HIV Prevention and Testing > Am I Infected?

Condom Slip - please help

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paulv21981:
Yes I know, if I'm honest I am worried to go for the test, sorry. He knows this as well, and he gets angry with me and says he doesn't want to talk about it. He said that he wouldn't of done unprotected sex and came in him if he thought I was at risk.

On the 11th January it will be 4 weeks when we had the unprotected sex and on the 7th January they have testing in our local clinic with results in 20mins. I can't go but he says he will go to prove to me.

I have one question though which probably will seem silly......after I came in his ass he cleaned like he usually does before sex - would this stop the HIV...because you have in a way got the cum out???

Paul.

paulv21981:
I found a power point presentation
www.mpaetc.org/fdc_06/reznik_oralsex.ppt

One slide:

The Options Project found that 7.8% (8 of 102) of recently infected men who have sex with men in San Francisco were probably infected through oral sex.

Nearly half (3 of 8) of these cases reported oral problems, including occasional bleeding gums.
Almost all (7 of 8) of these men reported to have had oral contact with pre-semen or semen.


My big worry is that I haven't been to the dentist for like 7 years maybe even longer - So I am guessing I have bad oral hygiene and probably you say no risk for people because people go to the dentist every 6 months and I haven't been.

I am starting to clean my teeth proper now unlike before I do get bleeding gums at the back but I never have bleeding gums in general without brushing.
For example if I spit I never see blood - its only when I brush my teeth.

Have you seen the power point presentation?

jkinatl2:

--- Quote from: paulv21981 on January 02, 2013, 09:30:16 PM ---I found a power point presentation
www.mpaetc.org/fdc_06/reznik_oralsex.ppt

One slide:

The Options Project found that 7.8% (8 of 102) of recently infected men who have sex with men in San Francisco were probably infected through oral sex.

Nearly half (3 of 8) of these cases reported oral problems, including occasional bleeding gums.
Almost all (7 of 8) of these men reported to have had oral contact with pre-semen or semen.


My big worry is that I haven't been to the dentist for like 7 years maybe even longer - So I am guessing I have bad oral hygiene and probably you say no risk for people because people go to the dentist every 6 months and I haven't been.

I am starting to clean my teeth proper now unlike before I do get bleeding gums at the back but I never have bleeding gums in general without brushing.
For example if I spit I never see blood - its only when I brush my teeth.

Have you seen the power point presentation?


--- End quote ---

Actually I have. I happen to live in Atlanta, GA. I saw the presentation online in 1993, two full years after the most recent study that made up the presentation. The other two research studies that supported this hypothesis were published in 1984 and 1986 - a full TEN YEARS before the advent of Anti Retroviral Therapy that changed the course of the pandemic.

And even back then, it was shoddy science. It relied on patient report, which is notorious for being unreliable. You know we've actually had science since then? I mean real, peer reviewed science to track serodiscordant couples? Three distinct studies on two continents that studied hundreds of couples for ten, five and three years. All of whom engaged in unprotected oral sex in every conceivable manner, but only used condoms for penetrative anal and oral sex. And guess what. Not a single infection through oral sex. Not a single one.

Sure, if you want to surf the web you can find studies dating back to the eighties (which you have) and even earlier than the ancient ones you dredged up. They will say you get HIV from kissing, cuddling, sharing food, "microscopic cuts." Look far enough and you will find all sorts of published findings in the day before we even had electron microscopes powerful enough to see the virus.

Trawling the net for outdated information, especially such discredited stuff that relied upon patient report, might be cathartic to fuel your fear. But it's not reliable science, and it's an insult to insinuate that I am talking out of my ass.

The serodiscordant couple studies I mentioned were staged between the late nineties and the mid-200s. To the best of my knowledge, we don't have many if any studies in the pipeline to ascertain the infectiousness of oral sex as regards HIV infection - because it has been established that it's unlikely if not impossible to get HIV through giving a blow job.

I am hoping that you are too young to remember the 80s and early 90s when it came to HIV. The Hysteria, the people dropping like flies, the toxic and lethal doses of AZT monotherapy, and the lack of healthy HIV positive people in relationships with HIV negative people to even formulate a study on causation and transmission theory.

What you read was and is shit masquerading as science. It was scientists who, if I am ascribing the noblest intentions, were scrambling without any real knowledge of the mechanics of HIV infection to discover the means by which people infected by asking them, often in the company of their partners and family, what sexual acts they did. Ascribing less than noble intentions simply shows scientists whose adherence to the Socratic method were less important than their tenure and/or status.

Just because a scientific theory is disproven does not mean that it magically disappears from the internet, from journals, from the annals of scientific methodology. Often these studies are kept and used as a cautionary tale to those who would desperately or cynically leap to a conclusion without the data required to even formulate their hypothesis.

Since we have been studying serodiscordant couples we have yet to find a single instance of HIV transmitted through oral sex. So any speculation we give (and we freely admit to giving it, my mentioning meth mouth as a possible caveat) is veering from data driven science and moving into the realm of speculation.

You will not get HIV from giving a blow job. Period. While you are trawling the web for answers, could you at least google the scientist whose quote appears in my signature line?

Also, I have no sympathy for someone who refuses to go for an HIV test out of fear, yet A) assumes that he might be exposed/infected and B) has unprotected insertive anal sex with his partner. If your paranoia was justified and you REALLY thought you might have gotten HIV, then you have done a truly shitty thing.

If you REALLY thought you could have gotten infected, then you had no business having raw sex with your partner. Period. Because in  a relationship, it's not just/all about YOU. If you thought you could have gotten HIV through oral sex, you did a horrible thing that could have lifelong consequences for someone else. And frankly, I hope you feel badly enough about that decision that you grow a pair of nads and just get tested already.

You had no risk. You cannot infect someone with a pathogen you don't have. But your behavior suggests that you don't believe that - and suggests that you care less for the health of the person you purport to love than facing the reality of your choices.

This is my last message to you in this forum. I leave it to others who have more patience.

You do not have HIV. But you THINK you might. And yet you still fuck this guy who has chosen to trust you without a condom. Regardless of the science, I hope you can someday become a person who does better things.

paulv21981:
Hi Jkinatl2,

Thanks for you reply. Your right I know - going for testing on Monday :-(
My partner is going on Thursday testing because they get the results in 20mins.

We had sex which you are right - he wanted to prove me to that I had no risk. I was getting to the point of having panic attacks. He has spoke to the sexual advisor we both know as we have both been there together for test and she wants to refer me for help.

Anyway I totally agree with what you said it was a bad thing.

paulv21981:
So,

I met a guy had protected anal sex - but not really full sex it asted about 30 sec. He put the condom on me and sat on me and after about 30 seconds I asked him to get up and the condom was in his ass and he pulled it out, said he did it on purpose in case it was dirty.

What is the risk?

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