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Magnetic Couple Questions - Boyfriend +, I'm -

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oksikoko:

--- Quote from: magneticnegative26 on February 15, 2013, 03:45:11 PM ---Would you say I'm playing with fire if I'm on Truvada, he's on Atripla and undetectable, we have protected sex, and I occasionally suck his dick after he's wiped all of his cum off of it?

--- End quote ---

Yeah, but that's a pretty low flame there. ;) My "playing with fire" comment was directed more at your desire to ramp it up, specifically with the oral sex and exchange of body fluids.


--- Quote from: magneticnegative26 on February 15, 2013, 03:45:11 PM ---but if you think that my acquisition of the virus is inevitable, even with these precautions - that seriously worries me.  Or, were you suggesting it if we were having unprotected sex? 

--- End quote ---

I don't think it's inevitable for you. I felt it was inevitable for me. I have my own history with this thing, and it wouldn't really be fair to apply to you. ;)  I think having unprotected sex with an HIV+ person is risky. I'm aware of recent studies about Truvada and serodiscordancy, the one from China in particular. It was a study of heterosexual couples, though we can probably assume similar results for MSM. The risk was shown to be reduced. Not 0. It was reduced a lot in fact, but it's still not 0. Whether or not you're OK with the risk that remains is up to you and your boyfriend. Here's a reputable article with the numbers. Impressive.
http://www.aidsmap.com/Real-world-evidence-shows-that-antiretroviral-therapy-reduces-risk-of-HIV-transmission-in-heterosexual-couples/page/2557243/


--- Quote from: magneticnegative26 on February 15, 2013, 03:45:11 PM ---Also, were you on Truvada when you acquired the virus?  I only ask because it is supposed to be pretty effective if taken consistently, and as the previous poster mentioned, if he's also UD, I'd think I were almost totally safe.

--- End quote ---

Nope. It became available the same month I became aware I was positive. I wouldn't have taken it anyway. If I had been really concerned about seroconverting, I would have reduced my risk factors (drastically) before taking such a strong drug for prophylactic reasons. Truvada (its constituent components anyway) are part of my current ART. I'm not complaining, per se, but yeah, I'd rather not have to take it if I didn't have to.

And again you said something that struck me: "I'd think I were almost totally safe." Yeah, you would probably be almost totally safe. Are you OK with probably being almost totally safe? ;) I was OK with far riskier things, so please don't think I'm pushing an agenda beyond hoping you make as informed a decision as possible.


--- Quote from: magneticnegative26 on February 15, 2013, 03:45:11 PM ---Are there other serodiscordant couples who have had long relationships without transmission?  Does the negative partner feel it's inevitable?

--- End quote ---

Don't get too hung up on my feelings about inevitability. Like I said, that was about me personally, and I felt it years before I even decided to have sex. It goes way back to the days when we thought mosquitoes could pass it from person to person. I'm not a paragon of mental clarity, even on my best days, if you know what I mean. ;)

Good luck!

mecch:
magneticnegative26
I believe you are throwing too many variables into your considerations.

1) There are the practices, and risks, and non risks of your sex life going forward with him undetectable, and you NOT on truvada.

2) Then there are the practices, and risks, and non risks, of your sex life with you ON truvada.

I don't see the benefit of going on Truvada if you are going to continue having intercourse with a condom.  Truvada is a drug, and besides that, its expensive... What's the point?   

I can't imagine a doctor prescribing you Truvada so that you can continue having sex with condoms, but maybe want some oral play with cum or precum.

Also, you seem overly fearful of him shooting in the condom.... Have you had some history with condom breaks???  If there ever was one going forward, and you got some jiz in you, you should have already decided on the game plan.  I would say it would be a crap shoot if a doctor would give you post-exposure Pep if your bf is undetectable, in any event. Though I guess it would be your choice...  Why not discuss this with your bf's doc.  You could, for example, already have the supply, just in case....  But yeah, once you decided to take the PEP, you'd have to finish the course.

________

On the other hand, if you decide to take the Truvada, why wouldn't you just then do whatever you want, no holds barred....

_______

Taking Truvada as prevention just in case of a very unlikely condom break, during protected sex with an undetectable person, or for oral play with undetectable person, seems.....  a bit much.... 

jkinatl2:

--- Quote from: magneticnegative26 on February 15, 2013, 03:45:11 PM ---Hey Oksikoko,

Thanks for the response.

I feel like I have two vastly different responses, however, and could really use the input of others.  Would you say I'm playing with fire if I'm on Truvada, he's on Atripla and undetectable, we have protected sex, and I occasionally suck his dick after he's wiped all of his cum off of it?

--- End quote ---

Just wanted to be clear. I have beena moderator in the AM I INFECTED forum for ten years (finally got the official Hat this month) and have answered thousands of risk assessments.

I also ran a non profit HIV awareness and safer sex Organization from 1994-2001. Been doing counseling in between, of course, and had a hand in redesigning the LESSONS of this site as regards HIV transmission.

I base my opinions on verified science, which I will be happy to cite.

Here are the facts about serodiscordant sex:

A) Nothing in the universe is 100% safe, except maybe sex with your hand. That is why ALL these practices are canned "safer sex."

There is absolutely no reason for a person with a low/UD viral load to worry that his semen will infect via oral sex. Notwithstanding the three serodiscordant couples' studies in which couples used condoms for penetrative anal and caginal sex, but no barrier at all for oral sex of any variety, and no couples were infected. This is through threestudies involving hundreds of couples and ranging from three. five, to ten years' strong.

Oral sex (giving fellatio) is NOT a real risk for HIV. And with an undetectable viral load that risk is essentially zero. IN addition to the dozen identified elements in saliva which neutralize HIV, a partner on meds is NOT going to have significant, viable viral particles in his semen

If you are using Truvada on top of that, there is no real reason for you to use condoms at all for sex, oral or anal. That's the technique straight couples use in order to conceive, yet somehow gay men are still asked to fear the same recommendations.

Please do not believe the hype, the fear, the stigma, and the use of anecdote as data. If real information matters to you, follow the science, not the rhetoric.

Treatment as prevention works. It works easily as well as condom use.







I think that further study is necessary before

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