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Author Topic: Took quality health care for granted...Now Im seeing the other side of the coin.  (Read 12401 times)

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Offline phillypinko

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From 1992 to 2000 I saw one of the top AIDS doctors here in Philly. When he retired I saw an associate of his who was just as good until two years ago when he left the office I was visiting. He left for a reason. The place used to have a clinic day once a week. Now every day is clinic day. Im not a snob I just don't like sitting in a room built for 10 people that is filled with 30 street people. I don't think it is to much to ask to wait in a waiting room that doesn't smell like a restroom at a football stadium. I have had a few health problems the last couple of years which were handled horribly. Now its time to find a new doctor for the first time since I tested positive in 92. WISH ME LUCK!!!! lol

Online Jeff G

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The answer to your question is if you don't like your clinic go find another one . We live in a country where medical care is a privilege and not a right so if you cant hang in a room and share the oxygen with the less fortunate then go somewhere you wont be offended .


   

Offline BT65

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Jeff gave you a gracious answer.  You may not know this but I worked with "street" people and my heart always goes out to them.  No matter how they got where they're at, or how they're living, they deserve quality medical care. 

With my clients, there's one, who unfortunately is incarcerated now, but when he's out he prefers to be homeless so he can use drugs over paying rent.  Do I treat him different than my other clients?  No.  I transport him to the doctor, and sit with him when he gets his exam.  I want to make sure he's treated with dignity. 

Whether or not you can stand "street" people, you have to realize they're human beings.  Instead of being offended, you should count your lucky stars you have a place to sleep that's not an abandoned building.  Too often street people are automatically judged, when, if you think about it, should something happen to our incomes, we would also be "street" people. 

Sorry for the rant but I don't like to see the homeless being degraded.  THEY ARE HUMAN BEINGS!
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline wolfter

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Sorry for the rant but I don't like to see the homeless being degraded.  THEY ARE HUMAN BEINGS!

This wasn't a rant at all.  When I came home early this morning from working way too many hours, this was one of the first threads I read and I couldn't even log in to comment.  You and Jeff were way more gracious than I was going to post.  I always have Ann's hammer in the back of my mind. ;D

Had I been in a large city with few friends and no family during my last illness, I too would have ended up one of the "smelly" people with not many options.  I was fortunate to have a great family who provided assistance until I could get healthy.  Without them, who knows?  For the first time in my life, I was flat ass broke and didn't have a place to live except with family.

I'm truly glad the OP has other options as it appears many of the others don't.  So to the OP, perhaps you'll do them a favor by moving on to lessen the burden on them?

One other aspect that originally returned to my mind was of the entire "good AIDS" v's "bad Aids" thingy that many of us remember.

Wolfie
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Offline phillypinko

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Im one of the less fortunate but I know how to take a bath every day. The people you know who would rather take drugs then pay rent are called drug addicts and you'd be doing them a greater service to let them hit bottom then enabling their lifestyle. Not liking the stink of filth does not make me some kind of monster who doesn't want to "share oxygen" with the less fortunate.

Offline phillypinko

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Thank you all for being so "gracious" lol

Offline Ann

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Im one of the less fortunate but I know how to take a bath every day. The people you know who would rather take drugs then pay rent are called drug addicts and you'd be doing them a greater service to let them hit bottom then enabling their lifestyle. Not liking the stink of filth does not make me some kind of monster who doesn't want to "share oxygen" with the less fortunate.

Not all homeless people are "drug addicts". Many people who are homeless do not take drugs as a recreational pursuit - they take them simply to blot out the reality of their lives. Many homeless people do not take drugs at all. It's all they can do to feed themselves.

Your idea of letting people hit "rock bottom" has been shown to be counter-productive in the extreme. For a start, for a homeless person, "rock bottom" more often than not equals death. Are you in a better place to dictate policy than people who have studied homelessness and it's causes for decades?

I'd like to know how you would propose to take a bath every day if you should ever become homeless yourself. You have no idea what you're talking about here.

I hope you realise that some of our members here are currently homeless, and some have been there, done that. Until you have walked a mile in their shoes, I suggest you drop the judgemental attitude.

You're being quite offensive and that will not be permitted here. Think before you post!

Ann
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Online Jeff G

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I guess I'm a half glass full kind of guy and love seeing people getting treatment no matter of their circumstance . I know the clinic I attend has many people who struggle to get to their appointments on time , some come in sitting in wheel chairs that are held together with duct tape . The clinic gives gas vouchers for people who drive and provide vans to bring people in but most people who are homeless have no phone or a way to arrange transportation . I have noticed that some have been in the same clothing for who only knows how long because they cant wash them due to low funds and being disabled with psychical limitations . Its these people who need a smile and hug more than you could ever imagine , that's being gracious .

The county hospital where many low income patients got HIV care closed abruptly and my clinic had to work over 860 new patients into our clinic in a matter of months . They are seeking patient volunteers to help with the transition and many have stepped up to help by giving their time and its made a huge impact .

Philly , have you considered volunteering at your clinic or elsewhere . Its a wonderful way to help your community as well as yourself . It can help take the focus off your own problems and realize that you are not alone in your struggles you face .               

Offline wolfter

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Im one of the less fortunate but I know how to take a bath every day. The people you know who would rather take drugs then pay rent are called drug addicts and you'd be doing them a greater service to let them hit bottom then enabling their lifestyle. Not liking the stink of filth does not make me some kind of monster who doesn't want to "share oxygen" with the less fortunate.

As someone who has never done or needed recreational drugs, I find your entire line of thought patterns so congruent with what I was raised with and therefore will disregard any input you provide.  Instead of apologizing for your assisine comments, you continue to espouse them.  Therefore, I can't imagine ever trying to be supportive since you view yourself in a different league.  BTW, I come from a good family and have never done drugs, am college educated and am only a few dollars away from the situation you describe.

I truly hope you can look at our comments from a different viewpoint and garner the insight to move forward without the judgmentalness I perceive.
productivity breeds content

Offline Mishma

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Consider for a moment that these "Streetfolks/drugaddicts," you speak of have a illness which I'll call mental illness for sake of argument that is no different than your HIV infection, a common cold or cancer. These are all illnesses of your body/brain and they all deserve treatment and compassion. Unfortunately, in this bloody country the brain dead powers to be still consider Health Care, in it's entirety, a privilege and not a right-a subject that pisses me off. 

Perhaps if their smell offends you, you can invite them home with you for a bath and meal-that would be the humane thing to do.
2016 CD4 25% UD (less than 20). 27+ years positive. Isentress, Truvada, Acyclovir, Clonazepam, Zolpidem, Bupropion, Lisinopril, Pravastatin, Quetiapine, Doxcycline, Testosterone, Suatriptan/Naproxen, Restasis, Dorzolamide, Latanoprost, Asprin, lortab, Levothyroxine, Fioricet, Restasis, Triamclinolone, Nitrostat.

Offline AlanBama

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I go to the same clinic as Jeff.  Some of the poorest folks are the most loving and generous people.  One I am thinking of, in particular, that Jeff will know who I am talking about, is on the Patient Advisory Board with us....

I understand it can be a nuisance sometimes, in a loud waiting room with some who don't smell so pleasant, and some who are always on the phone, and seem to create drama...but they are entitled to care, just like I am.  I think most of them are doing the best they can.  I get impatient at times, I am only human.  I try to say "there, but for the grace of God, go I".  Maybe some could do better than they do, but it's not for me to judge. 

I was in 'private' care from 1987 thru 2007, so I do know what a difference it is to go from that to a clinic setting.  We just all have to make the best of it, and be thankful for what we have.

Just my 2 cents worth.....

ALAN
"Remember my sentimental friend that a heart is not judged by how much you love, but by how much you are loved by others." - The Wizard of Oz

Offline Habersham

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I think Jeff's first answer was sensible. The responses since then are overkill.

It's not too much to ask to have a big enough waiting room for all patient's to wait comfortably. Clinics which are overcrowded and have long waits lose their patients with private insurance and don't serve their indigent patients well either.

Philly's choice of words was unfortunate.

Gang up on me if you like.

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Offline Miss Philicia

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I've obtained services regularly for close to a decade at two of the largest HIV clinics in downtown (Center City) Philadelphia. I rarely sit for long in a waiting room, nor have I ever encountered them to have a deficit of seating, nor do I routinely encounter patients that smell (though it has happened). I'd be interested to know exactly which clinic the OP is referring to.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline BT65

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You know, I just got home from work a bit ago.  I took one of my clients, from Africa, to get her eyes checked today.  She was telling me about going through the war in Mozambique and how she would walk along and see body parts lying all over.  She said she stopped crying after a month.  She also told me that if parents took a child to the hospital for care, if they did not have money to pay for the care, the child did not get taken care of.  She told me that's the beauty of America-people get care. 

I'm grateful I have medical care.  By the way, one of my doctor's offices is at the local homeless shelter here in South Bend.  Thank God I have a doctor who cares that much. 

When I worked with the homeless, the church had a program from Monday through Thursday that offered a free breakfast, plus showers.  However, there was a shower list and it would fill up by about 7:30 am.  If someone did not get their name on there, they did not get a shower. 

I just do not want to become so self centered that I think I am more deserving than anyone else.  No matter what that person smells like.  Lord knows when I was a using drug addict there were days I smelled like piss and ground in dirt.  I never forget that, nor how lucky I have been.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline phillypinko

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Thanks to the posters who came to my defense. It could be considered hypocrisy to judge someone who is supposedly judgmental. I have been doing volunteer work in the AIDS community for 6 years. I do prep work in a kitchen that feeds home bound AIDS patients and am a member of an "AIDS buddy" program. Those of you talking down to me sound incredibly self righteous. Its not asking much to go to a doctors office that smells clean and where the clients aren't packed in like sardines. Those of you talking down to me sound incredibly self righteous. You should read your posts and ask yourselves who the judgmental one is here.

Offline mitch777

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Thanks to the posters who came to my defense. It could be considered hypocrisy to judge someone who is supposedly judgmental. I have been doing volunteer work in the AIDS community for 6 years. I do prep work in a kitchen that feeds home bound AIDS patients and am a member of an "AIDS buddy" program. Those of you talking down to me sound incredibly self righteous. Its not asking much to go to a doctors office that smells clean and where the clients aren't packed in like sardines. Those of you talking down to me sound incredibly self righteous. You should read your posts and ask yourselves who the judgmental one is here.
Philly,
The term you used in your original post "street people" can be pretty offensive to most people. You might want to reread your own post and try to understand how others may read it.
It set the tone of your post in a way you might not have meant, but never the less did.
m.
31 years hiv+ (oct. 2013) with a curtsy.

Online Jeff G

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Thanks to the posters who came to my defense. It could be considered hypocrisy to judge someone who is supposedly judgmental. I have been doing volunteer work in the AIDS community for 6 years. I do prep work in a kitchen that feeds home bound AIDS patients and am a member of an "AIDS buddy" program. Those of you talking down to me sound incredibly self righteous. Its not asking much to go to a doctors office that smells clean and where the clients aren't packed in like sardines. Those of you talking down to me sound incredibly self righteous. You should read your posts and ask yourselves who the judgmental one is here.


Im glad you have found some time to give back to the community Philly because on
June 27th you shared what I quoted below when someone suggested volunteering .

You said .
Until two years ago I volunteered for Aids organizations in the Philadelphia area. Both of my parents became very ill so I have a full time job looking after them. Having no time to myself is starting to catch up to me.


Offline wolfter

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Replying to someone's ridiculous assertions is not judging, deeming a lobby full of smelly AIDS patients as homeless addicts is.

As my tagline reads; "judging someone does not define them, it defines you".

Perhaps a mea culpa is in order and we move past this?

Another hillbillyism just popped into my head (thanks Granny!); "never look down on someone unless you're helping them up".
productivity breeds content

Offline Habersham

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What is the pc term for street people? Would Philly saying the homeless bring down such ire?

I hope they don't treat any unwed mothers

Single parents are allowed
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Offline mitch777

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What is the pc term for street people? Would Philly saying the homeless bring down such ire?

I guess I would have eliminated the word "street".
31 years hiv+ (oct. 2013) with a curtsy.

Offline Habersham

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We can't be sure which clinic Philly was receiving care at but I can guess.

My best friend told me he was switching because "there's nothing there but drag queen prostitutes and fkcn druggies".
Because I Can

Online Jeff G

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We can't be sure which clinic Philly was receiving care at but I can guess.

My best friend told me he was switching because "there's nothing there but drag queen prostitutes and fkcn druggies".


 WOW , what a horrible thing to say .

Offline phillypinko

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Im glad you have found some time to give back to the community Philly because on
June 27th you shared what I quoted below when someone suggested volunteering .

You said .
Until two years ago I volunteered for Aids organizations in the Philadelphia area. Both of my parents became very ill so I have a full time job looking after them. Having no time to myself is starting to catch up to me.

My parents are well enough for me to have a life of my own again. Thank you so much for your obvious concern. Im sure you would keep going to your health care provider if their waiting room smelled like a urinal. Maybe with a lot of work on my side I can some day attain your level of tolerance for unsanitary conditions.

Offline BT65

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 WOW , what a horrible thing to say .

I agree.  If I were in a clinic where there was someone acting too self righteous to be in the same room as a "street" person, I would go somewhere else.  Nothing stinks like hypocrisy.

Maybe with a lot of work on my side I can some day attain your level of tolerance for unsanitary conditions.

Unsanitary, really?  That's a bit dramatic.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline Habersham

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I once went in a bar full of lady boy hookers, tweakers and smelly homeless looking people.

I didn't stay.

Because I Can

Online Jeff G

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I once went in a bar full of lady boy hookers, tweakers and smelly homeless looking people.

I didn't stay.




If you don't have anything put passive aggressive pot stirring to add to this thread don't participate . This is a serious and subject to some members myself included and it has caused some hurt feelings as well as offending people .

I was once one of those drug addicted and desperately poor that kept my doctors appointments despite having no choice but to go in clothing that had seen a few too many wearing's since they had seen a washing machine . I know what its like to stand on a train platform and have people stare and move away from me because I was sick and covered with sores .

This conversation doesn't and cant hurt me because I have hurt enough already . Im simply not gong to let this kind of talk demoralize other members that may be where I once was . This is the lowest kind of insensitivity and will be confronted by me each and every time . You and Philly should be ashamed of yourselves and the sad part about it is your not , not even a little bit .


Offline Habersham

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The issue to me is whether Philly or any other person we may find annoying can express their opinion without being corrected 9 times by the word police.

Once was enough.

And - I don't put my ugly on the front porch like everyone else.

I haven't always been the most attractive person and could understand why someone wouldn't want to sit next to me.

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Offline Miss Philicia

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My best friend told me he was switching because "there's nothing there but drag queen prostitutes and fkcn druggies".

Charming... Philly FIGHT or Mazzoni Center? I go to both and like I previously said I've not had any issues. Both are very well organized (well, Mazzoni often has issues in the front office (staffed by sober folks) but the doctors are top notch. And you can't beat the quality of medical services at FIGHT/Jonathan Lax Center.

Sorry, but knowing Philly like I do the underlying, unspoken issue is one of race often. And frankly I find it appalling.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2013, 01:24:09 AM by Miss Philicia »
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline wolfter

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Thanks Jeff for making me remember why this thread bothered me personally.  I had to recall the emotions of being an AIDS ridden faggot with a "Haz Mat" sticker plastered across my hospital room door and having staff covered head to toe in protective gear in order to protect themselves.

And dealing with ridiculed comments and people "politely" move away from me in public since it was obvious I had something nefariously wrong with me.

Perhaps this thread wouldn't be as disturbing in another section, but to have another LTS espouse these views is beyond my comprehension.  I sincerely hope that the OP can understand why this thread caused such heated comments.  Beyond that, I'm done with this topic as I don't think there's much left to be said.
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Offline phillypinko

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If you don't have anything put passive aggressive pot stirring to add to this thread don't participate . This is a serious and subject to some members myself included and it has caused some hurt feelings as well as offending people .

I was once one of those drug addicted and desperately poor that kept my doctors appointments despite having no choice but to go in clothing that had seen a few too many wearing's since they had seen a washing machine . I know what its like to stand on a train platform and have people stare and move away from me because I was sick and covered with sores .

This conversation doesn't and cant hurt me because I have hurt enough already . Im simply not gong to let this kind of talk demoralize other members that may be where I once was . This is the lowest kind of insensitivity and will be confronted by me each and every time . You and Philly should be ashamed of yourselves and the sad part about it is your not , not even a little bit .

HIGH DRAMA!!!

Offline phillypinko

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Charming... Philly FIGHT or Mazzoni Center? I go to both and like I previously said I've not had any issues. Both are very well organized (well, Mazzoni often has issues in the front office (staffed by sober folks) but the doctors are top notch. And you can't beat the quality of medical services at FIGHT/Jonathan Lax Center.

Sorry, but knowing Philly like I do the underlying, unspoken issue is one of race often. And frankly I find it appalling.

Its the Lax center I've been complaining about and im happy to tell you there are plenty of white slobs going there 2. Im disgusted with poor hygiene not skin color. My psychiatrist and therapist are at the U of P. Im going to ask my shrink for an infectious disease or hiv specialist I can see at U of P. I've had a few health issues come up since the Lax center turned into a homeless shelter that were handled poorly. Im leaving for health reasons as much as I am the new type of client.

Offline phillypinko

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I agree.  If I were in a clinic where there was someone acting too self righteous to be in the same room as a "street" person, I would go somewhere else.  Nothing stinks like hypocrisy.

Unsanitary, really?  That's a bit dramatic.
Its the smell that bothers me not so much that they are from the street. I mean I keep my eye on my wallet a little more with this new type of client around but its really the stink that gets to me. It so bad it gives me a headache. Can you imagine a doctors waiting room smelling so bad it gives you a headache?

Offline Miss Philicia

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I've been a patient at the Jonathan Lax Center (Dr. Mounzer is my doctor, executive director of the entire center which is the largest in the city and one of the largest in the US) for eight years. I never wait more than five minutes in the waiting room -- and the waiting room has about 30-40 seats and I never see more than 10 people in the room. Seriously, I don't know what you're talking about except that you don't care for the evidently lower income African American and Latino client base they serve -- and I'd say in fairness that's about 80% of the patients. Eight years ago I'd say 50% of their clients were white men -- now there are hardly any. Now, I wonder why that is -- the care is the same and the front office is super organized and never flubs bureaucratic issues up (unlike Mazzoni which is a mess in the front office -- they can't even return calls, much less transfer a call without disconnecting you).

A lot of these patients are from North and West Philadelphia -- the very hardest hit parts of HIV in Philly, and don't wish their neighbors to see them go into a clinic that is in their own neighborhood, hence why they come to Center City and the Lax Center, plus it's well organized and partially funded by private endowment left by a gay man who they named the facility for -- Jonathan Lax. They also provide in-house case management, in-house pharmacist, mental health services, a special hepatitis clinic, multi-drug resistance clinic, substance abuse issues and programs for recently incarcerated patients (boy, I bet you don't like those types!).

Guess what -- HIV isn't like it was 20 years ago when it was all white gay men that could pop their AZT and then hit Woody's for a vodka soda around the corner. The types of people I just described above are the faces of HIV/AIDS in the year 2013. If you can't handle that then you need to find yourself a private doctor where you don't have to see the hoi polloi of the world.

And now that I have described what the Jonathan Lax Center is like -- and frankly I've had better care there than the 15 years of private doctors in Manhattan where I used to live, I'll leave it to our fellow forum members to draw their own conclusions about what you are saying. I hesitate to judge as a personal matter -- it's simply not part of my personality.

http://fight.org/fight-programs/the-jonathan-lax-center/

ps: Seriously? You keep an eye on your wallet when you go to the doctor. I mean come on. You must do that 120% of the time in Philly then. Sorry but I really don't know how to respond to that one.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2013, 07:03:04 PM by Miss Philicia »
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Thanks for sharing that Miss P , you brought up some great points .   I have moved this thread into living with HIV , maybe some other people have some positive things to add to the conversation .

Offline oksikoko

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That's so funny. I was literally (old-school definition) just reading this in pre-HAART wishing I could respond.

I'm curious how the *health care* is at this clinic, since the title of the thread was "Took quality health care for granted." Does the OP get good service? If not, maybe that's really what he's upset with before the thread went this other direction. And that's a real concern.

As an aside, the HIV clinic I go to recently opened up to include neggers, you know, people without HIV. This caused quite a stir amongst the HIV gentry, let me tell you. They don't stand out either, so you might be at the clinic talking to one without even realizing it. Imagine.

Edit: Oh, sorry, yeah I've got nothing positive to add. :)
« Last Edit: August 23, 2013, 07:25:02 PM by oksikoko »
Code: [Select]
2013-10-03:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1105
2013-05-23:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (-) 945
2013-02-25:                ☣ VL (-) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1123
2012-12-16: Enter Stribild
2012-11-20: HIV+           ☣ VL (→) 132,683      ☣ CD4 (→) 920
2012-04-01: HIV-
Dates in this signature file conform to ISO 8601. ;-)

Offline Joe K

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I believe it is always easier for people to criticize those people they do not know.  Here in Montreal, we have plenty of street folks and some of their stories would rend your heart from your body.  I obtain my health care from a HIV clinic, that serves all who need help.  Strangely enough, when I find that odours are excessive, it's generally from some perfume or after shave and not from poor personal hygiene.

Not that any of that matters.  I don't have time to look down on anyone, as that is not how I am made.  I would leave the OPs clinic because of the horrible medical care and find the unnecessary insults, regarding the less fortunate to be most telling.

Here's hoping the OP never finds himself in the shoes, of those he so easily denigrates.

Joe
Life is what happens, when you are busy making other plans.

Though you may be only one person in the entire world, to one person, you may be the entire world.

I wish to become half the man, that my dog thinks I am.

Remember me with simple acts of kindness and I will live forever.

Offline 2blessed

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This is really offensive not because I've ever done drugs(never have my mother would KILL me) nor have I ever been homeless I come from a upper middle class African American family and am enjoying college life but I'm offended because I am a human being and there are just some thing you don't say maybe it's because I'm southern and we talk differently but I doubt thats the case maybe it's more you never took the time out to talk to a "street person" I know many, some distant family members, who have hit horrible patches in life and the worst thing you can ever do is to judge them...if you're not helping then you're hurting..it's not too much to ask for you to reach out help those less fortunate than you..I was always told by my mom "baby we have money...you don't" so although I'm not homeless I personally don't have much to give but time and a nonjudgmental listening ear and kind words

Offline oksikoko

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Homelessness comes on little cat feet, or so I'm told. One day, middle class office person, next day [POUNCE] learning not to eat, where to sleep and how to be very nice to strangers. Some strangers will let you shower, so that's like two birds with one stone. Or is it two kittens with one sack? I got lost in the metaphor.

I'm always surprised by how many people here have been homeless. You'd think there was a connection between HIV and homelessness or something.

Oh, look, they have a website for everything. http://www.nationalhomeless.org/factsheets/hiv.html
"HIV/AIDS and homelessness are intricately related.  The costs of health care and medications for people living with HIV/AIDS (PLWHA) are often too high for people to keep up with.  In addition, PLWHA are in danger of losing their jobs due to discrimination or as a result of frequent health-related absences.  As a result, up to 50% of PLWHA in the United States are at risk of becoming homeless (National Alliance to End Homelessness, 2006)."

Etc.
Code: [Select]
2013-10-03:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1105
2013-05-23:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (-) 945
2013-02-25:                ☣ VL (-) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1123
2012-12-16: Enter Stribild
2012-11-20: HIV+           ☣ VL (→) 132,683      ☣ CD4 (→) 920
2012-04-01: HIV-
Dates in this signature file conform to ISO 8601. ;-)

Offline wolfter

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Oski, I can always count on your for a good smile when reading your posts.  ;)  Absolutely adore your posting style.

Someone would have to be moronic to not see a connection to HIV and homelessness.  It was quite common in the early days for families to discard their previous loved ones because of this virus.  We took in a few different friends while dying from AIDS as they had nothing.  No support, no ability to work, and would been on the streets if they weren't lucky enough to have someone who cared enough to love and care for them through the dying process.

I never imagined being close to that predicament, but that's exactly what would have happened a few years back after the loss of my partner and my latest severe illness.  I was fortunate enough to have family who supported me for quite a while as I fought to recover.  Had I not been so fortunate, there were no other resources available and I cringe at the thought of the outcome.
productivity breeds content

Offline harleymc

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I guess the cure for bigotry hasn't been discovered.

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Offline Tool man

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HIV and homelessness...
One of my neighbors runs a HIV clinic here in Arkansas and I asked him if he had anyone who needed a place to live due to HIV cost issues. My husband and I live in a 5 bedroom house and have lots of room to offer. Friends of ours have done this and had great additions to the family for years. The doctor said he knew of no one in economic trouble. I wonder if he was being truthful or if things are better here in the smaller towns?

TM
Like I tell my husband, "I would agree with you but then we would both be wrong."

Offline oksikoko

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Oski, I can always count on your for a good smile when reading your posts.  ;)  Absolutely adore your posting style.

Wocka wocka!

The doctor said he knew of no one in economic trouble. I wonder if he was being truthful or if things are better here in the smaller towns?

That's a great gesture on your part. Rural v. Urban may be different. Or maybe it's just New York and my circle of friends. I can name on the top of my head five or six homeless friends and acquaintances right now and another half dozen who've been homeless this year but who now have living situations (of varying stability). In some cases the virus came first, but not in all. :-/
Code: [Select]
2013-10-03:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1105
2013-05-23:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (-) 945
2013-02-25:                ☣ VL (-) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1123
2012-12-16: Enter Stribild
2012-11-20: HIV+           ☣ VL (→) 132,683      ☣ CD4 (→) 920
2012-04-01: HIV-
Dates in this signature file conform to ISO 8601. ;-)

Offline phillypinko

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Wocka wocka!

That's a great gesture on your part. Rural v. Urban may be different. Or maybe it's just New York and my circle of friends. I can name on the top of my head five or six homeless friends and acquaintances right now and another half dozen who've been homeless this year but who now have living situations (of varying stability). In some cases the virus came first, but not in all. :-/

How many of your homeless friends are on drugs?

Offline BT65

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How many of your homeless friends are on drugs?

I honestly don't know how that's relative to what was posted.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline Miss Philicia

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I honestly don't know how that's relative to what was posted.

Drugs are bad and homeless people who get high every day deserve to smell. Or that was my take away... Kind of like how gay people are bad and deserve AIDS, unless you're gay then naturally you find that type of thinking repellant.

Of course, I could be off base with this assumption and if so I apologize.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline BT65

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Drugs are bad and homeless people who get high every day deserve to smell. Or that was my take away... Kind of like how gay people are bad and deserve AIDS, unless you're gay then naturally you find that type of thinking repellant.

Ah, so it was just more stereotyping.  He should have finished the thought, though, and maybe will come back to do that.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline JungleJungle

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Personally, i would be more interested in receiving the best quality healthcare rather than  worrying about who shares my waiting room oxygen...but i live in a country where healthcare is a right, and welfare provides a decent service for all. After reading all your posts i am glad not to live in US, in terms of welfare (no offending meaning here)...
You need coolin', baby, I'm not foolin',
I'm gonna send you back to schoolin',
Way down inside honey, you need it,
I'm gonna give you my love,
I'm gonna give you my love.

Offline phillypinko

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I honestly don't know how that's relative to what was posted.
If you can't understand how drug use and homelessness go hand in hand you may be to far gone to have a discussion.

Offline jkinatl2

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I have been on disability for twenty years, since I developed AIDS in 1994. I was lucky then, because I was fast-tracked to disability and managed to latch onto section eight (reduced rate) housing before the avalanche of HIV survivors clogged the system. At the present, there is an eight year wait forthat housing.

I currently pay $250 a month for rent ( including 30 pet rent, water and sewer, and all that).

I know full well that I am an inoppurtune inspection away from beign homeless. As it stands, each month I basically spend down to the dollar. Gas, meds, food/otc drugs, pet food and litter, and internet/phone take all but maybe a hundred dollars of my monthly income.

I know I am next door to homelessness. I fear that, and I act upon that fear by freaking out when scheduled inspections are scheduled.

It is a life basedon fear. And poverty.

And for the OP, how many people with mental illness face homelessness? I suspect that number rivals thatof the lowly drug abusers (and that there is serious overlap as people try to self-medicate).

I have more to say. I just don't have the energy this weekend.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline BT65

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If you can't understand how drug use and homelessness go hand in hand you may be to far gone to have a discussion.

And just how are you an expert on this?  I worked with homeless people, I know the incidence of drug use and/or mental health issues (which I believe you also face).  But asking right away, when someone mentions they know homeless people, if they're drug addicts is getting a little ahead of yourself.

I also do not know you tell me I am "too far gone."  I've been completely sober a few years, so my mental faculties are excellent.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline Tool man

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When I was living abroad and visiting the clinic, all 50 of us patients would have an 11 o'clock appointment and I didn't enjoy the surroundings nor other clients.
The place was not in good shape and the other patients were not of my choosing! Waiting would take from 1-3 hours so I would always take my book and read until they eventually called my name. Never did I complain since it was the "Free" socialized medicine that I paid for every month like everyone else who lived there.
Had I wanted to pay for a nicer facility and all the blood tests I had that option but chose not. Yes the place was abysmal, but the care was fine and tests/meds were free so I got what I paid for.

TM
Like I tell my husband, "I would agree with you but then we would both be wrong."

Offline intaglio

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I saw this thread when it was over in LTS. So much going on here.

Disclosure: I was homeless for a short time in the early '80's. I lost my job and my apartment. Since I was a 'college student' I could not get any help. So I lived out of my car for a while. I had it better than most. I was young and resilient. As it was, it still barely allows me to say "I was there myself" when others speak of homelessness.

There was a NYT article recently that showcased people who sought out HIV so they could keep from being homeless. Yeah, on the friggen' scale of what people don't want to have happen in their lives. some would rather be HIV+ than homeless because of the options and help available.

Columbia, South Carolina is planning to round up its homeless into shelters the homeless can't leave. Sort of a non-prison incarceration. Fun stuff. A few years back, the same thing was being proposed for HIV sufferers. Gives you a little perspective on how a few in power with the ability to help the homeless view them.

Okay, on to the homeless are druggies sentiment. Outliers get the attention. Media love the attention-grabbers that feed on peoples' fears. When media wants to demonize the homeless, they trot out the visuals of the stumbling drunk guy or the guy assaulting passers-by. They don't bother to show you the guy who's spent the last 12 hours combing job listings at the job bank, customizing his resumť for each one. He only gets trotted out when the United Way starts its annual money beg.

Do homeless people use drugs? Sure. Do some drink to excess? Sure. Do they obtain drugs when they could be using their limited resources differently? Sure. So do a bunch of non-homeless people.

Those who rail against and act against the homeless have stopped seeing them as people. Do you want the homeless to go away? Then maybe you need to work harder to insure all your tax money paying for explody things that kill others goes to improving the lives of those around you. The US government has the ability to wipe out homelessness. It chooses to wipe out lives overseas instead.

I know I am next door to homelessness.

You and many others. Too many people are just a paycheck away from homelessness, but many don't want to hear that.

The doctor said he knew of no one in economic trouble. I wonder if he was being truthful...

HIPPA constraints keep him from being truthful. Doctors are all too aware of their patients who struggle to afford their care.


Anyway, thank you all who care for others and can see past financial (and perhaps olfactory) challenges to the person struggling. You make this world a better place.
Reality is frequently inaccurate.

Offline leatherman

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Columbia, South Carolina is planning to round up its homeless into shelters the homeless can't leave. Sort of a non-prison incarceration. Fun stuff. A few years back, the same thing was being proposed for HIV sufferers.
this is only an emergency plan. This shelter is opening up 2 months before it's usual winter opening date. There are kitchen facilities providing meals, and they are setting up a tent to house service representatives, who will be helping the homeless get assistance which they are currently not accessing. Also no longer will released ex-prisoners just be "dumped" into the city; but taken to this shelter so they have someplace to be rather than living on the streets. The homeless are allowed to leave (the article you linked was incorrect about this detail); however there will be police on watch for these people trying to return to those locations in the center of the city where they had been. Over the next 3 months, the city will have hearings in which they are planning to develop a long term strategy to solve this situation - a situation which had become very detrimental to tourism and to local businesses - not too mention that this plan gives shelter, food, and access to resources for those who have been without and wandering the streets.


disclosure: I have luckily avoided homelessness 3 times now.
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline JungleJungle

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Too many people are just a paycheck away from homelessness, but many don't want to hear that.

So true...
You need coolin', baby, I'm not foolin',
I'm gonna send you back to schoolin',
Way down inside honey, you need it,
I'm gonna give you my love,
I'm gonna give you my love.

Online Jeff G

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In the late 80's some city's filed a lawsuit and won over Montgomery Alabama's solution to homelessness . They were arresting homeless people for simply being homeless and giving them a bus ticket to a city of their choice , so naturally they mostly chose to go to places like San Diego , cant remember where else .

A few of the city's sued and won and ended Montgomery's cost effective homeless relocation plan as it was referred to . It became known that if you were in need of transportation to another city and didn't have the means to make it happen on your own all you had to do was get to Montgomery and take a nap on the sidewalk near city hall . 

It all started when plans were offered and permits were requested from the city council to open a homeless shelter .

Offline oksikoko

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How many of your homeless friends are on drugs?

I'd have to call them and ask. Being or not being on drugs isn't a requirement for my friendship.
Code: [Select]
2013-10-03:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1105
2013-05-23:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (-) 945
2013-02-25:                ☣ VL (-) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1123
2012-12-16: Enter Stribild
2012-11-20: HIV+           ☣ VL (→) 132,683      ☣ CD4 (→) 920
2012-04-01: HIV-
Dates in this signature file conform to ISO 8601. ;-)

Offline phillypinko

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I have been on disability for twenty years, since I developed AIDS in 1994. I was lucky then, because I was fast-tracked to disability and managed to latch onto section eight (reduced rate) housing before the avalanche of HIV survivors clogged the system. At the present, there is an eight year wait forthat housing.

I currently pay $250 a month for rent ( including 30 pet rent, water and sewer, and all that).

I know full well that I am an inoppurtune inspection away from beign homeless. As it stands, each month I basically spend down to the dollar. Gas, meds, food/otc drugs, pet food and litter, and internet/phone take all but maybe a hundred dollars of my monthly income.

I know I am next door to homelessness. I fear that, and I act upon that fear by freaking out when scheduled inspections are scheduled.

It is a life basedon fear. And poverty.

And for the OP, how many people with mental illness face homelessness? I suspect that number rivals thatof the lowly drug abusers (and that there is serious overlap as people try to self-medicate).

I have more to say. I just don't have the energy this weekend.
I am on disability and in section 8 housing as well. Being poor doesn't mean I have to accept inferior medical care. A waiting room that smells horrible and declining quality of care are unacceptable. I meet plenty of people who reject me for being disabled and in section 8 housing. It hurts but I know I can't change the world.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 12:15:32 PM by phillypinko »

Online Jeff G

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I am on disability and in section 8 housing as well. Being poor doesn't mean I have to accept inferior medical care. A waiting room that smells horrible and declining quality of care are unacceptable. I meet plenty of people who reject me for being disabled and in section 8 housing. It hurts but I know I can't change the world.

You have talked about rejection and being judged in allot of your post so I'm wondering if you feel the way you do about people less fortunate as a way to feel better about yourself .

You may not be able to change the world but you can make a difference in your corner of it .

Offline Miss Philicia

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A waiting room that smells horrible and declining quality of care are unacceptable.

Except you are failing to mention that I GO TO THE EXACT SAME CLINIC and can truthfully say you are totally full of BS. So we've gone from smelly people to the actual waiting room always smelling foul? And your doctor sucks too and all of the support staff and case managers?

rrrright.

You know, you've been complaining about one thing or another ever since you showed up on this forum. Now, a rant from time to time is a cleansing experience but personally you might want to print out your older posts and give them a second look. I realize you're having some crisis episodes but seeing as how I've gone to the same clinic for close to a decade, and have found the quality of care there better or equal to the two private doctors in very expensive Manhattan neighborhoods I once had, I just find this all too unbelievable.

Maybe instead of going on and on about it in an internet thread that will do nothing to resolve what you perceive as an issue, you should make an appointment with Jane Shull -- one of the hardest working people I've ever encountered in HIV services. And if you don't bring this up with her, in person, then you're not being a serious person.

And yes, I want to hear back from you on this thread when you've spoken to her. You should also talk to Dr. Karam Mounzer as he is the lead medical director. He's my personal doctor there and I know 110% for sure he'd want to know about anything like this, as would Jane. Shit or get off the pot, as they say.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 03:14:36 PM by Miss Philicia »
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline buginme2

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I read two articles today in the paper that kind of show just how big of a problem homelessness in America is and how it's getting worse and the division society is making between the haves and the have nots.


In Columbia South Carolina the city council has voted to evict all homeless people from the city (from living on the street).  Basically you have three choices: go to a shelter, jail, or leave town. 

Reasons for this, people don't feel safe and the business community is afraid it will hurt business. 

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/26/us/south-carolina-city-takes-steps-to-evict-homeless-from-downtown.html?hp&_r=0

Another news article in today's paper was how rents in many places are so high that they are just unaffordable for many.  The Seattle Times had an article how the average rent in the city has now reached about $2200 per month.  For someone making the minimum wage or even substantially above that you would be hard pressed to find something affordable. 

http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2021673014_rentincreasesxml.html

IMHO this is all a symptom of how our society is becoming increasingly polarized both politically, socially, and economically.  There are more and more obstacles being placed on people preventing them from achieving economic freedom and a path out of poverty. 

Is is kind of related to the thread, just something to think about...maybe it would have been better to post in the economic thread but this one was more exciting.


Offline phillypinko

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Except you are failing to mention that I GO TO THE EXACT SAME CLINIC and can truthfully say you are totally full of BS. So we've gone from smelly people to the actual waiting room always smelling foul? And your doctor sucks too and all of the support staff and case managers?

rrrright.

You know, you've been complaining about one thing or another ever since you showed up on this forum. Now, a rant from time to time is a cleansing experience but personally you might want to print out your older posts and give them a second look. I realize you're having some crisis episodes but seeing as how I've gone to the same clinic for close to a decade, and have found the quality of care there better or equal to the two private doctors in very expensive Manhattan neighborhoods I once had, I just find this all too unbelievable.

Maybe instead of going on and on about it in an internet thread that will do nothing to resolve what you perceive as an issue, you should make an appointment with Jane Shull -- one of the hardest working people I've ever encountered in HIV services. And if you don't bring this up with her, in person, then you're not being a serious person.

And yes, I want to hear back from you on this thread when you've spoken to her. You should also talk to Dr. Karam Mounzer as he is the lead medical director. He's my personal doctor there and I know 110% for sure he'd want to know about anything like this, as would Jane. Shit or get off the pot, as they say.
I saw Dr. John Turner from 1992 until 1998 at Graduate hospital. He moved to the Lax center. Joe Ondercin was a PA who worked under Doctor Turner. I had known Joe since 1992. When Dr. Turner retired I started seeing Joe. Without warning Joe disappeared from the Lax center about two years ago. Since Joe left the Lax center there has been a steady decline in the quality of care I've received. I've had problems completely ignored. Rather then make appointments with staff and tell them how to run their clinic im just going to switch to U of P. I don't think i'll have to tolerate a room filled with loud smelly people at the office of an infectious disease/HIV specialist at U of P. I also don't think I will have to bring health problems up over and over again without them getting treated.

Offline phillypinko

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You have talked about rejection and being judged in allot of your post so I'm wondering if you feel the way you do about people less fortunate as a way to feel better about yourself .

You may not be able to change the world but you can make a difference in your corner of it .
No. I will say it again. I don't want to sit in an over crowded waiting room that smells so bad it gives me a migraine. Not liking the smell of filth does not make me someone who is looking for a way to feel better about myself it makes me someone who does not like the smell of filth...PERIOD...NO FURTHER NEED FOR ANALYSIS!!!!

Offline Miss Philicia

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I'll be at the Lax Center twice in the coming few weeks -- can't wait to inhale this "new scent" you've discovered. And it doesn't surprise me that you are refusing my suggestion to bring the issue up with the appropriate two directors. I'm sure it doesn't surprise anyone else here either.

ps: homeless people go to the U-Penn's services too, and guess what -- Dr. Mounzer from the Lax Center is affiliated with their program: http://www.uphs.upenn.edu/idd/mounzer.html

I bet he imports more stink. Maybe what you really need to do is move out to the suburbs. King of Prussia smells like gardenias.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline leatherman

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In Columbia South Carolina the city council has voted to evict all homeless people from the city (from living on the street).  Basically you have three choices: go to a shelter, jail, or leave town.
and what's wrong with having a roof over your head, a bed, and food?  ???
isn't a shelter a viable alternative to being homeless? or are you suggesting that living out on the street is a good thing? Should we just leave homeless people homeless and hungry??

you might want to see the post I posted earlier that includes the Columbia emergency plan, if you missed it.
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline buginme2

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and what's wrong with having a roof over your head, a bed, and food?  ???
isn't a shelter a viable alternative to being homeless? or are you suggesting that living out on the street is a good thing? Should we just leave homeless people homeless and hungry??

you might want to see the post I posted earlier that includes the Columbia emergency plan, if you missed it.

There's nothing wrong with that at all.  Besides those weren't my words they were what was written in the New York Times article I was referencing.

However, I do have a question.  Lets just say a homeless person doesn't want to go to a shelter for whatever reason.  Should they be subject to jail or run out of town?

Offline Miss Philicia

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and what's wrong with having a roof over your head, a bed, and food?  ???
isn't a shelter a viable alternative to being homeless? or are you suggesting that living out on the street is a good thing? Should we just leave homeless people homeless and hungry??

you might want to see the post I posted earlier that includes the Columbia emergency plan, if you missed it.

If you were raped in a shelter or mugged would you enjoy being forced by government authorities to go to such a place? I agree people should be encouraged to go to one, and that they should be safe places but the truth is that they aren't always like that.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Online Jeff G

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I suspect that the program in Columbia will face a challenge in the courts sooner or later .

Some of the homeless people in my Chicago neighborhood hated the shelters and preferred the streets , sometime when it was extremely cold they would go from lack of a better choice .

Offline oksikoko

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and what's wrong with having a roof over your head, a bed, and food?  ???
isn't a shelter a viable alternative to being homeless? or are you suggesting that living out on the street is a good thing? Should we just leave homeless people homeless and hungry??

There are a lot of reasons a person may not want to be forced into a shelter. I stayed outside on purpose sometimes to avoid certain un-niceties. It all blurs to be honest, and (probably) due to some other traumatic stuff I was having a touch of the psychosis (haha, no really), but I think, as much as I didn't want to be in the shelter, I only did this three times (because it was very, very cold). But quite a few other days I found other ways to be inside without having to go back there. Just to keep the record balanced, the second shelter was a dream. I wouldn't mind living there now, except 1) now I have control over the cleanliness of my own bathroom, a privilege everyone should have, and 2) now I'm not required to attend classes on things like bathing, shopping and housecleaning.

I don't know anything about this news story. I'm just saying shelters, as nice as they are compared to the street, are not necessarily better than the street all the time.
Code: [Select]
2013-10-03:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1105
2013-05-23:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (-) 945
2013-02-25:                ☣ VL (-) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1123
2012-12-16: Enter Stribild
2012-11-20: HIV+           ☣ VL (→) 132,683      ☣ CD4 (→) 920
2012-04-01: HIV-
Dates in this signature file conform to ISO 8601. ;-)

Offline oksikoko

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If you were raped in a shelter or mugged would you enjoy being forced by government authorities to go to such a place? I agree people should be encouraged to go to one, and that they should be safe places but the truth is that they aren't always like that.

This.
Code: [Select]
2013-10-03:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1105
2013-05-23:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (-) 945
2013-02-25:                ☣ VL (-) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1123
2012-12-16: Enter Stribild
2012-11-20: HIV+           ☣ VL (→) 132,683      ☣ CD4 (→) 920
2012-04-01: HIV-
Dates in this signature file conform to ISO 8601. ;-)

Offline leatherman

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Besides those weren't my words they were what was written in the New York Times article I was referencing.
oh, ok. it wasn't until I searched for the word "jail" (not "choices") that I found what you paraphrased over there in that small quote under the picture and not in that article at all. Since it wasn't in the article, that's why I thought that was your thought/opinion

Should they be subject to jail or run out of town?
no. I guess we could leave them on the streets to be hungry, with no bed, and no health care or easy access to services. As an advocate for health care, I just think society has an obligation to try to help people have food, healthcare and shelter. Perhaps too, my opinion comes from knowing how cold and unforgiving winter can be in the north. While these homeless people her in SC may be quiet happy to crash on the sidewalks and in the foliage surrounding the State House, I think they should have a bed and a roof - for their own basic health needs.

I suspect that the program in Columbia will face a challenge in the courts sooner or later .
I'm sure it will, and that's probably why the city council is scheduling hearings, etc to design a long-term plan to deal with this situation

I agree people should be encouraged to go to one, and that they should be safe places but the truth is that they aren't always like that.
so what then? we don't offer any shelter because some shelter situations are bad?? Rapes and muggings are crimes and hopefully can be prosecuted by proper legal actions to correct those situations. It seems odd to focus on the fewer amount of people assaulted in shelters rather than focus on the large amounts of people who are helped by shelters.
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline oksikoko

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so what then? we don't offer any shelter because some shelter situations are bad?? Rapes and muggings are crimes and hopefully can be prosecuted by proper legal actions to correct those situations. It seems odd to focus on the fewer amount of people assaulted in shelters rather than focus on the large amounts of people who are helped by shelters.

I think it's just the 'forced' part that troubles some people. Sure shelter should be available, but a good dose of PTSD shouldn't be forced on anyone seeking (or avoiding) shelter.
Code: [Select]
2013-10-03:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1105
2013-05-23:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (-) 945
2013-02-25:                ☣ VL (-) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1123
2012-12-16: Enter Stribild
2012-11-20: HIV+           ☣ VL (→) 132,683      ☣ CD4 (→) 920
2012-04-01: HIV-
Dates in this signature file conform to ISO 8601. ;-)

Offline buginme2

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Actually Leatherman what I said was in the article, 15th paragraph (it's also mentioned in the caption under the picture probably because it's such a powerful statement).

As far as offering shelter options.  solving the homeless situation requires more than offering shelter.  Go to downtown Seattle at night.  There are thousand of homeless people living in the streets and we have one of the if not the most social services available.  In fact we have vans that drive around downtown that give free rides to shelters to anyone that wants one yet hundreds of not thousands still live on the street. 

I don't guess to understand why, I've never been in that situation.  But it's naive and wrong to think it's ok to put someone in jailfor being a transient.

Offline Bowie-esq

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Drug addicts, clean, dirty, homeless, wealthy, middle class, gay straight bi lesbian transgender, smoker, drinker, coffee or tea, prostitute, washed, unwashed - are you a nice person with a kind heart? Then it doesn't matter who you are or what social situation you are in or from.

I find the best thing to do is give, always give within your means. Pass on your love, your hope and your dreams. Give people your hand without an expectation, without limits and without judgement.

To err is to be human, and we are all human.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2013, 05:12:23 PM by Bowie-esq »
Infected: +\-01/2010

Tested positive 08/2010
28/07/11 CD4 420 9% v.l. 20500
16/10/11 CD4 320 10% v.l. 185000
10/11/11 begin Truvada/Viramune
29/12/11 CD4 410 13% v.l. 115
14/4/12 v.l. undetectable
05/7/12 CD4 520 19% v.l. UD
21/08/13 CD4 470 20% v.l. UD
19/12/13 CD4 430 23% v.l. UD

Offline Bowie-esq

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And yes I'm a European hippy living in Amsterdam...
Infected: +\-01/2010

Tested positive 08/2010
28/07/11 CD4 420 9% v.l. 20500
16/10/11 CD4 320 10% v.l. 185000
10/11/11 begin Truvada/Viramune
29/12/11 CD4 410 13% v.l. 115
14/4/12 v.l. undetectable
05/7/12 CD4 520 19% v.l. UD
21/08/13 CD4 470 20% v.l. UD
19/12/13 CD4 430 23% v.l. UD

Offline Tool man

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Bowie, you are just un-American!
Meet you at the Kloss in a few days for some grilled lamb.

TM
Like I tell my husband, "I would agree with you but then we would both be wrong."

Offline phillypinko

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I'll be at the Lax Center twice in the coming few weeks -- can't wait to inhale this "new scent" you've discovered. And it doesn't surprise me that you are refusing my suggestion to bring the issue up with the appropriate two directors. I'm sure it doesn't surprise anyone else here either.

ps: homeless people go to the U-Penn's services too, and guess what -- Dr. Mounzer from the Lax Center is affiliated with their program: http://www.uphs.upenn.edu/idd/mounzer.html

I bet he imports more stink. Maybe what you really need to do is move out to the suburbs. King of Prussia smells like gardenias.
I had stress related tachycardia that was ignored by my doctor at the Lax center. My resting heart rate was well over 100. My psychiatrist takes my vitals so she treated it. I wake up with puss in my ears every morning and my doctor at the Lax center said to, "clean them with debrox". My psychiatrist said I clearly have serious infections in my ears and that the Lax centers treatment of my problems is bordering on negligent. As far as contacting the Lax center I'll say it again. IT IS NOT MY JOB TO POLICE HOW THE LAX CENTER FUNCTIONS. I WILL FIND A BETTER DOCTOR.

Online aaware72

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This is the types of thread that want to to stay away from this board.  Can we not all be respectful?   :(
"Yes, knowledge is power. Self-knowledge brings mastery of one's body."

Offline jkinatl2

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This is the types of thread that want to to stay away from this board.  Can we not all be respectful?   :(

You clearly missed the majority of this thread that was very respectful.

This thread is exactly the sort of thing this forum needs, to remind us that we are coming from all walks of life and to be respectful and mindful of that. There will undoubtedly be many more just like it. And i for one am happy to know that.



"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Online aaware72

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You clearly missed the majority of this thread that was very respectful.

This thread is exactly the sort of thing this forum needs, to remind us that we are coming from all walks of life and to be respectful and mindful of that. There will undoubtedly be many more just like it. And i for one am happy to know that.

No Iíll have to disagree and I did read the thread.  The digs and insults just take away from all that is respectful.  I would have to agree with you that we need to as you said remember that "we are coming from all walks of life and to be respectful and mindful of thatĒ In the end has this thread really served a purpose?  Has it drawn people together over a common cause to better everyone?  I don't think so.  Sometimes things get lost in this world of non-verbal communication.  Instead reading into what someone is writing, make assumption and then making an attack based on those assumptions is just wrong, in my opinion and doesn't serve any good purpose.  If anything we should seek to understand and ask question before we jump on someone. 
"Yes, knowledge is power. Self-knowledge brings mastery of one's body."

Online aaware72

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From 1992 to 2000 I saw one of the top AIDS doctors here in Philly. When he retired I saw an associate of his who was just as good until two years ago when he left the office I was visiting. He left for a reason. The place used to have a clinic day once a week. Now every day is clinic day. Im not a snob I just don't like sitting in a room built for 10 people that is filled with 30 street people. I don't think it is to much to ask to wait in a waiting room that doesn't smell like a restroom at a football stadium. I have had a few health problems the last couple of years which were handled horribly. Now its time to find a new doctor for the first time since I tested positive in 92. WISH ME LUCK!!!! lol

Lets look at this post...  Does he degrade anyone?  Does he speak badly about anyone?  NO.  However by post number #3 on this thread he is being attacked for things he did not say and words he did not use.  In my opinion this thread got out of control right from the gate and in my opinion should of been shut down.  But then it was allowed to digress and the OP was put on the defense for no reason in my opinion.     
"Yes, knowledge is power. Self-knowledge brings mastery of one's body."

Offline wolfter

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If anything we should seek to understand and ask question before we jump on someone.

I agree, we should seek to understand people before making assumptions.  Had the OP done that, this thread wouldn't exist.   :o

edited to add:  damn, got sucked back in.
productivity breeds content

Online aaware72

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I agree, we should seek to understand people before making assumptions.  Had the OP done that, this thread wouldn't exist.   :o

edited to add:  damn, got sucked back in.

I'll have to disagree with you.  What assumptions did he make?  It appears to me that the practice increased the number of day they do clinic on, which in my opinion is good, however that allow the condition of the facility to deteriorate that seems that it may have caused good physicians and some client to leave to find a better place to work or have care.  This is what I took out of the OP post.  I don't live in the area, but if I did and was aware of a good place to go for care with good doctors I may suggested a place for this OP to go. 

I go to ID department at Mass General in Boston. They run a clinic here 2-3 times a week.  The staff there is professional and the facility is kept clean.  Matter of fact they just replace all the carpeting in the waiting room and rearranged the waiting area to accommodate more people.  Now if I experienced the same thing as the OP stated that the doctors were leaving and the facility was unsanitary then I would also look to find another place to seek healthcare.

I guess I'm guilty of reading into the original thread as everyone else, although what I took was a person who was frustrated with the current care he was receiving and looking for a cleaner and better facility where he could get care.  And that he has now had life experiences of what some of the less fortunate person may have to deal with to get basic care.
 
"Yes, knowledge is power. Self-knowledge brings mastery of one's body."

Offline wolfter

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I'll have to disagree with you.  What assumptions did he make? 

did you read through the entire thread?  Most of us have no issue with his desire to change clinics if he has legitimate concerns about quality healthcare, but it progressed to issues unrelated to that.  His assumptions about all the homeless, smelly people being drug addicts and such, really hit a nerve with many of us.

When a vast majority disagree with someone's opinion, it might be time to reevaluate your beliefs.   ;)
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Online aaware72

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Just keep in mind if we look at the original post none of this was mentioned.  Only  after the OP was attacked for, in my opinion, for no good reason did this thread digress.  It's sad. 

I see homeless all the time in the city I live. The problem has got worse and that in mainly, in my opinion, due to the reduction in mental heath program in my area.   

As for making the assumption that "all the homeless, smelly people being drug addicts"  The fact of the mater is the vast majority of the homeless have some sort of addition problem or mental health issue.

A couple years ago I lost everything and if it was not for family I could of become homeless.  I have battle additions of sorts over the years.  I can relate 
 
But lets remember this thread was not started talking about the homeless, drug addition, and mental health.  It was started about health care and went to this bad place that, in my opinion, served no purpose.  Have we helped the OP with find a new place for care in the area?  Have we solved the homeless issues?  Have we gained a better understanding of the problems and found solutions?  IDK maybe made some are now more aware of the issues homeless face...
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 11:01:04 AM by aaware72 »
"Yes, knowledge is power. Self-knowledge brings mastery of one's body."

Offline Miss Philicia

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Like I said, I go to the same clinic -- he lied in the first post about the waiting room. It isn't built for 10 people. It easily has 30 chairs in it, maybe more. Furthermore the room is never full to capacity. I've often gone and there are no more than five people in a room that can hold over 30. The place isn't full of homeless people who smell. I can only recall ever smelling another patient in close to a decade of going there. Clearly riding the subway is a more traumatizing environment. So yes, as I can speak with authority once he disclosed exactly which clinic he was referring to in Philadelphia his post was full of mistruths and insensitive comments.

Once I read these fabrications it kind of did for me with the thread. I can't -- and wont' -- speak to what his relationship was or wasn't with his doctor. But I still stand by my suggestion to bring relevant concerns up to the executive directors, yes even if he still plans on discontinuing service there. All he need do is write a letter.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline wolfter

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It's just too bad they all can't receive a monthly government check, section 8 housing and numerous other residual benefits that accompany being poor enough to qualify for section 8.   ;)

NUFF said on my part.  I notice my snarkiness coming through and I feel a hammer coming my way.   :o
productivity breeds content

Online aaware72

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Like I said, I go to the same clinic -- he lied in the first post about the waiting room. It isn't built for 10 people. It easily has 30 chairs in it, maybe more. Furthermore the room is never full to capacity. I've often gone and there are no more than five people in a room that can hold over 30. The place isn't full of homeless people who smell. I can only recall ever smelling another patient in close to a decade of going there. Clearly riding the subway is a more traumatizing environment. So yes, as I can speak with authority once he disclosed exactly which clinic he was referring to in Philadelphia his post was full of mistruths and insensitive comments.

Once I read these fabrications it kind of did for me with the thread. I can't -- and wont' -- speak to what his relationship was or wasn't with his doctor. But I still stand by my suggestion to bring relevant concerns up to the executive directors, yes even if he still plans on discontinuing service there. All he need do is write a letter.

I agree call BS for what it is, however you post was post #59 in this thread.  By this point this thread had digressed and served no purpose, in my opinion.  Should of be shut done long before it got to this point. 
"Yes, knowledge is power. Self-knowledge brings mastery of one's body."

Online Jeff G

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I agree call BS for what it is, however you post was post #59 in this thread.  By this point this thread had digressed and served no purpose, in my opinion.  Should of be shut done long before it got to this point. 

There has been some very good things that have come out of this thread . One of those things are that the clinic in question is a good facility and resource for people living with HIV that is staffed with hard working people .

I find it odd when people object to thread and come in to criticize all the participants when all they need to do is avoid the thread if its not to their liking .

Online aaware72

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There has been some very good things that have come out of this thread . One of those things are that the clinic in question is a good facility and resource for people living with HIV that is staffed with hard working people .

I find it odd when people object to thread and come in to criticize all the participants when all they need to do is avoid the thread if its not to their liking .

No what is odd is that mods here let things go the way they did in this thread.  We have two different poster that spoke about this facility in PA.  I do not know either of these posters and who is more trustworthy and who is speaking the truth.  Then we had the mud slinging that happen.  This is my opinion and it seems my opinion is not wanted by you, but personal messages tell me that you are wrong!  But then again if someone can not take some constructive criticism then there is the real problem.  And I did not criticize "all" participant.  So whatever "good things" came from this thread are over shadowed my all the negativity in my opinion.  If someone here does agree with what someone says then they should be constructive in their response and remain respectful.  Maybe you need to poll the almost 2000 persons that have viewed this thread to get a real feeling of what people think of it.  Maybe I am wrong with my opinion, but then again they are just my opinion and I do not see a issue expressing those opinions.  As far as I am concern I have not been disrespectful in any of my posts and I have only expressed my thoughts in a respectful way.     
"Yes, knowledge is power. Self-knowledge brings mastery of one's body."

Offline Joe K

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Just keep in mind if we look at the original post none of this was mentioned.  Only  after the OP was attacked for, in my opinion, for no good reason did this thread digress.  It's sad. 

I see homeless all the time in the city I live. The problem has got worse and that in mainly, in my opinion, due to the reduction in mental heath program in my area.   

As for making the assumption that "all the homeless, smelly people being drug addicts"  The fact of the mater is the vast majority of the homeless have some sort of addition problem or mental health issue.

A couple years ago I lost everything and if it was not for family I could of become homeless.  I have battle additions of sorts over the years.  I can relate 
 
But lets remember this thread was not started talking about the homeless, drug addition, and mental health.  It was started about health care and went to this bad place that, in my opinion, served no purpose.  Have we helped the OP with find a new place for care in the area?  Have we solved the homeless issues?  Have we gained a better understanding of the problems and found solutions?  IDK maybe made some are now more aware of the issues homeless face...

Since the OP had no problem in stating his issues and defending his opinions, I'm curious on why you feel the need to overload the thread with your opinions and assumptions.  Rather than offering anything constructive, you come into the thread to belittle those who responded and our moderators.  You post multiple replies that all say the same thing, however, it's not your job to moderate these forums.

You also just had to throw in that comment about the homeless, that I noted above, when you know no such thing, as again, it's just your opinion.  I find folks like you tiring, as you seek to drain all that is good around you.  Rather than just plainly stating your displeasure with the thread, or better yet, just passing it by, you decided to rekindle the flames with baseless assumptions about what folks did or did not say.

Hopefully you are now happy, having pissed all over this thread and what I take away from your participation, says a lot more about you, than anyone who responded in this thread.

Joe
Life is what happens, when you are busy making other plans.

Though you may be only one person in the entire world, to one person, you may be the entire world.

I wish to become half the man, that my dog thinks I am.

Remember me with simple acts of kindness and I will live forever.

Online aaware72

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I find folks like you tiring, as you seek to drain all that is good around you.  Rather than just plainly stating your displeasure with the thread

Joe

Hi Joe

That is what I did with my original response in this thread, which was plainly state my displeasure with this thread.  All my other responses have been in response directly to post directed at myself.  If you find me tiring then block me or ignore me.

As for your bold area of my text.  (see page 4) on the follow report:

Substance Abuse and Mental Health Adminstration (2011) Current Statistics on the Prevalence and Characteristics of People Experiencing Homelessness in the United States.  Retrieved on August 28, 2013, from http://homeless.samhsa.gov/ResourceFiles/hrc_factsheet.pdf

As you can see the comment inregards to the homeless with substance abuse and mental health issues is not just my opinion, but a supported fact from a reputable source.
 
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 12:47:15 PM by aaware72 »
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Offline BT65

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The quality of the op's medical care was not the issue, though it has been found out he is telling untruths.

The issue was the op's denigrating a certain demographic when he himself faces mental health issues, poverty etc.    Putting oneself above another is intolerable. 
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline jkinatl2

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As a moderator, I have a special antipathy for people who enter a thread that might or might notbe/have been contentious and fan the flames by passive-aggressively stating that "it's threads like these that make me afraid to post."

Especially when it seems obvious that it's threads like these that actively motivate aforementioned person to post, in order to judge the quality of the thread and the discourse.

Lots of decent and good things came from this thread, despite Moderator Jeff being used as a punching bag from several members. Heavy hangs the head that wears the crown, right?

Thing is, threads like this serve a real positive and important purpose. This forum has a great diversity of people who are representative of all income levels. Up until about ten years ago there was a legitimate mantra regarding HIV for the newly diagnosed.

Prepare to be Poor.

It was the absolute truth, as only the most well-off with great insurance OR the most poor on Medicare/RyanWhite were afforded any decent care (if they got care at all beyond stabilization). Even now, as the Affordable Care Act rolls slowly out, cost of and access to treatment remain a HUGE and often overlooked factor in successful treatment.

disparaging poor people or homeless people on this forum is what may keep THEM from participating if it isn't called out, and called out harshly.

If that offends other peoples' sensitivities, then tough. There are other online forums for HIV support. If I recall, a member posted here a while back looking to set up a support system or group for the more well-to-do. And in his forum he can disparage the great unwashed all that he wants.

We don't do that here, and when it happens it will be struck down hard. Because frankly I care more about a desperate person with nowhere else to turn than I do with a well-connected person who just doesn't want to be reminded of the poor, sick, and homeless among us.

And according to a shockingly large portion of the HIV negative community, anyone with HIV is deserving of scorn, derision, judgment and ostricization. To many people, including doctors, being HIV alone makes us the Great Unwashed.

Divvying up our ranks by assumption of privilege simply dilutes our ability to advocate for one another, and serves no helpful purpose other than scaring away the people who might need this resource because they have no others. No supportive family, no friends, not even a computer other than a public one at a library.

in a way, and if you simply must delineate importance, those disenfranchised people need this resource more. Because without us, there literally might be no way for them to understand and address this disease in a way that will literally save their lives.
"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline phillypinko

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Lets look at this post...  Does he degrade anyone?  Does he speak badly about anyone?  NO.  However by post number #3 on this thread he is being attacked for things he did not say and words he did not use.  In my opinion this thread got out of control right from the gate and in my opinion should of been shut down.  But then it was allowed to digress and the OP was put on the defense for no reason in my opinion.     
There is no point in arguing with them. Their conditioning is Pavlovian. They are politically correct zombies and react to certain stimuli (politically incorrect words or language) with pre-programed conditioned responses (outrage). They are incapable of critical thinking once the conditioned response is triggered. You notice they completely ignored my post about having puss running out of my ears and a high heart rate ignored by my doctor. The story line is that im a bad person for looking down on others but its ok for them to look down on me. The mental gymnastics they have to perform to adhere to their story line is rather fascinating from a clinical perspective.

Offline skeebo1969

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From 1992 to 2000 I saw one of the top AIDS doctors here in Philly. When he retired I saw an associate of his who was just as good until two years ago when he left the office I was visiting. He left for a reason. The place used to have a clinic day once a week. Now every day is clinic day. Im not a snob I just don't like sitting in a room built for 10 people that is filled with 30 street people. I don't think it is to much to ask to wait in a waiting room that doesn't smell like a restroom at a football stadium. I have had a few health problems the last couple of years which were handled horribly. Now its time to find a new doctor for the first time since I tested positive in 92. WISH ME LUCK!!!! lol

If a person has to say they are not something, it usually means they realize they are.  It's your right though, just quit trying to defend what you made initially obvious.  If you didn't want to be around homeless people seeking the same medical attention that you are you picked the wrong place to air out your negative views about them. 


 


I despise the song Love is in the Air, you should too.

Offline Joe K

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There is no point in arguing with them. Their conditioning is Pavlovian. They are politically correct zombies and react to certain stimuli (politically incorrect words or language) with pre-programed conditioned responses (outrage). They are incapable of critical thinking once the conditioned response is triggered. You notice they completely ignored my post about having puss running out of my ears and a high heart rate ignored by my doctor. The story line is that im a bad person for looking down on others but its ok for them to look down on me. The mental gymnastics they have to perform to adhere to their story line is rather fascinating from a clinical perspective.

Nice try using psycho-babble to justify your intolerance of the less fortunate.  I suppose, if you can't dazzle us with your brilliance, you can always try to baffle us with your bullshit.

Joe
Life is what happens, when you are busy making other plans.

Though you may be only one person in the entire world, to one person, you may be the entire world.

I wish to become half the man, that my dog thinks I am.

Remember me with simple acts of kindness and I will live forever.

Offline phillypinko

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Nice try using psycho-babble to justify your intolerance of the less fortunate.  I suppose, if you can't dazzle us with your brilliance, you can always try to baffle us with your bullshit.

Joe

See!

Offline wolfter

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There is no point in arguing with them. Their conditioning is Pavlovian. They are politically correct zombies and react to certain stimuli (politically incorrect words or language) with pre-programed conditioned responses (outrage). They are incapable of critical thinking once the conditioned response is triggered. You notice they completely ignored my post about having puss running out of my ears and a high heart rate ignored by my doctor. The story line is that im a bad person for looking down on others but its ok for them to look down on me. The mental gymnastics they have to perform to adhere to their story line is rather fascinating from a clinical perspective.

This is like a bad movie that I keep watching just to see how it ends.  I don't think anyone missed your comments about your medical issues.  I simply have a difficult time offering support when someone is denigrating others while asking for empathy. 

Adhering to your story line is also rather fascinating.  Considering the vast majority here have suggested that you reconsider your views, it's telling that you refuse to consider that you may have been inappropriate. 
productivity breeds content

Offline phillypinko

  • Member
  • Posts: 112
This is like a bad movie that I keep watching just to see how it ends.  I don't think anyone missed your comments about your medical issues.  I simply have a difficult time offering support when someone is denigrating others while asking for empathy. 

Adhering to your story line is also rather fascinating.  Considering the vast majority here have suggested that you reconsider your views, it's telling that you refuse to consider that you may have been inappropriate.
That's what is so psychotic about all of this. What exactly are my "views"?

Offline bocker3

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,357
  • You gotta enjoy life......
Quite frankly, I stayed away from this mess, but I must comment here.

If YOU had puss running out YOUR ears and didn't MAKE your doctor treat it -- I'd say that your problem goes quite beyond a bad doctor.  You are a partner with your health care providers and seems to me that you aren't pulling your weight and suddenly throwing up the victim card.  Though your posts do a "victim" quality to them.
If you had a number of "signs" that you weren't getting good care and continue to go there (you obviously have options, as you are finally SAYING, you are moving on) well that is more on you.

M
Atripla - Started 12/05
Reyataz/Norvir - Added 6/06
Labs - Pre-Meds
Sep05 T=350/25% VL98,559
Nov05 288/18%  47,564
Current Labs
May2013 691/31% <20

Offline Denver Toad

  • Member
  • Posts: 158
Quote
You are a partner with your health care providers and seems to me that you aren't pulling your weight

This...
If you don't advocate for your own health care, who will? If the symptoms were present, and left untreated, is it easier to blame others or take responsibility for your health?  The distinctiveness of your fellow patients awaiting treatment have nothing whatsoever to do with the quality of healthcare you receive. The quality of your health has everything with your own advocacy.

And while were on the subject of advocacy, what better opportunity then this to open your eyes to the plight of others. Society finds it convenient to pretend homelessness, and the attendant issues, aren't their problem. Here you've the problem staring you in the face. Compassion, empathy, and an appreciation of the challenges homeless people face daily serve all better then judgementalism.
Life is short, Break the rules, Forgive quickly,
Kiss slowly, Love truly, Laugh uncontrollably, And never regret anything that made you smile.

Offline phillypinko

  • Member
  • Posts: 112
Quite frankly, I stayed away from this mess, but I must comment here.

If YOU had puss running out YOUR ears and didn't MAKE your doctor treat it -- I'd say that your problem goes quite beyond a bad doctor.  You are a partner with your health care providers and seems to me that you aren't pulling your weight and suddenly throwing up the victim card.  Though your posts do a "victim" quality to them.
If you had a number of "signs" that you weren't getting good care and continue to go there (you obviously have options, as you are finally SAYING, you are moving on) well that is more on you.

M
My doctor convinced me it was a hygiene issue by telling me to clean them with debrox. The doctor insisted it wasn't an infection. When I showed another doctor what was coming out of my ears the second doctor said it was puss and to find a new doctor.

Offline leatherman

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,049
  • Google and HIV meds are Your Friends
I'm sure it will, and that's probably why the city council is scheduling hearings, etc to design a long-term plan to deal with this situation
I thought I would follow up with some information about Columbia SC. The City Council passed a resolution,  to start to work on the situation downtown.
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline SANJUANDUDE

  • Member
  • Posts: 125
I never complain about the other people that may also be going to a clinic, but instead the level of care.  For example, about a month ago my ID doctor referred me to a dermatologist for "questionable" spots/moles.  I asked them to fax the request to the ASO that I was affiliated with, they did so.  My response was, "we don't pay for that, no funds."  I replied, and very nicely, "but this is a referral from my ID doctor."  It didn't matter.  Fortunately, I had the funds to pay for the visit.  In NY state and New Mexico, the state issues an insurance card, yes actual real insurance which cover 80%+ of the visit and then the ASO picks up the remainder.  In NM, it was a Blue Cross/Blue Shield of New Mexico card, in NY it was another insurance company that I was able to utilize even here in Florida for a while.  Moral:  don't leave what you know you have, you never know what you might get.

I got Florida.
10/2011-CD-4-598-Undetectable
01/2012-CD-4-758-Undetectable
04/2012-CD$-780-70 Viral Load
08-2012-CD4-846--20 viral load
02/2013-CD$ 865----20 Undetectable Viral Load
08/2013- CD4-898----<20 undetectable viral load

Offline oksikoko

  • Member
  • Posts: 680
  • Writing the congressman again
    • the treatment cascade
Moral:  don't leave what you know you have, you never know what you might get.

Sometimes this is reason to leave. ;)
Code: [Select]
2013-10-03:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1105
2013-05-23:                ☣ VL (=) undetectable ☣ CD4 (-) 945
2013-02-25:                ☣ VL (-) undetectable ☣ CD4 (+) 1123
2012-12-16: Enter Stribild
2012-11-20: HIV+           ☣ VL (→) 132,683      ☣ CD4 (→) 920
2012-04-01: HIV-
Dates in this signature file conform to ISO 8601. ;-)

 


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