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Author Topic: Smokers  (Read 98040 times)

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Offline GSOgymrat

  • Member
  • Posts: 5,031
  • HIV+ since 1993. INTJ
Smokers
« on: January 10, 2007, 02:08:25 AM »
I was reading the AIDSmeds article on higher rates of lung cancer for people with HIV and I was surprised that "cigarette smoking is very common among HIV-positive people in the U.S. Ė one analysis indicated that 60% to 80% of those living with the virus are smokers (compared to smoking rates of 20% to 30% in the general population)" I've never smoked. Are there are lot of people on this forum who do? For those who smoke did you start before or after your diagnosis? I wonder why there is a correlation between HIV infection and smoking.

Offline Queen Tokelove

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  • Smokey the Smurf
Re: Smokers
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2007, 03:27:55 AM »
I started smoking at 15, way before I got infected..Would like to quit but my insurance doesn't cover nicotine patches. I am already on 1 antidepressant for neuropathy and it seems like they like to dish out Wellbutrin to stop you from smoking. I'm taking enough pills as it is..
Started Atripla/Ziagen on 9/13/07.
10/31/07 CD4-265 VL- undetectable
2/6/08 CD4- 401 VL- undetectable
5/7/08 CD4- 705 VL- undetectable
6/4/08 CD4- 775 VL- undetectable
8/6/08 CD4- 805 VL- undetectable
11/13/08 CD4- 774 VL--undetectable
2/4/09  CD4- 484  VL- 18,000 (2 months off meds)
3/3/09---Starting Back on Meds---
4/27/09 CD4- 664 VL-- undetectable
6/17/09 CD4- 438 VL- 439
8/09 CD4- 404 VL- 1,600
01-22-10-- CD4- 525 VL- 59,000
Cherish the simple things life has to offer

The Royal Blog

Offline BassMan

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  • Posts: 77
  • Gran Canaria 2006
Re: Smokers
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2007, 04:03:26 AM »
I too have never smoked and was wondering about this. It would be interesting to see a breakdown by gender and sexuality of this 60-80% of HIV+ smokers.

I read recently that in the UK, smoking is much more common amongst younger (late teens  to early twenties) gay men than it is in older gay men. Interestingly, the figures quoted were very similar to the figures on smoking among HIV+ folk in general.

Now, given that (in the UK at least) gay men are still the group most affected by HIV, could it be that smoking has less to do with being HIV+ per se and more to do with being young and gay; and that therefore, the results are being skewed?

Just a thought.

Carl
Manchester, UK
Diagnosed December 2002
CD4 810 VL 750,000

Started meds October 2004
CD4 405 VL >100,000

Latest Results: October 2009
CD4 888 38%, VL undetectable
on fosamprenavir/ritonavir & Truvada

VL undetectable since November 2005

Offline carousel

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  • Posts: 821
Re: Smokers
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2007, 04:50:05 AM »
.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2007, 10:15:01 AM by carousel »

Offline Ann

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    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Smokers
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2007, 06:19:48 AM »

I quit smoking about six weeks before I was diagnosed with hiv. I lasted about 36 hours before I bought some and started smoking again. The first thing I wanted to do when I found out was to light up, so the fact that I didn't for 36 hours I suppose means I do have some willpower. That will be six years ago in February... think it may be time to quit again. ::)

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline fondeveau

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  • Posts: 425
Re: Smokers
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2007, 06:29:42 AM »
I'm not sure they meant that there is a correlation between smoking and HIV unless its that smokers are wild, rebellious, things that won't do what their told - at any rate, I'm trying Chantix to stop smoking and today is quit day...

Offline DanielMark

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2007, 06:35:45 AM »
For those who smoke did you start before or after your diagnosis? I wonder why there is a correlation between HIV infection and smoking.

No idea about the last question, but to answer the first one: I've smoked regularly since about age 16.

I stopped successfully for a decade when my partner Ken and I lived together, and have tried a few times to quit again since then, but no go. I've tried all the Nico-this-and-thats and they seem to have zero effect on me.

My next apartment (which Iím looking for now) will have a balcony, and Iíll make another attempt at quitting by limiting any smoking to the outdoors to begin with. Or if I fail again, I can always just jump.

Daniel
MEDS: REYATAZ & KIVEXA (SINCE AUG 2008)

MAY 2000 LAB RESULTS: CD4 678
VL STILL UNDETECTABLE

DIAGNOSED IN 1988

Offline Razorbill

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2007, 06:36:03 AM »
Good luck fondeveau

Offline ChaplinGuy

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  • Eat my left foot
Re: Smokers
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2007, 06:44:16 AM »
I was glad to see a post on this, as I have always wondered why anyone with HIV or any other serious disease would continue such reckless behavior. (Not casting stones, as I recognize it's my reckless behavior that, even if a non-smoker, got me here.)

That being said, I am curious to know if smokers recognize the impact that they have on those around them. I know that some are more conscious of their habit than others, but I become frustrated when I have to dodge smokers standing outside my building (who seem to form a herd that produces a disgusting cloud around them). And the ones that light up on the escaltors before we even get out of the subway ... don't get me started (have screamed at a few for such rude behavior).

Now that I think about it, smoking in public should be lumped together with HIV - which is criminalized in many states if you knowingly spread it. I'd back a law banning smoking in all public places, given that it directly spreads deadly toxins to those around you without their consent.

Anyone out there considering quitting - do it! If not for yourself (best reason), do it for the people who have to walk in your cancer-causing wake every day.


Offline david25luvit

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  • Member since March 2005
Re: Smokers
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2007, 06:50:13 AM »
Like Queen Akasha I too began smoking at the tender age of fifteen...
and back then smoking was not only way cool but much much cheaper.
All credible evidence suggests I should stop and being HIV doesn't help
that's for sure but I can't imagine not being able to light up...its the last
bad habit ( if you don't count an occasional glass of wine) that remains
after a life time of many bad habits...also

I can't imagine what federal and state governments would do without the revenue
...and we pay for those anti smoking campaign advertisements that are found on TV
and other media
 
How ironic that we are looked down upon for our weakness by those same people
who can't wait to get their hands on the tax money it generates and we're talking
billions of dollars just in the United States.

Modified to add...Smokers need love too.  Some of us aren't inconsiderated about our
habit.  We smoke only when & when permitted.  And these days that getting harder.   
« Last Edit: January 10, 2007, 07:07:03 AM by david25luvit »
In Memory of
Raymond David McRae III
Nov. 25, 1972- Oct. 15, 2004
I miss him terribly..........

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Smokers
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2007, 06:58:10 AM »

Studies have shown that quitting smoking is much more difficult than quitting heroin.

Just sayin...

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline carousel

  • Member
  • Posts: 821
Re: Smokers
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2007, 07:04:32 AM »
.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2007, 10:46:26 AM by carousel »

Offline DanielMark

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,475
Re: Smokers
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2007, 07:05:03 AM »
Studies have shown that quitting smoking is much more difficult than quitting heroin.

That's true Ann, and from personal experience I have no doubt about it.

Another thing I know is true: you can't make a non smoker understand nicotine addiction.

So I don't bother trying anymore.
MEDS: REYATAZ & KIVEXA (SINCE AUG 2008)

MAY 2000 LAB RESULTS: CD4 678
VL STILL UNDETECTABLE

DIAGNOSED IN 1988

Offline Gary85741

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  • Native Virginian living in Tucson AZ
    • Good guy, good heart
Re: Smokers
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2007, 07:51:17 AM »

     I agree particularly with David25.  I started smoking when I was 17.  Back then a brand-name carton of smokes cost $2.67 including tax (don't know why I remember that!)  I've never tried to quit.  I have cut back (down) a few times which is what I'd like to do...but not quit personally...as I enjoy it.  Unless someone's changed the Constitution and neglected to advise me...it's my right to do so. 

     I'm considerate of others who are non-smokers and hope in return for that reciprocity...sometimes I get it, sometimes I don't.  Some people of course are genuinely bothered by it (eg. asthmatics.)  However to be honest, I don't have patience with those who don't like it just because it's PC to not like it, or those who think they are better than me and other smokers just because they don't smoke.
     Interesting that in the mid-70s, for example, when more people smoked and there weren't sanctions...it did not seem to bother very many non-smokers.  So there's more to the psychology of all this than meets the eye.

     Oh yes, it's getting harder to smoke sociologically...with more prohibitions and ever increasing taxes.  Of course, it's not "good" for someone's physiology.  But then again life is a balance.  If we only did things that are good for us...well think how much each of our lives would change! 
     There are non-smokers who have other equally unhealthy habits, be it excessive drinking or drug use, not getting enough sleep, not adhering to one's medication regimen regularly...not to mention some sexual practices.

     One question no one seems ever able to really answer:  If smoking indeed is so terribly awful for us...how come people weren't dropping like flies in the 1940s-60s when over half the population smoked?  All these studies about second-hand smoke, and outrageous claims such as one having higher criminal tendencies in life if one's mother smoked while pregnant...oh gimme a break.  These studies often are of a very small pool size, usually woefully insufficient to draw valid statistical analyses.

     So I'll keep on smoking and being respectful of non-smokers.  If someone doesn't want to be around me because of it...so be it.  And if they seek to belittle or chastise me...well it wouldn't be long before I gave them their walking papers.

Gary
Poz since '89. 
Current regimen: Rescriptor, Emtriva, Kaletra, Invirase, Acyclovir, Lisinopril, Lipitor, Prilosec, Valium, Testim, Nandrolone, Loperamidr, Marinol.

Offline bear60

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  • Posts: 4,104
Re: Smokers
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2007, 08:02:11 AM »
"I'm not sure they meant that there is a correlation between smoking and HIV unless its that smokers are wild, rebellious, things that won't do what their told - at any rate, I'm trying Chantix to stop smoking and today is quit day"....Fondeveau
...................................................
I totally agree with this statement.  It may be coincidental...... but correlation???  Get real.
Modified to add: in my mind...... correlation implies a causal relationship...like cigarette smoking causes HIV....and there is no data to support that statement....at least I dont think so.  If you are "profiling" people with HIV then it is ok to say that more people with HIV smoke than does the general population.   But what does that actually say?....


« Last Edit: January 10, 2007, 08:08:08 AM by bear60 »
Poz Bear Type in Philadelphia

Offline skeebo1969

  • Member
  • Posts: 5,705
Re: Smokers
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2007, 08:06:04 AM »

  I started smoking at the age of 21 when I should have known better.   Since quitting weed my cigarette smoking has probably doubled.   It almost seems I can smoke one in 5 pulls...  I swear they go so fast!  

  I saw the article and saw that it is statistacally skewed.  I mean 25-30% of the general population smoke as opposed to 60-80% of HIVers.  Of course this means our percentage of lung cancer diagnosis/deaths are going to be higher.     Sheeez... Am I rationalizing it or what?

  I was suppose to quit on New Years... Then I changed it to my birthday...  Now I've changed my quit date to Martin Luther King's Birthday...  ::)
I despise the song Love is in the Air, you should too.

Offline bear60

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  • Posts: 4,104
Re: Smokers
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2007, 08:10:11 AM »
Awwwwwww Thomas.....  You said you were going to quit.  I know I know....tomorrow is another day.  Start with today...then deal with tomorrow.  I have been off cigarettes for over 6 months now.  Wellbutrin is the key for me.
Poz Bear Type in Philadelphia

tendai

  • Guest
Re: Smokers
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2007, 08:13:19 AM »
how about smoking pot?  since its got medicinal properties. i have a friend who likes me to share his joint sometimes. kinda worries me a bit

Offline Coffeechick88

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  • Posts: 431
Re: Smokers
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2007, 08:16:19 AM »
Smoking was the one rebellious thing I started as a teen (that includes weed).  I smoked about a pack or more a day of Marboro Menthol Lights 100s in a box.  Though sometimes I would switch brands and types because I was bored and wanted to see if I liked anything better.  I did also like Kools.  I did quit soon after diagnosis, but it didn't begin as any conscious effort.  You cannot really smoke if you are in the hospital and too sick to bathe yourself, let alone wheel your IV pole outside to go smoke.  When I did begin feeling better, I did feel like jumping out of my third floor hospital window, because no one would buy me cigarettes and the doctor wouldn't let me leave--I did even contemplate wheeling my IV pole down the road to the gas station.  They did give me those inhalor things.  I eventually kept up the quitting, I have asthma, so it never was a good thing to be smoking in the first place.  If I didn't have that issue, you can bet I would be still smoking---and loving every minute of it.  I guess it is worth it, though.  Besides my lungs being in better shape, I do have more money in my pocket, though I can't really complain much since Indiana,while expensive, it still is one of the cheapest (if not the cheapest) places to buy cigarettes in the states.  I remember when I was in Chicago, we would all drive across the border to buy cigarettes--when the tax rose astronomically there.  I still get times when work is stressful and I think about picking that habit up again.....
Lucas James is here
Born 6-14-08 at 1233 am
8 lbs 14 oz, 22 in long

Offline GSOgymrat

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2007, 08:19:52 AM »
Statistics 101: Correlation is not causation.

Because a higher percentage of people with HIV smoke doesn't mean smoking causes HIV or HIV causes smoking. It does mean there is some kind of relationship between people who smoke and people who have HIV if the originally quoted statistic is even valid. I'm curious as to the nature of that relationship.

Offline racingmind

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  • Posts: 236
Re: Smokers
« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2007, 09:07:25 AM »
I had been thinking about quitting long before my diagnosis, and when I got it, I looked into the effects of smoking on HIV folk.  It turns out that the carbon monoxide in cigarette smoke kills CD4 cells in the smoker.  As we all know, us HIVers need everyone of those we can produce.  I am in the process of trying to quit.  I have stopped all of my bad habits after being diagnosed and started eating better and joined a gym for exercise. I cannot seem to get rid of the smokes though.  I'm on Wellbutrin for 2 months now and I thought I would be done by the new year, but alas I am still smoking.  I keep buying the cheapest, most disgusting cigarettes I can find so that I will not enjoy them as much.....

The funny thing is that both my primary and my ID doctors suggested that I not try to quit immediately after diagnosis...I guess fearing that I would be going through enough without adding the discomfort of nictotine withdraw to the mix...

I know I will feel better about myself if I can rid myself of smoking...if I do, I plan to reward myself with fun things I wouldn't ordinarily buy for myself with the money I'm not spending on cigarettes....

Good Luck to us all that are trying to quit.....
Tested Negative: 5/06
Tested Positive: 9/06 
9/06: CD4: 442 (28%) VL: +100,000
10/06: CD4: 323 (25%) VL: 243,440
11/06: CD4: 405 (28%) VL: 124,324
12/06: CD4: 450 (29%) VL: 114,600
1/07: CD4: 440 (27%) VL: 75,286
3/07: CD4: 459 (30%) VL: 44,860
5/07: CD4: 353 (24%) VL: 50,852
7/07: CD4: 437 (29%) VL: 39,475
9/07: CD4: 237 (32%) VL: 372,774
10/07: CD4: 324 (27%) VL: 115,454 
Started Atripla: 10/07
11/07: CD4: 524 (?%) VL: Undetectable!
2/08: CD4: 653 (35%) VL: undetectable
5/08: CD4: 822 (40%) VL: undetectable
8/08: CD4: 626 (35%) VL: undetectable
12/08: CD4: 619 (36%) VL: undetectable
3/09: CD4: 802 (38%) VL: undetectable
7/09: CD4: 1027 (43%) VL: not tested
10/09: CD4: 1045 (43%) VL: undetectable

Offline ChaplinGuy

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #21 on: January 10, 2007, 09:17:29 AM »

Let me just add to my (admittedly) caustic remarks here and send I truly have the utmost respect and admiration for any and all of you who have, are trying, or will eventually quit smoking. I make an effort to applaud the efforts of folks I encounter who have succeeded, and wish every one of you trying the best.

Just remember you CAN do it and the benefits extend far beyond your health!

Offline dixieman

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2007, 09:39:23 AM »
Hey, I smoked on and off over the years and I do smoke weed for medicinal purposes.... but, has anyone correlated the effects of alcohol with their meds.... I quit drinking but, I will occassionally have a glass of wine... but, alcohol with meds does not work.... I've known several people who continued to drink alcohol with their meds and had a counter effect on shutting down the liver...Unfortunately they died... alcohol just does not mix well with the medications for hiv... so I enjoy my weed... in moderation.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #23 on: January 10, 2007, 10:06:23 AM »
I started smoking at 25 so that was 26 years ago. I like to smoke so I don't see myself quitting anytime soon. My lungs are clear and the xrays are clear so I'm not pressured to quit.

Offline aztecan

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  • 29 years positive, 57 years a pain in the butt
Re: Smokers
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2007, 10:07:56 AM »
I have smoked since I was 16.

I think the problem is that quitting is now so PC.

Everyone should quit, so government, the PC police, and, sometimes, the actual police, say. It is socially acceptable to quit. It is socially unacceptable to keep smoking.

Good drones quit smoking. Good drones act properly. Good drones abstain from sex until marriage.

Regardless of how bad it is for my health, the attitudes of rabid anti-smokers is enough to make me dig in my heels.

There was a story recently where a couple who lived in condo were told they could no longer smoke in their own home because the smoke was "migrating" to othe condos.

First, I would definitely question the building standards of those condos and, second, I would tell the condo association to stuff it or buy me out.

I've been stopped at a traffic light and had someone in an adjacent car give me grief because I was smoking. Bad move on their part.

Sorry, but being an old queer comes with its own baggage, including rebelliing against societal inquisitions such as this.

For the record, I have tried quitting - repreatedly. I did it before all the PC hoopla. I actually did OK, as long as I didn't have to speak to anyone, work, or eat.

I tried the patches. Did you know you get an interesting high when you smoke while wearing a patch? My doc wasn't amused.

The problem is I don't want to quit. I enjoy smoking. Now, with the added allure of it being socially rebelious, there is yet another edge added to it.

We learned nothing from prohibition.

HUGS,

Mark
"May your life preach more loudly than your lips."
~ William Ellery Channing (Unitarian Minister)

Offline Life

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2007, 10:23:51 AM »
How appropriate a post....  I quit today..  The thought has been there for a year.  I am absolutely so fed up with this vice that it really PISSES ME OFF that such a thing has such control over me.    I know how bad it is for me and I do not have the immune system to deal with it.   1 + 1 = 2.   I never get this to add up until of late...   I am sure its mucking up things and BY GOD this is going to stop here and now......
« Last Edit: January 10, 2007, 10:26:26 AM by Eric »

Offline allopathicholistic

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2007, 10:25:03 AM »
How appropriate a post....  I quit today.. 

HUGE CONGRATZ ERIC  :)  :)

What about Will?

Offline Bartro

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2007, 10:25:43 AM »
I am also a smoker.  I can quit.  I have quit many many times.  I doubt that smoking and HIV are related.  I think that smoking is just more common among gay men.   Walk into any of the gay bars around here (the midwest) and you'll see more than half of the patrons are smokers.  I think it might be a regional thing too.  I visit friends near San Francisco frequently and notice there are fewer smokers.  We went to a gay bar and there was a sign saying that the police would be called if you lit up a cigarette.  I also noticed many of the patrons off in the corners smoking marijuana with out any problem.  What's up with that?  I think a lot of it is political correctness run amok.  

I know how addictive smoking can be.  I quit and do quite fine until some negative event sends me back to the store for "just one pack".  I'm deeply hooked right now and my doc says to wait a little while before I try to kick the habit again.  I get so addicted I remember years ago I had just undergone back surgery and was on bed rest.  I snuck out of the hospital and walked three blocks in a hospital gown (with a long coat) to get a pack of smokes and something decent to eat.  

I too recently had a chest x-ray and everything looked fine.  I'll quit for myself when I'm ready.  I don't blow smoke in people's faces or light up around non-smokers.  

Things are a bit too controlled in the US.  I was on a train in europe.  An elderly woman sitting next to me was smoking a cigar and drinking a beer with a bourbon chaser.  My kind of woman.  

Best wishes.
Rusty

Offline Javicho

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2007, 10:27:31 AM »
I smoke since I was 15, and when I found out I was poz i start smoking more bat now I back to my normal 3 or 4 a day

J.

Offline Life

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2007, 10:28:21 AM »
HUGE CONGRATZ ERIC  :)  :)

What about Will?

Alex, Will has 2 a day... I smoke a pack for no GOD DAM REASON.....   Of course he supports me but this is for me and no one else...   I do not want another diagnosis down the pike that I have to deal with...   I could not handle that...

Offline Bartro

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2007, 10:28:40 AM »
J.

Is that three of four cigarettes or three or four packs?  :-)
Rusty

Offline allopathicholistic

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2007, 10:47:53 AM »
I smoke a pack for no GOD DAM REASON.....  

Yup, you don't need those fags, we've got plenty here!  :D

Offline ChaplinGuy

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #32 on: January 10, 2007, 10:48:04 AM »
I am not the world's biggest Pelosi fan, but this gets my vote:

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/01/10/house.smoking.ap/index.html

Offline woodshere

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #33 on: January 10, 2007, 10:56:05 AM »
How stupid am I, I didn't start until I was 30.  The Wednesday before Christmas my mom had a heart attack, she smoked (quit 2 years ago) for 40 years.  My father has heart disease and both of my grandfathers died due to heart disease.  Obviously I need, no must quit for my health.  During the past week I have smoked less than a pack, yesterday I only smoked 3 cigarettes and today zero.  Improved health is not the only benefit, quitting will add $100 (a pack in Ky runs about $3.25) to my disposable income.  Plus, my ID doc said Monday if I didn't he would cut off my Wellbutrin XL.   So forget health and money I need my happy pills!!!

Cheers,
Woods
"Let us give pubicity to HV/AIDS and not hide it..." "One of the things destroying people with AIDS is the stigma we attach to it."   Nelson Mandela

Offline skeebo1969

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #34 on: January 10, 2007, 11:02:22 AM »
 Plus, my ID doc said Monday if I didn't he would cut off my Wellbutrin XL.   So forget health and money I need my happy pills!!!


   I was on that weak stuff one time... all it did was make my coffee taste like crap and my cigarettes taste worse.. guess which one won out?

  I love smoking it is so enjoyable and I fear I will be one of those one day laid up with lung cancer trying to smoke a cigarette :-\
I despise the song Love is in the Air, you should too.

Offline poet

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #35 on: January 10, 2007, 11:06:18 AM »
I'm sure someone here would have the numbers for this (but even without them, does this get us somewhere?): what is the percentage of gay men versus the percentage of straight men (do we still go with 10%?)?  What is the percentage of hiv positive gay men versus hiv positive straight men?  What is the percentage of hiv positive men versus hiv negative men?  What is the percentage of gay men who smoke versus gay men who don't? What is the percentage of gay men who are single versus gay men who are partnered?  What is the percentage of single men who frequent bars versus single men who don't and then the percentage of partnered gay men who frequent bars versus partnered gay men who don't?  And by only thinking about this, would we see a pattern, such as men are more likely to go to bars if they are single and if they frequent bars, more likely to smoke? A larger picture, in short, of hiv postive men, their habits, their relationship status.  A question hovering, since you can't get infected if you don't have sex (ignoring, for this, needles sticks, blood transfusions, etc.) can we connect some dots, with correlations between gay men venturing out and getting infected?  Win

Winthrop Smith has published three collections of poetry: Ghetto: From The First Five; The Weigh-In: Collected Poems; Skin Check: New York Poems.  The last was published in December 2006.  He has a work-in-progress underway titled Starting Positions.

Offline Life

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #36 on: January 10, 2007, 11:11:32 AM »
Yup, you don't need those fags, we've got plenty here!  :D

I would rather seek comfort in knowing that the fags here can concur and rule over a vice??  It seems so rediculous to me that here I am fighting for my life and I am stepping all over that fight with smoking.   Now that is FUCKED UP in my mind....  I am going to hit the gym hard and just wear myself down when I get all cranky and want to kill guests/patrons alike.   I think whenever you start a job in the Guest Service industry, that HR should just hand you out a carton of cigs during orientation.. ;)

Offline aztecan

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2007, 11:13:22 AM »
It figures CNN would run this. They refuse to hire smokers.

I had a friend who, while battling non-Hodgkins Lymphoma, used to sneak down the hall and light up in the hospital linen closet.

Good ol California. Leave it to the politicos from there to be PC. I remember visiting my ex in Pasadena and learning they no longer are able to use charcoal barbecue grills because "they cause too much pollution."

This from the same state that rails against pollution, forces covers to be placed on cattle trucks, yet freely uses power generated by coal-fired generating stations in other states.

I just find the whole anti-smoking issue hypocritical. The aerosolized mercury levels in my area are among the highest in the nation - because of coal-fired generating stations. People are cautioned against eating fish from local rivers as a result and we have very high rates of pulmonary disease because of the pollution.

Yet nearby Farmington just passed one of those smoking bans while, just a few months earlier, approving government revenue bonds to refinance one of the local coal-fired generating stations built 50 years ago.

Makes no sense to me.
"May your life preach more loudly than your lips."
~ William Ellery Channing (Unitarian Minister)

Offline Ihavehope

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #38 on: January 10, 2007, 11:13:41 AM »
That is so dumb. To smoke and be HIV poz.
Infected: April 2005
12/6/06 - Diagnosed HIV positive
12/19/06 - CD4 = 240  22% VL = 26,300
1/4/07 - CD4 = 200 16% VL = ?
2/9/07 = Started Kaletra/Truvada
3/13/07 = CD4 = 386 22% VL ?

Offline Optimistic

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #39 on: January 10, 2007, 11:29:47 AM »
maybe I misunderstood the article, but it seems to me that the article is saying even non smokers who are hiv + have an increase risk in lung disorders. Anyhow, I quit cigs as soon as I found out my status...but I didn't smoke much to begin with.

Justin
12/06 (Atripla): cd4 - 260; cd% - 33%; vl - 169
1/07 (Atripla): cd4 - 267; cd% - 38.1%; vl - 132
4/07 (Atripla): cd4 - 373; cd% - 33.9%; vl - <50
7/07 (Atripla); cd4 - 287; cd% - 35.8%; vl - <50
9/07 (Atripla); cd4 - 356; cd% - 39.5%; vl - <50
12/07 (Atripla); cd4 - 517

Offline Boo Radley

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #40 on: January 10, 2007, 11:38:19 AM »
I started smoking tobacco in my teens but after a bout with hepatitis A in early 1980 I stopped for good (the cigarettes tasted godawful and I figured it was an opportunity to stop tobacco).  What really happened is I started smoking more pot and have ever since, with few interruptions.  Now I smoke between 1 - 2 joints a day but in my 20s and 30s I smoked far more since most of my friends smoked it, too.

I'm allergic to tobacco smoke and can't be in a smoke filled room for more than 5 minutes without feeling ill.  That's a good excuse to stay out of bars and other venues where tobacco smoke is concentrated.  I haven't been around many poz people in the last few years but when I was a lot of the guys smoked.  My best friend smoked until his lungs began filling with Coccidioides immitis and he was too ill. 

I guess a lot of people handle part of the stress of being poz by smoking tobacco.  I use pot.

Boo
String up every aristocrat!
Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!





Everything I do, say, think, excrete, secrete, exude, ooze, or write © 2007 Sweet Old Boo, Inc.

Offline Pippet

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #41 on: January 10, 2007, 11:42:32 AM »
Mark me down as another smoker...  I too, have been smoking since the age of 15 (25 years).
I was also a heavy drinker before diagnosis so that was the first habit I dropped. Smoking is next on the list, after I get past the shock of everything else. (starting meds etc.)
I don't want to throw my system into a total spiral.  Baby steps...

Good Luck to all who are trying to quit!
Diagnosed Aug. 2006
CD4 246, VL 202,000
Started Truvada/ Viramune 11-23-06
Taken off meds 12-06-06 (Bad Rash)
Started Truvada/ Reyataz, Norvir 1-18-07
Taken off Norvir 3-1-07 (Jaundice)
New doc 3-22-07
CD4 229  VL 1031
My latest cocktail...  Truvada and Kaletra (4-6-07)
CD4 289 VL 350 (5-15-07)
CD4 308 VL 115 (8-06-07)
CD4 349 VL 511 (11-5-07)
CD4 489 VL 383 (2-4-08)
CD4 483 VL <50 (5-6-08) YEAH
CD4 545 VL 108 (9-12-08)
CD4 409 VL <48 (1-27-09) YEAH
CD4 505 VL <48 (5-20-09)
CD4 385 VL <48 (9-15-09)
CD4 609 VL  159 (2-28-10)

Offline Jerry71

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #42 on: January 10, 2007, 11:44:06 AM »
I started smoking at the age of 25. I have tried to quit several times and when I was diagnosed with HIV I quit for four months but started right back up. It is very hard to quit. Hopefully if the insurance companies and medical expencies would allow for the patch I might consider to quit. But at the moment I will light up and enjoy my smoke.

Offline Life

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #43 on: January 10, 2007, 11:46:31 AM »
That is so dumb. To smoke and be HIV poz.

Ihavehope - That says it all for me.... Thanks...

Offline thunter34

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #44 on: January 10, 2007, 11:56:35 AM »
I actually 'learned' to smoke for a character I was playing in a theatre production.  I had to learn how to hold a cig casually like a second nature because this guy was supposed to be a chain smoker.  I remember getting tunnel vision from onstage because I was still adjusting to the nicotine.  Shortly thereafter, the whole gay coming out thing happened.  Fast forward about a year, and I suddenly have the self-realization that I am a full-fledged smoker.  It really got ahold of me for years.  I kinda quit by default through Wellbutrin prescribed for depression.

And therein I suspect is the 'correlation' between HIV and smoking:  depression.  I think depression lends itself to self-medicating through smoking, alcohol, drugs and yes, sexual behavior.

Anyway, I have to agree with aztecan about a few things.  Even though I really don't smoke these days, sometimes the condescending tone of non-smokers is almost enough to make me wanna pick one up just for spite.  And heaven help the person who might pull up beside me in traffic to berate me for smoking.  They just might find a lit cigarette butt flung into their window as reward.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline BooBoo

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #45 on: January 10, 2007, 12:09:01 PM »
I started smoking when I was 14.  And after many failed attempts to quit I think I have finally kicked the habit for good.  It's been almost a year since I've quit and I rarely get the urge to lite up.  Plus, over the past year my CD4 count has risen by about 300 points.....it was about 750 a year ago and in December it was up to 1057......not really sure if there's a connection or not but it sounds like a logical assumption.

My numbers are up, I feel better than I have in years and I've even managed to gain a much needed 10 pounds (and still want to gain another 10).....so I'm just gonna leave the cigarettes alone.

Jim

Offline Boo Radley

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #46 on: January 10, 2007, 12:20:43 PM »
And therein I suspect is the 'correlation' between HIV and smoking:  depression.  I think depression lends itself to self-medicating through smoking, alcohol, drugs and yes, sexual behavior.

Yep, masking depression played a large part in my pot smoking habits for years.  Since starting in the wonderful world of psychotropic pharmaceuticals I don't feel the urge to smoke as much as I once did.

Quote
... sometimes the condescending tone of nonsmokers is almost enough to make me wanna pick one up just for spite.  And heaven help the person who might pull up beside me in traffic to berate me for smoking.  They just might find a lit cigarette butt flung into their window as reward.

I don't condescend, I just start hacking up a lung.  People driving actually say something to other drivers?  Geez, in New Orleans you don't look at other drivers for fear of being shot (and you never look in a car stopped at a traffic light because the person is invariably picking his/her nose).  If I were a smoker and another car pulled up and the driver berated me I'd run the ass off the road!  One must deal with impertinence swiftly and harshly!

Boo
String up every aristocrat!
Out with the priests and let them live on their fat!





Everything I do, say, think, excrete, secrete, exude, ooze, or write © 2007 Sweet Old Boo, Inc.

Offline rick21007

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #47 on: January 10, 2007, 12:34:24 PM »
And I assumed I was the only smoker on the forums, LOL!!!!!!  And you guys seem to have it so together too (what people tell me!!)  I gotta quit--find a healthier addiction to replace it.  Funny how being diagnosed with hiv now makes me realize I have too much to live for.

Rick

Offline Strayboy74

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #48 on: January 10, 2007, 01:07:11 PM »
I have too much to live for.

Does this mean you're gonna die soon? :)

I think this would be a case of using a double positive. LOL

-joseph
(who has never smoked)

Offline Longislander

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Re: Smokers
« Reply #49 on: January 10, 2007, 01:34:38 PM »
I started at 12. Yep, I'd say it was depression. I quit when I was 34, bad triglycerides results (turned out to be wrong). I got Wellbutrin, bought the patch, went back to the gym everyday, and I was falling in love with a non-smoker-all at the same time. I quit first day. Stopped the pill and patch by 7th day. I lost 35 pounds and started a 5 year relationship.

I never thought of having another cigarette during those 5 years. Even through the pre-breakup stress and the breakup. Then I went to a bar with coworkers, was drinking and they were smoking. Guess what?

I'd say depression, even mild depression, helps a smoker keep smoking.

I've done wellbutrin and the patch since then. It doesn't work the same as that first time. What's missing? The love factor.

I'd give anything to quit. I know how bad it is for me. I've spent $500 on accupressure, useless.
I'm currently taking Chantix, not sure it's doing anything.

Funny how the cost of THE PATCH has skyrocketed al;ong with the price of cigarettes. Used to be 21.99, now it's somewhere in the $60 range.
infected 10/05 diagnosed 12-05
2/06   379/57000                    6/07 372/30500 25%   4/09 640/U/32% 
5/06   ?? /37000                     8/07 491/55000/24%    9/09 913/U/39%
8/06   349/9500 25%              11/07 515/68000/24     2/10 845/U/38%
9/06   507/16,000 30% !          2/08  516/116k/22%    7/10 906/80/39%
12/06 398/29000 26%             Start Atripla 3/08
3/07   402/80,000 29%            4/08  485/undet!/27
4/07   507/35,000 25%            7/08 625/UD/34%
                                                 11/08 684/U/36%

 


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