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Author Topic: Specific healthcare situations  (Read 7241 times)

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Offline Loveishope1970

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Specific healthcare situations
« on: August 02, 2013, 12:19:15 AM »
I was starting an IV and I took off my gloves to put the dressing on and I noticed a small amount of blood on my finger where I had a torn cuticle. I do not know the status of the patient. Can you get HIV from blood on a cut, tear in skin? Do you have to be bleeding? This has caused much anxiety. I tested negative at 2 weeks and 4 weeks. I'm breastfeeding and I don't want to hurt my baby or my husband.

Online Jeff G

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Re: Cuts and HIV Risk
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2013, 12:33:49 AM »
Hi Love , you didn't have a risk in the situation you described . HIV is instantly rendered unable to infect when exposed to oxygen . The other obstacle is the type of cells on your already healing finger or not susceptible to acquiring an HIV infection , that's why HIV isn't transmitted in the manner you are concerned with .

The only routes for HIV transmission are as follows ....
Sharing IV drug needles immediately after use.
Unprotected anal and vaginal sex.
Mother to child during or shortly after birth
Very specific healthcare situations , and that doesn't mean blood on a cuticle I might add .

No one in the 30 + years of the Aids epidemic has ever been infected in the manner that you are concerned with so you can relax and put this incident behind you .

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Cuts and HIV Risk
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2013, 12:43:46 AM »
Thank you for answering. I was just scared I was hurting my baby. She won't take a bottle so I didn't know what to do. And of course, I didn't want to have to stop breastfeeding her. My doctor didn't seem to be cconcerned and I didn't even meet requirements for PEP. Of course, I googled and scared myself to death because 13 days later I had swollen lymph nodes under my jaw and a canker sore, but i think it's from being run down, working nights, not eating enough calories, being dehydrated, and only sleeping 3-4 hours a day. Breastfeeding takes a toll I think if one is not taking care of themselves and that's hard to do when are consumed with anxiety and fear. Thanks for listening.

Online Jeff G

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Re: Cuts and HIV Risk
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2013, 12:54:21 AM »
That's what we are here for . If we thought there was even the slightest risk we would tell you so that you could follow through with testing in order to protect the health of you and your baby .

It really is safe to put this behind you ... and get some rest  ;) .

Offline Loveishope1970

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Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2013, 01:34:41 AM »
My situation has caused so much anxiety and it continues. I guess because there is so much conflicting information. I started an IV and somehow in the process I got blood on my finger. I sometimes pick at skin around my nails and I had a torn cuticle. I had no bleeding. What kind of cut poses a risk? Does it have to be bleeding? Does it have to be a significant amount of blood? At 13 days I had swollen lymph nodes under my jaw and canker sore that lasted 5 days. I had no fever. I'm so worried about hurting my husband and my baby that I'm breastfeeding. My tests at 2 weeks and 4 weeks were negative. I know I've already posted, so im sorry to bother anyone.

Offline Ann

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2013, 06:24:10 AM »
LiH,

I've merged your new thread into your original thread - where you should post all your additional thoughts or questions. It helps us to help you when you keep everything in one thread. It doesn't matter how long it has been since you last posted in your thread or if the subject matter is different.

If you need help finding your thread when you come here, click on the "Show own posts" link under your name in the left-hand column of any forum page.

Please also read through the Welcome Thread so you can familiarize yourself with our Forum Posting Guidelines. Thank you for your cooperation.




I really think you're over-thinking this. Hiv infection due to occupational needle-stick injury is exceedingly rare and when it has happened, it's been when the health worker had just finished drawing blood from a patient and stuck themselves with the blood-filled needle. I honestly can't see this happening while inserting an IV. 

You had a cut on your cuticle. It bled. Unless you're in the habit of sticking your bleeding cuticles into your patient's fresh wounds, then you don't need to worry about hiv. You do need to stop picking at your cuticles - if a nurse came at me with torn, bleeding cuticles, I'd be afraid of catching a blood borne pathogen from him or her.

I don't get why you took your gloves off to put on a dressing. Aren't you supposed to wear gloves for that sort of thing as a universal precaution to protect both yourself AND your patient?

I do understand that you're worried about your baby, but please, you needn't be. I suggest you have another talk with the person who is in charge of doling out PEP to hospital staff, just to put your mind at ease.

Maybe you should also review proper infection control and universal precautions. Putting a dressing on a patient bare-handed isn't proper infection control - that's how staph infections are spread.

If nothing else puts your mind at ease, test again at six weeks. The vast majority of people who have actually been infected will seroconvert and test positive by this time, with the average time to seroconversion being only 22 days. You very likely would have tested positive, or indeterminate at the very least, when you tested at four weeks.

I seriously do think you're blowing this all out of proportion, so please, relax, get some rest, and take care of yourself. All this worrying isn't doing you or your baby any favours.

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2013, 07:04:31 AM »
I didn't have a bleeding cuticle. I had no bleeding wounds. I had a torn cuticle. I took off the gloves to put the dressing over the IV site. I took the gloves off because they always stick to the adhesive dressings. I have seen many nurses in a code start an IV without gloves on. I won't take my gloves off again. In fact, I most likely will not start an IV again until I am finished breastfeeding my baby. I don't even know how the blood got on my finger. I just wanted to know if one could get HIV from blood on a torn cuticle or through cuts on hands. I did not see any open cuts. My employee health nurse said that I did not meet criteria for PEP. I didn't have a needle stick. I just don't want to hurt my baby or my husband.

Offline Ann

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2013, 07:33:30 AM »
LiH,

Thank you for the clarification.

Here's the thing - hiv isn't as easily transmitted as you seem to believe. It can only infect a very few, very specific types of cells, cells that are not found in small, superficial wounds or wounds that aren't fresh and bleeding.

Also, hiv is very fragile. It is only transmitted INSIDE the human body, as in unprotected anal or vaginal intercourse where the virus never leaves the confines of the two bodies. (Remember how I said "unless you're in the habit of sticking your bleeding cuticles into your patient's fresh wounds..."?)

Once outside the body, small changes in temperature, and pH and moisture levels all quickly damage the virus and render it unable to infect.

Take the sexual act of fingering, for example. Not one person has ever been infected through fingering, despite the presence of cuts, torn cuticles or whatever. It's simply not a risk, even though the finger is actually inside someone's body. The cells that hiv can infect simply aren't present in little cuts on fingers such as the one you're talking about.

Your employee health nurse was absolutely correct in her risk assessment of your case. You had no need for PEP because you didn't have a risk for hiv infection.

Please put this to rest. As I said earlier, all this worrying about a no risk situation isn't doing you or your baby any favours. She's only going to be little for a short time - relax and enjoy this time and closeness while it lasts. Before you know it she's going to be a stroppy teenager making you want to tear your hair out. ;)

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2013, 07:39:29 AM »
Thank you Ann. I appreciate your knowledge. If I didn't have my baby, I most likely wouldn't have thought twice about it. I do believe that my canker sore is due to extreme stress from worrying. I will try to not worry.

Offline Ann

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2013, 07:43:49 AM »
LiH,

Rest assured, canker sores have nothing to do with hiv. Stress can really do a number on your body (and mind!), so please, chill out. You're not harming your baby or husband.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2013, 08:04:56 AM »
You guys really do provide a wonderful service. I have to admit, I am ashamed that I do not have knowledge of HIV transmission, even though I'm in healthcare. I will try to educate myself more. But I do appreciate you lending an ear. I really do. God bless you and have a good day.

Love,
Stephanie

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #11 on: August 06, 2013, 02:59:17 AM »
I just have another question about PEP, HIV tests. I had another incident where I was stuck by a needle starting an IV. It pricked my finger through my glove. It wasn't a deep stick, I don't know if that matters. My patient was tested for HIV and was negative. I did stop breastfeeding and resumed when I got the results of the patient. My patient was hepatitis c positive. I was told that if I had received PEP that it would be discontinued if the patient was negative. My pediatrician said I could resume breastfeeding once I got the results back on the patient.  I'm worried about the accuracy of the patient's test because of the window period.

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #12 on: August 06, 2013, 03:10:53 AM »
I just have another question about PEP, HIV tests. I had another incident where I was stuck by a needle starting an IV. It pricked my finger through my glove. It wasn't a deep stick, I don't know if that matters. My patient was tested for HIV and was negative. I did stop breastfeeding and resumed when I got the results of the patient. My patient was hepatitis c positive. I was told that if I had received PEP that it would be discontinued if the patient was negative. My pediatrician said I could resume breastfeeding once I got the results back on the patient.  I'm worried about the accuracy of the patient's test because of the window period.

Have you reported this incident to your supervisor? I am baffle as to why you are coming here for advice when as a healthcare professional you should clearly be discussing these incidents with your supervisor.

I am also of the opinion that, until you are finished breastfeeding, you might reconsider working with patients, especially involving invasive procedures such as starting IVs and the like, This stress cannot  be good for you. It might even be a factor in the accidents you have described.

Trust me, when I am putting myself into a nurse's hands, I do not want to think that s/he is preoccupied with his/her own health over mine.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #13 on: August 06, 2013, 03:18:05 AM »
Yes, I followed through with employee health nurse. The patient was tested for HIV and was negative. I then contacted my pediatrician and was told I could breastfeed if patient was negative. But no one said anything to me about the window period. I read that PEP is discontinued if patient is negative. I also read that the person is considered uninfected if negative. I'm just confused as to why my pediatrician said it would be ok to breastfeed when we don't know if the patient was in the window period. I guess I was just wanting to get some information about accurate testing and window periods.

Offline Ann

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2013, 04:51:53 AM »
LiH,

You're worried about a virus your patient tested negative for and glossing over a virus your patient tested positive for? I don't get it.

Forget about hiv. I already discussed hiv and starting IVs. Hiv is a very fragile, very difficult to transmit virus. You're highly unlikely to end up with hiv over a needle stick while inserting an IV. Sticking yourself with a syringe full of blood after just having drawn it from a patient is a concern, not inserting IVs.

Hep C, on the other hand, is MUCH more easily transmitted than hiv (when it comes to needle stick accidents) and your patient tested positive for hep C. You need to be tested for hep C. Unfortunately there is no prophylactic treatment for possible hep C infection, nor is there a vaccine.

The good news is that it is safe to breastfeed if you've been exposed to (or have) hep C. Hep C is rarely transmitted outside blood-to-blood situations.


I am also of the opinion that, until you are finished breastfeeding, you might reconsider working with patients, especially involving invasive procedures such as starting IVs and the like, This stress cannot  be good for you. It might even be a factor in the accidents you have described.

Trust me, when I am putting myself into a nurse's hands, I do not want to think that s/he is preoccupied with his/her own health over mine.


I cannot agree with Jonathan more. It sounds like you need to be transferred to a job where you're not using needles, syringes or IVs, at least until after you've stopped breastfeeding and aren't so nervous. I mean jeeze, I'd hate to be your patient right now.

You'll need hep C testing - it shares a three month testing window with hiv for a conclusive result.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #15 on: August 06, 2013, 06:29:18 AM »
There isn't any place I can be transferred to, I work in a small rural hospital. I am a good nurse. This has never happened to me before. I just was so fearful of hurting my baby. I never want to hurt anyone. And yes I am worried about hepatitis c too. But I was more concerned with causing harm to my baby. I am in a position to errrr I can have others start IV's, I charge at night. But I always jump in to help. That's my nature. But I agree with you as well. Because I am under a huge amount of stress. When I went back to work, I was so worried about my baby because she refused to eat from a bottle when I was gone. That caused a lot of stress. It's hard to work with a baby. My mind is always on her... Is she sleeping on her back, is she breathing, is she scared I'm not there?? I just need to sit back and do the paperwork and let my staff do the invasive procedures for the time being. But I am a good nurse. I love helping people. And my baby was an unplanned blessing at the age of 43. I just want to protect her. I love her more than anything.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #16 on: August 06, 2013, 08:33:33 AM »
You need to take good care of yourself. That way you will be best able to take good care of your baby. As exciting and rewarding as becoming a mother can be, it also exacts a great toll physically and emotionally.

Perhaps there is a professional in the hospital where you work with whom you can discuss the stress you're coping with. We can't address that in this setting. All we can assure you is that you have not had a risk for HIV. Period.
Andy Velez

Online Jeff G

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #17 on: August 06, 2013, 08:44:41 AM »
Andy has made an excellent point here . The stress of the situation is what you are suffering from , not HIV . Treat the stress and get some relief from your anxiety and you can get back to enjoying being a new mom without constant worry . I urge you to take Andy's advice to heart .     

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #18 on: August 06, 2013, 02:11:39 PM »
How is transmission of HIV not a risk with a needle stick injury? I know the patient tested negative and that is why I wasn't offered PEP. I just don't understand why it wasn't offered because the patient could be in the window period.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #19 on: August 06, 2013, 02:18:00 PM »
You need to discuss your concerns with your employer. We can't address how they operate.

And maybe more importantly for your own good you need to give some thought to letting go of this incident and just getting on with your life. Again, we can't help you with that or anything further on this issue at this point.i
Andy Velez

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #20 on: August 15, 2013, 07:11:03 PM »
Dear Ann,

I know you said that sticking yourself while inserting an IV is not
a risk for HIV, but I was wondering if you could explain why. I thought it was a risk because it was in someone's vein and the needle does have a hollow bore. It wasn't a deep stick, just a prick through my glove. When I was unscrewing it from the hub of the catheter, it pricked my finger because the needle did not retract all the way.

Thank you for your help.

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #21 on: August 15, 2013, 07:20:26 PM »
Dear Ann,

I know you said that sticking yourself while inserting an IV is not
a risk for HIV, but I was wondering if you could explain why. I thought it was a risk because it was in someone's vein and the needle does have a hollow bore. It wasn't a deep stick, just a prick through my glove. When I was unscrewing it from the hub of the catheter, it pricked my finger because the needle did not retract all the way.

Thank you for your help.

The reason needle-stick injuries in a healthcare setting rarely result in transmission, whereas IV drug users who share needles commonly result in transmission has as much to do with the mechanism of the needle as the hollow bore.

You were not injecting yourself with blood. Your needlestick injury did not accomplish the one thing necessary for HIV infection to occur- material was NOT held in the hollow bore and then pumped directly into your bloodstream.

When IV drug users inject a shared needle, they often do not push saline through the needle beforehand, injecting the material (blood) from the last user into their veins.

I ask again, have you grilled your supervisor about this incident? Asked further questions? Many places use the newly approved rapid test that doubles as an antigen test, and can easily detect HIV infection in the window period. At any time were you specifically denied PEP though you demanded it? That sounds like a violation of your rights as an employee.

While I firmly expect you to come through this situation OK insofar as HIV in concerned, I reiterate my concern about your working environment, including your choice to continue putting yourself at perceived risk and your supervisor's unwillingness to take you off of a duty that clearly puts your mental health (and the physical/mental health of your patients) at risk.

« Last Edit: August 15, 2013, 07:22:47 PM by jkinatl2 »
"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

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Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #22 on: August 15, 2013, 07:29:24 PM »
It was an antibody test. The labs were sent off to labcorp and the results took a week to get back. I work at a small rural hospital. I'm doing paperwork now, reviewing charts. I have spoken to a physician at work and was told I could continue breastfeeding and the physician at the PEPline said the same. Also my pediatrician agreed it was safe to breastfeed because the patient tested negative. Your explanation of the transmission risk makes sense and clarifies things for me. I didn't inject anything. I just pricked my finger.

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #23 on: August 15, 2013, 07:31:06 PM »
We don't even have PEP. We have to order it.

Offline anniebc

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #24 on: August 15, 2013, 07:34:24 PM »
Love

As a retired nurse I can tell you that your needle stick was a no risk situation for a few reasons..1) if you were inserting a needle it's a no risk  2) if you were taking out an IV it's a no risk because clear fluids are run through an IV line and should clear the hollow bore of all blood fluids, and 3) a superficial needle stick injury is a no risk one.

The needle has to be imbedded under the skin to be considered a risk, this did not happen so there was no risk.

As a healthcare worker you really need to educate yourself on HIV, I travel all over NZ and overseas doing talks to Doctors and Nurses for this very reason, they seem to know very little about HIV transmission, so please read up on this for your sake and that of your patients.

Jan
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Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #25 on: August 15, 2013, 07:34:37 PM »
We don't even have PEP. We have to order it.

I hope you are able to change that situation. There ought to be at least one or two rounds on hand, I think. Also, the blood/labcorp tests must cost more than the easily available rapid oral tests, mustn't they?

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

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Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #26 on: August 15, 2013, 08:11:30 PM »
Jan, so since I pricked my finger and the needle didn't get embedded in my finger, there's not a risk? When I retracted the needle from the catheter, it did not retract all the way and when I unscrewed it from the catheter, it then pricked my finger through my glove. I will try to better educate myself.

I would think the antibody tests were more expensive because you have to send them out. The PEP situation is not a good one. My friend was splashed in the eye during a trauma in the ER and when he texted our supervisor about PEP, no one responded. We were told it has to be ordered. When I called the PEPline, they told me I didn't meet requirements.

Offline anniebc

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #27 on: August 15, 2013, 09:06:50 PM »
Hi Love

Trust me you didn't have any risks, I know how stressing it is having a needle stick injury, but you are going to be fine.

I know how difficult it is getting PEP to Rural hospital, I also live in a rural area so I can relate, but luckily you don't need it.

Maybe you need to talk to someone about not being able to reach anyone is a time of stress, tell them they need to look after their Healthcare workers, because without them there is no Healthcare, it's that simple.

But the good news is you are Ok, so educate yourself and you will be just fine.

Jan
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Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #28 on: August 15, 2013, 09:48:31 PM »
Thank you for taking the time to explain things. If it was just me, I probaly wouldn't be so worried, but I was worried about hurting my baby breastfeeding her. But I was told it was ok. Just scared me. I don't want to hurt anyone. I appreciate your time.

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #29 on: August 17, 2013, 03:34:26 AM »
I know you aren't suppose to diagnose HIV based on symptoms, but it is still scary to get symptoms you never experienced before. 4 weeks after the needle stick, I had a swollen lymph gland under my chin and a canker sore. It lasted a week. With ARS, do you have more than one symptom? If it was just me, I don't think I'd be so scared, but I'm so scared I've hurt my baby and my husband. I just don't know what to do. At first I felt confident about the patient's HIV negative result, but now I'm just not so sure. How can I rely on his result? What's the point in testing a
patient if the test isn't reliable? It seems the smart thing to do would be to give the exposed patient PEP anyways just to be cautious. Because now I'm afraid that I have hurt my baby and my husband.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #30 on: August 17, 2013, 05:52:32 AM »
You never had an exposure and you were advised of it by a doctor in another forum.

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #31 on: August 17, 2013, 06:20:30 AM »
But I was pricked/stuck by a 20 gauge IV catheter after I inserted it, it pricked my finger. That is an exposure. Yes, he tested negative for HIV, but he could have been recently infected. There is no way to know for sure. I'm just suppose to believe his negative result? If it was just me, I would not be freaking out, but I have 2 other people, my husband, and an innocent baby. I had a risk. I was stuck. And I had symptoms I've never had before.

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #32 on: August 17, 2013, 08:31:49 AM »
I don't understand how it's not an exposure.

Offline anniebc

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2013, 08:39:56 AM »
Hi Love

Were you stuck with the tip of the needle?

Jan
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Offline Ann

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #34 on: August 17, 2013, 08:51:08 AM »
LiH,

An IV pushes fluids INTO the body, it does not take blood out. There would not be any blood inside the needle. Any blood present would be on the OUTSIDE of the needle and hiv cannot remain viable outside the body.

You've been told by your own employers that you haven't had a risk. You've been told by us that you haven't had a risk. Yet you seem to want to believe that you have. Well, there's not much more we can do for you here.

Your symptoms do not remotely resemble ARS. Canker sores can be caused by stress, and canker sores can cause swollen glands under your chin. Surely as a nurse you should realise this.

If you read the Welcome Thread before posting like you're supposed to, you will have read the following posting guideline:

Quote

Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result or no-risk situation, will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.


Please consider yourself warned!

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #35 on: August 17, 2013, 09:44:43 AM »
I'm only answering your question. I was stuck/pricked with the tip of the needle. The 20 gauge IV has a hollow bore. I thought blood is in the hollow bore. I wasn't pushing any fluids in. I was inserting the needle to start an IV. Once the catheter was in and I saw a flashback, I retracted the needle, but it did not retract all the way and it pricked my finger when I disconnected it from the catheter. I do not want to believe I'm infected. I want to understand how it's not a risk and I want to keep my husband and baby safe.

Online Jeff G

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« Reply #36 on: August 17, 2013, 09:56:56 AM »
Keeping in mind Anns warning ... We cant help you with your anxiety over your fear of being infected with HIV other than giving you the facts on the science of transmission routes .

I tried to read back a bit but as far as I can to see what the date was when you stuck your self . The bottom line is if you have tested 6 weeks post event and again at 3 months for peace of mind then you are worrying for nothing . You need to talk to a therapist and get some counseling , we can do no more than this .

You didn't have a risk but if you need to test for peace of mind , do so . I would suggest getting some therapy if you are going to continue in your profession .     

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #37 on: August 17, 2013, 10:48:32 AM »
I wasn't trying to argue or post excessively and I will disable my account today. I was just trying to really understand how getting pricked/stuck by a needle wasn't a risk. And I guess there is really no reason for anyone to ever take PEP who works in healthcare because you can stick yourself and not worry because it's not a risk at all. I'm kind of confused as to why we have universal precautions.  I have not tested since I was stuck. I had baseline testing at the same time the patient was tested. The only thing I can go on is the patient tested negative, but that means absolutely nothing because they could have been in a window period. And according to the PEP guidelines, if the patient is suspected to be in ARS or was in a risky activity 1-2 months before they were tested, then I should have received PEP. But no physician assessed that. No physician knew I was stuck. The only person who knew was my manager and the employee health nurse. See, I trusted they knew what they were doing. I had to find information about the PEPline on my own. No one from my job sat down to talk to me about anything. And that has lead to confusion which has lead to anxiety. I was coming here to seek information on how a needle stick was or was not a risk. But it seems when someone can't answer your questions, they accuse you of posting excessively. I was just trying to get information to be better informed so I could protect my baby. According to PEP guidelines, I do not need further testing because source patient tested negative. But I'm having testing anyways and I pray that I have not been mis informed about breastfeeding because there is an innocent baby in all of this. I was just trying to do the right thing for her and I wanted to get all the information I could. I do know this. Being a nurse is a huge mistake because I don't make enough money to risk my life or my family's life.

Offline anniebc

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #38 on: August 17, 2013, 06:35:45 PM »
I'm only answering your question. I was stuck/pricked with the tip of the needle. The 20 gauge IV has a hollow bore. I thought blood is in the hollow bore. I wasn't pushing any fluids in. I was inserting the needle to start an IV. Once the catheter was in and I saw a flashback.

As you have already been told you did not have a risk and you are not HIV positive. If you were only stuck the tip of the needle then all you have to worry about is a sore finger for a day, the bevel of the needle has to penetrate the skin fairly deep into order for any blood to enter the blood system, this did not happen.

Quote
I was just trying to really understand how getting pricked/stuck by a needle wasn't a risk. And I guess there is really no reason for anyone to ever take PEP who works in healthcare because you can stick yourself and not worry because it's not a risk at all. I'm kind of confused as to why we have universal precautions

First of all Love it has been explained to you why your needled stick wasn't a risk, Secondly all "Deep" need stick injuries are taken seriously, and they are a risk, and we do worry about it, PEP is given when it's a know risk, (again yours was not a risk for HIV)and last but not least Universal Precautions are carried out as a huge part of caring for patients properly, they are not just to prevent needle stick injuries, because wearing gloves doesn't prevent this, but they serve as a barrier, keeping patient's and healthcare worker's safe from infection, but of course you know all this.

As you have been warned and told now, several times, that you do NOT have HIV it's best you put this to rest and get on with your life.

Jan
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Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #39 on: August 17, 2013, 10:17:18 PM »
Thank you for answering my questions. I have a better understanding now. My finger didn't even hurt at all after getting pricked/stuck. I'm trying to figure out how to cancel my account to this forum. Appreciate all the advice.

Online Jeff G

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #40 on: August 17, 2013, 10:28:19 PM »
Thank you for answering my questions. I have a better understanding now. My finger didn't even hurt at all after getting pricked/stuck. I'm trying to figure out how to cancel my account to this forum. Appreciate all the advice.

You cant cancel your account , all you have to do is simply stop participating if you want . I'm wishing you the best of luck and hope you get the help you need .

Offline Ann

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #41 on: August 18, 2013, 08:02:17 AM »
LiH,

I hope that in all your (unnecessary) worrying about hiv, you didn't forget your patient DID test positive for hep C. Hep C is MUCH more easily transmitted than hiv. Please don't forget to get tested for hep C.

A three month negative will be conclusive. I'd recommend that you first test at six weeks, and and if negative, test again at three months to confirm that result. Some people will clear the virus on their own, so you will need further, ongoing testing should you test hcv antibody positive.

Don't worry about hep C as regards breastfeeding your daughter; it's not a risk. I was (unknowingly) hep C positive when I breastfed my own daughter and she's hep C negative. Good luck, and know there are treatments available for hep C should you test positive.

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #42 on: August 21, 2013, 09:28:27 PM »
Ann,

I had my 6 weeks tests, negative for HIV and negative for Hep C. Thank you for listening to me about the HIV. I was just so scared for my baby

Offline anniebc

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #43 on: August 22, 2013, 04:35:25 PM »
Hi Love

That is a really good result, no more worrying OK?..all you have to do now is focus on your career and your family, have a good life.

Jan
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Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #44 on: August 26, 2013, 08:08:47 AM »
I know I am probaly driving you crazy with all my questions and fears. I was always told that fear develops from lack of knowledge and clearly, I have a lack of knowledge about HIV. So I tested HIV negative 44 days after my needle stick from an HIV negative patient. I was relieved at first, but then my husband developed a sore throat and sore neck. The sore throat lasted 3 days, got better the next day after a rocephin injection. He had a fever for just one day. Of course, I've convinced myself that it was ARS. You are probaly thinking, poor guy, he is married to a certified nut. And you are right, this whole thing has made me a ball of nerves. Not proud of myself at all. Should I test again at 12 weeks. The PEPline said no further testing is needed because the patient was negative. The thought of me hurting my husband or baby is just killing me. How reliable is my test at 44 days?

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #45 on: August 26, 2013, 09:27:00 AM »
Can someone tell me how reliable a 6 week HIV test is? It was an antibody test that was done by labcorp. Should I be worried about my husband's sore throat, fever, and sore neck as ARS symptoms? I am scared I made him
sick.

Offline Ann

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #46 on: August 26, 2013, 09:33:16 AM »
LiH,

The vast majority of people who have actually been infected will seroconvert and test positive by six weeks, with the average time to seroconversion being only 22 days.

A six week negative must be confirmed at the three month point, but is highly unlikely to change. Seeing as how you really didn't have a risk, it's high time you let this go.

Test again if you want/need to, but don't expect your results to change.

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #47 on: August 26, 2013, 09:41:01 AM »
And I have really tried to let it go, I really have. But I'm just so overwhelmed with fear that I'm hurting other people. I would never want to hurt someone. Are my husband's symptoms suggestive of ARS?

Offline Ann

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« Reply #48 on: August 26, 2013, 10:02:23 AM »
Are my husband's symptoms suggestive of ARS?

NO. They are in NO WAY hiv-specific or even hiv-suggestive.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #49 on: August 26, 2013, 10:12:59 AM »
Thank you Ann:) I appreciate you being so patient, I really do. I'm going to try and let it go. I'm going to quit reading about ARS symptoms. I just have to put this behind me. I have trouble letting go. I'm going to keep praying about it. But I wanted to tell you thank you.

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #50 on: August 26, 2013, 10:33:48 AM »
Really, I want to tell everyone thank you. You really have no idea how much comfort you give to those who are scared.  That's a very giving thing to do. Not many can do that. Where would we all go for information if we didn't have this forum? You do a great service and I thank you.

Offline anniebc

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #51 on: August 26, 2013, 04:38:43 PM »
Hi Love

I'm glad the guys helped you, they really do know their stuff.

Remember educate, learn and have a good life.

Jan
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Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #52 on: September 04, 2013, 11:36:44 AM »
I thought I would feel better after I received my negative HIV test at 6 weeks(44 days), but I don't. I don't know if it's anxiety or what. I was ok until my husband had a sore throat for 3 days, fever for one day, and a stiff neck. Then my baby developed a rash on her bottom and back and on her arms which were tiny bumps. I'm so scared I've hurt her and my husband. I don't know what to do. I can barely function, can't eat or sleep.

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #53 on: September 04, 2013, 11:40:00 AM »
Would you feel that your HIV negative test at 6 weeks is accurate since the patient was HIV negative?

Online Jeff G

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #54 on: September 04, 2013, 01:32:57 PM »
Would you feel that your HIV negative test at 6 weeks is accurate since the patient was HIV negative?

You cant get HIV from an HIV negative person , cant believe you asked that .

You really need to talk to your healthcare providers and insist they can hook you up with someone to help you with your anxiety about HIV .  We do care that you are scared but we have done our part in giving you a proper risk assessment and this isn't the proper forum to offer the support you seem to need .

   

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #55 on: September 04, 2013, 02:20:45 PM »
I know you can't get HIV from a an HIV negative person. I'm
worried the patient could have been in the window period and that his test may not have shown antibodies yet. I just keep thinking of the what if's.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #56 on: September 04, 2013, 02:22:55 PM »
Step away from the computer and seek professional mental help. You are beyond the scope of help any Internet Forum can provide.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #57 on: September 04, 2013, 06:54:53 PM »
Do yourself and your family a favor and get yourself professional help. We cannot provide what you need in this setting. I'm just going to repeat what has been said to you over and over. You did not have a risk. You're just making drama.

Get some help to get yourself sorted out. HIV is not the problem. 
Andy Velez

Offline Loveishope1970

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« Reply #58 on: September 05, 2013, 04:24:54 AM »
I'm not making drama, believe me. I am a quiet person who leads a pretty ordinary life, wPeking and being a mom. I really am scared. And I am very confused about HIV. I was told it was a risk by employee health that I pricked my finger. At first I felt ok knowing the patient was HIV negative, but then I started worrying about the window period and wondering if he was in it. Then I had my test at 44 days and it was negative and I felt relieved, but then my husband had a sore throat for 3 days, fever for one day, and a stiff neck, the same week I got my negative results. Now, my baby had a rash for 3 days, red bumps on her bottom and a few scattered on her back and arms. And I have had irregular menstrual cycle this month, it won't end basically. All of these things are symptoms if HIV that I have read. I am so scared I have hurt my baby and my husband. And I'm so angry with myself that I stuck myself. How could I have been so careless? And why didn't I just stop breastfeeding? I was told I could if the patient was negative, but I don't think my pediatrician considered that the patient could have been in the window period. And me not having much knowledge of HIV, I thought I was ok because the patient tested negative. See I could I take it if I was sick, but the thought of hurting my baby and my husband is killing me. I come here to talk, not cause drama. My mom is gone, passed away in a car accident 6 years ago. I'm alone right now, sitting here typing this and crying, because I am truly scared. And I don't know what to do.

Online Jeff G

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« Reply #59 on: September 05, 2013, 08:33:06 AM »
We offer risk assessments for HIV , we cant help you with your anxiety that you have repeatedly been told to seek help for OUTSIDE of this forum . You are stuck in a loop of worry and are now back to square one . Allowing you to continue to post here is doing you more harm than good and may be preventing you from getting the help that you need .

I'm giving you that time out you were warned about and when its over and if you decide to come back again and post more of the same you will get another . If you come back here , come back with an update that you have received some mental health counseling .   
« Last Edit: September 05, 2013, 08:37:52 AM by Jeff G »

Offline Loveishope1970

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Re: Specific healthcare situations
« Reply #60 on: October 11, 2013, 08:16:31 PM »
My 12 week test (86 days) was HIV negative and hepatitis c negative. I just have a few questions about testing. I have read 12 weeks is conclusive and then I read that 90 days is conclusive. Is a test at 86 days conclusive? I also was sick with an upper respiratory infection in august and in September so I had a medrol dose pack beginning of august that I didn't finish so I only took it for 3 days and I had a steroid shot the week before my 12 week test. Do corticosteroid injections and prednisone, medrol packs alter an HIV test? Clarification on these questions will be helpful. And yes, I am seeing a counselor about anxiety. I guess it wouldn't be so bad if there wasn't so much confusion around testing, etc. My employee health nurse said I have to test for a year and I don't know why. Lastly, when is a hepatitis c test conclusive? Thank you.

Online Jeff G

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« Reply #61 on: October 11, 2013, 08:32:27 PM »
Your test is conclusive and you do not need to test again . Three months is the guideline for a conclusive result . Testing four days early isn't going to make a difference any way because you are ignoring the fact that YOU DID NOT HAVE A RISK . None of the things you mentioned have any bearing on the accuracy of your HIV test and you have conclusively tested negative .; 

You have been advised on the testing window period already and can now move on with your life . YOU DO NOT HAVE HIV .

I bet its a relief for you now that this is over .

Offline Loveishope1970

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« Reply #62 on: October 11, 2013, 09:33:56 PM »
I guess I feel a little bit better. Just a little annoyed at the whole process at work and how it was handled which caused a lot of anxiety. Employee health should be a resource and it was not. I work in a very small rural hospital. Anyways, hopefully all that will change. There needs to be more education in my facility as far as HIV risks and testing. That's what caused confusion because the enployee health nurse said I was at risk. Just caused a lot of confusion.

Offline Loveishope1970

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« Reply #63 on: October 15, 2013, 08:15:18 PM »
I think the needle stick incident has made me very anxious as a nurse. I was helping to turn a very heavy patient so the nurse could clean him after a bowel movement. I had to help turn the patient because the nurse taking care of patient is pregnant and for some reason thinks she doesn't have to do any lifting. Anyways the patient had a urinary catheter and had blood in his foley catheter bag. I didn't touch the catheter or the bag. But I felt like I got something in my eye. I felt nothing on my face at all. My eye didn't even water, but now I'm scared that urine may have been leaking around his catheter and when we turned him, a drop Gould have splashed me in my eye. But if I got splashed in the eye, I would think I would have felt it on my face too. Of course I've convinced myself that I've been exposed to HIV. Is urine infectious if there is blood in it? And I am working with a counselor.

Online Jeff G

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« Reply #64 on: October 15, 2013, 08:30:44 PM »
I think the needle stick incident has made me very anxious as a nurse. I was helping to turn a very heavy patient so the nurse could clean him after a bowel movement. I had to help turn the patient because the nurse taking care of patient is pregnant and for some reason thinks she doesn't have to do any lifting. Anyways the patient had a urinary catheter and had blood in his foley catheter bag. I didn't touch the catheter or the bag. But I felt like I got something in my eye. I felt nothing on my face at all. My eye didn't even water, but now I'm scared that urine may have been leaking around his catheter and when we turned him, a drop Gould have splashed me in my eye. But if I got splashed in the eye, I would think I would have felt it on my face too. Of course I've convinced myself that I've been exposed to HIV. Is urine infectious if there is blood in it? And I am working with a counselor.

You have been told what the risk factors are for HIV . We cant help you with your HIV phobia and we are not a chat room or a place to hold your hand every time you become fearful . We have fulfilled our mission to give out accurate up-to-date science based assessments . Please do not come back asking questions we have already addressed because you have already had two timeouts and the next one is a complete permanent ban . 

Offline Loveishope1970

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« Reply #65 on: October 15, 2013, 08:48:32 PM »
I've only had one time out and I've never asked a question about blood in urine before and I've tried to look up info on it but some say yes that urine with blood is infectious and some say it's not so I was just trying to find the accurate answer. I didn't come to chat. I just asked a question. It seems if I was a person who was sleeping with everything that walked or crawled and had concerns, you would answer my questions.

Online Jeff G

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« Reply #66 on: October 15, 2013, 08:57:02 PM »
You're banned .

 


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