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Author Topic: Mutual masturbation, again...  (Read 7522 times)

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Offline madmaf

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Mutual masturbation, again...
« on: June 12, 2006, 09:15:36 AM »
Hi,

I went to a massage parlour 2 weeks ago and the lady (quite vigorously) masturbated me using her own vaginal fluids as lubricant, which she had a lot of.

Now, in normal circumstances, I would not be worried but since the lady was, should I say, a "pro", I started wondering and now, I am panicking a bit.

On the good side, she did defend me from touching her lips, clitoris and vagina.

So, I will get tested in 3 months, if only to calm me down. But in the meantime, what is your opinion? Another worried well?

Many thanks

MM

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2006, 09:23:15 AM »
M, you don't any reason whatsoever to get tested for HIV in relation to this incident. Mutual masturbation is not a risk for transmission. The vaginal fluids which could potentially be a source of transmission are in the cervical area and not really accessible via masturbation. So in this instance you don't have any cause for concern about HIV.

Read the lesson on transmission if you haven't already done so.

Risk is related to what you do and not who you do it with. As long as you are wearing a condom consistently for either vaginal or anal intercourse you are pretty much covered literally and figuratively as far as HIV is concerned.

Cheers,
Andy Velez

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2006, 09:29:01 AM »
I urge you to read the LESSONS section of this website for the latest in transmission information.

Pro or civilian, whore or nun, you DO NOT get HIV from mutual masturbation.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2006, 10:05:59 AM »
Many thanks for your answers!

One thing I would like to add is that although I have spent much time on very credible Internet sites (i.e. CDC, Thebody.com, poz.com) I do not recall any information regarding the vaginal fluids at the entrance of the vagina being less (or not as) contaminating, compared to the fluids found in the cervical area - which I guess is found inside the vagina.

But one could argue that even if the info was there, my brain would probably not have registered it, anxious I was to find info specific to my case...

Thank you very much.

MM

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2006, 09:03:16 AM »
Hi again,

It has now been 3 weeks and I am experiencing very weird symptoms, the most bizarre one being low body temperature (between 95.36 and 96.12 taken every hour or so). I am frequently feeling like I'm cold but I don't have fever.

I also have diarrhea, cannot eat although I feel hungry and I experience somewhat important nigthsweats, with the sweating mostly around the neck and upper torso.

Finally, 6-7 very bright red (ruby) small patches (very small) have appeared on my torso.

I am a complete nervewreck.

I am somewhat confident that the diarrhea is stree related, as is the issue with eating.

The thing that REALLY bugs me is the low body temperature. Any ideas?

thanks

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2006, 09:27:33 AM »
Well, you don't get HIV from mutual masturbation. So if you are having troubling symptoms, go see a doctor. It won't be HIV

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2006, 09:46:21 AM »
I agree with Jonathan about seeing a doctor if you have what you are calling symptoms that are troubling you.

What your report reads like is that of someone who is assiduously searching for "signs" through a mindset of HIV jitters -- all with absolutely no basis in HIV science of course.

You can continue to do that and it still won't change that (happily) this is not an HIV situation.
Andy Velez

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2006, 07:58:54 AM »
Hi again,

Sorry for bothering you with this topic again. As you can see, I am having a REAL tough time accepting that my risk was "no-risk" due to all the "symptoms" I am experiencing. And yes, I know, symptoms mean nothing. but stil... I never experienced things I am currently experiencing (as explained in my previous post), including a now white tongue (dehydration?).

I only have one quick question: What is the durantion of ARS? 1 week? 2 weeks? One month? I understand that it can be different for each person but, usually, what would it be?

Thank you,

Offline Ann

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2006, 08:07:40 AM »
mad,

ARS, if it happens in a noticeable way at all, usually only lasts for a week, two weeks tops. The symptoms come on all at once and they go all at once. They don't come one by one and they don't come and go either.

You didn't have a risk of hiv infection. If you continue to have difficulties accepting that fact, you would be wise to seek professional help for your hiv anxiety. We cannot do that for you here, you must have face-to-face support and help.

If you continue to have physical worries, you'll have to go see your doctor about them, again, face-to-face. Nobody can diagnose your problems over the internet.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2006, 09:15:53 AM »
So, and I assure you this will be my last post on ths topic, for example, ARS symptoms such as swollen lymph nods, diarrhea and no appetite would last the same amount of time re: come and go together?

I ask because I had highly noticeable swollen lymp nodes in the neck that have lasted 2 days but diarrhea, low body temperature, night sweats and loss of appetite are still present.

Thanks

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2006, 09:20:03 AM »
What you are experiencing is NOT ARS.

Offline Ann

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2006, 09:21:20 AM »
Mad,

Nothing you report sounds remotely acute hiv infection related. It sounds like stress. If your symptoms continue to bother you, go see your doctor!

And yes, that includes the swollen gland in your neck. Hiv is an infection in the blood and therefore it involves the whole body. Having swollen glands in one part of your body is usually caused by an infection nearby. Swollen neck glands could be caused by a sore throat, sinus problems, an infected tooth or gums and many other things besides, but not, NOT hiv.

You did NOT have a risk for hiv infection.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2006, 10:36:34 AM »
Ok. I'm starting to get it.  Just to clear my mind:

I did have huge swollen lymph nodes (as big as almonds) in the neck for 2 days and they were so noticeable that, I have to assume, if the lymp nodes located in the armpits and the groin would have swollen, I would have noticed them for sure.

So, during ARS, because the virus is in the blodd and hence goes everywhere in the body, it is either none or ALL of the lymph nodes that get swollen. Since  only the ones located in the neck were enlarged, it is "proof" that what I experienced was not ARS.

Can you please confirm?  I know I have to let go and everything but I am a chemist by profession and logic is the only way I can understand things (pitty, isn't it?)

Sorry for bothering you, again.

 


Offline Ann

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #13 on: June 26, 2006, 11:55:10 AM »
mad,

The only proof you need that you were not experiencing ARS is the fact that you did not have a risk of hiv infection.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #14 on: June 26, 2006, 08:12:45 PM »
Thanks for your reply.

Please understand that I am not trying to be difficult - I just want to get the logic here. Although I understand what you guys are telling me - I had no risk whatsoever - the "symptoms I get tel otherwise, even if symptoms mean squat.

1- A "pro" masturbates me using her own vaginal fluids. Prior to the massaging, I did see vaginal fluids "dripping" from her lips to the uncircumcized head of my penis. At that time, I thought it prabaly was lubrifiant getting warmer from her body heat since, I assume, prostitutes do not get excited by their clients.

2- 2.5 weeks later, I get diarrhea and, 2 days later, chills but no fever (in fact lower body temperature), stomach ache and loss of appetite. Now, that says viral infection.

3- 2 days later I get huge swollen lymph nodes in my neck for around 36 hours. Confirmed viral infection.

4- White tongue that lasts 1 week following the lymph nodes. Let's assume it was a sinus infection. What do I read? That among the symptoms is sore throat - exactly what I got, located in the soft palate.

5- All in all, beside the lymph nodes adn the white tongue, all these "symptoms" have lasted 12 days. And because they (diarrhea, stomach ache, loss of appetite and chills VS swollen lymph nodes and white tongue) were apart in time, we could even strech it to 2 viral infection.

Now, I am extremely rarely sick so this is really disturbing for me.

I really want to accept the idea that my encounter was "no risk - I really do.  The problem I get is with all these symptoms!!!!

Thanks for reading me .

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #15 on: June 26, 2006, 08:15:19 PM »
Go to the doctor if you are having those symptoms. It's not an HIV concern.

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #16 on: June 26, 2006, 08:26:13 PM »
That's the issue! I don't have the symptoms anymore!

The diarrhea, stomach ache and chills with lower body temperature came within 2 days of each other and have disapeared at the same time. They lasted 12 days (from June 13 to yesterday). That is a sign of a major infection - not some small little strepthroat!

As for the lymph nodes and the soft palate infection, the symptoms lasted 2 days have also passed by, included the relalted white tongue - which has lasted a full week.

I really am trying to make sense of what you (Andy, jkinatl2, RapidRod and Annn) are telling me but it is obvious my body went through an important virus!

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2006, 07:50:05 AM »
Andy Velez regularly says that most people will serconvert within 20-some days.

I went for an HIV test at 4 weeks and I will get the results in 10 days. I fully understand that these results are way too soon to be definitive but I was wondering if they can be indicative of a trend?

And please don't discard my question by saying that I did not have an HIV risk.  My symptoms, including the huge lymph nodes were all very real and I did not make any of them up.

My appetite is partially back since last night but my diarrhea is still present although much milder. I still have a white tongue which I never had in my whole life and I am 44. Went to the dentist 3 days ago and he said that it was most probably caused by a virus.

I am very much concerned that even though you say I was not at risk, somehow I got infected with her vaginal fluids finding a way to the mucous membrane of my uncircomsizd penis - the head.

So, what about those 4 weeks results I will get in 10 days? Can I build on them?


Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2006, 09:02:40 AM »

And please don't discard my question by saying that I did not have an HIV risk.  My symptoms, including the huge lymph nodes were all very real and I did not make any of them up.


You see that as discarding your question? It is not. It is addressing it through the function of this forum, which is risk assessment.

As there was no risk, nothing you suggest can possibly be HIV related.

I am not exactly sure what more you expect from this forum, which has clearly outlined it's limitations, its unwillingness to discuss symptoms, and it's function as risk assessment.

I recommend that you talk about this with a professional.
"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2006, 09:05:26 AM »
I never wanted to sound obnoxious, arrogant or ungrateful. If it is what came out of my words, I am really sorry.

Can you please provide me with some insight on the 4 weeks test?

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2006, 09:08:56 AM »
It's a waste of money to test at 4 weeks and an even bigger waste, to test for a non-risk event.

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #21 on: June 30, 2006, 09:25:50 AM »
OK. But what about the results? If my episode of diarrhea, loss of appetite, stomach ache, swollen lymph nodes and white tongue represents the way my body was fighting the HIV, will the blood test be positive or does it take additional weeks before the antibodies are created?

As for the non-risk event, I will take your words on it. Including Ann', Andy's and Jonathan's. But honestly, I still can't see any other reason than seroconversion for what my body went through in the last 18 days.

I will share with you the results as soon as I get them.

I SO (but SSOOOOOOOOOOOO) hope you are right. If you are not and I indeed seroconverted, I will have to disclose my status to my kids and my ex-wife will know for sure. And then court action to get the kids out of my home. If it indeed what happens...I'm already crying....

Thanks for you help guys.


Offline Ann

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #22 on: June 30, 2006, 10:41:50 AM »
mad,

If you insist on testing over your no risk event, then at least wait until the six week point. A negative at six weeks is highly unlikely to change... and even more so in your case since you didn't have a risk of infection.

I saw your question earlier, by the way, but didn't bother to answer because you made it clear you didn't want to hear what I had to say... which is ... YOU HAD NO RISK OF HIV INFECTION.

~shrug~

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #23 on: July 04, 2006, 06:03:56 PM »
Hi,

To someone else, Andy just wrote:

"Essentially this was a masturbatory situation which means there wasn't any risk"

Is that why you (Ann, Andy, Jonathan and RapidRod) are referring to in my case as a non-risk event?

Did science and research have proven that no matter the amount (in my case) of vaginal fluids used, because there was NEVER unprotected penetration I cannot get HIV? And the drip on my uncircumcized head - which was probably from lube (a women cannot get soooooo hot that she drips....) cannot have contaminated me since the mix of fluids with the lube would have made the virus ineffective?

And because the vaginal fluids came into contact with her hands, it destroyed it?

If it is so, it would certainly take 80% of the stress away from my shoulders. As for the 20%, well, science and research (and being a chemist, I know what I'ma talking about) have many times been proven wrong...

Please confirm.

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #24 on: July 05, 2006, 11:58:02 AM »
Hi,

Please Andy, Ann, Jonathan.  Confirm or not what I wrote in my previous post.

I promise to log off afterwards and not post again - you can even ban me if you wish, I just need to fully understand.

Thanks.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #25 on: July 05, 2006, 01:03:18 PM »
I don't know how many ways we can tell you that you were not at risk for HIV during this incident. Various forms of masturbation between two is one of the most common of sexual activity.

In more than two decades of the epidemic and uncountable such acts later there has never been a documented case of transmission in this matter. It doesn't how much of the vaginal secretions you had on your hand that may have gotten on to your foreskin or any other details your mind comes up with to throw in the worry mix.

If the woman you were with is HIV+, the vaginal fluids which might contain HIV would be in the cervical area, not around the vaginal lips or thereabouts which would have been where you were fingering. Additionally, you've already been told HIV is a fragile virus. Once it hits the air it quickly becomes inactive.

So we're talking here about a non-event as far as HIV is concerned. It doesn't matter how long your mind may continue to push your buttons with more what ifs and other doubts, you have absolutely no basis whatsoever in HIV science to be concerned.

No kidding. You need to work on letting go of this concern now and turn your attention to getting on with your life.

Andy Velez

Offline madmaf

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #26 on: February 06, 2014, 08:52:37 AM »
Hi all

I (male) went to a strip club last Friday and things became wild between the girl and I. I ended up giving her a cunnilingus, and rimming her. After that, I licked one finger, inserted it in her bum for 30-40 seconds, and followed up with a second finger for about 10 seconds. Both fingers went deep in her bum. She turned around and we started kissing and fondling for about 30 seconds. She presented her bum to me again and I licked again my finger but realized it was one of the same finger I used to masturbate her anus a few seconds before.

So, first off, sorry for the graphic details.

Secondly, what's my risk level here? Beside e coli and bacterial infection (to which I reacted 3 days afterwards....), should I be worried about HIV infection? Did not taste any blood.

thanks


Offline Ann

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Re: Mutual masturbation, again...
« Reply #27 on: February 06, 2014, 09:07:58 AM »
Mad,

I've merged your new thread into your original thread - where you should post all your additional thoughts or questions. It helps us to help you when you keep everything in one thread. It doesn't matter how long it has been since you last posted in your thread or if the subject matter is different.

If you need help finding your thread when you come here, click on the "Show own posts" link under your name in the left-hand column of any forum page.

Please also read through the Welcome Thread so you can familiarize yourself with our Forum Posting Guidelines. Thank you for your cooperation.




You did NOT have a risk for hiv infection.

Oral activities are not a risk because not only is saliva not infectious in the person who has hiv, but ALSO anyone's saliva contains over a dozen different proteins and enzymes that damage hiv and render it unable to infect.

There have been three long-term studies of couples where one is positive and one is negative. In the couples who used condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, but no barrier for oral activities, not one of the negative partners became infected with hiv. Not one.

In adults, hiv is transmitted through:

Unprotected anal intercourse.

Unprotected vaginal intercourse.

Sharing drug injecting equipment.

And that's it.

Here's what you need to know in order to avoid hiv infection:

You need to be using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, every time, no exceptions until such time as you are in a securely monogamous relationship where you have both tested for ALL sexually transmitted infections together.

To agree to have unprotected intercourse is to consent to the possibility of being infected with an STI. Sex without a condom lasts only a matter of minutes, but hiv is forever.

Have a look through the condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use condoms with confidence.

ALTHOUGH YOU DO NOT NEED TO TEST FOR HIV SPECIFICALLY FOLLOWING ANY OF THE ACTIVITIES YOU'RE WORRIED ABOUT, anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care check-up, including but not limited to hiv testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.

If you aren't already having regular, routine check-ups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine hiv tests to return with negative results.

Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than hiv. Some of the other STIs can be present with no obvious symptoms, so the only way to know for sure is to test.

Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple!

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

 


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