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Author Topic: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections  (Read 4628 times)

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Offline ichigo_kun

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It appears we're on the cusp of a major breakthrough in the prevention of HIV/AIDS. The FDA said yesterday that Truvada, a drug currently used to treat patients with HIV, appears to be effective at preventing HIV infection in healthy people. This would be the first drug of its kind and would obviously have a huge impact on the efforts to stop the spread of the deadly virus. Tomorrow, a panel of FDA advisers is set to review Truvada, which is made by Gilead Sciences, and vote on whether it should be approved as a preventative treatment for HIV. While the FDA doesn't have to follow the panel's recommendation, it commonly does. If approved, the pill would then be allowed to be marketed to and prescribed for those patients who had a high risk of contracting HIV through sexual intercourse. A three-year-long study on Truvada found that "daily doses cut the risk of infection in healthy gay and bisexual men by 44 percent, when accompanied by condoms and counseling." A second study found that it cut infection by 75 percent in heterosexual couples where one of the partners was healthy and the other had HIV. While it certainly holds a great deal of promise, some researchers warn that this pill is not the same as using a condom, which remains the most powerful weapon against HIV. There is also concern because the drug has not been as effective in preventing infection in women. It's not clear whether the problem is that women require a higher dose or whether the women in the study in question were not taking the pills daily as prescribed. That's an issue that definitely needs to be sorted out, but if the drug is approved it's likely to be embraced quickly, since there's really nothing else like it in the pipeline and an AIDS vaccine is probably many years from being a reality.

 http://m.jezebel.com/5909103/the-fda-is-poised-to-approve-the-first-drug-that-prevents-hiv-infections?utm_campaign=socialflow_jezebel_twitter&utm_source=jezebel_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

Offline J220

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Thanks for posting this.

As far as the study that led to this, I have a major problem with this being effective at prevention only 44% of the time (or even 75% in heterosexual) "when accompanied by condoms and counseling."

With these numbers I would suspect that the trial participants who did not get infected were using condoms, and were not really protected by the drug.

I'm all for a search for a preventive method, of course, but I'm afraid that this could give people a false sense of security.
"Hope is my philosophy
Just needs days in which to be
Love of Life means hope for me
Born on a New Day" - John David

Offline Cosmicdancer

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The different PREP trials have found limited efficacy, but the Partners PREP trial found that "men and women who had detectable drug in their blood were 86% to 90% less likely to become infected with HIV than men and women who did not have detectable drug in their blood."  It doesn't say in the article I linked to below, but I believe Aidsmeds had a summary of the findings that said that none of the people with higher levels of Truvada in their blood were infected. 

In any case, it's clear that if people aren't adherent, PREP is of very limited value.  I think it's a viable additional prevention tool for people in sero-discordant relationships if people are given intensive counseling to understand they need to be at least 95% adherent, just like their poz partners need to be if they're on meds.

(This is a summary of findings from several PREP studies, I excerpted part of the text below, see the link to read the whole article)

http://www.catie.ca/en/catienews/2012-03-15/pre-exposure-prophylaxis-adherence-key-and-may-explain-disappointing-trial-resu

Partners PrEP trial

Study population: 4758 heterosexual men and women (serodiscordant couples)

Study arms:

Daily Viread pill – 17 HIV infections
Daily Truvada pill – 13 HIV infections
Daily placebo pill – 52 HIV infections
Effectiveness:

Overall, a daily Viread pill was 67% effective and a daily Truvada pill was 75% effective in reducing the risk of HIV transmission compared to a placebo.
Estimated Adherence:

Pill counts: 97%
Drug levels: In an analysis of 198 men and women who were supposed to be taking a Viread or Truvada pill daily (and did not become infected with HIV in the study), drug was detected in 82% of their study visits.
Additional information on anti-HIV drug levels:

Among the men and women who became infected with HIV in the daily Viread or Truvada group, only 35% (Viread) and 25% (Truvada) had detectable drug in their blood at the study visit closest to the time of their HIV infection.
Men and women who had detectable drug in their blood were 86% to 90% less likely to become infected with HIV than men and women who did not have detectable drug in their blood.
http://www.catie.ca/en/catienews/2012-03-15/pre-exposure-prophylaxis-adherence-key-and-may-explain-disappointing-trial-resu
Summer, 2007 - &$#@?
November, 2007 - Tested poz, 300,000 vl, 560 cd4
Feb, 2008 - 57,000 vl, 520 cd4, started Atripla
June, 2008 - undetectable, 612 cd4
January, 2009 - undetectable, 670 cd4
May, 2009 - undetectable, 593 cd4
Sept, 2009 - 83 vl, 763 cd4, 34%
Dec, 2009 - undetectable, 889 cd4, 32%
April, 2010 - undetectable, 860 cd4, 31%
October, 2010 - undetectable, 800 cd4, 38%
April, 2011 - undetectable, t-cell test not done
October, 2011 - undetectable
April, 2012 - undetectable, 850 cd4, 39%
November, 2012 - undetectable, 901 cd4, 41%
April, 2013 - undetectable, 846 cd4, 36%
October, 2013 - undetectable
May, 2014 - undetectable, 784 cd4, 48%

Offline WorriedWife

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does anyone know if Truvada was approved by the FDA. I Google'd it but I dont see if they actually made a decision? Im just curious.

Thanks :)
"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline Rockin

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does anyone know if Truvada was approved by the FDA. I Google'd it but I dont see if they actually made a decision? Im just curious.

Thanks :)

It was and it was announced today.

Offline Rockin

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Quickly following the big news regarding the FDA approval of Truvada, this article came out in one of Brazil's biggest news website. For those willing to use Google Translator here it is:

"Safe sex is still the best form of prevention against AIDS", says doctor
http://noticias.uol.com.br/saude/ultimas-noticias/redacao/2012/07/16/sexo-seguro-e-ainda-a-melhor-prevencao-a-aids-diz-medico.htm

There's one thing that bothered me about this article:

Madruga (the doctor) reminds of a recent study in Switzerland in which men had a viral load of zero in their blood and yet showed a 10% amount of the virus in their seminal fluid. "This is another worrying factor for the liberation of sex (he meant condomless sex) with just the antiretrovirals".

Offline WorriedWife

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Thank you Rokin. I agree I would not want to just rely on this med for protection, But at least this for me gives me added protection being in a sero-discordant relationship. My husband is Poz and I am not (Thank GOD) We would like to have another child but we are being very, very careful. But its nice to know this is approved so that I have the ability to get it being neg. My first priority although, is to ensure my husband stays healthy. We just recently, due to my job got placed with a high deductible insurance and now have to come up with 1800 dollars to get my husbands meds (Truvada). So one problem at a time :)

"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline leatherman

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off topic:
due to my job got placed with a high deductible insurance and now have to come up with 1800 dollars to get my husbands meds (Truvada).
have you checked into patient assistance programs and co-pay assistance programs available through the drug manufacturers? (google the med and go to it's webpage) or an ASO for help getting your husband's medications? or your state's (if you're in the USA) ADAP program?
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline WorriedWife

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leatherman,

yes I have checked with Atripla, I can not use the co-pay assistance since it is the deductible I have to meet not the co-pay of the meds. I did send in a appeal but they told me my income is to high to qualify for the assistance. as far as ADAP Im not familiar with this or how I can get it in Georgia. My husband talked to a counselor today at the doctor he goes to and they are going to see if there is anything they can do to help.
"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline leatherman

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as far as ADAP Im not familiar with this or how I can get it in Georgia. My husband talked to a counselor today at the doctor he goes to and they are going to see if there is anything they can do to help.
ouch! right now there's a waiting list for AIDS Drug Assistance Program (ADAP) in GA but here's the state webpage about it - http://health.state.ga.us/programs/stdhiv/adap.asp. if you're eligible make sure to apply, even if you end up on a waiting list. if ADAP is approved but you are put on the list, you can contact http://welvista.org which is a SC agency that has been supplying meds to people on wait lists throughout America until their state ADAP is able to come through for them.

is your husband's doctor a stand-along ID (Infectious Disease) doctor or part of an ASO (AIDS Service Organization)? Not everywhere has an ASO (check here (http://directory.poz.com/) to find organizations in your area that could be of help); but an ASO usually has case managers who can help with the issue of finding access to medications. Of course, finding access to meds can be done without an ASO (I did it that way for 18 yrs in an area with no ASO) as long as you contact the local RyanWhite/ADAP rep, apply for all the patient assistance stuff, check into medicare and medicaid, find your own ID doc, etc - it's just all easier with a case manager who KNOWS all the places and options without you having to figure it all out

hope all that helps and best of luck! If you have more questions or problems, you might want to start you own thread about this and explain whereabouts you live so that someone local and more in the know can help you out. Say Hi to the hubby for me! :) He's obviously a very lucky guy to have someone like you helping him out and supporting him - not to mention loving him.  :-* :D Oh! and good luck on having that next child  ;)
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline WorriedWife

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2012, 07:54:25 PM »
Leatherman,

Thanks for the help, His doc is part of an ASO. That is why I choose the insurance I did so he could keep the same doctor. I had the choice between United Healthcare and Kaiser. His doctor does not take Kaiser so we went with UHC. When I had a job that did not offer medical insurance his doctor was able to give him his meds for free. but now that we have insurance it has taken that option away from us.
"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline WorriedWife

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #11 on: July 16, 2012, 07:56:02 PM »
The thing that really is frustrating is knowing that if the dang pharmacy would just bill us I could get the money out of my flex account to pay the bill. But they wont bill us for the med. :(
"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline Rockin

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2012, 10:04:08 AM »
The thing that really is frustrating is knowing that if the dang pharmacy would just bill us I could get the money out of my flex account to pay the bill. But they wont bill us for the med. :(

I'm still baffled by the way the American government treats positive people. It's like "every man for himself" up there.

If Republicans (we know its their fault) think each person has to pay for their own health problems then why not try to do something to lower the price of meds? Isnt it in everyone's interest to lower overall numbers of HIV infections? How can someone with a low-income afford this? I'm baffled, I do admire the US in many aspects but this particular subject is mind-boggling.

Will "Obamacare" change this in any way?

Offline WorriedWife

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2012, 03:46:51 PM »
I dont see how ObamaCare will help any of this except for the fact that they are making me pay more in taxes to provide medical care for (the majority not all) people that are just to lazy to work. Why should I pay for people like this. Not only are my taxes going up (like they are not high enough as it is) but I will also pay higher premiums to provide insurance for my family. Im sorry, I AM a Republican, Yes I admit that there are flaws with Republicans just like there are with Democrats. I was in the military and Ive see all sides of both. In fact it was while I was in Iraq helping this nation on the war in Terriorism when my husband made is decision and ended up with HIV. All I can say is I really hope this is not just one more blow to the people in this country. I dont disagree that people need medical insurance but here I am working full time, a mother and a wife trying to support her husband and his terrible mistake he has made in his life and I cant even afford to get the meds to keep him healthy. How are raising my taxes going to help this.
"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline Rockin

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2012, 03:56:02 PM »
I dont see how ObamaCare will help any of this except for the fact that they are making me pay more in taxes to provide medical care for (the majority not all) people that are just to lazy to work. Why should I pay for people like this. Not only are my taxes going up (like they are not high enough as it is) but I will also pay higher premiums to provide insurance for my family. Im sorry, I AM a Republican, Yes I admit that there are flaws with Republicans just like there are with Democrats. I was in the military and Ive see all sides of both. In fact it was while I was in Iraq helping this nation on the war in Terriorism when my husband made is decision and ended up with HIV. All I can say is I really hope this is not just one more blow to the people in this country. I dont disagree that people need medical insurance but here I am working full time, a mother and a wife trying to support her husband and his terrible mistake he has made in his life and I cant even afford to get the meds to keep him healthy. How are raising my taxes going to help this.

Well I understand your point and I respect your feelings. However, I do not think it is as black-and-white as you portray.

Truth is most health care companies are just plain evil. They will flat-out refuse treatment in some cases and they can make your life a living hell. I honestly do not feel that I'm overstating when I say a lot of people have died because their health plan wouldn't cover their treatments or operations.

I know Michael Moore is sometimes sketchy when it comes to facts and numbers but I completely believe in his Sicko doc.

Offline WorriedWife

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2012, 04:13:09 PM »
Well I understand your point and I respect your feelings. However, I do not think it is as black-and-white as you portray.

Truth is most health care companies are just plain evil. They will flat-out refuse treatment in some cases and they can make your life a living hell. I honestly do not feel that I'm overstating when I say a lot of people have died because their health plan wouldn't cover their treatments or operations.

I know Michael Moore is sometimes sketchy when it comes to facts and numbers but I completely believe in his Sicko doc.


I know its not all black and white its just hard to explain it otherwise :) I agree with you that most health care companies are evil and they can make you life a living hell. Im sure there are alot of people out there suffering because they can not afford health care and it just makes me sick to think of it. Im sorry I didnt mean to sound heartless. I cant make a statement about Michael Moore because I am not familiar with his work.  :D I dont like to make comments that I havent researched. To me that is the same thing as treating someone with HIV differently then everyone else (Im sure Im not the only one that has happened to) I just wish people would educate themselves correctly before making comments to someone living with this horrible diesese.
"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #16 on: July 17, 2012, 04:13:16 PM »
I dont see how ObamaCare will help any of this except for the fact that they are making me pay more in taxes to provide medical care for (the majority not all) people that are just to lazy to work. Why should I pay for people like this. Not only are my taxes going up (like they are not high enough as it is) but I will also pay higher premiums to provide insurance for my family. Im sorry, I AM a Republican, Yes I admit that there are flaws with Republicans just like there are with Democrats. I was in the military and Ive see all sides of both. In fact it was while I was in Iraq helping this nation on the war in Terriorism when my husband made is decision and ended up with HIV. All I can say is I really hope this is not just one more blow to the people in this country. I dont disagree that people need medical insurance but here I am working full time, a mother and a wife trying to support her husband and his terrible mistake he has made in his life and I cant even afford to get the meds to keep him healthy. How are raising my taxes going to help this.

How will your taxes be raised? I was under the impression that under the Affordable Care Act, your husband would receive the mediations necessary to keep him healthy, even if he started a job whose insurance used to refuse those with "pre-existing conditions." I was under the impression that people who chose not to obtain health insurance would be penalized, but that it was capped out at a reasonable rate (especially considering the burden uninsured persons already place on the rest of the country's healthcare institutions.)

Insofar as YOUR premiums going up, they likely will. Then again, once you start making insurance claims for upwards of a grand apiece every three months (which is what my dr visit, blodwork, and assorted other office perks usually tally) and then double that monthly for meds, assuming something as pedestrian as Atripla is appropriate medication, I imagine your rates might reflect that as well.

What you CAN NOT be, however, is dropped from your insurance for having a husband with HIV. This is a new thing, and thanks to the AHCA,

As for the majority of people needing assistance being too lazy to work, well, I am sure other members will pipe in. Suffice it to say that your understanding of the Affordable Care Act appears to be flawed, and people who know way more about it that I do will be along to help educate you.

BTW, your taxes have ALWAYS paid for those less fortunate than yourself. Only now, instead of overloading (and bankrupting) your local non-profit hospitals for the slightest malady, they will be sent to the appropriate care centers (urgent care clinics, physicians) that they need, freeing up those hospitals to treat those with serious and life-threatening conditions.

Also, let's see how this whole "too lazy to work" mantra gets you in an HIV forum, where many of the members are too ill to work. I know, I know, maybe we are the vast swatch of "exceptions" that seem to follow any broad brushed "rule" that meets with indignation on the internet.

Also, it's far close to RomneyCare than Obamacare. There actually ARE places to learn all about this new, groudbreaking situation that will actually end up HELPING your husband through this expensive, sometimes heartbreaking journey through HIV.

I totally agree that this is a baby step towards what EVERY SINGLE OTHER industrialized nation has in terms of health care for it's citizens. And getting the parasitic insurance companies (who I almost equate with Viatical Settlement Companies in their gleeful ghoulishness) out of the picture will be a HUGE step in the right direction, but that's going to take a long time - and a lot of voting out people on both sides of the aisle who are in their deep, smelly pockets.

But pinning it on people who you figure are "too lazy to work" simply paints you in a bad light. It would be a shame to establish such a reputation on a forum created and run by people with a serious, expensive, and often debilitating disease. Surely you are not like that.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline Jeff G

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #17 on: July 17, 2012, 04:19:00 PM »
I dont see how ObamaCare will help any of this except for the fact that they are making me pay more in taxes to provide medical care for (the majority not all) people that are just to lazy to work. Why should I pay for people like this. Not only are my taxes going up (like they are not high enough as it is) but I will also pay higher premiums to provide insurance for my family. Im sorry, I AM a Republican, Yes I admit that there are flaws with Republicans just like there are with Democrats. I was in the military and Ive see all sides of both. In fact it was while I was in Iraq helping this nation on the war in Terriorism when my husband made is decision and ended up with HIV. All I can say is I really hope this is not just one more blow to the people in this country. I dont disagree that people need medical insurance but here I am working full time, a mother and a wife trying to support her husband and his terrible mistake he has made in his life and I cant even afford to get the meds to keep him healthy. How are raising my taxes going to help this.

Your story in its entirety is why we need health care reform , please remember the Republican party may promise to do something about healthcare reform but they simply never have and really don't want to discuss it until Democrats force them to by enacting this law .

I'm very sympathetic with you and how you are struggling with trying to get affordable treatment because I have been in the same quandary for 27 years now . I assure you denying health care to others is not going to make it any easier for your husband to get what he needs . 

Offline WorriedWife

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2012, 04:27:38 PM »
But pinning it on people who you figure are "too lazy to work" simply paints you in a bad light. It would be a shame to establish such a reputation on a forum created and run by people with a serious, expensive, and often debilitating disease. Surely you are not like that.

I did not say that everyone is to lazy to work. I said some people but not all. I completely understand and don't mind paying taxes to help people that physically can not work. It was not my intention to make anyone feel bad or to paint myself in a bad light. I can name several people in my own family that just don't work because they don't want to. These are the people I am referring to. I say my taxes will go up because part of my taxes go to pay for welfare, Not all people on welfare truly need the assistance. Although they are trying to make that better I acknowledge that. I'm truly sorry if I made anyone upset. This forum has been a lifesaver for me other the last several years and I'm sure it will for many, many more. I have nothing but total respect for everyone on this forum and thank everyone for the kind words and encouragement I have received.
"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline leatherman

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2012, 06:44:57 PM »
I say my taxes will go up because part of my taxes go to pay for welfare,
a few points:

1) Obama's proposed plans/budget will only make taxes go up for those that make over $250k and only for the amount over $250, so I doubt your taxes will go up

2) The ACA requires people to purchase health insurance. It does not require anyone to pay more taxes to give other people health insurance. Oh there are incentives to companies to fully cover their employees and subsidies to individuals who are unable to afford health insurance, but much of that is offset by the saving from this health care plan. Once we all stop paying for the cost of so many uninsured people going to the ER and stiffing the hospitals, we'll all be healthier, happier, and have more cash in our pockets.

3) welfare is not food stamps, nor is it medicaid. There are only 5 million people in all of America receiving welfare. Of that 5 mill, 1 million are adults who are only eligible for welfare funds for two years. The other 4 million people are children. I doubt any of us mind for mere pennies of our federal tax money being spent to keep a point zero zero zero percent of the population, children no less, housed in homes with electricity, water and heat.

4) Medicaid and Medicare are excellent cost-containment programs. While for-profit insurance companies pay outrageous sums to doctors and hospitals causing YOUR insurance costs to rise, Medicaid and Medicare negotiate and pay basic fair rates for services causing the government's cost of health to go down. Therefore the more poorer people we can get into the Medicaid/Medicare programs and out of costly ERs, the less health care will cost the entire country. Right now we all pay the cost of millions of people unable to pay those outrageous hospital costs, not to mention the lost productivity while they are unable to work from preventable illness that would have cost less to treat if preventive medicine was affordable.
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline Rockin

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #20 on: July 17, 2012, 06:49:44 PM »
Not all people on welfare truly need the assistance. Although they are trying to make that better I acknowledge that. I'm truly sorry if I made anyone upset. This forum has been a lifesaver for me other the last several years and I'm sure it will for many, many more. I have nothing but total respect for everyone on this forum and thank everyone for the kind words and encouragement I have received.

I don't think anyone is upset at you, don't worry. And to your quote above I'll say...well, the system is not perfect, is it? There is no perfect system and there will always be people trying to scam benefits.

Here in Brazil we have something called "Family Sponsorship" (literal translation). It's basically a welfare system but theres no "are you looking for a job?" thing. As long as a family has a very low income and can prove it they will receive some money that can last their entire lives. So what happens (or so they say) is that some families...the "lazy" ones...simply do not bother looking for better jobs and/or better opportunities and keep on living from this welfare.

I do not like this personally because is the whole "give the man fish/teach the man how to fish" situation. I just pointed this as an example...have you seen the movie Precious? That nasty woman Mo'nique portrayed was scamming welfare, back in the 80's. It has always been done, period. That doesn't mean people shouldn't benefit from it.

After all socialism is everywhere, in some countries more than in others. Do you honestly think schools, police and firefighters in America are services that are truly free of charge?


Offline leatherman

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #21 on: July 17, 2012, 07:09:04 PM »
That nasty woman Mo'nique portrayed was scamming welfare, back in the 80's.
and that's why under President Clinton welfare regulations were changed. A single adult gets $115 a month (to get housing, heat, power, and water. how they get all that is beyond me) and is only eligible to stay on the program for 2 yrs.

blaming people who receive welfare, food stamps, or medicaid has always been a very poor excuse to use to explain America's problems. There are less than half of 1% of our citizens using welfare. if you totally closed that program, we would see no change in our national budget. Right now the amount of people receiving SNAP benefits (food stamps) has gone up to 14% (I think) but that has been due to the terrible economic problems in America (unpaid wars and extreme corporation tax cuts). Of course, if you cut out that program we would see a change in the budget - and we'd probably be seeing starving people dying in the streets.
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline mecch

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #22 on: July 17, 2012, 07:14:02 PM »
Worriedwife:  The objective of so called "Obamacare" is to eventually, during Presidents who come after Obama, surely, make sure ALL Americans have health care, just like every other damn rich country in the world, and many developing ones.
Your story, as others point out, is precisely one that will already be HELPED by Obama's Affordable Care Act.  No denial based on pre-existing conditions. No caps. Etc. etc. etc.
I find it incredible that you could not understand how it will help you in the near future because you are so concerned about a very negative stereotype of people "too lazy" to have access to a fundamental human right.
You probably do not see health care as a human right, for people who "don't work".  So called "lazy people".  Have some faith in people's natural dignity and desire to be valuable members of society. Of the hundreds of millions of people in the USA, many tens of millions of people are without health care.  You personally have woefully inadequate coverage.  Surely the stereotype of "lazy" freeloaders is a very very very small minority.  Most people are good and want to work and live a life with basic dignities.  Like a job. Education. Housing. And health care. 
Oh, and on a purely economic and budgeting rationale, the current system is NOT working. People without health care end up costing untold more money than people with preventative care, and continuous care.  Your husband as an HIV+ person is proof of this.  Imagine how much repeated hospital stays directly cost taxpayers when an uninsured person is wasting away with AIDS.  Not to mention the totally unnecessary suffering, and sadness, and death. 
Really, your post, the mind boggles!
« Last Edit: July 17, 2012, 07:17:59 PM by mecch »
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline WorriedWife

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #23 on: July 17, 2012, 07:31:27 PM »
Ok so apparently I did hit a few nerves, Im sorry if my opinion or my choice of wording has offended anyone. I have said numerous times that not all people are "lazy people" There are many people are that truly need assistance and have a hard time receiving it, there are people that have assistance they try to get off of assistance just to have a harder time getting off of it then on, There are people out there that just cant find jobs and there are people out there that have just given up and many, many more different types of people. I use to be one of those people, fortunally, I was able to find a job but in the meantime, I have had to get my house out of foreclosure, Im behind in student loan payments, power bill, water bill, and hospital bills but I keep on working and trying little by little to make it all better. Everyone has there own political opinions that is one of the things that makes this a great country. Im sorry if you dont agree with my opinions but they are just that opinions. I have been disappointed by so many things that I tend to look at the worst case possible. I really hope "Obamacare" is better then my perception of it for all of our sakes.

With all the respect in the world.
"Everything Happens for a Reason"

Offline mecch

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #24 on: July 17, 2012, 07:36:29 PM »
But your vision of the situation is so much deeper and more comprehensive than your initial statement. Its just curious how you could flippantly say something like that when now you make it clear you know its not the case.  Your own experience, so many on this form, so many around you.  All overlooked for a swipe at some stereotype. 
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline mecch

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #25 on: July 17, 2012, 07:41:04 PM »
It seems to be a cheap, Republican party shot at Obama, taken gratuitously DESPITE the ample evidence of the dire reality of life with limited resources in the US of "Amercia".  Affordable care act is NOT a giveaway to "undeserving" citizens.  Its for everyone, and if it follows its course it should eventually alter health care all the way up and down the line. 
The USA does NOT have the finest health care system in the world. Its cruel, scattershot.  And can destroy peoples' and families' integrity when there is no insurance.
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #26 on: July 17, 2012, 07:52:07 PM »
IIRC federal income tax is the lowest it has been since Eisenhower, so I'm not sure how anyone thinks their taxes are high. Unless you live somewhere (like NYC) that also takes off high-ish state AND separate city taxes and make over $200,000 -- they maybe you can complain. Even then it's lower than it was in 1998.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline mecch

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #27 on: July 17, 2012, 08:04:16 PM »
Its Romeny care, who so clearly explained it, argued for it, rather well!  No free ride. Everyone should pay, but then collectively everyone gets at least basic coverage. 
Obama puts it in nationally, because we KNOW some states never would, and suddenly its something for free, given to freeloaders.....
And the Republicans can't even cough up an alternative. 
Ok my hijack over.  Its not the topic of the thread.
Respect for your political opinions, Worried, but how about respecting your self a bit more, and asking for a rich Amercia that doesn't leave a good person like you worried to death, under mounting debts for such basic things as health care, education, and housing.
How did those few bankers do, after destroying so much wealth? It was a tiny blip....
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline Rockin

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #28 on: July 18, 2012, 05:31:38 PM »
I'll be moving to London soon and the UK has an amazing health care system. If I ever receive a job proposal to work in USA I'm not sure I'll be able to take it because I wouldn't be able to afford US$ 1 or 2.000,00 a month in HIV medication alone.

And I really do not think that giving free health treatment is making countries lile England or France poorer at all.

Offline mecch

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #29 on: July 18, 2012, 07:08:32 PM »
Well its really all a federal balancing act on taxes and budgeting.  The Bush administration was always lecturing Europe about how unsustainable the welfare states are (when it wasn't reduced to evil "socialism").   
But it's true Europe doesn't finance huge military forces.  I'm no expert but it seems to me that Americans really do want and like very low federal taxes so something has to give. 

Huge cuts in U.S. military spending would be a sea change nationally, and internationally.  One wonders if Europe would have to budget much more, if the US would budget say, 1/2 of the current level. 

But something has got to change in the USA.  Either higher tax revenue, or cuts in military.  I mean, just how close to the bone are you going to cut everything else?

Another thing I wonder:  if the USA cut defense budget down to national defense only, would there be an arms race in the rest of the world, with every other country buying American arms, compensating the lack of Pentagon purchases? 

I guess it would be political suicide for either party to discuss such things, but really something has to give to get the US standard of living back up to the level of its wealthy economy.

Neither national congress nor presidential powers seem to have the stomach for radical restructuring.  At least "Obamacare" sets the terms of conversation going forward:  rich countries shouldn't have so many uninsured people.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2012, 07:11:11 PM by mecch »
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline Rockin

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #30 on: July 19, 2012, 09:27:52 AM »
rich countries shouldn't have so many uninsured people.

And they do not, except for the USA. Correct if I'm wrong but free health care is available in every one of the richest countries in the world, isn't it? UK, France, Germany, Sweden, Switzerland, Denmark, Norway, Belgium, Australia, Netherlands, China, Canada...I'm not sure what the situation is in places like Hong Kong and Japan though.

Brazil can be misleading...our HIV treatment is pretty great considering we are a developing country. It might not be as good in smaller towns in the countryside, where good medical services are not easy to find. But at least there is the option.

But our overall health care is shitty. Low-income citizens (a great percentage of our population) have to wait in line for ours at the public hospitals and we know its not rare for someone to die while waiting in line for any treatment or emergency surgery.

Our situation is actually pretty similar to that of the US, we are all hostages of health care companies as well. The only difference is our HIV treatment, thank God.

Offline wolfter

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Re: The FDA Is Poised to Approve the First Drug To Prevent HIV Infections
« Reply #31 on: July 19, 2012, 09:45:07 AM »
Why should I pay for people like this.

And yet, you considered ADAP for your husband's meds?  Wouldn't that mean others would be paying for him?
productivity breeds content

 


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