HIV.  That is good enough for me.  It's not practical for folks to post all of their test results, when in reality it wouldn't differ from the overall argument they are trying to make.  I personally don't need to see it, given the various guidelines available (from numerous sources, not just the CDC).  Plus I usually don't make my decisions based solely on advice received in the forums.  It's a combination of advice I get from the forums, my doctors, CDC and my personal preferences.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #16 on: February 11, 2007, 11:31:05 AM »
Boo, that is something I can't really tell you. I didn't have any symptoms when seroconverted and wasn't diagnosed until 1984 when I went in for a full physical and was a LTNP for almost 21 years  with no meds.

Offline AustinWesley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2007, 12:03:47 PM »
Hey Ann,

Thank you so much for sharing all of that detail and I learned quite a bit.   I also agree that I wouldn't start up on meds after one set of labs.

I'm waiting for my 5th set of numbers; however, the prior 4 have all shown a steady decline in absolute CD4 count and percent.  The VL has remained pretty level.   

Anyways, yeah, I'll print em all out, but I wanted one last set of labs before making a decision.   

I can certainly appreciate your point of view.   Unfortuantely, the virus affects us all so differently it makes it difficult to decide what to do.

Who knows, now watch my numbers bounce up again.  Grrr.   

Thanks for your feedback.  I know a lot of people will be interested in your input as well.

Wesley
Diag. 3/06  Infected aprx. 2 mo. Prior
Date        CD4   %      VL
4/6/06     627    32    36,500     NO MEDS YET!
6/7/06     409    27    36,100
8/23/06   408    25     22,300
1/2/07     354    23     28,700
2/9/07     139    30     23,000  Hep A Vaccine same day???
2/21/07   274    26     18,500 
3/3/07    RX of Truvada/Sustiva Started.
4/5/07    321     27      Undectable 1st mo.  
5/16/07  383     28    Undectable 2nd mo.
8/10/07  422     32   UD <48 on new scale!

Offline Ann

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2007, 01:15:57 PM »
You're welcome Wes.

Don't forget that you are in your first year of infection and it can take time for things to settle down. You are not currently in danger with those numbers.

Stress can play a big part in what your numbers are doing. In my own case, every single time I had lowered CD4s it was because there was a lot of stress, either physical or mental or both, in my life at that time. If nothing else, you are under a lot of stress simply by virtue of being newly diagnosed, and add to that your worries about starting meds.

Hang in there Wes, you have every chance of being pleasantly surprised by your next results. In any case, you've got time to consider your options.

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2007, 02:38:28 PM »

Might my credentials as an HIV+ person now be acceptable?

Boo

*chuckle*
"Ive slept with enough men to know that Im not gay"

Offline marco23

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2007, 03:49:38 PM »
chuckling here with philly,
I used to keep track of my numbers when I tested positive back in 93 but after several years I realized I would get nervous when the results would go down a few points and I'd panic. I'd stress myself when there was no reason to but, hey, if people want to keep track charting their numbers, I've got nothing against that.
Now, I have blood work and see the doctor every 3 months and he tells me (jokingly) that I'm the most boring patient because I usually have no complaints and the test results are always good so when I hear "you're still undetectable"...that's enough for me.
Don't hide your hurt, pain and feelings inside..for they will harden your heart.

Offline heartforyou

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2007, 04:27:45 PM »
I most certainly seroconverted in spring 1983, when I was admitted in hospital with very high fever of unknown origin, that lasted about 10 days. As a flight attendant I had been in the US many times and of course had unsafe sex, as I was not aware at that time what was going on.

Tested positive in july 1987. Did not take meds and worked normally till 1995.
Started meds after PCP, CD4 count of 7 and a viral load of more then 5.000.000 ( 5 million copies per ml³)

Jeffrey, grab my hand and walk with me...

Hermie
Diagnosed in 1987 and still kicking
Viread, Kivexa (Epzicom),Viramune once daily

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Offline aupointillimite

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2007, 04:35:43 PM »
Hell, I've been doing the labwork game for only two years, and I don't remember my results... just generalities.

The first couple times I had the results memorized.  Now, I get them and generally forget the exact values within about a day.

I attribute this to two things.

One is that there hasn't been much of a change in those two years until recently... and even with the CD4 drop, that's still high, and the viral load is low... smooth sailing through calm seas.

The other that it's kind of boring to me now... I'm very ADD... so knowing exactly how well my immune system is doing is soooo 2005. 
Your tastebuds can't repel flavor of this magnitude!

Offline Dachshund

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2007, 05:01:41 PM »


The only thing I can remember it was the third of June, another sleepy, dusty Delta day. I was out choppin' cotton and my brother was balin' hay...

Offline manchesteruk

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2007, 05:07:46 PM »
I'm trying to work out when it will have been I can't remember I didn't get ill I had slightly swollen glands in my groin if I remember rightly.  I know I got my positive result sometime in early Nov, 05 I know I got an early negative result then put off getting a checkup for a bit because the syphilis I got at the same time had cleared up and I thought that was the end of it so it came as a bit of a shock thats for sure!  I'm guessing I seroconverted sometime in August as the 'encounter' was in July.  Wow i've made that confusing haha.  I got my first CD4's and VL in December, 05 I was shitting myself as some people on here back then could probably vouch for but they came in cd4 1400+ and viral load undetectable.  I don't think i've ever had a bigger high in my life i've never felt like that before.
Diagnosed 11/05

"Life is too important to be taken seriously" Oscar Wilde

Offline libvet

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #25 on: February 11, 2007, 05:31:50 PM »
Oddly enough, I remember my seroconversion illness vividly.

I ended up with a terrible rash, a fever, sore throat, muscle aches and generally felt awful.  It resolved in about a week.

I went to a clinic and they couldn't identify it.  They suggested it was probably a viral illness (right on target with that, I guess) that would probably resolve itself in a matter of days (which technically was true for the initial illness).

It was in the summer of 86.   Can't be more specific than that.

Offline aupointillimite

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #26 on: February 11, 2007, 05:37:20 PM »
I had absolutely no seroconversion illness at all.

I know this because I usually do get a cold or something in the winter at least (ironically enough, ever since being diagnosed, this pattern has ceased... my theory is that my HIV is very territorial and doesn't allow any other microbes in)... and I remember remarking that it was strange that I hadn't been sick at all that winter.

An immunologist told me, after seeing my numbers, that it could possibly be a sign of a really good immune system, a less-virulent version of HIV, or both. 

Your tastebuds can't repel flavor of this magnitude!

Offline Boo Radley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #27 on: February 11, 2007, 05:49:52 PM »
The only thing I can remember it was the third of June, another sleepy, dusty Delta day. I was out choppin' cotton and my brother was balin' hay...

Thank you, Ms. Gentry.  Such a touching reminiscence.

Billie Joe MacAllister
String up every aristocrat!
Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!





Everything I do, say, think, excrete, secrete, exude, ooze, or write 2007 Sweet Old Boo, Inc.

Offline Boo Radley

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #28 on: February 11, 2007, 05:51:51 PM »
An immunologist told me, after seeing my numbers, that it could possibly be a sign of a really good immune system, a less-virulent version of HIV, or both. 

He was only trying to get into your pants, sweetie-darling!  Knowing you...

Let's simply leave well enough alone.

Boo
String up every aristocrat!
Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!





Everything I do, say, think, excrete, secrete, exude, ooze, or write 2007 Sweet Old Boo, Inc.

Offline aupointillimite

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #29 on: February 11, 2007, 05:55:11 PM »
He was only trying to get into your pants, sweetie-darling!  Knowing you...


He could've. 

Hot.  Doctor.

Speaking as someone of Jewish origin and who's poz... I would've felt like bagging an immunologist would be a notable high point.



Your tastebuds can't repel flavor of this magnitude!

Offline Londonguy

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #30 on: February 11, 2007, 05:58:34 PM »
I seroconverted June 2004. I remember it vividly.  It lasted about a week and I felt worse than I've ever felt in my life.  I had had unprotected sex about a few weeks before and had returned home from Uni for the summer.  For that week my mum had to look after me while I lay on the sofa feeling like shit.  

I had no energy (I literally had to drag myself up the stairs to go to the toilet), I had the shivers, I would go from blazing hot to freezing cold within minutes, I couldn't eat, couldn't sleep, felt sick constantly.  At the time I didn't even know what seroconversion was so I just thought I had some virus or flu.

Offline poet

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #31 on: February 11, 2007, 06:17:54 PM »
Thanks, LondonGuy, for describing what I had in (May? June?) 1984, about a month after my first sexual act with someone which was unprotected passive anal intercourse.  I had a raging fever, no appetite, no energy.  My neighbor was somehow concerned enough that she called my parents and insisted that my mother get me to their house.  My mother took me to our internal med. doctor who, of course, was sure that I had mono.  His office was up a steep flight and I had to crawl up on my hands and knees to reach it.  An antibiotic with penicillin knocked out the fever, but I then had a reaction to penicillin (hot, itchy extremities). 

Since the NY doctors decided that I had had the flu, that's where things sat until 1986 when, as part of an effort to counsel with testing, I got tested myself and it came back positive.  Since I finally threw out the decades of med. sheets, lab results, doctor's notes, etc., I can only tell you that I delayed starting meds. until my cd4's were around 250 and that Crixivan was in the trio/cocktail, the concept being new.  Since we didn't have viral loads in the early days, I can only say, if it helps anyone, that I was able to stay off meds for years IF we only look at cd4's and 8's and IF we look at 250 as a starting point, quite different from now.  Best, Win
Winthrop Smith has published three collections of poetry: Ghetto: From The First Five; The Weigh-In: Collected Poems; Skin Check: New York Poems.  The last was published in December 2006.  He has a work-in-progress underway titled Starting Positions.

Offline englishgirl

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Re: exactly when did you seroconvert? no speculating, you're wasting my time
« Reply #32 on: February 12, 2007, 03:10:05 PM »
i had almost exactly the same as londonguy (maybe it's an english thing?!) - had never been so ill my whole life... slept for a week, lost tons of weight, serious photosensitivity which continues to this day.

am still exhausted 18 months later (altho maybe some of that is mental) my question is - does your seroconverion 'type' (dramatic/subtle/etc) have anything to do with your future 'symptoms'? cos altho ive put the weight back on the exhaustion, photosensitivity, night sweats, hot flushes are still well and truly with me

ps that was my first post so be nice to me! ;)
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