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Author Topic: Condoms are 70% effective!  (Read 2239 times)

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Offline Coins82

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Condoms are 70% effective!
« on: March 12, 2013, 11:33:59 PM »
Yes, folks. 70% Effective. The CDC presented this new found data during the CROI annual conference this month. So this new data completely upends the current coventional knowledge of HIV prevention. Condoms arent safe folks, 70% is way too risky! This has me very uneasy. I had protective sex with a Transexual escort in 2011 and I tested 6 times out to 12 months. I had and still have some questionable symptoms so this new data really has me thinking about testing again.

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Condoms are 70% effective!
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2013, 11:43:58 PM »
Yes, folks. 70% Effective. The CDC presented this new found data during the CROI annual conference this month. So this new data completely upends the current coventional knowledge of HIV prevention. Condoms arent safe folks, 70% is way too risky! This has me very uneasy. I had protective sex with a Transexual escort in 2011 and I tested 6 times out to 12 months. I had and still have some questionable symptoms so this new data really has me thinking about testing again.

Doesn't upend anything. Simply accounts for condoms not used correctly, and condoms used without or with the wrong lubrication.

A properly applied condom with adequate and proper lube has a success rate of over 95 percent.

If you condom did not break, you had no risk. If the condom broke, you would likely have known as they are designed to fail catastrophically.

Moreover, are you also suggesting that the HIV tests you took were invalid? Not sure when that was presented at the conference.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline Jeff G

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Re: Condoms are 70% effective!
« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2013, 11:44:48 PM »
Hi Coins . Im not sure what you want from us because you made a statement but didn't ask a question . Please read the posting guidelines at the top of the page so that if you do have some questions for us you can make the most of the two you have left .

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Condoms are 70% effective!
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2013, 12:01:35 AM »
Hi Coins . Im not sure what you want from us because you made a statement but didn't ask a question . Please read the posting guidelines at the top of the page so that if you do have some questions for us you can make the most of the two you have left .

Found the presentation in question. As I suspected, it was based on two studies, one from 1989 and one from 1999.

http://www.aidsmap.com/The-AIDSVAX-trials/page/2027990/

http://www.aidsmap.com/HIV-risk-behaviour-of-gay-men-revealed-in-large-US-study/page/1416096/

Both used patient report, which is notoriously unreliable due to, among other things, Social desirability bias. A decent description of it can be found here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_desirability_bias

Those studies are markers for researchers, and honestly not for people who don't understand and incorporate the scientific method appropriately. Such as someone with, say, a confirmation bias.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias


Biases and soft sciences aside, you reliably tested negative. So these studies should have zero impact on you, unless you believe your HIV test is flawed.

By the way, want to blow your mind? Read the Swiss Study.

http://www.aidsmap.com/page/1429357/

Folks with HIV who are in meds and have a consistent undetectable viral load have a near-non-existent chance of passing along the virus even without condoms. More recent studies are proving a similar result in anal sex as well as vaginal sex. Many of our members with HIV negative partners have used this data in order to naturally procreate. And, often, recreate.



"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline Coins82

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Re: Condoms are 70% effective!
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2013, 12:28:43 AM »
By the way, the study stated that when used consistently, i.e., all the time, the condom is only 70% effective. This is crazy! I read the information you posted jkinatl2 and it is the way I thought about condoms until I saw this new study. And yes, self reporting can be unreliable, but geez if the CDC (the authority on HIV) says that condoms are only 70% then damn I guess we should listen. And the reason I tested out to 12 months is because of delayed serovonversion which has been reported many times in the medical field.

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Condoms are 70% effective!
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2013, 12:42:14 AM »
By the way, the study stated that when used consistently, i.e., all the time, the condom is only 70% effective. This is crazy! I read the information you posted jkinatl2 and it is the way I thought about condoms until I saw this new study. And yes, self reporting can be unreliable, but geez if the CDC (the authority on HIV) says that condoms are only 70% then damn I guess we should listen. And the reason I tested out to 12 months is because of delayed serovonversion which has been reported many times in the medical field.

The studies used PATIENT REPORT in 1989 and 1999. Did you even read my post regarding social desirability bias? Because those studies are in sharp contrast to every single study based on hard data, not soft data.

What about the three serodiscordant studies from Spain and the US which used hundreds of couples who were followed for ten, five and three years? These couples used condoms for anal and vaginal sex, yet no barrier whatsoever for oral sex. And there were only two infections, which were linked to condom breakage due to incorrect use.

This was using known serodiscordant couples, some on meds, some not. Some with high viral loads, some undetectable.

Sorry, but the criteria of the Romero and Page-Shafer studies more than trumps the soft science peddled at the CROI.

IN addition, the ONLY reason you would habe a "delayed seroconversion" is if you had no immune system to mount a defense against HIV. People on chemotherapy for cancer for example, which temporarily and utterly destroys the immune system, and some people with long-term IV drug use, which accomplishes the same.

You would know if you had an immune system that was impaired enough to warrant testing out to six months. You would be extremely ill, or in a hospital.

And even then the CDC's recommendations for those rare cases only dictate a test at six months instead of the global gold standard of three months.

That is science. That is what we use here.

If you can't let it go, then why not just go test again? Though I seriously douvt you would believe the veracity of that test.

Better than that, seek out a counselor who specializes in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. CBT works wonders for people with irrational fears - and yes, yours is one.

*modified to add - We draw our conclusions and base our recommendations and risk evaluations from the raw data itself. The CDC is certainly NOT "the authority" when it comes to HIV. They still list open-mouthed kissing, insertive fellatio (getting sucked) and cunnilingus as possible risks, even though there is zero documentation to quantify those claims - and plenty of science to thoroughly dispute them.

« Last Edit: March 13, 2013, 12:44:35 AM by jkinatl2 »
"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline Coins82

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Re: Condoms are 70% effective!
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2013, 11:11:14 PM »
Question: According to the CDC, the condom protected the person from HIV 70% of the time. But it doesn't say what happened with the 30%? Did the condoms malfunction 30% of the time? Did the virus penetrate the condom 30% of the time? Why publish something so significant and not clarify the data! This is important!

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Condoms are 70% effective!
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2013, 11:19:09 PM »
Latex condoms, when used consistently and correctly, are highly effective in preventing the sexual transmission of HIV, the virus that causes AIDS. In addition, consistent and correct use of latex condoms reduces the risk of other sexually transmitted diseases (STDs), including diseases transmitted by genital secretions, and to a lesser degree, genital ulcer diseases. Condom use may reduce the risk for genital human papillomavirus (HPV) infection and HPV-associated diseases, e.g., genital warts and cervical cancer.

http://www.cdc.gov/condomeffectiveness/latex.htm

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Condoms are 70% effective!
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2013, 02:00:41 AM »
Question: According to the CDC, the condom protected the person from HIV 70% of the time. But it doesn't say what happened with the 30%? Did the condoms malfunction 30% of the time? Did the virus penetrate the condom 30% of the time? Why publish something so significant and not clarify the data! This is important!

I have answered all your questions. I respectfully withdraw from further discussion. The 70% was based on faulty and anecdotal data collection in the 80s and 90s. That is all.

Your hysteria over this press release is unwarranted, and your seeming unwillingness to read replies causes me to doubt that you comprehend the data I have spent quite a lot of time and effort to bring forth.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

 


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