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Author Topic: most likely irrational but pleae humour me  (Read 3098 times)

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Offline emilyh

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most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« on: June 21, 2011, 05:15:49 PM »
ok so I went for my HIV DUO today at 28 days, negative.  Yay!! 

I live in Dubai and the STD clinic is different to what we are used to in the western world.  When I went into the room I asked her to make sure she used a new needle and I def saw her pick one out of the draw.  I  however did not watch to make sure that the needle she picked out was the one that she put in my arm.

My concern is that if there was an old (capped) needle on the bench and she mistook if for the new one she could have used that on me.

If this did happen what is the likelihood of transmission occuring?  I know its irrational but what I am asking is if due to human error she just messed up would I be infected from this?

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2011, 05:24:43 PM »
Frankly we are not going to get into speculative what ifs about this situation. Stop making yourself nutz with things that will never get answered.

Be glad about your negative result. If you had a genuine risk such as unprotected vaginal or anal intercourse, you still need to re-test at 13 weeks for a conclusive negative result.

Andy Velez

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2011, 05:25:58 PM »
So basically don't worry about it?

Because its so irrational or because its not a risk?

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2011, 05:47:19 PM »
Because it's all speculative and you can endlessly think up potential risks that simply didn't/don't happen.

This kind of fear is not that unusual but that doesn't make it any less out to lunch.
Andy Velez

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2011, 10:53:21 AM »
Ok so i totally get what you are saying, if you could just respond to my following question it would help me greatly move on from this anxiety.

There had been at least 13 hours between me and the previous client, I was the first one in the clinic.  IF (and I do understand its an if) there was blood left in a capped hollow bore needle and that needle was used on me would the virus still be alive or would it have died due to 13 hours having passed?

If you could please just answer this it would help me greatly, I really do understand that I sound irrational but this answer will help greatly.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2011, 10:59:43 AM »
The don't reuse needles.

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2011, 11:02:47 AM »
I know, I know I really do but just to put my anxious mind at ease I want to know if 13 hours would be long enough with a capped needle.

I am newly pregnant and was so relieved for the negative result I received but I really really just want to understand if 13 hours would be enough time.  Please help, the anxiety is messing with me so it must be messing with the baby as well :(

Offline RapidRod

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2011, 11:04:03 AM »
■Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result or no-risk situation, will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2011, 11:07:58 AM »
Serioulsy I understand what you have all said I honestly do.  Its just that looking through your archives here I found a couple of posts from a moderator that said that in uncapped hollow bore needles the virus only survives a few minutes (hence why it is generally immediate transfer with drug users) and another that said that even in the body it will only survive 90 mins if it doesn't bump into the right cells.

I figured that if this is right then the 13 hours for me means its fine.  Its all I want to know and then I wont come back with more questions I just want to know if this is right and that my 13 hours means nothing to worry about, that really is it.

Seriously hormones can make a person crazy, please help

Offline Ann

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2011, 11:14:55 AM »
Emily,

Health care workers do not re-cap used needles because it poses the risk of needle-stick injury while replacing the cap. Used needles are put uncapped into a sharps container directly after use. Health care workers are very careful with used needles for their OWN protection.

If you cannot put this irrational fear behind you, I suggest you seek out counselling. We cannot help you with that here.

You did NOT have a risk for hiv infection during your hiv test.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2011, 11:17:48 AM »
I know and like I said.  All i want to somebody to tell me if I am right with my analysis of the science side of it.

Please know that I get it and I know that it is irrational.  Just to get it straight in my mind I just want to know about the time frame.  I don't want to keep coming back and forth but you guys seem to really know your stuff and I am asking for you to help me with that knowledge, that is all I need and then I wont come back.  Honest.

Please

Offline Ann

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    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2011, 11:23:05 AM »
Emily,

You are not going to become infected with hiv from a needle lying around for thirteen hours, capped or not.

You are on the verge of being given that time out Rodney warned you about.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2011, 11:26:03 AM »
Thank you so much Ann, that was all that I needed to know.

Offline emilyh

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P24 antigen
« Reply #13 on: April 23, 2012, 03:31:30 AM »
Hi,
Could somebody please tell me if a p24 antigen, as a stand alone test no antibody, at 15 days past an exposure tells me anything about my status?

I know it's not a conclusive test but is it a pretty good indication?

Thanks

Offline Ann

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #14 on: April 23, 2012, 04:06:36 AM »
Emily,

What are you imagining put you at risk this time? Unless it was unprotected anal or vaginal intercourse, you're likely worrying (and testing) for no good reason.

The p24 test is not a stand-alone test and no, a fourteen day test is not conclusive. There are no short-cuts when it comes to hiv testing.

If you have actually had a risk, the earliest you should test is at six weeks. The vast majority of people who have actually been infected will seroconvert and test positive by six weeks, with the average time to seroconversion being only 22 days.

A six week negative must be confirmed at the three month point - when there has actually been a risk - but is highly unlikely to change.

The p24 test is usually "bundled" into a standard antibody test and it's put there because it can sometimes catch an infection a little earlier. However, while any negative result is a good result, a negative p24 test is by NO means conclusive.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline emilyh

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  • Posts: 14
Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #15 on: April 23, 2012, 07:07:41 AM »
Thanks Ann, the honest truth is I don't know but probably nothing. I went out on the weekend and drank too much, I don't normally drink much because I get anxiety. I had a blackout and don't remember leaving the bar or getting home, I do remember talking to some guys at the bar though. I woke up in my own bed, alone.

I asked my friend who was staying with me and she days that to her knowledge nothing happened, yes we were talking to these guys but she says that's it, although her memory is a little hazy as well and she has no idea how we got home.

My anxiety has gone into overdrive and I am worrying about the what if's e.g did I have unprotected sex with one of them. Probably not but a black out coupled with high anxiety is not a good combo.

It's one of those things that I have no idea of knowing if anything happened or not, although my friend thinks that if I had slept with one of them surely I'd no about it!!??

I've no idea and am wondering if I should test just in case.

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #16 on: April 23, 2012, 07:58:46 AM »
Emily,

Yes, if you had sex with one of them, you would know. You do not need testing unless it is part of a yearly, routine sexual health check up. You do not need to test over imaginary sex.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #17 on: July 26, 2012, 11:54:25 AM »
Hi ann and others,

To be honest I am embarassed to be back on here and feel that given everythign that I have read on tranmission lessons etc.. I know what you are all going to say.  Clearly by the tone of my previous posts it is obvious to anybody reading them that I have an anxiety issue but this one involves my daughter and I really need to ask you guys as you are experts.

I was in the airport with my daughter, she was playing in a play area and we ate in a restaurant.  I noticed that she had blood on two of her fingers and I freaked out, I have a feelign that it came from the play area but I really don't know.  She is only 6 and is a bit of a nose picker, fiddler etc... and I am just really worried that if she had blood on her fingers and then was picking her nose, rubbing her eyes etc.. this is a concern for her.

I don't think it is but I really need to ask you guys to explain it to me, she had no cuts or anything where the blood was so I don't think she had any contact with anybody.

So.. blood on fingers then touching mucuc membranes, eyes etc... risk or no risk.

I would really appreciate a response.  I am really sorry for coming back but its my daughter and I just don't want her to be at risk.  Please can you tell me if she is ok or not.

Again, sorry but I know that you guys will tell me 100% the truth.

Thanks

Offline RapidRod

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #18 on: July 26, 2012, 11:59:36 AM »
Seek professional mental help for your HIV phobias, at no time was your daughter at risk of contracting HIV.

Offline emilyh

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  • Posts: 14
Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #19 on: July 26, 2012, 12:46:42 PM »
Rod, you have a very valid point and I know I need help. I was put at risk years ago buy a person who I was in a monogamous relationship with and I've never really gotten over it. It needs addressing.

Ann, do you agree. If the blood from her fingers got in her nose or eyes absolutely no risk? She is only 6 and means the world to me. I don't want her to pick up on my anxieties which is why I'm asking you.

Thanks and I am sorry

Offline Ann

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    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #20 on: July 27, 2012, 03:55:03 AM »
emily,

Yes, I agree that your daughter has not been a risk.

And if you think that she hasn't already picked up on your anxieties, you're deluding yourself. Kids are extremely perceptive when it comes to emotions, but they don't have the language to discuss it. Get yourself into therapy for your daughter's sake before she ends up as neurotic as you.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #21 on: July 27, 2012, 05:20:18 AM »
Thanks for that Ann, I know I'm not helping her and I am also aware I need to sort myself out with respect to this. I actually just visited my doctor and got some SSRI's and have been put on a wait list for therapy.

I just read an awesome post by you which really explained why environmental exposure simply cannot happen and it said that the outer shell was damaged in seconds and without this intact infection is impossible. Is this thinking still valid?  If it is it really really helps me to understand why anything outside of sex and drugs is not a risk.

Thanks

Offline Ann

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #22 on: July 27, 2012, 05:55:36 AM »

I just read an awesome post by you which really explained why environmental exposure simply cannot happen and it said that the outer shell was damaged in seconds and without this intact infection is impossible. Is this thinking still valid? 


Yes, it is still valid. It's the science of hiv transmission. Hiv is extremely fragile and its outer shell needs to be intact in order for it to latch onto the types of cells it infects. Good thing too - if it wasn't so fragile, many, many more people would be hiv positive.

I hope therapy helps you. There's no reason for you to be so worried about hiv. Just make sure your partner is wearing a condom and you'll be just fine where hiv is concerned.

Just in case you haven't seen this elsewhere...

Here's what you need to know in order to avoid hiv infection:

You need to be using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, every time, no exceptions until such time as you are in a securely monogamous relationship where you have both tested for ALL sexually transmitted infections together.

To agree to have unprotected intercourse is to consent to the possibility of being infected with an STI. Sex without a condom lasts only a matter of minutes, but hiv is forever.

Have a look through the condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use condoms with confidence.

Anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care check-up, including but not limited to hiv testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.

If you aren't already having regular, routine check-ups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine hiv tests to return with negative results.

Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than hiv. Some of the other STIs can be present with no obvious symptoms, so the only way to know for sure is to test.

Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple!

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #23 on: July 27, 2012, 09:10:04 AM »
Thanks Ann, for your patience and advice. Contrary to how I am sure I am coming across I'm not a total nutter :)

Thanks for explaining it all to me and for making me prioritise my thinking and make me realise how behaviour is surely effecting my daughter.

Take care, thank you and I hope you keep doing this, you have no idea how much you help x

Offline emilyh

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #24 on: August 01, 2012, 10:46:57 PM »
I have decided to educate myself as it seems that it is easy to misunderstand transmission and risks.

I have read alot of what you guys have written and there is one thing that I am confused about and hope somebody can explain to me.

In a scenario where somebody is cut on say a piece of metal and bleeds and then 10 or 20 seconds later another person is cut and bleeds, so cuts are bad enough to cause bleeding, why would this not lead to transmission. The exceptionally short time frame between fluid transfer is what has me confused.

Can somebody explain this to me, it seems that anything in the environment is not a risk even when fluid transfer is within a short space of time I.e seconds.

If I can just understand this then I wi be able rationalise risks myself.

Thanks

Offline Ann

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Re: most likely irrational but pleae humour me
« Reply #25 on: August 02, 2012, 06:25:27 AM »
Emily,

By your own admission, you've already read why environmental transmission just isn't an issue.


I just read an awesome post by you which really explained why environmental exposure simply cannot happen


I'm giving you that time out you've been warned about. Do not attempt to create a new account to get around your time out because if you do, you will be permanently banned.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

 


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