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Author Topic: Positive - No other explanation  (Read 7136 times)

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Offline Depressed Head

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Positive - No other explanation
« on: January 27, 2012, 04:14:01 PM »
Almost 20 weeks ago, I had a broken condom incident with a prostitute in West Africa. I noticed it after about 5 - 10 seconds and changed condom and finished. I tested negative 5.5 weeks after this with a 4th generation Elisa and rapid finger prick test but stupidly, I kissed another prostitute whilst another had her hands on my penis 7 weeks after the 1st incident. I was so paranoid after the 1st incident that I demanded PEP (started 55hrs) from my Doctor after this episode, which I finished after 4 weeks.

Now to the symptoms.  7 weeks after the 1st incident and the day before I began PEP, my upper inner thighs were sore. For the last 12 weeks I have had a rash on my penis/scrotum which has come and gone about 8 times, I have had joint/muscle pain all over my body, not an area of my body has escaped it. I've had night sweats every night for about 9 weeks, I've have a white tongue which still persists. My neck, armpits and upper inner thighs have been tender/sore on and off for the last 12 weeks. Ive had 'pins and needles' in my hands and feet for a no. of weeks.  No sore throat, no body rash and no real fever although for the last couple of days, I've had hot flushes (best as I can describe it).
     
Now to the tests. I've had 9 fourth generation elisa tests , 2 no. 'DUO' tests, 1 no. -1 PCR RNA test, 1 PCR RNA Multiplex test (-1 & -2) and four or five rapid finger prick tests. My CD4+ count 16 weeks after the broken condom exposure was 992. My CD8+ count was 371. My last Elisa test was yesterday, 19.5 weeks after the broken condom exposure. All of the other tests were at various periods from 5.5 weeks after the broken condom exposure.
 
I'm literally going through hell. All I can think about is where and when I will kill myself. I made a stupid mistake but am paying the ultimate price. The Doctor here in Africa says he has come across cases of late seroconversion (admittedly in the 90's and early 00's) and I have read stories of how people have seroconverted late with the -2 strain. Delayed seroconversion is not an 'urban myth' as stated by some.
 
Surely after 12 weeks of very real symptoms, I would have tested positive by now? The Doctors want me to look at other areas but how can I? I've had a big risk and have had so many symptoms that there is just no other possible outcome.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2012, 05:57:52 PM »
Whoa! Slow down, bud. Doing PEP was unwarranted but you did it so that's history now.

There was absolutely no risk from the second incident of kissing and having your penis handled. Zero risk.

The broken condom incident was a low level risk. HIV is significantly harder to transmit from female to male as contrasted with the other way around. It was a single and very brief risk during which you were protected until the condom broke.

With that negative result at 5.5 weeks I certainly expect you to continue to test negative. Mainly for your peace of mind I suggest you re-test at 3 months after having completed PEP. And I certainly expect you will test negative.

If any symptoms persist you should discuss them with your doctor. This is not an HIV situation. Really.
Andy Velez

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2012, 10:03:50 PM »
Hi Andy, thanks for your reply.
 
The test at 7 weeks was also taken just prior to starting PEP. Yes, in hindsight, the second incident probably didn't warrant PEP but I let my guard slip and went into panic overdrive as a result of the first episode. I was also concerned about a cut in my mouth.

So even if you started PEP 7 weeks after an episode, you still have to wait the three months after finishing it? This will be in one month's time.
 
Even though I've tested negative 19.5 weeks after the broken condom exposure and 8.5 weeks post PEP, I'm 100% convinced it will soon be positive there is just no other explanation.  The prostitute here in Africa probably has a high viral load as very few here are on treatment.  I have persistent sore lymph nodes which is sign of an infection and a constant white tongue which is a sign of a weakened immune system. Who knows what strain of the virus I could have contracted over here?

I've been to a Doctor over my symptoms, lots of them. On Monday I'll have blood taken for a whole host of other tests but deep down,  I know what the real issue is. I have never ever had any of these symptoms in my life. Now all of these known acute HIV symptoms come on shortly after an exposure? It's just no coincidence.

12 weeks of symptoms which are only getting worse. I just can't understand why I've not yet produced sufficient antibodies but I know that I soon will and a positive test is just around the corner.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2012, 10:08:35 PM »
Sorry to bust your bubble but ARS symptoms never last that long.

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2012, 04:10:11 AM »
Hi RapidRod,

Yes, I've read in a lot of different websites that ARS shouldn't last that long. But the amount of symptoms that I have at the moment (12 wks later) and the way I feel is just crazy. 

Since the onset of these symptoms I've continuously tested negative but here is my concern. When antibodies show up in sufficient numbers then the symptoms go away and the test will show positive soon after the symptoms have subsided, right? Or, should it be the case that as soon as symptoms show up (and a significant amount in my case) then antibody production will start as the body fights back and the test should show positive?

Surely antibodies would have shown up 12 weeks into symptoms? OK, I took PEP on the first week of the symptoms for 4 weeks and this may have an effect. However, the symptoms were exactly the same when on PEP as when off PEP. It made no difference.

I just don't think that it can be anything else.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2012, 09:45:15 AM »
Fortunately doubts and fears aren't facts. And I still expect you to test negative. There's really nothing more to add at this point. You have to wait and take your test.

Which as I have said I expect will be a negative result. 
Andy Velez

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2012, 10:09:05 AM »
I guess you're right Andy; more tests are the only answer despite fact that I've had 17 or 18 tests to date. However you did state that "this was not an HIV situation" but now you are recommending more tests. I'm just worried and confused that's all.
 
I've read on a lot of websites that a test should be positive shortly after the onset of symptoms. PEP made no difference to my symptoms as they were the same and just as strong when on it.

I know that I have to simply keep on testing and I feel like testing every day at the moment. Thanks.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2012, 10:30:08 AM »
My apologies. That was my error as I misread and was still thinking of a previous thread I had been reading.

No further HIV testing is necessary. You had a low level risk to begin with. And you have reliably tested negative.  You ARE HIV negative. Period. End of story.

Whatever is going on with you symptomatically has nothing to do with HIV. If your symptoms continue you need to pursue the matter with your doctor(s). 

This is not an HIV issue.
Andy Velez

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2012, 07:47:23 AM »
You seem very confident but my main concerns are:
-   Different strains of the virus in Africa with perhaps different window periods.
-   The Prostitute that I had sex with is a very high risk case (especially in Africa) If she is positive, then she is no doubt not on any treatment and has a high viral load.
-   I started PEP 7 weeks after the broken condom encounter (55hrs after the kissing and hand job) and took it for four weeks. This will no doubt affect the reliability of the tests. Ive tested negative 8.5. weeks after completion of PEP.
-   The symptoms. So many of them for the last 12 weeks (even through PEP). They are probably worse than ever now with no sign of them abating.
Im just waiting to test positive and can understand how you and other Doctors have said there is absolutely no risk of HIV. One Doctor laughed when I said that I refused to have sex with my Wife! What if I had listened to him and she subsequently became infected? 

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2012, 07:50:41 AM »
You seem very confident but my main concerns are:
-   Different strains of the virus in Africa with perhaps different window periods.
-   The Prostitute that I had sex with is a very high risk case (especially in Africa) If she is positive, then she is no doubt not on any treatment and has a high viral load.
-   I started PEP 7 weeks after the broken condom encounter (55hrs after the kissing and hand job) and took it for four weeks. This will no doubt affect the reliability of the tests. Ive tested negative 8.5. weeks after completion of PEP.
-   The symptoms. So many of them for the last 12 weeks (even through PEP). They are probably worse than ever now with no sign of them abating.
Im just waiting to test positive and can understand how you and other Doctors have said there is absolutely no risk of HIV. One Doctor laughed when I said that I refused to have sex with my Wife! What if I had listened to him and she subsequently became infected?
Move along you do not have an HIV concern.

Offline Ann

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2012, 08:04:08 AM »
DH,

Different strains do not have different window periods.

People are not high or low or no risk, ACTIVITIES are high or low or no risk. Being the insertive partner when a condom breaks is very much on the low end of the scale.

You started PEP after a NO RISK kissing incident. You started FAR too late for the broken condom incident, which is the only risk you have had. PEP must be started within 72 hours for it to be effective. You started seven WEEKS after the only risky incident you had.

The PEP will have no bearing on your test result concerning the broken condom. If you were hiv positive following the broken condom, you would have already seroconverted by the time you started PEP. PEP would not change your antibody results. You tested hiv negative 8.5 weeks after PEP because YOU DO NOT HAVE HIV!

You are conclusively hiv negative. You do NOT have hiv.

If you continue to feel unwell, see a doctor. It's nothing to do with hiv.

If it had anything to do with hiv, you would have tested positive by now. The symptoms that sometimes accompany hiv seroconversion are NOT due to the virus itself. They are due to the process the body goes through while producing antibodies. If your illness was due to the production of antibodies, you would have tested poz by now. You haven't because you do NOT have hiv.

If you read the Welcome Thread before posting like you're supposed to, you will have read the following posting guideline:

Quote

Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result or no-risk situation, will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.


Please consider yourself warned!

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2012, 08:45:32 AM »
OK Anne. Thanks for your comments and I note the warning.

I had another negative test this morning. That's 20 weeks from the broken condom incident and 9 weeks following completion of PEP.

I also gave blood for a whole host of other tests that the Doctor recommended to see if I can find out what is wrong as symptoms are still persisting for almost 13 weeks now.

Seroconversion is still my main fear though and I will still take a weekly antibody blood test.

Thanks for your time.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2012, 08:57:31 AM »
Man, you have made this situation so much more complicated than it had to be. That's what happens sometimes when you allow your fears to outrun the facts of the situation.

You can continue testing as long as you want to. It's totally a waste of resources and unncessary. You are way past the point of possibly seroconverting. I don't see any sound basis to doubt that you will do anything other than continue to collect negative results.

Cut out the drama and get on with your life. Really.
Andy Velez

Offline Ann

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2012, 09:52:14 AM »
DH,

I'm happy to hear your doctor is looking for other things that may be making you ill - because whatever is going on is NOT hiv. You do NOT have hiv. You have conclusively ruled hiv out of the picture.

Stop wasting your time testing for a virus you do not have.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2012, 12:22:26 PM »
I'm sorry for posting again but I'm simply in a desperate way. I have been reading stories on the "just tested poz" forum and it is riddled with stories of symptoms similar to mine and late or later than normal seroconversion, most recently jtb's story under the heading "I'm cooked". I have the exact same symptoms as him (and more) and even had the same exposure as him. Furthermore, the PEP I took has delayed seroconversion.

I just don't know what to do anymore? All I have thought about for the last 3 months (when symptoms started) is when I will test positive and when I will kill myself. I am not looking for sympathy; I am just in an absolutely desperate way with nobody to turn to. The only reason I have not yet killed myself is because I have not yet tested positive.  I am not being dramatic but you just cannot begin to imagine the stress and strain that I have been under for the last 3 months. It has just destroyed me and I have no fight left in me.
 
The stories of late or later than normal seroconversion on this site just show it is a common occurrence. The symptoms, so many symptoms that just won't go away. I have never had these in all of my life and they all came on 7 weeks after a broken condom incident with a high risk exposure. Andy, Anne, Rapidrod ... surely you have read these late seroconversion stories and have read of the stories where symptoms last weeks?

There is just no other explanation to this. I'm worn out and so scared. I will never see my family again. I cannot and will not live as a positive individual. I have come to terms with suicide and am ready when the day finally comes.

Again, I'm so sorry for this. I have nobody else!

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2012, 12:26:59 PM »
■Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result,  or no-risk situation will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #16 on: February 01, 2012, 12:53:34 PM »
Stop with all the drama including threatening suicide. Shame on you. You would do yourself a big favor if you stopped searching here and elsewhere for fuel to feed your worst fears.

You have unquestionably and reliably tested negative for HIV. You ARE HIV negative. Whatever is going on with you symptomatically has nothing to do with HIV. Instead of feeding your fears you should be working with doctor or doctors to find the real cause of your symptoms.

So stop this drama which is along with everything else an insult to the many here and in the world who are living with the virus. Your hysteria is really classic shame about having strayed sexually. If you can't let go of this unwarranted fear then along with seeing a doctor you should see a therapist or other professional to deal with you baseless fears.

Rod has warned you and I am going to repeat that warning. If you continue to return here insisting you're positive or about to be when we know you have absolutely no basis in HIV science to think so, then you are going to find yourself getting a Time Out from the site.

Andy Velez

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #17 on: February 13, 2012, 02:53:39 PM »
Andy/Ann/Rod,

Looking back on my previous posts, I apologise for the desperate and dramatic nature of my last post. As you said Andy, shame on me. It certainly was not my intention to insult anyone on the site who is living with the virus on a daily basis. If I came across like this, then I apologise. I was simply in a desperate state of mind when posting.

I had another negative DUO and rapid finger prick test today (22 wks post exposure and 11 wks post PEP which was taken too late). I also had a negative test last week.
 
I have been tested for a whole host of other illnesses/viruses as you insisted but unfortunately, these have not confirmed anything. 

I still have a rash on the shaft of my penis that just keeps coming and going as well as a rash on my upper inner thighs. Both armpits are always sore and I have a white furry tongue. These and other symptoms have now been present for almost 15 weeks.

I hope that you can understand why I can't move on? I had a condom break with a prostitute in Africa and have had every symptom in the book from 7 weeks post exposure. I have been trying to find her to ascertain her status but no luck. In my head, she is positive and if so, she no doubt has a high viral load as few are on treatment over here.

I have had so many different types of testing in three different countries (as noted in previous posts) but the symptoms and exposure have me extremely worried. I know Dr. Handsfield on Medhelp always says that "Tests overrule symptoms" but I'm struggling to grasp this simply because I have NEVER had any of these symptoms before and all of a sudden they appear after a high risk sexual exposure. What else am I supposed to think!

My exposure and especially the symptoms are just telling me one thing. You have also recommended counselling and I have tried this. I have even been prescribed anti-depressants but these don't help because all I can think about is more testing until such time as I test positive or hopefully, until such time as I test as far away from the date of exposure as is possible.

I apologise for coming back to this site and landing you with my troubles.

Thank you also for your previous comments which have certainly been helpful.
 

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2012, 04:58:54 PM »
I understand THAT you can't move on. The WHY of it ought to be addressed with a professional counselor.

You do not have HIV.

Oh, and you will note that the "Im cooked" guy never came back. This is the Internet. Sometimes Worried Wells such as yourself test and test until they invariably encounter a false positive. This is, of course, negated by follow up testing.

And sometimes we get trolled.

You'd do yourself a favor by finding some real help.
"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline ConfusedAndWorried

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2012, 10:35:07 PM »
Well i can see myself with your description to what you feel. IM in the same boat. Tested negative after 155 and 195 days and very worried. Now it is like 11 months after the exposure and still have symptoms mostly oral thrush, muscles and joints pain, lymph nodes swollen, red lines in the eyes and mostly enlarged thyroid.
I thought and still thinking about the suicide but i have a family and very afraid that i could have passed that virus to them, so i am in a more difficult situation than you and out of my mind. I am very afraid of taking the test now and as you said i got no one but these virtual people on these forums who scare for banning us. I know they do All they can. I guess people like yourself and me are sick physically and psycholgically. We definitely want to believe we are safe but the reality won't give us that fact. I hope this nightmare will end up very soon for both of us.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2012, 02:21:55 AM »
Well i can see myself with your description to what you feel. IM in the same boat. Tested negative after 155 and 195 days and very worried. Now it is like 11 months after the exposure and still have symptoms mostly oral thrush, muscles and joints pain, lymph nodes swollen, red lines in the eyes and mostly enlarged thyroid.
I thought and still thinking about the suicide but i have a family and very afraid that i could have passed that virus to them, so i am in a more difficult situation than you and out of my mind. I am very afraid of taking the test now and as you said i got no one but these virtual people on these forums who scare for banning us. I know they do All they can. I guess people like yourself and me are sick physically and psycholgically. We definitely want to believe we are safe but the reality won't give us that fact. I hope this nightmare will end up very soon for both of us.

Only those Moderators and members who are authorized to answer questions in the Am I Infected? forum are permitted do so. Unauthorized responses may be deleted without permission of the poster. Repeatedly posting replies of this nature may result in a Time Out or permanent ban, at the discretion of the Moderator Team.

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2012, 02:57:33 AM »
ConfusedandWorried,

Thanks for your response and I note Rod's warning. I've sent you a PM as a response.
 
jkinatl2, thanks for your comments.

Offline Ann

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2012, 05:37:54 AM »
Confused,

You need to read the rules in our Welcome Thread. You know, the one right at the top of the page that says Please read before posting?

If you post where you're not supposed to again, you will be given a time out, no question about it. Abide by our rules or go elsewhere.

Thank you for your cooperation.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Ann

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    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2012, 05:42:41 AM »
ConfusedandWorried,

Thanks for your response and I note Rod's warning. I've sent you a PM as a response.
 
jkinatl2, thanks for your comments.


Depressed,

Well, you may have sent him a PM but that's the last PM you'll send. I've removed your PM privileges and his too.

If you read the Welcome Thread before posting like you're supposed to, you will have read the following posting guideline:

Quote

Do NOT use Private Messages to question other members about any transmission, testing or symptom issues. These issues must be discussed in the public forum. Misuse of the PM function in this manner will result in your PM privileges being removed without warning.


I'm also giving you that time out you've been warned about. Enough is enough already.

You do NOT have hiv.

You are CONCLUSIVELY hiv negative whether you believe it or not.

Do not attempt to create a new account to get around your time out because if you do, you will be permanently banned.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline ConfusedAndWorried

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2012, 10:12:08 AM »
Hi admin,
As expected, thank you for banning us. All we try to do is comfort each other. Maybe our blood is a type where hiv cannot be easily detected. Anyways that is your choice and decision but won't change our view for hiv still aweird virus to Scientists.
Thanks for your time.

Offline Ann

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #25 on: February 14, 2012, 10:54:31 AM »
Hi admin,
As expected, thank you for banning us. All we try to do is comfort each other. Maybe our blood is a type where hiv cannot be easily detected. Anyways that is your choice and decision but won't change our view for hiv still aweird virus to Scientists.
Thanks for your time.

Con,

You're not banned (yet), I've only removed your PM privilege.

Post where you're not supposed to (anywhere other than your own thread) one more time and you will be given a time out - and do NOT reply to my post in this thread either.

This forum is not provided as a place for "worried wells" to egg each other on and we will not permit anyone to use it that way. You included.

Please consider yourself warned!

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #26 on: April 02, 2012, 03:54:23 AM »
I was given a time out recently but whilst banned, after almost 6 months I found the Woman from the condom break. She tested negative with two types of test so this was a huge relief for me. If I'm negative, it is proof that you can have EVERY symptom under the Sun, even ones that don't occur in most ARS cases and not have the virus.

However, I'm an expat working in sub-Saharan Africa where women are easily available and there is little to do other than go for a few beers at the weekend. After leaving a bar on Sat night I was chatting and just having a laugh with a couple of roadside prostitutes. Whilst taking to one, another playfully had my hand and was rubbing it against her leg (she had a mini skirt on). In a brief moment of absolute drunken madness, for 2 - 3 seconds my index and middle finger can into contact with her labia. Normally I wouldn't even bat an eyelid at this but I had what I would call a paper cut on my middle finger from earlier on in the day. It was about 1cm long and though it never bled, it was open at the time. My fingers were moist after the 2 3 seconds and I immediately did what I could to wipe them clean.

Because of what happened previously, I'm worried. I took one of the Women's phone numbers as I knew straight away that I had a problem and might want her to test. I have decided to hand in my notice shortly and go home. This place and my stupid behaviour is very dangerous for me and I need to get away from it. Thing is, I could never do this at home. 

How risky is this?
 

Offline Ann

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #27 on: April 02, 2012, 05:41:34 AM »

Because of what happened previously, I'm worried. I took one of the Women's phone numbers as I knew straight away that I had a problem and might want her to test.


Depressed,

The ONLY problem you have is in your own head. You have been previously told that sexually speaking, the ONLY proven risks are unprotected anal or vaginal intercourse. You didn't have unprotected intercourse - you touched a woman's labia.

Fingering, with or without cuts, hangnails or whatever, is NOT a risk for hiv infection. Not one person has EVER been infected this way and you are not going to be the first.

You do not need to test over this incident.

You do not need to force this woman to test for your peace of mind. It doesn't matter whether or not she's hiv positive - YOU HAD NO RISK.

I agree with you - you should go home. The place isn't a danger to you, but you and your paranoid attitude is a danger to the place's peoples. Go home.

Please remember when you get home - hiv isn't only present in Africa. You need to use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, no matter where in the world you live. IT REALLY IS THAT SIMPLE!!!

Don't bother coming back with more worries about this fingering incident. If you do, you will be given another Time Out.

Please consider yourself warned!!!

Ann

 
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Depressed Head

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #28 on: April 03, 2012, 05:11:58 AM »
Thank you for your comments Anne and I note the warning.

I found your below comments to a previous poster regarding the same issue very interesting as I also only came into contact with the Woman's external genitals, only for about 2 - 3 seconds, I did not insert my finger.
 
"NO. It is the cervicovaginal fluid that is infectious in a woman. This is actually a thick mucus that covers and protects the cervix, which is found deep within the vaginal. The lubricating fluid that a woman produces when sexually excited comes from the bartholin glands, which are found on either side of the vaginal opening. I have not found one shred of evidence that this lubricating fluid is infectious - it's like sweat or tears, and sweat and tears are NOT infectious fluids. You would not have been in contact with infectious fluid when you touched her clit or any other part of her external genitals"

I have also heard people comment that the relevant cells that the virus binds to are not found in the finger but wouldn't think that this info is accurate.

Deep down I suppose I know that you are right but it's very easy for fears to get the better of you.
 
Thanks again and I will get on with things and leave you to address more serious risks.

Offline Ann

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Re: Positive - No other explanation
« Reply #29 on: April 03, 2012, 07:56:30 AM »

I have also heard people comment that the relevant cells that the virus binds to are not found in the finger but wouldn't think that this info is accurate.


Depressed,

And you know what, exactly, about what types of cells hiv can infect and what, exactly, about where these cells are and are not found? Going by your comment above, you know absolutely nothing.

We're not here to teach you the finer points of hiv transmission on the cellular level nor are we here to give you anatomy lessons.

I'm giving you that second time out that you've been warned about. It will last 56 days. Do not attempt to create a new account to get around your time out because if you do, you will be permanently banned.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

 


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