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Author Topic: Not so good lab results  (Read 12289 times)

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Offline RAB

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,895
  • Joined March 2003
Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #50 on: December 15, 2006, 07:21:08 PM »
Point taken Ernie.  I'm gonna take Wednesday afternoon off and will go to the clinic and meet with the on-call doctor to try and get on meds.

Cliff

Any updates?

RAB

Offline Eldon

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #51 on: December 15, 2006, 08:53:28 PM »
Hey Cliff...

Put that wildfire out. Any changes since your last appointment?


"Don't Give Up, Don't Give In... Cause it is ALL within you to WIN!"

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #52 on: December 16, 2006, 04:28:24 AM »
No updates.  I waited at the clinic for 3 hours, and never got to see a doctor.  The notion of an on-call doctor is a bit of a joke, the doctors had appointments all day and refused to see anyone in between appointments.  A nice nurse was kind enough to get me an appointment for Monday.

I think I'm gonna switch to the big HIV clinic in London (Koebler).
« Last Edit: December 16, 2006, 04:30:51 AM by Cliff »

Offline David_CA

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #53 on: December 16, 2006, 10:00:17 AM »
Hey,
   Sorry I'm not impressed.  "End of the year" lacks a ring of urgency.  Someone else on these forums who means a lot to me went from "sinus thing" to PCP in a few days time.  He too was waiting and waiting before starting meds.  Ne remettez pas à demain ce que vous pouvez faire le jour même.
Razorbill

Yep, I sure did, and spent 8 days in the hospital.  It surprised the hell out of me.  My CD-4's were a bit higher than yours, too.  There was not much of a trend with my numbers - just fluctuations that didn't seem to be of any real concern.  I was planning on starting meds in early-mid December, but started Dec 1 when I was in the hospital.  I'm on Atripla and really have no side effects to complain about.  Good luck and be proactive when it comes to this shit.

David
« Last Edit: December 16, 2006, 10:02:54 AM by David_NC »
Black Friday 03-03-2006
03-23-06 CD4 359 @27.4% VL 75,938
06-01-06 CD4 462 @24.3% VL > 100,000
08-15-06 CD4 388 @22.8% VL >  "
10-21-06 CD4 285 @21.9% VL >  "
  Atripla started 12-01-2006
01-08-07 CD4 429 @26.8% VL 1872!
05-08-07 CD4 478 @28.1% VL 740
08-03-07 CD4 509 @31.8% VL 370
11-06-07 CD4 570 @30.0% VL 140
02-21-08 CD4 648 @32.4% VL 600
05-19-08 CD4 695 @33.1% VL < 48 undetectable!
08-21-08 CD4 725 @34.5%
11-11-08 CD4 672 @39.5%
02-11-09 CD4 773 @36.8%
05-11-09 CD4 615 @36.2%
08-19-09 CD4 770 @38.5%
11-19-09 CD4 944 @33.7%
02-17-10 CD4 678 @39.9%  
06-03-10 CD4 768 @34.9%
09-21-10 CD4 685 @40.3%
01-10-11 CD4 908 @36.3%
05-23-11 CD4 846 @36.8% VL 80
02-13-12 CD4 911 @41.4% VL<20
You must be the change you want to see in the world.  Mahatma Gandhi

Offline allopathicholistic

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #54 on: December 17, 2006, 06:27:47 PM »
No updates.  I waited at the clinic for 3 hours, and never got to see a doctor.  The notion of an on-call doctor is a bit of a joke, the doctors had appointments all day and refused to see anyone in between appointments.  A nice nurse was kind enough to get me an appointment for Monday.

I think I'm gonna switch to the big HIV clinic in London (Koebler).

Hey - Good luck if you do that.  Bigger's sometimes better anyway!  :D

Offline Eldon

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #55 on: December 17, 2006, 06:32:20 PM »
Hey Cliff...

Let us know how it goes tomorrow. Best wishes!



"Don't Give Up, Don't Give In... Cause it is ALL within you to WIN!"

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #56 on: December 18, 2006, 12:22:38 PM »
Met with the consultant today and he thinks I've gone and got myself superinfected.  They charted my results and things took a dive sometime between July and Sept.  My liver functions are also extremely high, (10 times the normal level), something my last consultant forgot to mention.  But no STDs and no Hep. C (I'm immune to A/B), that could explain the liver results or the increase in viral replication (a jump from 10-20k to 300-400k).  The only logical conclusion is that either my immune system simply gave up this summer, or I've acquired a new HIV strain and it overloaded my immune system.

They are going to genetically test some of my stored blood samples and compare it to the genetic profile of the virus I have right now.

updated numbers.....355,000 viral load, 110 tcell count.

He doesn't want me to start meds until after I return to the UK (makes a valid point that if things go haywire, I'm not going to be in a position to see anyone about it).  The risk of me getting PCP within the next couple of weeks is low.

He gave me a one-month supply of Sustiva/Truvada to take with me.  He and I are gonna speak again on Friday (to review my latest tcell count).  I will make a decision then whether or not to start taking the meds or just store them until I get back.  The HIV genetic stuff will come back sometime in January.

 :-\

I can be such a fucking idiot sometimes.

Offline joemutt

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #57 on: December 18, 2006, 12:33:09 PM »
Cliff I hope everything works out great with your upcoming trip
and the gen tests.

Offline RAB

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #58 on: December 18, 2006, 03:16:11 PM »
Well Crap!

 That's got to have been disturbing to hear!  (the superinfection possibility) 

Hopefully they'll be able to get to the bottom of what's going on and you can get all this sorted out.

Are you taking prophylactic for PCP?  I hope.

RAB

Offline manchesteruk

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #59 on: December 18, 2006, 03:47:34 PM »
Sorry to hear the latest news Cliff you would have been unbelievably unlucky to have suffered from a super infection I thought the only reported cases of this were soon after the initial infection?  Fingers crossed for you though matey.

Chris
Diagnosed 11/05

"Life is too important to be taken seriously" Oscar Wilde

Offline allopathicholistic

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #60 on: December 18, 2006, 04:12:41 PM »
Hear hear. Hope the 'superinfection' thing is a huge error. Thinking of you

Offline David_CA

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #61 on: December 18, 2006, 04:33:29 PM »


He doesn't want me to start meds until after I return to the UK (makes a valid point that if things go haywire, I'm not going to be in a position to see anyone about it).  The risk of me getting PCP within the next couple of weeks is low.


Cliff,
Even though my CD4's are a lot higher than yours, I still got PCP.  My Dr. is keeping me on one Bactrim per day until they rise significantly so it won't happen again and started me on Atripla the 2nd day I was in the hospital.  I'm sure your Drs. know better than I do, but, like Rocky mentioned, I might request something to prevent it.  Good luck with it all and keep us informed.  Take care.

David
Black Friday 03-03-2006
03-23-06 CD4 359 @27.4% VL 75,938
06-01-06 CD4 462 @24.3% VL > 100,000
08-15-06 CD4 388 @22.8% VL >  "
10-21-06 CD4 285 @21.9% VL >  "
  Atripla started 12-01-2006
01-08-07 CD4 429 @26.8% VL 1872!
05-08-07 CD4 478 @28.1% VL 740
08-03-07 CD4 509 @31.8% VL 370
11-06-07 CD4 570 @30.0% VL 140
02-21-08 CD4 648 @32.4% VL 600
05-19-08 CD4 695 @33.1% VL < 48 undetectable!
08-21-08 CD4 725 @34.5%
11-11-08 CD4 672 @39.5%
02-11-09 CD4 773 @36.8%
05-11-09 CD4 615 @36.2%
08-19-09 CD4 770 @38.5%
11-19-09 CD4 944 @33.7%
02-17-10 CD4 678 @39.9%  
06-03-10 CD4 768 @34.9%
09-21-10 CD4 685 @40.3%
01-10-11 CD4 908 @36.3%
05-23-11 CD4 846 @36.8% VL 80
02-13-12 CD4 911 @41.4% VL<20
You must be the change you want to see in the world.  Mahatma Gandhi

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #62 on: December 18, 2006, 06:22:57 PM »
I asked about PCP.  He says they usually don't see folks get PCP until their tcell % drops to 10% or below.  My % is 17, so he doesn't think PCP is a major concern.  I am taking Doxycycline, (purchased on the internet), to stop in-grown hair infections.  I wonder if this will offer protection from PCP?

I feel fine.  No symptoms, so I wonder if they think this is something to ride out (e.g., my tcell counts will increase to normal range after things stablize, much like a new infection).  I didn't ask that, but I will on Friday.

Offline jack

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  • fomerly the loser known as Jake
Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #63 on: December 18, 2006, 06:32:16 PM »
mine jumped from 75000 to 1 million in a six week period after a long drug stop. After 4 years of trying to find a regimen that works I have been undetectable for several months and for the first time in 16 years have no sides. Drugs work.

Offline Razorbill

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #64 on: December 18, 2006, 06:42:05 PM »
Tcells nose dive quickly.  Instead of all this talk of super infection, could it just be the virus is winning it's battle in your body? Period.  I'm just not getting why so many people involved in your care are so circumspect about your taking drugs.  Could it be they're taking your lead?  Take the pills, take something.  I don't believe Doxycycline is the treatment for PCP, and Bactrim is the preventive.  You're making my head spin!

Offline Eldon

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #65 on: December 18, 2006, 08:48:26 PM »
Hey Cliff...

I do not want to be the one to raise your inner anxiety level about this. However, with the risk of a superinfection, a lowered CD4 count, and a wildfire of a viral load. You may want to reconsider taking the Sustiva/Truvada combo that you Doctor gave you in order to initiate operation suppression.

Either way have a safe trip and Yes, you are in my thoughts and my prayers and I am sending you some positive energy your way as well.

Take care of YOU!

"Don't Give Up, Don't Give In... Cause it is ALL within you to WIN!"

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #66 on: December 19, 2006, 02:28:06 PM »
Tcells nose dive quickly.  Instead of all this talk of super infection, could it just be the virus is winning it's battle in your body? Period.  I'm just not getting why so many people involved in your care are so circumspect about your taking drugs.  Could it be they're taking your lead?  Take the pills, take something.  I don't believe Doxycycline is the treatment for PCP, and Bactrim is the preventive.  You're making my head spin!
Well, I kinda am taking the lead I suppose.  I did ask for and get meds, but I just decided that the doctor made some reasonable points that I really hadn't considered.  I can start the meds right now if I choose to...the doctor just wants me to hear him out before I make any decisions.

After thinking it over last night, I really struggle to see how I could have contracted another strain, but there is a possibility so who knows.  Much of this discussion is a bit academic cause it still doesn't change the fact that my tcells are in the treatment range.  Perhaps they think things will rebound and would rather I wait to know for sure that this isn't a temporary thing, before I jump back on meds.  Also, the UK has a less aggresive approach to HIV care than the US, so that probably has something to do with it as well.

Offline newt

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  • the one and original newt
Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #67 on: December 19, 2006, 05:02:32 PM »
Cliff,

Your clinical picture is also consistent with having had a second strain from the start which has now come to the fore.

Julia Marcus' reseach (some on Medscape, I can find it if you want) has documented rapid decline in immune function on appearance of a second but genetically distinct virus in a small number of people within a few years of seroconversion. She showed half of this number were definitly not superinfections, ie the second strain was present from the start and had replaced the original one.  She modelled this to polulation level and concluded it applied to between 1.5% to 3.0% of HIV+ people. This is consistent with the understanding on the proportion of people who need to start treatment within 1-4 years after seroconversion. (Now you's gonna go say you've been +ve more than 4 yrs so it must be superinfection....). 

I am interested to see if the genetics supports a possible explanation of second infection.  In any case it's by the by.  If your CD4s stay low you need treatment.  This extra info is all a bit of a red herring anyhow, I seem to remember you were thinking it was time to restart treatment anyway, which is why you was down the clinic in the first place. 

- matt

PS: doxy can bugger your liver enzymes
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline David_CA

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #68 on: December 19, 2006, 05:34:21 PM »
.  I don't believe Doxycycline is the treatment for PCP, and Bactrim is the preventive. 

I took Septra for PCP and now Bactrim for the preventative 'til my t-cell numbers increase.

David
Black Friday 03-03-2006
03-23-06 CD4 359 @27.4% VL 75,938
06-01-06 CD4 462 @24.3% VL > 100,000
08-15-06 CD4 388 @22.8% VL >  "
10-21-06 CD4 285 @21.9% VL >  "
  Atripla started 12-01-2006
01-08-07 CD4 429 @26.8% VL 1872!
05-08-07 CD4 478 @28.1% VL 740
08-03-07 CD4 509 @31.8% VL 370
11-06-07 CD4 570 @30.0% VL 140
02-21-08 CD4 648 @32.4% VL 600
05-19-08 CD4 695 @33.1% VL < 48 undetectable!
08-21-08 CD4 725 @34.5%
11-11-08 CD4 672 @39.5%
02-11-09 CD4 773 @36.8%
05-11-09 CD4 615 @36.2%
08-19-09 CD4 770 @38.5%
11-19-09 CD4 944 @33.7%
02-17-10 CD4 678 @39.9%  
06-03-10 CD4 768 @34.9%
09-21-10 CD4 685 @40.3%
01-10-11 CD4 908 @36.3%
05-23-11 CD4 846 @36.8% VL 80
02-13-12 CD4 911 @41.4% VL<20
You must be the change you want to see in the world.  Mahatma Gandhi

Offline gerry

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #69 on: December 19, 2006, 09:12:40 PM »
Cliff:

Did you doc by chance check an HCV PCR to make sure you are not dealing with acute hepatitis C infection in which sometimes, there is a significant delay in seroconversion (i.e., antibody-negative window)?  Do they have any other explanation for the liver enzyme abnormalities or other tests in mind?  Also, are they going to check another genotype if they suspect the possibility of superinfection?  Just a few more questions to add to your list.  Good luck and keep us posted.

Gerry

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #70 on: December 20, 2006, 03:50:58 AM »
I now prefer the term reinfectionSuperinfection sounds too CNN Breaking Newish.

Matt- I'm in the 1-4 year window, can you send through that paper.  I can email it to the consultant.  Gerry- I don't think he did a HCV PCR.  I think he just did another antibody test.  But it has been a few months since the last HCV antibody test (which was near the first viral load spike), so if it is HCV then I suppose it would probably show up on the antibody test by now.  But now you are scarying me!!!  I think I would much rather have a reinfection than HCV.

He came up with only two explanations for the liver enzyme results....1) they are correlected with my viral load so now that my viral load has increased so will my liver enzymes, or 2) I have heptatits, but he almost conclusively ruled that out since I last tested negative and I haven't really been at high risk for it.  Even though it can be sexually transmitted, it's mostly seen with traumatic gay sex...er fisting (it was kinda funny seeing him stumble to say that word).

Yes, (if I understand your genotype question correctly), they are going to check another test.  They store all of our blood samples.  So they are going to pull one of my old ones (say January of this year)/pre spike and do a genotype on it.  They will then do a genotype on the viral load he ordered this week and compare the two.

Cliff

Offline Dachshund

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #71 on: December 20, 2006, 08:08:32 AM »
Good luck to you Cliff...what would we do without Matt?

Offline newt

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #72 on: December 20, 2006, 09:33:16 AM »
I will sort out some stuff.

One for starters is this poster (PDF and a bugger too cos it's big and landscape) from the 2005 Retrovirus Conference:

Higher Frequency of Apparent HIV-1 Superinfection -- Sequentially Expressed Dual Infection (SEDI) -- in Recent Infection Compared to Chronic (PDF poster)
Robert M Grant, J Jeff McConnell, Julia L Marcus, Christophe Kreis, Gerald Spotts, Teri Liegler, Rosaleen Brennan, and Frederick M Hecht, Gladstone Institute of Virology and Immunology/University of California, San Francisco

Pay special attention to "Leon", where a second virus appeared shortly before a collapse in CD4s.

- matt

===

"One case described here would have met criteria that other groups use for "superinfection" in that a virus population at baseline was replaced by a second highly divergent viral variant. However, analysis of the screening sample indicated that the subsequent virus was present at baseline. This case demonstrates how the dynamics of dual infection can lead to the appearance of superinfection."


[attachment deleted by admin]
« Last Edit: December 20, 2006, 05:49:47 PM by newt »
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline newt

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  • the one and original newt
Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #73 on: December 20, 2006, 09:53:36 AM »
Cliff,

Doc could be right re: HIV viral load/liver but...from the British HIV Association guidelines on hep C coinfection:

1.1 Assessment of all HIV+ patients

1. Screen all HIV-positive patients for HCV infection, at first HIV diagnosis and subsequently according to risk, by antibody test and confirm viraemia with HCV PCR.

2. Perform PCR test even if HCV-antibody negative in patients with unexplained liver disease

PCR please, the seroconversion period can be long. You are right that typically sexual transmission requires trauma but better to check eh? Also, the duration of hep A and B immunity following vaccination/infection is presumtive (a guess) rather than well-known, and in the absence of hep C antibodies a check on these is in order.  (HIV-positive people who are successfully vaccinated against hep A and B are recommended to get their level of immunity checked annually).

- matt
« Last Edit: December 20, 2006, 05:59:45 PM by newt »
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline Lisa

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #74 on: December 20, 2006, 11:38:35 AM »
OK Little brother!
Our beloved Newt makes excellent points, and whatever decisions you make about your HIV meds is certainly not an emergency.
I do however, have a couple of bones to pick with you. The first bone concerns the Doxy. (especially internet purchased Doxy) and the effects it may be having on your liver fnx. Which leaves me to wonder if you had presence of mind to tell doc you were taking it as prophylaxis for hair bumps. Although I do still vividly remember helping my ex get those damn little things picked out of the bumps on his face. I understand your dilemma, but not at the expense of your young liver.

The second bone is out of concern for your increased need for PCP prophylaxis for your trip home for Xmas. You're going to be passing through airport terminals, close quarters on airplanes for extended periods, then eventually getting home and kissing all of your family which will include neices, nephews, babies (possibly), and we know what little harbingers of disease kids can be. I would feel better for you if you at least had some Bactrim to travel with....especially given your CD4 count.

Rant over........I love you.
No Fear  No Shame  No Stigma
Happiness is not getting what you want, but wanting what you have.

Offline newt

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #75 on: December 20, 2006, 12:08:16 PM »
Two

This is a good good write-up, not by Dr Marcus though, of a study on re-infection with extensive references:

Human Immunodeficiency Virus Type 1 Superinfection Was Not Detected following 215 Years of Injection Drug User Exposure
Rose Tsui, Belinda L. Herring, Jason D. Barbour, Robert M. Grant, Peter Bacchetti, Alex Kral, Brian R. Edlin and Eric L. Delwart
Blood Systems Research Institute, and Department of Medicine, Center for Bioinformatics and Molecular Biostatistics, Urban Health Study, University of California, San Francisco, Gladstone Institute of Virology and Immunology, San Francisco, California, Center for the Study of Hepatitis C, Weill Medical College of Cornell University, New York, New York

The abstract + discussion and conclusion has the meat and drink of what the study found/said, the science bit in the middle is kinda dense. Although its with IV drug users, their risk factors for reinfection includes sex.

- matt
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #76 on: December 20, 2006, 05:52:12 PM »
Thanks Matt!!  I'm gonna get through the links tonight and tomorrow and fire off an email to him on Friday (hopefully he'll get it before our phone conversation).  I will ask about the pcr or maybe try to get to the clinic again to see if they will test me for it.

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #77 on: December 21, 2006, 06:51:06 AM »
Good news!!

I just called the nurse and my tcell counts are back.  It is 320 and 21.4%.  The viral load and Hep. C stuff aren't back yet.  I don't know if the quick rebound supports the idea of some sort of reinfection.

I've decided not to start meds.

Cliff 

Offline RAB

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #78 on: December 21, 2006, 10:53:09 AM »

Cliff

Good news about the upswing in your most recent labs.  But it doesn't change anything, other than the need for PCP prophylaxis, in my opinion. 

Either way though the decision to start meds is a personal one, and despite some of your posturing that the Europeans have a more conservative approach as to when to start meds, despite your suggestion that the decision to continue to hold off was being driven by the "system", it really was always about whether you are ready. 

Have a Merry Christmas and enjoy your family visit.   :-*

One pesky little detail that started this thread though:



I met with my HIV doc (Angela) today.  She is a very thourough doctor (and straight-to-the point).  My lab results haven't been great the past few months, but they were borderline enough to where I could delay starting treatment without too much protest from anyone.  Not anymore.  My viral load was 300,000 in Sept. and now it's 455,000.  My tcells have remained constant at 300.  She is recommending that I go back on meds.
 
I knew this day would come, but I didn't think it would come this fast.  Part of me is still thinking about taking a wait and see approach.  I do feel fine.  No weight loss.  No fatigue.  Only minor night sweats and swollen lymph nodes.  But I probably don't need to risk getting sick.


RAB


Offline alisenjafi

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #79 on: December 21, 2006, 11:07:39 AM »
Good news!!

I've decided not to start meds.

Cliff 

Out of curiosity and not meaning to sound like an attack but what are you using as a justification not to go back. How long are you reckoning it will take to get your t cells and v load back to before the holiday?
What was your key factor in taking the holiday?
I am wondering why people choose this as I don't see many good results from a holiday. My doc wants me to do one and I refuse. I never had an oi to begin with. My nadir before meds was 327 before going on , and once on was pretty steady in 700- 800 range dipping only once to 446 when I had a sinus infection , when taking my blood work and have been undetectable since 6/03.

While this is a personal decision, in the end I know it's not like they are going to tell me one day "Okay you're completely weaned from Sustiva" And 3 years on I still have the spacey trippy side feeling of the drug. Hearing horror stories in NY of people taking years to rebound for 2-3 months and the complications I even wonder why the docs let it go on for so long. You keep stating issues yet (I am probably missing something) seem not to take the inevitable step of going back.

Just curious-
Johnny
"You shut your mouth
how can you say
I go about things the wrong way
I am human and I need to be loved
just like everybody else does"
The Smiths

Offline newt

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #80 on: December 21, 2006, 11:33:53 AM »
I am gonna put money on this settling out as a temporary viremia of unknown cause.  On the genetics, I will accept a heteroduplex analysis that shows divergence of >5% between virus types as evidence of a possible acquired second infection but not a standard genotype, it just ain't precise enough. Liver/viral load correlation is speculation.  Maybe you was just stressed, taxing your liver with doxy (+maybe a martini/similar or two), got your bloods drawn at a bad time of day, had a bit of a cold, got the lab staff on a slightly careless afternoon etc etc etc.  I hope I am right  :D Have a good trip to Texas n eat me a big 16oz chargrilled steak  :)

- matt
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline Ann

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #81 on: December 21, 2006, 11:40:08 AM »
I am gonna put money on this settling out as a temporary viremia of unknown cause.  On the genetics, I will accept a heteroduplex analysis that shows divergence of >5% between virus types as evidence of a possible acquired second infection but not a standard genotype, it just ain't precise enough. Liver/viral load correlation is speculation.  Maybe you was just stressed, taxing your liver with doxy (+maybe a martini/similar or two), got your bloods drawn at a bad time of day, had a bit of a cold, got the lab staff on a slightly careless afternoon etc etc etc.  I hope I am right  :D Have a good trip to Texas n eat me a big 16oz chargrilled steak  :)

- matt


And let's not forget, Cliff, that you've been under tremendous stress lately, what with leaving your old job, interviewing for a new one, all that crap about your status when you were first hired and now being the new kid on the block. All that combined with what Matt mentions is bound to take a toll - and it looks like a temporary one.

Treat yourself well in the coming weeks - eat right and make sure you're getting plenty of rest and relaxation in and hopefully your upward trend will continue. Good luck! :)

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Robert

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #82 on: December 21, 2006, 02:30:09 PM »
Cliff!@!!

I just caught up with all this today.  What's going on?  I'm inclined to agree maybe it was just a matter of all the planets lining up the wrong way, sun spots, intrusions from outside the realm and all that but please, be careful during the holidays.  I like the idea of eating good and getting lots of rest and away from the ordeals of work. But be careful.  Holidays are also stressful.  I know you're going to see Will and I hope things go OK.  More than OK.  I hope they're fantastic.   But regardless, please try not to stress out.

And by the way.  Ok. YOu've made your point and you've reached your goal:  2 years on a holiday.  When you come back, time to start your meds, mister.  Don't even give "reinfection" a chance.

robert

robert
..........

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #83 on: December 21, 2006, 09:00:11 PM »
Gonna play it by ear.  I'll try to get labs done every month when I get back (at least until my numbers stabilize again).  As long as my tcells are in the 300's, don't think I'm gonna start back yet (I want 3 years now Robert).  It really does feel nice not being on meds.  Maybe Rocky is right and the stress/drama is more about not taking the meds.  But at least now I have them in my possession now (sitting in my underwear/sock drawer), so whenever I want to start I just start.

Offline Eldon

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #84 on: December 21, 2006, 09:22:01 PM »
Supporting You

Hi Cliff...

However it works out, I just wish you the BEST with your situation. Take care of YOU!



"Don't Give Up, Don't Give In... Cause it is ALL within you to WIN!"

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #85 on: January 08, 2007, 07:07:48 PM »
I got my latest number.  Tcell wa s290 and $ was 20.  About the same from the bnast report;  I'm gonna just stick with ths plans.  Meeting with docutor to discuss resinfecition is in a couple weeks.  I wanna know if they'ved complkete the genetic tests.

Offline koi1

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #86 on: January 08, 2007, 08:01:42 PM »
Hey Cliff,

I know you have been living with HIV for a while, so I"ll keep it short. Through denial I managed to avoid getting tested, even after having very bad digestive problems. By the time I decided to bite the bullet, my t cells were down to 97 and I got pcp. The pcp was controlled just fine. But, I have done perhaps ireparable harm to my digestive system by not being tested and having started meds earlier. Take care of that digestive tract. Don't let this virus get a hold of it, because it takes its toll.

rob
diagnosed on 11/20/06 viral load 23,000  cd4 97    8%
01/04/07 six weeks after diagnosis vl 53,000 cd4 cd4 70    6%
Began sustiva truvada 01/04/07
newest labs  drawn on 01/15/07  vl 1,100    cd4 119    7%
Drawn 02/10/07
cd4=160 viral load= 131 percentage= 8%
New labs 3/10/07 (two months on sustiva truvada
cd4 count 292  percentage 14 viral load undetectable

Offline Robert

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #87 on: January 09, 2007, 12:36:45 AM »
Cliff

From the typing/spelling alone..........

Quote
I got my latest number.  Tcell wa s290 and $ was 20.  About the same from the bnast report;  I'm gonna just stick with ths plans.  Meeting with docutor to discuss resinfecition is in a couple weeks.  I wanna know if they'ved complkete the genetic tests.

....................... I'd say it's already too late.   ;D

robert
..........

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #88 on: January 09, 2007, 06:47:43 AM »
Sorry.  Wrote that after a night of drinking and eating.   :-[

 :-[

Offline skeebo1969

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #89 on: January 09, 2007, 07:17:09 AM »


  I knew it!!  When I saw it I figured you were drinking..lol.  I hope you are not making your decisions while drunk Cliff..  You are well aware of how close you are cutting it here so I won't even start... I hope you have at least made your doc appointments more frequent so you can monitor this closely.

  Be careful.

  Thomas
I despise the song Love is in the Air, you should too.

Offline alisenjafi

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #90 on: January 09, 2007, 07:33:22 AM »
In  keeping with the theme- should AIDSMEDS have a boot to use to kick those in the arse for making decisions that they know were completely foolish-
Cliff I get the feeling you are playing this like a poker game- so
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxTmOOvigJY&mode=related&search=
"You shut your mouth
how can you say
I go about things the wrong way
I am human and I need to be loved
just like everybody else does"
The Smiths

Offline newt

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #91 on: January 09, 2007, 11:23:29 AM »
I dissent

There's time to make a considered decision on when to start, if indeed that ends up being the outcome here.  What with a new job, emotional stuff around the reinfection(?) thingy (or not), and reconciling the loss/lessening of them Dirty Martini nights to accommodate Sustiva, few hands of poker may not be a bad idea. Never lost a game of poker when the other player had all his cards on the table.

There ain't any point starting if you ain't really ready, treatment needs to fit your life to save it, and counts here are good enough to afford time for consideration.

- matt

Now playing: the air conditioning
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline Cliff

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #92 on: February 10, 2007, 04:54:46 PM »
I had another appointment with the doctor.  My tcells are 290 and viral load is 11,000.  He was throwing around superinfection again.  But the genetic tests weren't back yet (not sure how long it takes) so he couldn't say for certain.  Part of me wanted to tell him to stop saying superinfection unless he had proof of it (I still can't recall being at specific risk for it during that period), but I chickened out.  Anyways, he recommended not starting treatment but that I could do so if I wanted to.  He didn't see a need for me to start back now because the risk of OI was low.  I've decided to hold off and see how things are in April.

Offline Razorbill

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #93 on: February 10, 2007, 04:58:30 PM »
Not smart.  And you know it.

Offline hussy_24

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #94 on: February 10, 2007, 05:35:02 PM »
this thread kinda scares me away from having sex again :( then again i had lots of sex between infection and diagnosis and my numbers are on the low end anyway so probably reinfected before knowing i had hiv then again might not be reinfected at all just thinking i am because i am reading it on the net, then again again  ??? always get bloods taken when i am feeling "off" with a cold or whatever which never helps i am sure.


Hope things go well for you Cliff. April seems a long way away though ??? . Look after yourself in any event, wrap up warm, i've been wearing a wooly hat to bed this week because of the snow!!

Offline RAB

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #95 on: February 10, 2007, 08:49:24 PM »
Hi Cliff:   ;D

These most recent labs are a remarkable improvement over where you were just a couple of months ago.
I'm remembering a cd4 count of somewhere just over 100 and a vl at one point that was like 1/2 million.

So to hear that your most recent counts are 290 and 11,000 is good news obviously.  (Very interesting how the roller coaster of results has played out--makes one wonder what exactly is contributing to them).

I think you know where I stand on the decision of restarting.  That's the funny thing about the question you are currently wrestling with, there is no concrete, cut and dried, absolutely positively (sic) road map for anyone to follow. 

I do agree with something that Matt said, unless you are personally ready then it isn't a good idea to restart.

You've made a really smart decision to monitor your labs monthly until a clearer picture emerges, for that you get loads of brownie points.

Good luck and keep up the fight my friend.

RAB


Offline Robert

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Re: Not so good lab results
« Reply #96 on: February 11, 2007, 12:35:52 AM »
I know I'm not convinced of any so-called "superinfection".  I think it's just your numbers going up and down, perhaps influnced by some external behaviors (like sex) and once they find a nice plauteu they settle down.  They're in no hurry and so it's a good thing you're not either.

robert
..........

 


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