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Author Topic: Could I be infected if he's negative?  (Read 774 times)

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Offline nathanx85

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Could I be infected if he's negative?
« on: May 22, 2013, 02:18:23 PM »
   Hello everyone and thank you for taking the time to consider my question. I will try to be as thorough as possible in explaining my risk and hope that you can help me with your knowledge.
   10 months ago, I had my first and only sexual encounter ever. This encounter was with another male whom I met online. (Big Mistake I know). This encounter included making out and deep kissing, receiving and giving unprotected oral sex, bottoming for protected anal sex (I had him put the condom on before he entered me, though he kind of rubbed around there with his penis beforehand), and mutual masturbation.
   After I came to my senses and freaked out about what a huge mistake I made, I asked him if he had ever been tested. About 3 weeks after our sex, he got tested for HIV and was negative. Around this time, I noticed a canker sore on my left tonsil which lasted about a week or so. It wasn't painful until I prodded at it and made it so. Additionally, around this time, I noticed my right lymph node in my neck had swollen and become quite large. Also, I noticed some white buildup in the back of my throat and a little bit of a rash on my neck.
   Jump forward to 6 months after exposure, my only symptoms were some mouth issues still, like the white buildup, and swollen painful lymph nodes, (including the right one in my neck and the left one in my armpit, which I could not feel but it was painful). At this time, I asked the guy if he could test again, he obliged and tested negative again. (I've seen all his results on official doctor notes and lab forms and he's told me when he was going to test and waited for results each time, so I believe his results to be accurate and truthful)
   Now, at 10 months, I am still experiencing swollen painful lymph nodes in my right neck and left armpit glands. Could this be HIV? If he was negative 3 weeks and 6 months after our one time exposure, that would mean he was negative at the time of our sex, correct? Has there ever been a case of someone getting infected by another person who was negative? That is, could he have infected me without actually being infected himself? I was even thinking, what if he had sex with someone else before me and some residual virus was still present on his penis when we had sex. Then could he have infected me without himself being infected? Or, could the virus have been in his fluids without actually infecting him?
   He also said the last person he was with before me was 3 months before, and I am inclined to believe him as he's been so cooperative with testing and everything up until now and truthful.
   So to sum up my experience and question:
-One time sexual exposure was 10 months ago
-Exposure included making out, unprotected oral sex, protected receptive anal sex, and mutual masturbation
-My partner tested negative at 3 weeks and 6 months after our sex
-My symptoms included a small painful canker sore on my tonsil about 3 or 4 weeks after sex which lasted for about 5 days, painful swollen lymph nodes(one in my neck and one in an armpit), and some white buildup in the back of my throat

   So, could I have been infected from this? I'm very scared and ashamed of my actions. Thank you for any help and advice you can give. I greatly appreciate your help.

Online Jeff G

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Re: Could I be infected if he's negative?
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2013, 02:25:26 PM »
Hi Nathan , I can say with absolute certainty that you cannot and no one ever has been infected with HIV from a person who is truly negative . 

You didn't have a risk in the situation you described and as long as you use condoms correctly and consistently for anal or vaginal sex  you can safely have sex and avoid HIV .

ALTHOUGH YOU DO NOT NEED HIV TESTING AT THIS TIME, anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care checkup, including but not limited to HIV testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.

If you aren't already having regular, routine checkups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine HIV tests to return with negative results.

Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than HIV. Some of the other STIs can be present with no obvious symptoms, so the only way to know for sure is to test.

Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid HIV infection. It really is that simple!

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Could I be infected if he's negative?
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2013, 02:44:54 PM »
Okay, I read through your wall of text (paragraphs please!) and I was puzzled at the 'big mistakes you claim to have made.

You met a guy online. Well, so have I. We're celebrating two years together this summer. There's no shame and no mistake about meeting online, even if it's just for sex. Would it be less shameful to meet at a bar? A Rotary Club meeting? Online dating/hooking up had it's moments of shadiness, and I am sure there are still pockets of people who sneer at such a method of finding partnership.

I certainly can't tell you what to feel, but this might be more of a "shame for having hooked up at all" rather than shame about the methodology/technology used. And for the record, there's no reason to feel guilt for having hooked up, either. Sex is a primal human drive, as strong in the limbic system as the drive for social companionship and food. Please don't beat yourself up over something you should celebrate - your sexuality.

Now the science. Then a little more henpecking and we're done.

There was NO RISK for HIV in any of the things you and your companion did.

Kissing - no risk

Oral - no risk

protected sex - no risk.

Your "symptoms" are in no way specific to, or are even indicative of, HIV. You realize that you are making your lymph nodes swell by poking at them, right? Also makes them hurt, and you could even develop an infection. Stop doing that.

If you wear a condom for penetrative anal/vaginal sex, you will avoid HIV. People have a hard time accepting that, but it's truly that simple.

And of COURSE you can't get a virus that someone else keeps testing negative for. HIV doesn't erupt from the ether like some vengeful dark angel and loiter about int he penises of people without infecting them, in order to infect others. HIV is a pathogen. And a very fragile one at that. It cannot linger in/on the penis of someone. It must be transmitted inside the body. And no, an HIV negative person can't have 'lingering virus" in or on his person.

Now to the henpecking part again.

You mentioned asking this guy to get not one but two HIV tests. In my opinion, he has been more than gracious to accommodate your rude and insensitive requests. It is not his responsibility to "prove" that he doesn't have HIV. It's YOUR responsibility to protect yourself from HIV in the first place, which you did.

Moreover, nowhere in your post did you indicate that YOU have had an HIV test or STD panel. Every sexually active adult who is not in a securely monogamous relationship needs to get a full STD panel, including (of course) and HIV test at least twice a year. Nothing you did put you at any risk for HIV,but other pathogens like syphilis A) are much easier to contract from skin to skin contact, and B) share the three-month window with HIV.

If you are not ready to accept the full and complete responsibility for your own sexual health, then you are not ready to have sex. If you are chasing after sex partners demanding that they take HIV tests (plural) to assuage YUR fear and anxiety, then I have serous doubt in that regard.

You had no risk at all for HIV in the scenario you presented. Even if your partner had HIV and a high viral load, you would still not have been at risk.

I suggest that you stop badgering this guy and concentrate on building up your own confidence/knowledge regarding STDs and HIV. It is highly unusual for a protected sex act to cause such anxiety ten full months after the fact. Sex shouldn't work like that. Sex should be the opposite of that.

Please summon the courage to get a full STD panel, to give yourself a baseline of negative results across the board before you go forward with your sexual exploration. You owe it to yourself and your future partners to do so.

And please quit poking at your lymph nodes.
"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Online Jeff G

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Re: Could I be infected if he's negative?
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2013, 03:05:48 PM »
I have to agree with JK in his assessment and I would like to add that you are lucky your online hookup hasn't taken out a restraining order of protection against you .

If you haven't come to terms with your sexuality you need to do so before you drag others into your confusion .

I hope you take this as what its meant to be and that's constructive criticism . You have taken the first step in educating yourself about your responsibility's as a sexually active adult and that's to be applauded , take the advice and make something good from it .     

Offline nathanx85

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Re: Could I be infected if he's negative?
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2013, 06:59:17 PM »
Thank you very much for the input from both of you. I am sorry for how I phrased that. It was rude and insensitive. I wasn't saying the way I met him was a mistake, but the fact that I didn't really know him at all and I had sex with him which I thought was a mistake. You're completely right about me being wrong in asking him to test while not testing myself. I was terrified. This was my one and only time doing anything, even making out. I just turned 19 and am completely in the closet and working through my issues with my own sexuality. I think the situation just freaked me out and made me jump to the worst case scenario because I'm not at terms with who I am sexually yet. As far as the restraining order thing, I didn't demand or hassle or yell at him about any of this, he tested in order to try and ease my anxiety about the whole situation voluntarily to show me it was okay. However, I see what you mean that its not his responsibility to test, but mine to protect myself. You're right, I don't think I am ready for the responsibility of sex yet. When I am, I will take the responsibility of using protection every time. Thank you for all your help. One question, just for my own knowledge, so there's no such thing as a carrier of HIV? Nobody can harbor the virus but still test negative? Also, based on these symptoms, is there anything else you could think of which would cause these? I've tried not poking them for a long time and they remain enlarged and painful. Again, I'm very sorry if I offended either of you. My anxiety and fear over this situation come from my lack of experience and knowledge as well as problems coming to terms with my own sexuality. While I am coming close to my limit of posts I can make on this particular forum, if either of you would like to follow up with me through personal messages or email, I would be glad to talk to you. Sorry and thank you so much for easing my worry.

Online Jeff G

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Re: Could I be infected if he's negative?
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2013, 07:16:55 PM »
If your friend had HIV he would have tested positive for it . I'm HIV positive and undetectable but would still test positive if I took an HIV test .

Your symptoms are not specific to HIV and cold be any number of things but its not HIV because you did not have an exposure . We don't diagnose things here and it would be impossible to do so over the internet , if you are unwell then go see your doctor .

You didn't offend me and please do not be put off our blunt brutally honest assessments , if we thought you had even a slight risk we would tell you so that you could get treatment and prevent others from becoming infected .

You owe it to your self to have a happy satisfying sex life so if I were you I wouldn't hesitate to see a councilor to help me sort out my conflicted thoughts and emotions about your sexuality ... life is short , make the best of it . 

Offline Ann

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Re: Could I be infected if he's negative?
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2013, 06:19:36 AM »
Nathan,

This is going to be long, but please bear with me and read the whole thing, along with re-reading your entire thread until it sinks in. It contains information you need as a young man to get along in life. This information will also serve you well as you age and become dinosaurs like us - albeit hiv negative, UNlike us.

First off, a quick Writing for the Internet 101 course....

You're still writing in huge blocks of text which makes it next to impossible to read your posts. I'm still trying to get my eyes to un-cross after trying to decipher your two posts in this thread. Didn't your teachers ever tell you about the wonderful world of paragraphs?

They're easy to create - at the end of every two or three sentences, just hit the big key on the right-hand side of your keyboard, the one with a left-pointing arrow on it (used to be called the return key back in the days of typewriters).

Don't just hit it once, hit it twice to create spaces between your paragraphs. Do it - otherwise many people just won't bother to wade through your wonderwalls of text. I nearly didn't.


I had to dig this bit out of your wall of text:


One question, just for my own knowledge, so there's no such thing as a carrier of HIV? Nobody can harbor the virus but still test negative?


Yes, but not in the way that you're thinking.

A newly infected person can still be testing antibody negative in the first few weeks of infection, before the body has produced enough antibodies to trigger a positive result.

In these first few weeks, the viral load can be as high as in the millions, which means a newly infected - but still testing hiv antibody negative - person can be extremely infectious.

Epidemiologist (scientists who track how infections move around in the population) have good reason to suspect that many new infections are due to people having unprotected intercourse with others who are very newly infected - but claim/think/assume they're hiv negative because they have had a negative result too early in the window period. (This also applies to newly infected people who haven't tested. A newly infected person can be the most infectious they'll ever be during the course of their infection.)

The vast majority of people who have actually been infected will seroconvert and test antibody positive by six weeks, with the average time to seroconversion being only 22 days. A six week negative is highly unlikely to change, but must be confirmed at the three month point. A negative test result at three months is conclusive.

This testing window period means there is a up to a six week window where a newly infected person is still testing hiv negative, but is highly infectious.

Once a person has hit the point where there are enough antibodies present to produce a positive antibody test result (between three and six weeks), they will ALWAYS test hiv antibody positive.

People can go years and years before having any obvious problems caused by hiv, all the while never testing (because they think because they feel fine, they don't need to test) all the while spreading hiv through unprotected intercourse because they don't think they have it. This is one of the reasons why regular hiv testing is so very important.

As far as your specific situation is concerned, you have no real need to test for hiv other than perhaps to put your mind at ease.

However, if you've ever had unprotected anal or vaginal intercourse with anyone - including women - then you do need to test. Once you are sexually active on a regular basis, you need to have yearly sexual health check ups (including but NOT limited to hiv testing) at least once a year and more often if you're very active or if unprotected intercourse has occurred.

The ONLY way to ever accurately know your own hiv status is through testing. Asking about a person's hiv status doesn't work (unless they admit to having hiv), because many people do not accurately know their hiv status - they only assume they're hiv negative. Also, unfortunately some people will lie (mainly because of the stigma attached to being poz) and some will even go so far as to falsify testing documents.

If you make sure condoms are used for all anal or vaginal intercourse, then you won't have to worry about the other person's hiv status or even viral load. Condoms have been proven to prevent hiv infection.

There have been three long-term studies of couples where one is positive and one is negative. In the couples who used condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, but no barrier for oral activities, not one of the negative partners became infected with hiv. Not one.

Here's what you need to know in order to avoid hiv infection:

You need to be using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, every time, no exceptions until such time as you are in a securely monogamous relationship where you have both tested for ALL sexually transmitted infections together.

To agree to have unprotected intercourse is to consent to the possibility of being infected with an STI. Sex without a condom lasts only a matter of minutes, but hiv is forever.

Have a look through the condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use condoms with confidence.

Anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care check-up, including but not limited to hiv testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.

If you aren't already having regular, routine check-ups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine hiv tests to return with negative results.

Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than hiv. Some of the other STIs can be present with no obvious symptoms, so the only way to know for sure is to test.

Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple!

I know this has been a long post, but I hope you take the time to read and re-read what not only I, but also what Jeff and Jonathan have taken the time to explain to you. You're young; we get that. You probably didn't have sex-ed in school and even if you did, it probably didn't discuss men having sex with men. We get that too and that's why we've taken the time to give you what you need to know in order to remain hiv negative.

Heh. We were young once too - even though we're old enough to have used typewriters and know that the button I mentioned to you earlier (the "enter" button with the left-pointing arrow) used to be called the "return" key. I hope you take at least two lessons away from your time here - 1) paragraphs are your (and your reader's) friend and 2) condom will protect you against hiv, regardless of the other person's hiv status.

Always assume the other person is hiv positive, and rather than badger them to take test after test or otherwise ask them about their hiv status, just use a condom and be done with it.

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Ann

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Re: Could I be infected if he's negative?
« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2013, 06:27:05 AM »
By the way, regarding your symptoms - go see a doctor! Hiv is far from the only thing that can cause sore, swollen lymph glands. We cannot tell you what is troubling yours; only a doctor can after a thorough medical examination.

NO excuses - just go see a doctor. You could be missing something serious in your misguided focus on hiv.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

 


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