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Author Topic: Damn HPV  (Read 9713 times)

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Offline bnyc23

  • Member
  • Posts: 13
Damn HPV
« on: December 03, 2006, 07:41:49 PM »
So, I was diagnosed with anal warts the same day as HIV. I've been going every week or two to have them frozen for the past 3 months. I guess i they were pretty bad in the beginning but are small and responding to treatment well. The problem is that just when the ones that are being treated are gone, more pop up. Obviously getting my ass frozen once a week is not fun or comfortable at all and i'm beginning to get frustrated. Not to mention the fact that i haven't had anal sex since july! COME ON! Is there anything i can do to help get this under control? I'm not on meds for my hiv yet. My cd4 is 335 with a vl around 17,000- so i could definitely start meds if i chose to. Would starting meds help my HPV or make it worse??? Or is there anything i can be doing other than going to the doc every week?

Any thoughts on this would be great. Thanks.

Offline red_Dragon888

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2006, 08:22:36 PM »
You could have the Doctor use the acid to burn off some skin and the warts.  This is really painful... I mean really really painful when the acid does it job.  You will have to take a pain reliver just to walk, sleep, stand and sit.  But is works with two treatment.  Again, really painful so be warned.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=I3ba3lnFHik

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Offline Tucsonwoody

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2006, 09:09:47 PM »
Sorry to hear you are dealing with this painful problem.  I had one outbreak 10 years ago and the treatment was a cream I applied myself.  Burned like hell but worked.  Sorry I can't remember what it was.  But here is a clip from a site with some other treatment options you might ask you doctor about.

Good luck - hope this resolves soon for you.

For small warts that affect only the skin around the anus, several medications are available, which can be applied directly to the surface of the warts by a physician or by the patients themselves.

Such medications include podophyllum resin (Podocon-25, Pod-Ben-25), a substance made from the cytotoxic extracts of several plants. This agent offers a cure rate of 20-50% when used alone, and is applied by the physician weekly and then washed off 6 hours later by the patient.

Podofilox (Condylox) is another agent, and is available for patients to use at home. It can be applied twice daily for up to 4 weeks. Podofilox offers a slightly higher cure rate than podophyllin, and can also be used to prevent warts.

Trichloroacetic and bichloroacetic acids are available in several concentrations up to 80% for the treatment of condyloma acuminata. These acids work to cauterize the skin, and are quite caustic. Nevertheless, they cause less irritation and overall body effects than the other agents mentioned above. Recurrence, however, is higher with these acids.

Bleomycin (Blenoxane) is another treatment option, but it has several drawbacks. First, it must be administered by a physician into each lesion via injection, but is can have a host of side effects, and patients must be followed carefully by their physician.

Imiquimod 5% cream is also available for patients to apply themselves. It is to be applied three times weekly, for up to 16 weeks, and has been shown to clear warts within eight to 10 weeks.

Finally, the interferon drugs, which are naturally occurring proteins that have antiviral and antitumor effects, are available. These include interferon alfa 2a and 2b (Roferon, Intron A), which are to be injected into each lesion twice a week for up to eight weeks.
And I wished for guidance, and I wished for peace
I could see the lightning; somewhere in the east
And I wished for affection, and I wished for calm
As I lay there - Nervous in the light of dawn

Offline northernguy

  • Member
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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2006, 09:25:48 PM »
Just had my 2nd bout of those myself, they're a pain n the ass ;)  By day 2 after the freezing and podophylin I'm freaking out about the pain but both times its passed in about 7 days.
Apr 28/06 cd4 600 vl 10,600 cd% 25
Nov 8/09 cd4 510 vl 49,5000 cd% 16
Jan 16/10 cd4 660 vl 54,309 cd% 16
Feb 17/10 Started Atripla
Mar 7/10 cd4 710 vl 1,076 cd% 21
Apr 18/10 cd4 920 vl 268 cd% 28
Jun 19/10 cd4 450 vl 60 cd% 25
Aug 15/10 cd4 680 vl 205 cd% 27
Apr 3/11 cd4 780 vl <40 cd% 30
Jul 17/11 cd4 960 vl <40 cd%33
April 15/12 cd4 1,010 vl <40 cd% 39
April 20/12 Switched to Viramune + Truvada
Aug 2/12 cd4 1040, vl <40, cd% 38
Oct 19 cd4 1,110 vl <40 cd% 41

Offline cph9680

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  • Posts: 325
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2006, 09:33:02 PM »
I had to go to the hospital and have some doctor zap my ass before they finally went away, but they didn't respond to any other treatments

Talk about a pain in the ass <HAR HAR HAR>  :D

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2006, 09:54:08 PM »
Try getting an external hemmoroid AND anal warts at the same time and get back to me.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline edfu

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2006, 05:30:31 AM »
My PCP, in an annual prostate digital exam last week, went to use an anoscope and discovered internal warts, which has me both terrified and frustrated.  I've been reading about the extraordinary increase in anal cancer related to HPV and HIV+, which has me in full panic mode and retrieving my RX bottle of Xanax.  It appears that internal warts are an extremely common marker for anal cancer, especially in HIV+. 

I have no symptoms whatsoever and never experienced an outbreak of anal warts before.   To top it off, so to speak, no one has been up there for 24 fucking years except for doctors' digits!   I've been anally celibate since 1982. 

My PCP has referred me to a colon and rectal surgeon.  I'm not going to let him do anything until an anal pap test is done.

We really must start urging our doctors to administer anal pap tests (although I have also read that some insurance companies won't cover it).   Anal cancer is increasing at abnormal rates amongst HIV+ gay men and can occur at any CD4 level.  Anal cancer also does not seem to be altered by treatment with HAART, either.   It has become one of those post-HAART diseases (cardiovascular problems, diabetes, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, etc.) that have replaced the opportunistic illnesses of the pre-HAART era. 
"No one will ever be free so long as there are pestilences."--Albert Camus, "The Plague"

"Mankind can never be free until the last brick in the last church falls on the head of the last priest."--Voltaire

Offline J.R.E.

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  • Joined Dec-2003 Living positive, since 1985.
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2006, 06:21:16 AM »
Hello ,

HPV warts is certainly a pain in the Ass, It's something that I have the most problem dealing with, even though right now the problem is minimal. But minimal doesn't cut it. So , I  have to make this my priority come January, to get those remainders surgically removed. I will schedule this when I have the colonoscopy done, I will take some additional vacation time from work, just in case anything else is discovered, and needs to be removed. As I mentioned in another thread, I had absolutely no idea I had these , until I started on medication, that is when they became visible. I am also in the habit of checking myself out , so discovering the warts was quite an unwelcome surprise to me. And Like Edfu, I also put a lot of concern and thoughts into this. And yes, I worry about it...

http://www.niaid.nih.gov/factsheets/stdhpv.htm

Ray


« Last Edit: December 04, 2006, 06:23:55 AM by J.R.E. »
Current Meds ; Viramune, Epzicom, 40mg of simvastatin, 12.5mg of Hydrochlorothiazide.
Metoprolol tartrate 25mg



http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=40802.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=45159.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39722.msg495621;topicseen#msg495621

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=46806.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39414.msg491701#msg491701


 In October of 2003, My t-cell count was 16, Viral load was over 500,000, Percentage at that time was 5%. I started my first  HAART regimen  on October 24th,03.

 As of 6/4/14,  t-cells are at 423, Viral load <40

 Current % is at 13% 

  
 62 years young.

Offline J.R.E.

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,114
  • Joined Dec-2003 Living positive, since 1985.
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2006, 06:27:12 AM »
We really must start urging our doctors to administer anal pap tests (although I have also read that some insurance companies won't cover it).   Anal cancer is increasing at abnormal rates amongst HIV+ gay men and can occur at any CD4 level.  Anal cancer also does not seem to be altered by treatment with HAART, either.   It has become one of those post-HAART diseases (cardiovascular problems, diabetes, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, etc.) that have replaced the opportunistic illnesses of the pre-HAART era. 


Total agreeement with you !!! My doctor did not mention it, until I brought it up to his attention. :-\


Ray
Current Meds ; Viramune, Epzicom, 40mg of simvastatin, 12.5mg of Hydrochlorothiazide.
Metoprolol tartrate 25mg



http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=40802.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=45159.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39722.msg495621;topicseen#msg495621

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=46806.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39414.msg491701#msg491701


 In October of 2003, My t-cell count was 16, Viral load was over 500,000, Percentage at that time was 5%. I started my first  HAART regimen  on October 24th,03.

 As of 6/4/14,  t-cells are at 423, Viral load <40

 Current % is at 13% 

  
 62 years young.

Offline edfu

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,084
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2006, 08:26:49 AM »
Ray, this is so typical and infuriating, but the NIH document you link to does not state that men can get HPV warts on the anus, external or internal.  It's just so classically homophobic on the part of the government's health bureaucracy.

For those who are interested here's a link to HPV-related carcinoma of the anus:

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/499295_1
"No one will ever be free so long as there are pestilences."--Albert Camus, "The Plague"

"Mankind can never be free until the last brick in the last church falls on the head of the last priest."--Voltaire

Offline Buckmark

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2006, 09:26:21 AM »
Having had an outbreak myself back in 1998, I can attest that anal warts (and their treatment)
just suck.  In my case, the doctor used a technique called acid fulguration to remove them  --
both internal and external (ouch!).  I went back to the doc about every 3 months for treatment,
to treat any new growths.  After 4 years of this, the doc finally felt like they were cleared after
finding no new growths for a period of a year.  That was back in 2002, and so far, I've been free
of HPV warts ever since.

So it seems it is possible to clear them up, but you do have to be persistent and aggressive.

Regards,

Henry
"Life in Lubbock, Texas, taught me two things:
     One is that God loves you and you're going to burn in hell.
     The other is that sex is the most awful, filthy thing on earth and you should save it for someone you love."
- Butch Hancock, Musician, The Flatlanders

Offline bocker3

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  • Posts: 3,370
  • You gotta enjoy life......
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2006, 10:48:26 AM »
Spent all this year dealing with my warts.  Surgery in March (both internal and external warts).  Had more grow twice and both times they responded quickly with Aldara (gone in 2 weeks).  I've currently gone almost 6 months without any.

My Colo-rectal surgeon did say that starting HAART can help - your immune system plays a role in controlling the HPV.  I've also read that sometimes when you do start HAART it can cause an outbreak.  My warts first appeared a couple of weeks after I started my meds. 

As for the anal pap smears -- I think it is a very good idea for annual screenings.  Instead of the pap smear, I've already worked out with my colon-rectal doc to see him yearly for an anoscope exam.  I know, I know -- it involves sticking a scope up my butt-- but I'm willing to do whatever it takes to stay healthy   ;D.

Good luck as you go through your ordeal -- I would suggest talking to your doctor for his/her thoughts on starting HAART and whether it will help.

hugs,
Mike
Atripla - Started 12/05
Reyataz/Norvir - Added 6/06
Labs - Pre-Meds
Sep05 T=350/25% VL98,559
Nov05 288/18%  47,564
Current Labs
May2013 691/31% <20

Offline J.R.E.

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  • Posts: 7,114
  • Joined Dec-2003 Living positive, since 1985.
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2006, 11:46:25 AM »
Ray, this is so typical and infuriating, but the NIH document you link to does not state that men can get HPV warts on the anus, external or internal.  It's just so classically homophobic on the part of the government's health bureaucracy.


http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/499295_1

Edfu,

Actually it is mentioned but not very much,( or sufficiently) not in detail.And you are correct, it doesn't mention internal. From that link : ( perhaps it's time they update their info.)

"In men, genital warts are less common. If present, they usually are seen on the tip of the penis. They also may be found on the shaft of the penis, on the scrotum, or around the anus." (no mention of internal)


By the way thanks for the medscape link. For those interested in that article you must create a user name and password.

This is section one from Medscape :

Cancer
Spectrum of Human Papillomavirus-Related Dysplasia and Carcinoma of the Anus in HIV-Infected Patients

Lori A. Panther, MD, MPH; Hans P. Schlecht, MD; Bruce J. Dezube, MD 

The incidence of human papillomavirus (HPV)-related anal squamous cell carcinoma is increasing. It is likely that long-standing HIV-related immunosuppression plays a significant role in the pathogenesis of anal carcinoma; however, a direct HIV-HPV interaction has also been implicated. Using cervical cancer prevention as a paradigm, anal Pap smear screening as part of routine HIV preventive care has been proposed to detect and treat precancerous anal lesions in the hope of decreasing anal cancer rates. All HIV-positive patients with invasive cancer of the anal canal, particularly those with CD4+ cell counts greater than 200/µL and those receiving HAART, should be managed in the same manner as their HIV-negative counterparts. [AIDS Reader. 2005;15:79-82, 85-88, 91]

Dual Infection and Oncogenesis
Anogenital acquisition of human papillomavirus (HPV) begins shortly after the onset of sexual activity. The highest rates of anogenital HPV shedding occur in sexually active men and women younger than 30 years. Acquisition of more than 1 HPV type is associated with an increased number of lifetime sexual partners, high frequency of sexual activity, and a history of sexual partners with genital warts.

HIV infection further increases the risk of anogenital HPV infection, possibly because of a high cumulative number of sexual partners in some HIV risk groups.[1] Among HIV-infected patients, men who have sex with men (MSM) have a high prevalence of detectable anal HPV DNA by polymerase chain reaction (PCR) testing, from roughly 54% in earlier studies to 80% to 93% in more recent series.[2-8] Moreover, HIV-positive MSM have a higher rate of harboring multiple types of HPV than do their HIV-negative counterparts.[3,6,7] Fewer data exist on HIV-positive women; however, roughly 75% have positive anal HPV PCR test results; HIV-positive women also display a higher rate of infection with multiple HPV types than do HIV-negative women.[9,10] Even without a history of receptive anal intercourse, HIV-positive heterosexuals have been found to have a 46% prevalence of anal HPV infection by PCR.[11]

More than 100 HPV types have been documented, and approximately 30 are known to infect the human genital tract. These have been further classified into low-risk types (mainly types 6 and 11), which are associated with condylomata and low-grade dysplasia, and high-risk types (mainly types 16, 18, and 31), which are associated with high-grade dysplasia and invasive carcinoma.

The hallmark of high-risk HPV types is their ability to integrate into the host cell genome. Following direct exposure to squamous cell epithelium, the HPV virion infects the immortalized basal lamina cells of the epidermis. As the basal cells ascend the strata of the epidermis, both integrated and unintegrated HPV possess the capacity to express the oncoproteins E6 and E7, which inhibit cellular p53 and retinoblastoma tumor suppressor proteins, thereby transforming normal cell proliferation into cells with malignant potential.[12]

En route to anal squamous cell carcinoma is a spectrum of anal dysplasias similar to that of cervical dysplasias and histologically categorized as anal intraepithelial neoplasia (AIN) 1, AIN 2, or AIN 3, based mainly on nuclear characteristics as well as proportion of the epithelial layer replaced by dysplastic cells. Identification of AIN 1 on histology corresponds to the diagnosis of low-grade squamous intraepithelial lesion (LSIL) on cytology; likewise, AIN 2 and AIN 3 correspond to high-grade squamous intraepithelial lesion (HSIL). Analogous to HPV-related cervical carcinoma, AIN 2 and AIN 3 are thought to be precursors of anal squamous cell carcinoma.[13]

The natural history of HPV- related squamous cell dysplasia in HIV-infected persons is accelerated compared with that in the HIV-negative population. HIV-positive women are 3 times more likely than their HIV-negative counterparts to have an anal squamous intraepithelial lesion during 2 years of follow-up.[14] Prevalence and incidence of anal dysplasia are also higher in HIV- infected MSM than in HIV-negative MSM, and the risk of anal dysplasia for both men and women increases as CD4+ cell count declines.[14-16] Compared with the general population, HPV- related anogenital disease including condylomata; high-grade squamous dysplasia; Bowen disease of perineum, perianal area, and vulva; and invasive squamous cell carcinoma—tends to be more prevalent in HIV-infected persons, more advanced at diagnosis, and more recalcitrant to standard therapies.

Duration and severity of immunosuppression are major factors in the acceleration of HPV oncogenesis in HIV-infected persons, analogous to the epidemiology of cervical cancer in transplant recipients. In addition, in vitro studies have suggested a direct role for HIV in the acceleration of HPV-induced oncogenesis, although this direct HIV-HPV interaction is a subject of some controversy. Proposed mechanisms of this interaction include up-regulation of HPV-16 oncoprotein expression by the HIV-1 regulatory protein Tat and expression of HIV regulatory proteins contributing to cell cycle disruption.[17]
 
 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Section 1 of 6 Next Page: Epidemiology of Anal Carcinoma
 

 
Lori A. Panther, MD, MPH, Hans P. Schlecht, MD, and Bruce J. Dezube, MD 





Thanks----Edfu
 


Then there is this info, from the Aidsmeds lesson section. I meant to put this up before :


http://www.aidsmeds.com/OIs/HPV1.htm




« Last Edit: December 04, 2006, 11:57:40 AM by J.R.E. »
Current Meds ; Viramune, Epzicom, 40mg of simvastatin, 12.5mg of Hydrochlorothiazide.
Metoprolol tartrate 25mg



http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=40802.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=45159.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39722.msg495621;topicseen#msg495621

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=46806.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39414.msg491701#msg491701


 In October of 2003, My t-cell count was 16, Viral load was over 500,000, Percentage at that time was 5%. I started my first  HAART regimen  on October 24th,03.

 As of 6/4/14,  t-cells are at 423, Viral load <40

 Current % is at 13% 

  
 62 years young.

Offline antibody

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  • Posts: 525
  • "every man thinks his burden is the heaviest"
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2006, 04:06:11 PM »
I've had laser surgery to remove them twice now both for internal and external warts. they have seemed to cleared since my last procedure in may. boy it hurt like hell during the healing process. i was put out for the procedure. it was the only thing that has seemed to help. i tried acid , Aldara  and some natural crap from the Whole Foods Market that didn't do a damn thing nothing worked till the laser. i have since started Atripla in July so maybe it's a combonation of therapies in order to clear em'.
Timbuk      <50/ 794  CD4 10/06 
                 <50/ 1096 CD4 3/07
                 <40/ 1854 CD4 4/09

Started Atripla  7/14/06
Switched to boosted Reyataz Truvada 3/28/07

*Ask me about Medical Marijuana and how it can help you!*

Offline poet

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  • Poet living and working in Central Maine
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2006, 07:52:50 PM »
You are actually located in a good spot, although you might not feel that way with our posts.  Dr. Stephen E. Goldstone, author of The Ins and Outs of Gay Sex, is considered the ass/butt doctor and his practice is in the city.  He is, to my mind, a bit fixated on the subject, so if you book an appointment, listen to what he has but leave before taking the next step.  One client of mine swore that he had saved him, literally, by catching hpv and then anal/colon cancer before it spread.  He of course insists on anal pap smears as standard medical attention of gay men.  Efu and the others have been right on the money with the issue and in their experiences.  Win
Winthrop Smith has published three collections of poetry: Ghetto: From The First Five; The Weigh-In: Collected Poems; Skin Check: New York Poems.  The last was published in December 2006.  He has a work-in-progress underway titled Starting Positions.

Offline AtomicA

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  • that's Famous with an F
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2006, 08:16:57 PM »
*sigh* I am right there with you my firiend. I use to have warts on my fingers as a kid then one day (literally overnight) they all dried up and fell off. Never saw them again until 3 months after my diagnosis when my ass started to get itchy, like REALLY itchy, especially at night and in the shower. Went to the doc and he burnt them off wth liquid nitrogen, gave me a prescription for aldera and sent me on my way. To be honest he was pretty dissmissive about the whole thing, he refused to do an internal exam, wouldn't do a pap smear and told me they would go away. Did 8 weeks on aldera - which for the record is no cake walk, I've never been so uncomfortable in all my life - and within a week of stopping they were coming back. So I went to another doctor who did another liquid nitrogen freeze, gave me more aldera and tried to send me on my way again until I threatened to sure him for malpractise for not continuing to freeze them on a weekly basis. after 6 weeks of that and aldera they weren't going away so he FINALLY did an internal exam and found that they were several inches up, beyond the reach of anything he or I could do. Of course had these two docs just done the internal exam like I had asked in the first place we could have skipped several months of excruciating pain. After that it was 6 months to get in to see the colo-rectal surgeon and another 6 months to get the surgery date booked.

As a matter of fact, the surgery is tomorrow morning at 11.

since it's been 6 months of them marauding unchecked I'm terrified that it's going to have turned into cancer. I don't know what the surgery is going to entail, other than an epidurral (spelling?) and a continue 'burn and scrape' until they're all gone but I'm going to demand that he does a pap before the surgery starts.

The moral of the story, these doctors will dismiss you and do a half ass job if you let them. DEMAND an internal exam because if there is even one left up there, every time you do a #2 you are spreading active viral wart cultures back to the rest of your ass.

Mine seem to have stopped spreading once I started the ant-virals, but when I asked the surgeon he said that no one really knew if that would have an effect on recurrance.


Offline J.R.E.

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2006, 08:35:24 PM »


As a matter of fact, the surgery is tomorrow morning at 11.



Hey Atomic,

Good luck tomorrow... Wishing you the best


Ray
Current Meds ; Viramune, Epzicom, 40mg of simvastatin, 12.5mg of Hydrochlorothiazide.
Metoprolol tartrate 25mg



http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=40802.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=45159.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39722.msg495621;topicseen#msg495621

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=46806.0

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=39414.msg491701#msg491701


 In October of 2003, My t-cell count was 16, Viral load was over 500,000, Percentage at that time was 5%. I started my first  HAART regimen  on October 24th,03.

 As of 6/4/14,  t-cells are at 423, Viral load <40

 Current % is at 13% 

  
 62 years young.

Offline Longislander

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,486
Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #17 on: December 04, 2006, 09:07:21 PM »
Hey Atomic, we'll be thinking about you tomorrow, and wishing for the best results!
infected 10/05 diagnosed 12-05
2/06   379/57000                    6/07 372/30500 25%   4/09 640/U/32% 
5/06   ?? /37000                     8/07 491/55000/24%    9/09 913/U/39%
8/06   349/9500 25%              11/07 515/68000/24     2/10 845/U/38%
9/06   507/16,000 30% !          2/08  516/116k/22%    7/10 906/80/39%
12/06 398/29000 26%             Start Atripla 3/08
3/07   402/80,000 29%            4/08  485/undet!/27
4/07   507/35,000 25%            7/08 625/UD/34%
                                                 11/08 684/U/36%

Offline bnyc23

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2006, 12:14:05 AM »
Hey guys,

Thank you all for your input and sharing your story. I have an appointment with my hpv doc tomorrow for my weekly nitrogen treatment and i will talk to him more about this and let you all know what happens.
Atomic, my thoughts are with you tomorrow.

THank you!!!!

B

Offline Amosboy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2006, 12:39:01 AM »
Been there, done that in 1989.  It was pretty awful and involved about six shots up my ass, and then being probed with some metal thing.  I remember some fucking student nurse being in the room to observe the whole procedure...for God's sake, I didn't need an audience.  I have tried to block that out of my mind.  And I swear the doctor was using something that was using electricity to "burn the little fuckers" off.  I could hear crackling and flesh burning...sorry for all of the graphic details, but I hadn't actually ever had an opportunity to share this with ANYONE so openly.  I do know that I did the whole topical/acid thing for about an entire year and it wasn't really working.  That was really awful...having to look forward to that visit.

After the final "electrifying" procedure, I was in a Tylox daze for literally days.  I took lots of hot baths and lots of Tylox...that was one good thing. 

On a positive note, I did learn how to become a damn good Top because nothing was going up the butt for a long time.  You will be able to get fucked again and enjoy it, but give your ass some time to heal up.  And have a little more compassion for who you are pounding from now on...God knows I do.

Good luck and keep your attitude "up"!  Anal warts belong in HELL!!

 ;D Brooks
"Love isn't love unless it's not painfully absurb."

-Charlotte Martin

Offline edfu

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #20 on: December 05, 2006, 01:29:43 AM »
I'm thinking of you, Atomic, and hope for the best.  Please let us know how it went and how you are. 

I really think more and more that this HPV anal-wart situation is much, much more common than we think.  As Brooks may have intimated, it might be one of those "taboo" topics we hesitate to bring up.

The initiation of HAART has nothing whatever to do with my own situation.  I began HAART in late 2001 and went undetectable in Jan. 2002 and have remained so ever since.  My CD4's are around 500.  And as I've already stated, I never experienced an outbreak of anal warts (to my knowledge), mine are not external, and I've not bottomed since 1982, believe it or not (I'm 64).   

I've found a really terrrific article about this whole topic, written in non-medicalese (as much as it's possible), from San Francisco AIDS Foundation's BETA publication:   

 http://www.sfaf.org/treatment/beta/b46/b46anal.html
"No one will ever be free so long as there are pestilences."--Albert Camus, "The Plague"

"Mankind can never be free until the last brick in the last church falls on the head of the last priest."--Voltaire

Offline poet

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #21 on: December 05, 2006, 05:45:41 AM »
Much success with the surgery, Atomic.  If you guys haven't found it yet, gayhealth.com is Goldstone's website about, surprise, gay health.  I haven't gone over it in years, so I am not sure whether it is being updated regularly or not.  Win
Winthrop Smith has published three collections of poetry: Ghetto: From The First Five; The Weigh-In: Collected Poems; Skin Check: New York Poems.  The last was published in December 2006.  He has a work-in-progress underway titled Starting Positions.

Offline AtomicA

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #22 on: December 06, 2006, 04:08:38 PM »
hi all

well it went ok... when I got to the hospital they told me I had the option of going completely under as opposed to localized freezing. So I said screw the risks, that was NOT something I wanted to remember. Spent all of yesterday feeling like ass (literally) and boo ya does it hurt... though not as bad as I thought it would. In fact the worst of it so far is the sore throat from having a breathing tube shoved into my lungs.

didn't get a chance to talk to the doctor afterwards but the nurse said they got everything. Let's just hope that with HAART and a high CD4 count this is the last time I'll ever have to see the little bastards.


bnyc - I predict that sooner than later we're both gonna be perfect assholes again  ;)

Offline Longislander

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2006, 05:08:37 PM »
Thanks for coming in and letting us know you got thru it ok! If I were clever I'd insert a funny-ass joke, or a lame-ass joke.....
infected 10/05 diagnosed 12-05
2/06   379/57000                    6/07 372/30500 25%   4/09 640/U/32% 
5/06   ?? /37000                     8/07 491/55000/24%    9/09 913/U/39%
8/06   349/9500 25%              11/07 515/68000/24     2/10 845/U/38%
9/06   507/16,000 30% !          2/08  516/116k/22%    7/10 906/80/39%
12/06 398/29000 26%             Start Atripla 3/08
3/07   402/80,000 29%            4/08  485/undet!/27
4/07   507/35,000 25%            7/08 625/UD/34%
                                                 11/08 684/U/36%

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2006, 06:40:35 PM »
Oh wow.  I'm glad I found this thread.
I'm going in for surgery tomorrow morning.
They didn't even try creams or freezing.  They said there are enough that we can just do the surgery and that the creams and so on don't always work and have a high risk of recurrence.

Scared shitless.  Well, I might just be shitless from all the laxatives and enemas I have to take today.
-D
Boys are Stupid

Offline Tucsonwoody

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #25 on: December 06, 2006, 06:49:39 PM »
Good luck Dancer - hope it all goes as good as it can for such a crappy disease.  Not much comfort to you now I know but not getting it taken care of would only make it worse down the road.  I must have had a milder form 100 years ago because some cream did work for me even though it was still a literal pain in the ass for weeks.

Hope you'll keep us updated on how you're doing and remember we will be thinking about you and hoping for the best.

Kevin
And I wished for guidance, and I wished for peace
I could see the lightning; somewhere in the east
And I wished for affection, and I wished for calm
As I lay there - Nervous in the light of dawn

Offline poet

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #26 on: December 06, 2006, 07:34:40 PM »
I am glad that things went well for you, AtomicA, and send best wishes for success to DancerBoy.  Now since some of you know that I did prostate work as part of my bodywork practice in NYC and worked with many guys with post-operative concerns, if there is someone where you live who knows what he is doing, let him work with and on you prior to trying the real deal?  At least my clients were petrified of profuse bleeding, agonising pain, etc. when they started up again and I was able to get them back on their... well you can figure it out.  :)  Win
Winthrop Smith has published three collections of poetry: Ghetto: From The First Five; The Weigh-In: Collected Poems; Skin Check: New York Poems.  The last was published in December 2006.  He has a work-in-progress underway titled Starting Positions.

Offline shawnathan

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2006, 07:35:23 PM »
We really must start urging our doctors to administer anal pap tests (although I have also read that some insurance companies won't cover it).   Anal cancer is increasing at abnormal rates amongst HIV+ gay men and can occur at any CD4 level.  Anal cancer also does not seem to be altered by treatment with HAART, either.   It has become one of those post-HAART diseases (cardiovascular problems, diabetes, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma, etc.) that have replaced the opportunistic illnesses of the pre-HAART era. 

I totally agree with you too Edfu.  My doctor did a manual check for warts at my last annual exam, but a couple exams later when I brought up the vaccine (under the assumption I might not have HPV... big assumption, right?*), I was surprised that he didn't understand why I was asking about it.  If I had an HIV- partner with HPV, I'd want to protect myself against his HPV as much as I want to protect him from my HIV.  HPV worries me, even though as far as I know I don't have it (but most people don't know, right?), because my sister dealt with cervical cancer when she was 24.  I know what a painful experience that was for her.  I don't know if having a family member develop cancer from HPV makes you more likely to, but could be?

I'm a "consumer member" of the Community Advisory Board for my HIV clinic.  They talk about pap smears a lot for patients... in terms of what percent of women are receiving them annually.  But I don't think I've heard them talk about pap smears for men at all.  I think I should bring it up.  Guys should defintely be asking their docs about it, but if your clinics have CAB's, would be worthwhile to bring it up.. even just with an email or call... that it's an important issue that we as consumers want our doctors to be addressing!

*it seems to me that there might be some benefit to the vaccine even for people with HPV already... the vaccine protects against 4 or so strains that are known to cause cancer.  If someone has 1 or 2 of them already, wouldn't it be worth it to protect against the other strains?  Maybe it doesn't work that way though... I just dont' know enough about it.
poz since 10/04(?)
tested 7/1/05 (Canada Day!)
last check, 12/06 - CD4 650, VL 1100.
Still no meds yet...
Fortune Cookie Say: "You display the wonderful traits of charm and courtesy"  Surely I got the wrong cookie! :)
~Shawn

Offline AtomicA

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2006, 08:08:58 PM »
Dancer boy - I promise it's not as bad as you think it's going to be, though if they're giving you the option of going to sleep.. dam that's so much better! Sometimes I wish someone had sat me down as a gay 15 year old and said "alright, these are the things that are GOING to happen unless you are VERY careful" I mean, I'm all for learning from experience but there are some things that I think I could have been happy to let others learn for me.

I don't know much about the mechanics of HPV, is it a retrovirus?

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2006, 08:26:36 PM »
Oh no.
I will be totally knocked out.
I'm pretty uncomfortable already.  The nastiness is bleeding and raw from so much freakin' crappin.

Four enemas to go before the surgery. I'll survive.

-D
Boys are Stupid

Offline AtomicA

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #30 on: December 06, 2006, 08:31:35 PM »
christ, 4? that's way more than they made me do, I only had to do 2! don't they know that more enema's are not always better? they can cause your colon to go into spasm which sucks hard core.

oh well, I suppose they know what they're doing.
good luck!

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #31 on: December 06, 2006, 09:56:38 PM »
I think I'll only do one more tonight and one in the am before I leave.

I can't wait for this all to be over with.  I'm more scared about the recovery... I hear it's horrible.
-D
Boys are Stupid

Offline AtomicA

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #32 on: December 06, 2006, 10:01:48 PM »
Not gonna lie to you, before my last posts I hadn't had my first um... movement yet. Now I have.

<insert brutal yelping noise HERE>

make sure they give you some REALLY strong painkillers. T-3's aren't cutting it for me. Stock up on metamucil too.

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2006, 10:29:07 PM »
EEP!!!  That's what I'm the most worried about.
I'm a sissy.
I don't even bottom.
I'm gonna die.
-D
Boys are Stupid

Offline AtomicA

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #34 on: December 06, 2006, 10:37:01 PM »
You'll be fine!

a few days worth of pain... or a lifetime of itchy, bleeding, ugly embarrassing little bastards.

You're clearly making the right choice

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #35 on: December 06, 2006, 10:42:51 PM »
Geez, I wish I had your positive outlook. No pun intended
-D
Boys are Stupid

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #36 on: December 07, 2006, 09:28:28 PM »
I'm home now.
Ow.
-D
Boys are Stupid

Offline Longislander

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #37 on: December 07, 2006, 09:38:25 PM »
I'm home now.
Ow.
-D

Welcome home? I hope you do as well as Atomic seems to be doing!
infected 10/05 diagnosed 12-05
2/06   379/57000                    6/07 372/30500 25%   4/09 640/U/32% 
5/06   ?? /37000                     8/07 491/55000/24%    9/09 913/U/39%
8/06   349/9500 25%              11/07 515/68000/24     2/10 845/U/38%
9/06   507/16,000 30% !          2/08  516/116k/22%    7/10 906/80/39%
12/06 398/29000 26%             Start Atripla 3/08
3/07   402/80,000 29%            4/08  485/undet!/27
4/07   507/35,000 25%            7/08 625/UD/34%
                                                 11/08 684/U/36%

Offline Tucsonwoody

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #38 on: December 07, 2006, 09:39:35 PM »
Aw Dancer - glad the first part is over for you and hope recovery is not to godawful.  Would normally offer to kiss it and make it better but doubt if that would help this time.   ::)

Hope you got lots of good pain meds to take - keep us updated ok?

Keviin
And I wished for guidance, and I wished for peace
I could see the lightning; somewhere in the east
And I wished for affection, and I wished for calm
As I lay there - Nervous in the light of dawn

Offline poet

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #39 on: December 08, 2006, 06:30:02 AM »
I hope that both of you will let us know how you are doing and that the reports show a fast recovery!  I guess this reminds me that much as we do much through the forums, being there to provide hands on assistance hasn't yet happened. :)  Perhaps version 3 will allow for forum participants to rush to posters in need. Win
Winthrop Smith has published three collections of poetry: Ghetto: From The First Five; The Weigh-In: Collected Poems; Skin Check: New York Poems.  The last was published in December 2006.  He has a work-in-progress underway titled Starting Positions.

Offline AtomicA

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #40 on: December 08, 2006, 03:01:12 PM »
How you doing Dancerboy? See, that wasn't so bad! (yeah right...) I'm on recovery day 3 and I'm finding I can largely ignore it until it's time for a number 2. Then oh my sweet jesus. Bloody stools freak me right the hell out.


I hope they gave you something more exciting than t-3's, I asked for demerol (spelling?) but they just looked at me like I was drug addict and sent me on my way.

I hope you're alright!
and thanks everyone... you're far to nice to me.

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #41 on: December 08, 2006, 05:49:11 PM »
I'm doin' ok, I hurt more up top from the damned breathing tube. My chest and throat are killing me.

Haven't shat yet.  I'm very afraid.
-D

They gave me lots of vicodin
Boys are Stupid

Offline AtomicA

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #42 on: December 08, 2006, 05:55:06 PM »
oh yes, the breathing tube thing sucked. I sounded like I had laryngitis for the last two days. It's almost gone now though.

was your neck sore as all hell too? surgery sucks.

ps, if you feel the need to go... you would be wise to go the instant you feel the urge. holding on to it makes it WAY worse in the end. Trust me.

eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #43 on: December 08, 2006, 06:00:48 PM »
I expect I'll have to go tonight at some point. I keep thinking I do, but then I just fart :-P
My neck is killing me, and my chest too!
Boys are Stupid

Offline DancerBoy

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #44 on: December 10, 2006, 06:34:27 PM »
I finally had to go.  :o
Boys are Stupid

Offline livingpos

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #45 on: December 10, 2006, 08:03:50 PM »
Hi all, thanks for your posts, i have had anal warts surgically removed twice this year under general anesthetic. There were about 7 or 8 both times! I have found it really difficult dealing with this and my first year hiv+ at the same time. But its good to know I am not alone. So, thank you all.

Offline AtomicA

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #46 on: December 10, 2006, 11:30:26 PM »
The more I read about this and how common it appears to be with poz guys the more I'm starting to think someone should do a study on how they relate to each other. I'm not just talking a higher statistical correlation between people with HIV and getting HPV, I mean the fact that the vast majority of people have a strain of the HPV virus anyway but something about becoming HIV+ seems to encourage them to present themself in this particular way. I was talking to my HIV doc and he has straight male patients who have never ever had anal sex who rocked up with anal warts within months of either getting HIV or something about their HIV changing (serious drop in CD4, starting HAART). It's something that people hate talking about cuz it's pretty dam embarrassing but I'm starting to think that one has a whole lot more to do with the other than anyone knows....

Offline Robert

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #47 on: December 11, 2006, 12:21:05 AM »
A....

Yeah, I think an HPV exam is just about par for the course.  It's pro forma.  I was sick with PCP in the hospital.  After my recovery and my first actual office visit to my ID Dr. the first thing she did was ask me to bend over and she looked for those nasty little buggers.  I was lucky.  Negative. 

robert

(who does have hemoroids which can also be friggin pain in the ass)
..........

Offline edfu

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #48 on: December 11, 2006, 04:45:22 AM »
Atomic, see my post in this thread above on Dec. 5 with the link to the San Francisco AIDS Foundation "BETA" article.  Look for the heading there "HIV and HPV Interactions." 
"No one will ever be free so long as there are pestilences."--Albert Camus, "The Plague"

"Mankind can never be free until the last brick in the last church falls on the head of the last priest."--Voltaire

Offline blondbeauty

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Re: Damn HPV
« Reply #49 on: December 12, 2006, 05:57:07 AM »
Atomic; my friend Felix is havig surgery for that the 18th. He also had them frozen and used Aldara as well. Hope you feel better soon.  ;)
The only member in these forums approved by WINBA: World International Nail and Beauty Association.
Epstein Barr +; CMV +; Toxoplasmosis +; HIV-1 +.
Counts when starting treatment:
V.L.:80.200 copies. CD4: 25%=503
Started Sustiva-Truvada 14/August/2006
Last V.L.count (Oct 2013): Undetectable
Last CD4 count (OCT 2013): 52%= 933

 


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