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Author Topic: bisexual  (Read 18820 times)

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Offline LM

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  • Posts: 409
Re: bisexual
« Reply #50 on: June 22, 2011, 07:03:22 PM »
next2u, I think it's cool you talk about your attraction towards the opposite sex. I believe in Kinsey's scale, but society tries too much to label us as "straight" or "gay". And there's so much in between.

spacebarsux, I think it's all in your mind. If you want, you can be monogamous with anyone. However, considering our nature (human nature, that is), being monogamous is quite difficult. So I think I would have to be pretty happy with what I had at the moment. And this is an aspect that is crucial for everyone. You see many men, straight or gay, in happy relationships, but they still cheat sometimes just because they are unhappy with other aspects of their life.

But all in all, I can't say for sure, because no one can, but I think it would be easier to be monogamous with a girl.

You said that you don't think you could be monogamous with a woman in the long-run. What about with a man?

Offline spacebarsux

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #51 on: June 23, 2011, 12:16:20 AM »

funny thing - im kinda embarrassed to post this...i considered not posting this many times. its like i feel like if i talk about any attraction towards the opposite sex people will either ridicule me or push me towards that. i say all good things in their time.

Why are you embarrassed about it next2u? Its quite good to talk about it. :)


.

You said that you don't think you could be monogamous with a woman in the long-run. What about with a man?

I could be monogamous with the right guy, yes. But finding the right one hasn't been easy.

Infected-  2005 or early 2006; Diagnosed- Jan 28th, 2011; Feb '11- CD4 754 @34%, VL- 39K; July '11- CD4 907@26%,  VL-81K; Feb '12- CD4 713 @31%, VL- 41K, Nov '12- CD4- 827@31%

Offline pat46

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #52 on: June 26, 2011, 12:31:36 PM »
came across this website VISIBLE.BISOCIALNETWORK.COM , might be of interest to some,good luck.pat

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #53 on: June 28, 2011, 10:27:25 AM »
You know, on the topic of threesomes, I still have to try more. I've done it with 2 guys.. it was good, but kind of awkward. They were boyfriends, and one of them kept whispering in my ear that he wanted me just for him.

I would love to try with 2 girls, but especially with a guy and a girl. Now that's gotta be something.

Offline Solo_LTSurvivor

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #54 on: June 29, 2011, 01:12:36 PM »
Wait. Hal Sparks is bi???

http://visible.bisocialnetwork.com/bis-around-town-hal-sparks-and-the-bisexual/

You mean that show wasn't real and he never was involved with Robert Gant?  Shit.

Carry on.  Back to threesomes.
don't equate intelligence with lack of masculinity
Jim Phelps, Mission Impossible
____________________________

Seroconverted: Early 80s
Tested & confirmed what I already knew: early 90s

Current regimen: Atripla. 
Last regimen:  Epzicom, Sustiva (since its inception with NO adverse side effects: no vivid dreams and NONE of the problems people who can't tolerate this drug may experience: color me lucky ::))
Past regimens
Fun stuff (in the past):  HAV/HBV, crypto, shingles, AIDS, PCP

Jan 2012: 818/21%
Apr 2012: 964/22%
Jul. 2012: 890/21%
Oct. 2012: 920/23%

Still UD after all these years

Offline Valmont

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #55 on: August 03, 2011, 12:49:26 PM »
I´ve seen this thread some weeks ago and I immediately felt concerned...

Well, as I´m a little more quiet these days, it makes me easier talking about some aspect of myself and particularly bisexuality...  I can now talk these things quietly and objectively.

It is a hard matter because I believe my curiosity in that kind of sexuality (I explain after why I refer to sexuality...) make my whole life changed so deeply...  Because I got infected that way and because I exposed my wife…

I always have been attired by girls and women and I´m still.  I love her and I cannot imagine living my life without women love.  Sexually, I feel very confortable and I always enjoyed a lot sex with women.  I had my first sexual relation very early and I have always had a lot of curiosity for sex.

At around 20, I started to have curiosity with men, but only in a sexual way.  I´ve never felt falling in love with a man or being attracted as I could have been with a women.  My interest was sexual and relationated with new experience.  Particularly, what about sexual things I could not experimented with women.

I started to communicate with men in internet and then to meet some of them only for sex (very few, in a large time), using a period I was single.  I had relation maybe 2 or 3 times a year.  But it always have been difficult to find one person for that, I wanted a little more than only sex, a kind of special friendship with someone that was experimenting the same as I. 

I enjoyed a lot sex with men, but only sex, and this gave me the curiosity to look for more…  By another way, I need woman´s love and the kind of relationship I can have with women…

For mi, the idea situation is being loved by a woman, but having sex with men, sometimes…..  That not a good way how to built anything strong, no?  Any kind of family…  Who accepts that?  It oblige to lie at the end…

Then, I knew my wife, I told her in the first weeks that I had sexual relations with men, but this was so strong for her to accept, and I was so in love with her that we never talk again the point because I was afraid to loose her…

After a few years, the need of being with men came again and I started having meeting with guys I met in internet, very few times in the year, always protected.  I was starting accepting I´m a bisexual and that there is nothing to do with this (anyway I hate categories, because things are much more complexes…).  For external other reasons, my relationship with my wife was getting each time worth, but I decided to go on because I did not want to lose my family…

Then, one day, with a man, we had a problem with the condom, it slipped into me and the guy end up into me…  I´m sure I got infected that way…

Of course, probabilities were very low and the few times I had sex with my wife, we did not take any special cares.  From being quiet and tranquil, I went for a test I imagined I would have been negative, but as most of us here, I could not imagine this could have happened to me…
And here I am…  What a mess, as someone said…

I don´t know why I telling all this, but it makes me good…  You cannot imagine how I feel with this…
It is like something went wrong…  I´m a very planificated person, I choose a difficult life, travelling, with many challenges and everything was going well.  I was dealing well with everything, but at the end, I broke it all because of the way how I managed my life…

I still cannot understand…  In the past I felt guilty or as if it was a shame to have the kind of attracting I had, or to decide to experiment…  I thought I could live this life like many other people do….  I feel I´ve been selfish, I think…  But anyway, I don´t have regrets expect about the fact I exposed my wife to HIV (she still does not want to test herself…).  Maybe I should have not been married…..  Well, past is past, and nothing serves thinking of that, mistakes have been done…

What I believe for now is that bisexuality is extremely difficult to live (in my case)…  It is also very dangerous if one is not loyal with the person he lives or he is in relation with.  But by another way, who accepts being or living with a person that lives that way?

For now, I don´t want to know anything of sex with men, but I know it is maybe a matter of time, things don´t change at all…  I feel like if I had done it all wrong from the beginning and I even did not noticed anything…  I cannot imagine I´m in the situation I am now, I would have never imaginated it ever…

Curiously, I deal fairly well with the fact I´m now living with HIV, but that are all the consideration around me that are so heaving to deal with: my family and what I´ve done…  I always thought I was not hurting to anyone with my lifestyle, but I´ve been wrong.  I´m certainly not a good person for that, but I don´t think I´m a bad person… 

Everything escaped me from control…  Can you understand me????

Apr 2011: Diagnotized
Jun 2011: CD4: 504  VL: 176.000
Dic 2011: CD4: 714  VL: 95.000
May 2012: CD4: 395 VL: 67.000
Jun 2012: CD4: 367
Agu 2012: Starting Emtricitabine 200 mg / Tenofovir 300 mg and Efavirenz 600 mg (2 pills) different brands or VIRADAY/ATRIPLA/Mylan....
Sep 2012: VL: 138
Dic 2012: CD4: 708 VL: <34  %CD4: 32%
Jan 2013: CD4: 707 VL: <20
May 2013: CD4: 945 VL: <34 %CD4: 33%
Agu 2013: CD4: 636 VL: <34 %CD4: 50%
Dic 2013: Latent TB, started Isoniazid

Offline spacebarsux

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #56 on: August 03, 2011, 01:44:11 PM »
Valmont you should convince your wife to get tested.
Infected-  2005 or early 2006; Diagnosed- Jan 28th, 2011; Feb '11- CD4 754 @34%, VL- 39K; July '11- CD4 907@26%,  VL-81K; Feb '12- CD4 713 @31%, VL- 41K, Nov '12- CD4- 827@31%

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #57 on: August 03, 2011, 02:19:05 PM »
Valmont, I can't say it doesn't piss me off to read what you've done. You've been extremely selfish and if you couldn't control your urges, you shouldn't have gotten married or at least you should have been with someone who accepted an open relationship. Then, you should have been more careful and not put your wife at risk. It's because of people like you that there is so much prejudice against bisexuals.

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #58 on: August 03, 2011, 04:25:11 PM »
Valmont, I can't say it doesn't piss me off to read what you've done. You've been extremely selfish and if you couldn't control your urges, you shouldn't have gotten married or at least you should have been with someone who accepted an open relationship. Then, you should have been more careful and not put your wife at risk. It's because of people like you that there is so much prejudice against bisexuals.

So you tell everyone person you have sex with that you're bisexual -- as in you're 100% out of the closet about this at all times with all people?
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #59 on: August 03, 2011, 04:42:49 PM »
So you tell everyone person you have sex with that you're bisexual -- as in you're 100% out of the closet about this at all times with all people?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you trying to compare marrying someone and cheating on that person, without protection, to telling everyone you have sex with that you're bisexual?

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #60 on: August 03, 2011, 04:52:53 PM »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you trying to compare marrying someone and cheating on that person, without protection, to telling everyone you have sex with that you're bisexual?

Just asking the question, that's all -- obviously you prefer not to answer it, which is your right of course.  Valmont did disclose his bisexual issues to his new wife early in the relationship if I read his post correctly -- the wife chose not to discuss it further. Frankly IMO they're both a bit at fault with that point.

And you know what, you might think I'm a big queer with no experience in this issue but you'd be wrong. When I first began having sex at the ate of 18 it was with both women and men, and at that young age and even way back in the early 80's I was always open with this issue with all partners. 

Basically it boils down to being spineless or not -- so if one lacks a bit of spine maybe it's not a great idea to throw around petty judgements.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #61 on: August 03, 2011, 05:05:33 PM »
Just asking the question, that's all -- obviously you prefer not to answer it, which is your right of course.  Valmont did disclose his bisexual issues to his new wife early in the relationship if I read his post correctly -- the wife chose not to discuss it further. Frankly IMO they're both a bit at fault with that point.

And you know what, you might think I'm a big queer with no experience in this issue but you'd be wrong. When I first began having sex at the ate of 18 it was with both women and men, and at that young age and even way back in the early 80's I was always open with this issue with all partners. 

Basically it boils down to being spineless or not -- so if one lacks a bit of spine maybe it's not a great idea to throw around petty judgements.

It's not a problem for me to answer it, I just didn't see the point. Unless agreed otherwise, in a relationship, you expect commitment. Just disclosing you're bisexual doesn't make it ok for you to sleep around, if this was not discussed before in the relationship. The times I have tried a long-term relationship, I told them both I was bisexual. I didn't sleep around and I assured them that I would be monogamous and that it wouldn't be in the way of our relationship. Regardless, none of them took it well and broke up with me, out of fear I would cheat on them with men and spread to them any STDs. Why? Well, as you can see, we have examples of that, huh...

Offline Jeff G

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #62 on: August 03, 2011, 05:50:50 PM »
LM ... before you judge and condemn Valmont why don't you read what you wrote in June ... seems you are hardly a spokesperson for the virtuous bisexual .



Quote from LM on June 27
You know, on another note, I'm bissexual, and I'm not open about that. Some friends know, but not many. About HIV, some will know eventually, but not many either. I have thought about being open about all that, but it wouldn't work for me, not right now. I wish I were a paragon in the fight against the stigma of HIV, but I have so many issues that I lack the power and even the strength for it. I do feel that perhaps one day, if I am in a better position than I am right now, I see that I can make a difference and I have the strength to face it all, then I might come out about it.

Offline Nestor

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #63 on: August 03, 2011, 06:10:33 PM »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you trying to compare marrying someone and cheating on that person, without protection, to telling everyone you have sex with that you're bisexual?

But he doesn't say he didn't use protection.  He says there was a problem with the condom.  Big difference. 

Even if you want to take a hard line on monogamy, why would this give a bad name to bisexuals, any more than the numerous heterosexuals who cheat give a bad name to heterosexuality? 
Summer 2004--became HIV+
Dec. 2005--found out

Date          CD4    %       VL
Jan. '06    725    25      9,097
Nov. '06    671    34     52,202
Apr. '07    553    30      24,270
Sept. '07  685    27       4,849
Jan. '08    825    29       4,749
Mar. '08    751    30     16,026
Aug. '08    653    30       3,108
Oct. '08     819    28     10,046
Jan '09      547    31     13,000
May '09     645   25        6,478
Aug. '09    688   30      19,571
Nov. '09     641    27       9,598
Feb. '10     638    27       4,480
May '10      687      9    799,000 (CMV)
July '10      600     21      31,000
Nov '10      682     24     15,000
June '11     563    23     210,000 (blasto)
July  '11      530    22      39,000
Aug '11      677     22      21,000
Sept. '12    747     15      14,000

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #64 on: August 03, 2011, 06:13:18 PM »
So not telling everyone I meet I'm bisexual is on par to cheating on your wife and putting her risk for STDs? Right on, you guys, you certainly follow a great sense of morality.  ;)

Nestor, that's the view many people have on bisexuals. They marry women, sleep around with men and then give them HIV.

Offline Jeff G

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #65 on: August 03, 2011, 06:19:07 PM »
So not telling everyone I meet I'm bisexual is on par to cheating on your wife and putting her risk for STDs? Right on, you guys, you certainly follow a great sense of morality.  ;)

Nestor, that's the view many people have on bisexuals. They marry women, sleep around with men and then give them HIV.

I'm just suggesting if you are a closet fag with the butt flu maybe you shouldn't be judging other peoples relationships . You missed the point again .

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #66 on: August 03, 2011, 06:22:45 PM »
I'm just suggesting if you are a closet fag with the butt flu maybe you shouldn't be judging other peoples relationships . You missed the point again .

You're one to talk about judging. But please, do tell me, why would it be wrong if I'm not open about being bisexual? I'm anxious to hear.

Offline Valmont

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #67 on: August 03, 2011, 06:31:26 PM »
Well, many thanks for your comments...

I was not try to justify actions that I do consider completely fool, but telling my story...  And of course, it is fair to receive any feedback, positive or negative...


The problem, I believe, is no so much what we are but what we do...  And LM is right...

Things we do can make one have regrets, but things are done...  Of course, I´m feel sad and miserable...  But I should have thought this before, no?  The things would have been different if I would have met a woman instead of a man?  No I don´t think so...

This matter is more about fidelity...  In the middle of that I was thinking that using condom, going for a good time and them, normal life will go on and nobody would never know about that...

I think mine is most commun that we can imagine, there is many married men that look for a one-day sex relation with another one, and nothing more...

I failed to build a family because of selfish decision I took, because I decided to open a Pandora Box...  I should not have been married?  Maybe...

I disclosed to my wife, but for sure, this does not allow to sleep around...

Well, it´s done and cannot be repaired, this has escaped me for completely, sure I should have thought about that before, but don´t think I don´t care, this is a very heavy situation I have to deal with, I´m very shamy about that and never imagine this could happened to me...  And sometimes I think my life don´t worth a lot, I still go on only because I believe suicide does not mean anything and because anyway, there are still things I can do, I can do better...  I have a son I love that did not asked for anything, and my wife still deny HIV situation (I´m aware she has to be tested as soon as possible, I insist her)....

... But I also know I´m the worst of the worst... not to say anything else !





I was posting, but 4 posts appeared...

Ok, about the relations I had outside (and before marriage), I always used condom.  In last relation, we had a problem with it at the end...  I never imagine in being infected, I talked with this guy and he was so scared as I.  I decided immediatly to make a test after 6 weeks and here I am...  The statistics..............  

LM, the problem would be the same if the married man goes to another woman, or ever if the woman goes sleeping with another man; it is not only bisexuality...  And what´s about men that goes to prostitute?

I wonder if it was a good idea to tell my history...
Apr 2011: Diagnotized
Jun 2011: CD4: 504  VL: 176.000
Dic 2011: CD4: 714  VL: 95.000
May 2012: CD4: 395 VL: 67.000
Jun 2012: CD4: 367
Agu 2012: Starting Emtricitabine 200 mg / Tenofovir 300 mg and Efavirenz 600 mg (2 pills) different brands or VIRADAY/ATRIPLA/Mylan....
Sep 2012: VL: 138
Dic 2012: CD4: 708 VL: <34  %CD4: 32%
Jan 2013: CD4: 707 VL: <20
May 2013: CD4: 945 VL: <34 %CD4: 33%
Agu 2013: CD4: 636 VL: <34 %CD4: 50%
Dic 2013: Latent TB, started Isoniazid

Offline Joe K

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #68 on: August 03, 2011, 07:00:43 PM »
It's not a problem for me to answer it, I just didn't see the point. Unless agreed otherwise, in a relationship, you expect commitment. Just disclosing you're bisexual doesn't make it ok for you to sleep around, if this was not discussed before in the relationship. The times I have tried a long-term relationship, I told them both I was bisexual. I didn't sleep around and I assured them that I would be monogamous and that it wouldn't be in the way of our relationship. Regardless, none of them took it well and broke up with me, out of fear I would cheat on them with men and spread to them any STDs. Why? Well, as you can see, we have examples of that, huh...

I'm curious, did they actually say that your being bisexual was the sole reason for breaking up with you?

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #69 on: August 03, 2011, 07:29:09 PM »
Valmont, you told your story and I told what I felt about it. You know it, but I think you needed to hear from someone else that you fucked up. Despite that, I hope your wife is ok, that she forgives you in any case and that you guys can be happy together. I hope whatever lesson you get from this, you make sure that you don't do the same mistakes. I believe you should find the roots of your infidelity. Is it just guys, or would you do it with women as well? Infidelity is all around, that's true, but what happened to you is the stereotype of bisexuals, and it's terrible to see it happen again and again. I can't tell you what to do, but I think you should think better about what you really want in life if you don't want to hurt your wife and son.

This topic gets to me because I've been always been adamant about infidelity. I saw my father cheating on my mom countless times and how it made her unhappy. Not only that, but I didn't want to be that guy that has a perfect marriage but who sleeps with men on the side, like many expect from bisexuals.

killfoile, and this goes back to your question. Yes, the first one told me she loved me, but that she couldn't be with me because I was bisexual. The second one I told right in the beginning and she took it well, found it "cool", but as things got more serious, she started to get worried about it and eventually broke up with me. She made it implicit it was because of that. Maybe not the sole reason, but surely the main one.

Offline Valmont

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #70 on: August 03, 2011, 07:55:44 PM »
I never had a long term relationship at the same time as my marriage. I only met men for a couple of hours, men I did not know, only for sex...  I´ve never involved feelings.  I´ve never done it with other women...  I was believing fidelity was much more than only sex (maybe an easy way to justify a conduct I knew wrong...)

I don´t think my infection is a bisexual problem, it could have happened exactly in a same way if I would have gone to prostitutes, or not?...  Or maybe the problem was telling my story as it happened?

When I decided to get married, I did not think I will have this kind of moment I can count in one hand...  I would not have married...  But you know, with the time, curiosity....

You know, when people get married, they never imagine they can divorce in the future, they don´t imagine they can feel in love with other people...  Life is impossible to predict...  But for sure, what is important is the way how we take our decisions, this is the difficult part...  I´m clear about what I should do in the future, but what is broken is...  I want to repair what is possible, I want to be a better person I am...

Apr 2011: Diagnotized
Jun 2011: CD4: 504  VL: 176.000
Dic 2011: CD4: 714  VL: 95.000
May 2012: CD4: 395 VL: 67.000
Jun 2012: CD4: 367
Agu 2012: Starting Emtricitabine 200 mg / Tenofovir 300 mg and Efavirenz 600 mg (2 pills) different brands or VIRADAY/ATRIPLA/Mylan....
Sep 2012: VL: 138
Dic 2012: CD4: 708 VL: <34  %CD4: 32%
Jan 2013: CD4: 707 VL: <20
May 2013: CD4: 945 VL: <34 %CD4: 33%
Agu 2013: CD4: 636 VL: <34 %CD4: 50%
Dic 2013: Latent TB, started Isoniazid

Offline BT65

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #71 on: August 04, 2011, 07:02:08 AM »
You're one to talk about judging.

Just what do you mean by this?  Throughout this whole thread, I've read not one iota of judgment from Jg1962.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #72 on: August 04, 2011, 11:59:15 AM »
You're one to talk about judging. But please, do tell me, why would it be wrong if I'm not open about being bisexual? I'm anxious to hear.

Are you honestly that daft? If one is in a relationship the other partner expects a high level of openness and honesty. Sexuality is a major component in anyone's personality, and for you to think it's fine to never discuss this with your partner speaks volumes of your character.

And yes, that's a judgement.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #73 on: August 04, 2011, 12:01:57 PM »
I never had a long term relationship at the same time as my marriage. I only met men for a couple of hours, men I did not know, only for sex...  I´ve never involved feelings.  

I'm sure all of your gay male furtive dalliances appreciate the absence of emotion and being treated like a breathing plastic blow up doll. Do you bisexual guys that keep insisting that with men it's just sex and not emotions realize how tedious and insulting that is?
« Last Edit: August 04, 2011, 12:24:44 PM by Miss Philicia »
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Offline Valmont

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #74 on: August 04, 2011, 12:15:33 PM »
That was not what I wanted to say (sorry, English is not a language I use everyday)...  It is not an absence of emotion, of respect, it much more than only a sex time that is shared at the end...  I´ve never treated anyone as you say, I met people that were looking for the same than I, a good moment without many questions...  Really in that time I was looking for a good friend.  When I refered to involving feelings, I refer to love...
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Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #75 on: August 04, 2011, 12:25:04 PM »
Just what do you mean by this?  Throughout this whole thread, I've read not one iota of judgment from Jg1962.

He knows what I mean, it didn't start on this thread. And do you think it's nice to come here quoting something I said like if he was showing evidence of a crime I committed? And I'm still waiting for him to answer my question. Or perhaps he just likes to hit and run.

Are you honestly that daft? If one is in a relationship the other partner expects a high level of openness and honesty. Sexuality is a major component in anyone's personality, and for you to think it's fine to never discuss this with your partner speaks volumes of your character.

And yes, that's a judgement.

Miss P, I know your life is pretty miserable so you have to try and make other people's life miserable as well, but please, next time make a proper effort to read what I say. Perhaps it won't make you look stupid. There you go again:

The times I have tried a long-term relationship, I told them both I was bisexual.

Offline leatherman

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #76 on: August 04, 2011, 12:29:47 PM »
Do you bisexual guys that keep insisting that with me it's just sex and not emotions realize how tedious and insulting that is?
People can't just fuck to be fucking? Emotions have to be involved with something that could just be a physical act and not one step on the road to a long-term relationship? What's the diff between a gay man tricking and a the bisexual guy tricking? They don't call them one-night stands for nothing.  ;)

While I can't say that it engenders me to them either to hear that the gay daillances seem to always be of less importance than the hetero ones, I don't think many of us could throw stones since we probably weren't looking for relationships either with a lot of the people with whom we had sex.
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Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #77 on: August 04, 2011, 12:31:54 PM »

Miss P, I know your life is pretty miserable so you have to try and make other people's life miserable as well, but please, next time make a proper effort to read what I say. Perhaps it won't make you look stupid. There you go again:


Oh, OK -- my life is now miserable. Got it. What was that joy I just experienced with my morning Rare Earth mud mask and digging out an old Vivienne Westwood belt. I will, however, agree that I did not enjoy spraying soap scum remover in my shower and scrubbing it all down a few hours ago. That did indeed make me miserable. Really what makes me miserable is the continual "whoa is me" routines on this forum. It makes me pull out a razor blade on an hourly basis.

By the way, it's you that seems miserable, unhappy, and dissatisfied with the sexual space you attempt to inhabit. How's that going? Personally I've been out of the closet since I was 18 so I'm not sure why that would make a miserable person. Maybe you can edify our friendly forum readers on this issue.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2011, 12:34:40 PM by Miss Philicia »
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #78 on: August 04, 2011, 12:33:11 PM »
People can't just fuck to be fucking? Emotions have to be involved with something that could just be a physical act and not one step on the road to a long-term relationship? What's the diff between a gay man tricking and a the bisexual guy tricking? They don't call them one-night stands for nothing.  ;)

As usual, you simply don't get it... Bivens. And no, that doesn't need a damn emoticon.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline Jeff G

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #79 on: August 04, 2011, 12:36:26 PM »
He knows what I mean, it didn't start on this thread. And do you think it's nice to come here quoting something I said like if he was showing evidence of a crime I committed? And I'm still waiting for him to answer my question. Or perhaps he just likes to hit and run.

You need to stop trying to work out your own issues in other peoples thread about hiding who you really are . I stopped replying because you are never going to see this for what it is , and that's you jumping down another members throat about there honesty issues . The truth is the truth and you can not pick and choose how to apply it to appease your guilty conscience about pretending to be some thing you are not .  

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #80 on: August 04, 2011, 12:43:44 PM »
You need to stop trying to work out your own issues in other peoples thread about hiding who you really are . I stopped replying because you are never going to see this for what it is , and that's you jumping down another members throat about there honesty issues . The truth is the truth and you can not pick and choose how to apply it to appease your guilty conscience about pretending to be some thing you are not . 

Oh come on Jeffypoo -- you're just being a miserable poz cock sucker again.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline Jeff G

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #81 on: August 04, 2011, 12:54:30 PM »
Oh come on Jeffypoo -- you're just being a miserable poz cock sucker again.

If this is misery I'm a lucky guy  ;D . Some of us have made the choice to march in the streets for gay rights and be openly POZ to fight stigma . It just seems a bit easy to attack others honesty and call them miserable when you have done nothing but float through life on the hard work of others .

Offline phildinftlaudy

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #82 on: August 04, 2011, 01:02:33 PM »
Oh come on Jeffypoo -- you're just being a miserable poz cock sucker again.

Ewww me too! me too!......I want to be a miserable poz cock sucker too....  oh, wait, I already am - never mind...
September 13, 2008 - diagnosed +
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Offline Joe K

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #83 on: August 04, 2011, 01:50:35 PM »
This thread has so many tangents and some people seem to be confusing facts with feelings.  Sexual orientation is one of the most complex aspects of being human and each of us has a sexuality that is just as unique as our fingerprints.  I think we also develop a "personal approach" to difficult issues, that we believe will work and often do not understand that just because it works for you, does not mean it will work for someone else.  There also seems to be a lot of confusion on what it takes to have a fulfilling relationship with another person.  I'll share a couple of ideas and let the chips fall where they may.

If you are unable to be honest with yourself, regarding your own sexuality, you will never be able to be honest about it with someone else.  You have every right to feel as you feel, however, if you want something meaningful with another, you must be brutally honest in sharing those feelings.  Suggesting that stereotypes or using words like "most" or "many" do something, are excuses, not justification.  Relationships that last are based upon unconditional trust, that your mate will do as they say and say as they do.  If you cannot be honest and truthful, that trust will never grow.

Relationships can be really frightening, as you are exposing your inner most thoughts and leaving yourself open to possible rejection.  I understand that fear, yet without the honesty, another keystone to relationships, what do you expect the other partner to do?  As much as it may scare you, if you want something meaningful with someone, they deserve to hear it all, the good, bad and ugly, so they can make an informed decision on whether to become involved with you.  This sharing requires another key component to relationships: respect.  If you do not respect your partner enough, to share the truth, so you both can address whatever issues arise, your relationship is doomed.  Trust, honesty and respect are key to any relationship, whether it be as a partner, family or friend.  If you truly want to be with someone, you must respect those boundaries, because it is from these traits that almost everything else flows.

I also reject the idea that you cannot be intimate or distant with a trick, because that requires a judgement, one that nobody is qualified to make regarding another person.  What I see are some folks being less than honest with themselves, regarding who and what they are and expecting others to compensate for that lack of honesty, which results in blame deflection.  You control what you do and say, period.  You are solely responsible for your words and actions, period.  Rationalizing hurtful personal behavior, as opposed to directly addressing your own issues, is a character flaw and it can be overcome, but it's your responsibility, period.

At one time, I lived a life of lies and it only brought pain to everyone it touched, including myself.  At first it was easy to blame others for my failings, until it wasn't.  I was incredibly damaged by my lies and only by accepting my guilt, in how I treated others, including myself, could I move past that life and understand what it took to be an honest person.  And as soon as I started to live a truthful life, by being honest with who and what I am, my life took a new trajectory and I was able to find peace within me.

I don't think sexuality is as important here, as opposed to personal skills and a strong moral fiber.  When I met Stephen, we shared our darkest, most intimate secrets.  What we heard scared us both, because we both have baggage by the trunk load.  Yet, by sharing those secrets, our feelings, thoughts and philosophies, we developed an incredibly intimate personal bond.  I was petrified when I shared my history of depression with him and I expect him to bolt for the door.  I expected to lose someone I cared deeply for, because I misjudged his capabilities.  While I had told him the truth, I didn't respect his ability to make an informed decision that ultimately worked out very well for us both.

My last point is you need to come to terms with who and what you are, before you can every expect anyone else to understand how you feel.  You need to possess the moral fiber to treat others as you would wish to be treated.  Using excuses or suggesting that nobody can understand your life, may be true, but it does nothing to help heal you.  If you want a meaningful relationship, it means approaching it like an adult, laying ALL of your cards on the table and letting the chips fall where they may. 

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #84 on: August 04, 2011, 03:35:55 PM »
You need to stop trying to work out your own issues in other peoples thread about hiding who you really are . I stopped replying because you are never going to see this for what it is , and that's you jumping down another members throat about there honesty issues . The truth is the truth and you can not pick and choose how to apply it to appease your guilty conscience about pretending to be some thing you are not .  

I don't get you. I try to think it's a cultural difference, that it's the American way of being to just butt in where they are not invited and assume they are the center of the universe, that everything they feel or know is just the same for the others, so they can go judging what someone should feel or do. But it's not, because I've met many Americans in my life, including others here, that do not act like that. So it's just your way of being. And Miss P's.

Do you think you are better than me because you are open about being gay and HIV+? Do you think I owe you anything for that? And really, questioning my honesty because of that, that I can't criticize someone for cheating on a spouse and putting that person at risk for STDs is a sign of a sick, twisted morality.

You have to accept that you don't know me. You know shit about my life, and I couldn't care less about yours. What makes you think I have a guilty conscience? Over what?? And answering Miss P's question, I can feel miserable about many things in my life, but not being open about me being bisexual or HIV+ is certainly not one for them. Is it so hard for you to handle that?

The fact is that you think I'm just working my own issues in other people's thread (is anyone's really? the topic is being bisexual). But I think it's you doing that. You can't accept the fact I'm not "out of the closet" like you and that's the second time you bring it out, for no reason. If it's someone who has issues, it looks like it's you. Grow up and take responsibility for your own actions without expecting the same from others.

So, finally, I ask you: if in twisted mentality you think I'm dishonest because of that, good for you, if it makes you feel better about yourself. But I ask you to keep it to yourself. If you don't have anything to add, better keep it quiet. Especially in your case, "speech is silver, but silence is golden".

Offline thunter34

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #85 on: August 04, 2011, 05:00:16 PM »
I don't get you. I try to think it's a cultural difference, that it's the American way of being to just butt in where they are not invited and assume they are the center of the universe, that everything they feel or know is just the same for the others, so they can go judging what someone should feel or do. But it's not, because I've met many Americans in my life, including others here, that do not act like that. So it's just your way of being. And Miss P's.

Do you think you are better than me because you are open about being gay and HIV+? Do you think I owe you anything for that? And really, questioning my honesty because of that, that I can't criticize someone for cheating on a spouse and putting that person at risk for STDs is a sign of a sick, twisted morality.

You have to accept that you don't know me. You know shit about my life, and I couldn't care less about yours. What makes you think I have a guilty conscience? Over what?? And answering Miss P's question, I can feel miserable about many things in my life, but not being open about me being bisexual or HIV+ is certainly not one for them. Is it so hard for you to handle that?

The fact is that you think I'm just working my own issues in other people's thread (is anyone's really? the topic is being bisexual). But I think it's you doing that. You can't accept the fact I'm not "out of the closet" like you and that's the second time you bring it out, for no reason. If it's someone who has issues, it looks like it's you. Grow up and take responsibility for your own actions without expecting the same from others.

So, finally, I ask you: if in twisted mentality you think I'm dishonest because of that, good for you, if it makes you feel better about yourself. But I ask you to keep it to yourself. If you don't have anything to add, better keep it quiet. Especially in your case, "speech is silver, but silence is golden".

They're still right, though.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #86 on: August 04, 2011, 05:21:50 PM »
They're still right, though.

You tell me then, right about what?

Offline thunter34

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #87 on: August 04, 2011, 06:29:22 PM »
You tell me then, right about what?

This:

Basically it boils down to being spineless or not -- so if one lacks a bit of spine maybe it's not a great idea to throw around petty judgements.

or this...

I'm just suggesting if you are a closet fag with the butt flu maybe you shouldn't be judging other peoples relationships

However you'd like it said to you.  Take your pick.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #88 on: August 04, 2011, 06:42:55 PM »
Yup, thunter34, it sure is a twisted world. Suddenly keeping something personal to yourself and to those you wish to share, which does no harm to anyone, is as bad as cheating on your wife and putting her at risk for STDs, which clearly is a risk for someone else. Superb reasoning.

Offline thunter34

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #89 on: August 04, 2011, 06:46:40 PM »
Yup, thunter34, it sure is a twisted world. Suddenly keeping something personal to yourself and to those you wish to share, which does no harm to anyone, is as bad as cheating on your wife and putting her at risk for STDs, which clearly is a risk for someone else. Superb reasoning.

Hey!  Perhaps if you can meet us in Seattle you can teach us the steps to your Superiority Dance.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Nestor

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #90 on: August 04, 2011, 06:51:48 PM »
This:

or this...

However you'd like it said to you.  Take your pick.

Sorry, but I really don't see the logic in any of this either.  LM criticized someone--or attacked him, if you like--for "cheating on" his wife.  I fail to see how being gay, or being closeted, or having HIV, or being spineless, disqualifies him from making that judgement, no matter how colorful the vocabulary in which those conditions are described.  

The valid criticism against you, LM, is simply that you were unkind and uncharitable to someone who with a great deal of honesty shared a difficult part of his experience with us.  This is why a fairly large group of people have been unkind to you in return, and if their logic eludes me their sentiment does not.  Not that you have to agree with everything Valmont does or says, but a little bit of compassion in your response to him might have helped avoid a lot of the bitterness in their reply to you.  

You are passionate about--you use the word adamant--monogamy.  Please recognize that many other people are not.  I myself see the beauty in a monogomous relationship but I also see the beauty in an open relationship.  And many, many people are somewhere in the middle and believe in monogamy but do not always practice it.  I have heard that something like 75% of married people have "cheated on" their spouses.  That doesn't make it right, but it ought to be enough to make us question whether monogamy is the natural condition, and to suggest that breathing fire against someone who honestly shares the fact that he slept with someone not his wife is not the appropriate response.  

I do think that someone who is sleeping with more than one person has a strong obligation to use protection.  And to be honest, with the less than 100% clarity in the sentence in which Valmont described the way in which the condom did not work, I'm not sure what to think about that episode.  But I don't have to be.  I am not called upon to make a moral judgement here.  

I repeat that none of this should have any reflection on bisexuality.  A purely heterosexual man sleeping with another woman would be doing the exact same thing Valmont did, and unless you are willing to say that he is giving a bad name to heterosexuality I don't see why you should say that Valmont gives bisexuals a bad name.  
« Last Edit: August 04, 2011, 06:55:01 PM by Nestor »
Summer 2004--became HIV+
Dec. 2005--found out

Date          CD4    %       VL
Jan. '06    725    25      9,097
Nov. '06    671    34     52,202
Apr. '07    553    30      24,270
Sept. '07  685    27       4,849
Jan. '08    825    29       4,749
Mar. '08    751    30     16,026
Aug. '08    653    30       3,108
Oct. '08     819    28     10,046
Jan '09      547    31     13,000
May '09     645   25        6,478
Aug. '09    688   30      19,571
Nov. '09     641    27       9,598
Feb. '10     638    27       4,480
May '10      687      9    799,000 (CMV)
July '10      600     21      31,000
Nov '10      682     24     15,000
June '11     563    23     210,000 (blasto)
July  '11      530    22      39,000
Aug '11      677     22      21,000
Sept. '12    747     15      14,000

Offline bocker3

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #91 on: August 04, 2011, 06:58:51 PM »
I don't get you. I try to think it's a cultural difference, that it's the American way of being to just butt in where they are not invited and assume they are the center of the universe, that everything they feel or know is just the same for the others, so they can go judging what someone should feel or do. But it's not, because I've met many Americans in my life, including others here, that do not act like that. So it's just your way of being. And Miss P's.

Do you think you are better than me because you are open about being gay and HIV+? Do you think I owe you anything for that? And really, questioning my honesty because of that, that I can't criticize someone for cheating on a spouse and putting that person at risk for STDs is a sign of a sick, twisted morality.

You have to accept that you don't know me. You know shit about my life, and I couldn't care less about yours. What makes you think I have a guilty conscience? Over what?? And answering Miss P's question, I can feel miserable about many things in my life, but not being open about me being bisexual or HIV+ is certainly not one for them. Is it so hard for you to handle that?

The fact is that you think I'm just working my own issues in other people's thread (is anyone's really? the topic is being bisexual). But I think it's you doing that. You can't accept the fact I'm not "out of the closet" like you and that's the second time you bring it out, for no reason. If it's someone who has issues, it looks like it's you. Grow up and take responsibility for your own actions without expecting the same from others.

So, finally, I ask you: if in twisted mentality you think I'm dishonest because of that, good for you, if it makes you feel better about yourself. But I ask you to keep it to yourself. If you don't have anything to add, better keep it quiet. Especially in your case, "speech is silver, but silence is golden".

You are a bit of a piece of work, aren't you??  you are berating others who you think are "judging you" by screaming that they don't "know you".  What are you doing???  Judging someone whom you don't know.
come down off your fucking high horse and stop projecting your morals, your standards and your "issues" on others.  You almost NEVER interact with anyone on this site without judgment, venom and anger.  Go find a mirror and have a long, hard look darling.......  if it don't break first.

M
Atripla - Started 12/05
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Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #92 on: August 04, 2011, 07:07:48 PM »
Hey!  Perhaps if you can meet us in Seattle you can teach us the steps to your Superiority Dance.

Well, if I had the money to even travel to the US and then Seattle, I would be glad to talk to you and get you to know me better. In no way I feel better than anyone here. Nor worse. What I told Valmont was because I think he needed to be reminded what he did was wrong. He took it well, and I wish him all the best. But I find it despicable that someone might think he/she is better than me or that I can't say this or that because I'm not openly bisexual or that I tell everyone I'm HIV+. I think everyone here should respect people's personal choices on how to deal with these aspects in their lives, always paying attention to the potential harm that they could cause others. So in this respect, I don't see why a "closet fag with the butt flu", as offensive as that may be, is seen with so much contempt by some.


Nestor, it's just that it's classic, bisexual man sleeps with other men and infects wife. I hate that, Valmont was asking people's thoughts and said mine. I'm ok if people want to have open relationships, but then both partners have to agree on that, and that was certainly not the case. Sure, I was unkind and maybe uncharitable, like you said, and I don't mind you saying that. And if someone thought like that, they should have come and said it, like you're doing it yourself. That's a valid criticism. But coming here and attacking me for completely unrelated reasons is just vile. And regardless if it was right or wrong, and unkind as I may have been, Valmont took well what I said, and I really wish him no ill fortune.

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #93 on: August 04, 2011, 07:14:26 PM »
You are a bit of a piece of work, aren't you??  you are berating others who you think are "judging you" by screaming that they don't "know you".  What are you doing???  Judging someone whom you don't know.
come down off your fucking high horse and stop projecting your morals, your standards and your "issues" on others.  You almost NEVER interact with anyone on this site without judgment, venom and anger.  Go find a mirror and have a long, hard look darling.......  if it don't break first.

M

Really? Have you read the thread thoroughly? I've only had problems in this thread and another and with the same person who has come to attack me once again. I'm pretty sure if you look at all my posts, you'll see little "judgment, venom and anger". Except for the way I addressed Valmont, for I did get pissed off with his story, I dare you to show me I have judged someone without that person judging me first.

Offline thunter34

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #94 on: August 04, 2011, 08:18:43 PM »
I just think it's real easy to wag a finger in disapproval from the shadows of a closet.

But yeah...it is often repulsive to see folks infect others from the DL.  It's also a wee bit repulsive when some stay in their relative safety while others brave the consequences of being honest about who they are.

Kids leap to their deaths.  Staying silent in the shadows isn't a completely victimless endeavor.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #95 on: August 04, 2011, 08:20:26 PM »
I just think it's real easy to wag a finger in disapproval from the shadows of a closet.

As opposed to being a slutty stripper dancing up on a bar for tips from closet cases?
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #96 on: August 04, 2011, 09:58:02 PM »
I just think it's real easy to wag a finger in disapproval from the shadows of a closet.

But yeah...it is often repulsive to see folks infect others from the DL.  It's also a wee bit repulsive when some stay in their relative safety while others brave the consequences of being honest about who they are.

Kids leap to their deaths.  Staying silent in the shadows isn't a completely victimless endeavor.

What, am I to blame for people committing suicide or something? Is that really what you want to say?

I'm starting to think it is indeed a cultural thing. It seems you guys have the surreal idea that just being open about being gay, bisexual, or HIV+ will change the world. I know your country has bad examples of politicians or political activists in the closet badmouthing the gay community just to hide their own condition. And that's why I insist: none of you know me. You don't know how I've been always fighting for gay rights in my country, signing and helping with petitions, participating in more than one political demonstation, and I'm not talking about the Gay Pride parade. You don't know that long before I got HIV, I've always criticized those who showed any prejudice against people who were HIV+. I know, regardless of what you may think, that I have done much more against prejudice than many people who are open about their status or their sexuality.

Yet, even if I didn't, if I just stood quiet about it, it would be in my right to do so. There are many open gay, bisexual or HIV+ people who are open about their condition and act against their community, either by example or just by simple badmouthing. The thing is: no one has to be an activist of their condition, but not being open about it doesn't stop you from being an activist as well. Sure, if you are both, it can only add up, but disrespecting those who aren't is absurd.

And really, if I'm not welcome here because of that, as stupid as that may be, I can leave with no problems. I certainly don't want to be attacked for unrelated reasons all the time.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2011, 10:00:43 PM by LM »

Offline thunter34

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  • His name is Carl.
Re: bisexual
« Reply #97 on: August 04, 2011, 10:21:53 PM »
I'm just riding you because I think you need to hop down off your Hobby Horse.  You'll got an unwarranted sense of self righteousness going, sweet pea. 

I get just as fatigued watching bisexuals live comfortably on the side while dipping in when it suits them as you do watching some take reckless chances with others' health.  Very often, the two go hand in hand.

And I don't like seeing people who dare to be honest in a place like this get slapped by people who lack that same courage themselves.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline LM

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Re: bisexual
« Reply #98 on: August 04, 2011, 10:55:53 PM »
I'm just riding you because I think you need to hop down off your Hobby Horse.  You'll got an unwarranted sense of self righteousness going, sweet pea. 

You basically blame me for people's deaths and I'm the self-righteous one?


I get just as fatigued watching bisexuals live comfortably on the side while dipping in when it suits them as you do watching some take reckless chances with others' health.  Very often, the two go hand in hand.

And I don't like seeing people who dare to be honest in a place like this get slapped by people who lack that same courage themselves.


Like I said, twisted sense of morality. What you guys think about being open about your sexuality or HIV status is unreal, to say the least. It's not about courage, or being a paragon of justice and the fight against prejudices or stigmas. Being open about your sexuality or HIV status is a personal choice and I'm pretty sure whatever decision you've made was not thinking about the well-being of mankind, but your own. And that's not bad, it's just what it is. You're entitled to decide what's best for your life and so am I. I respect that, so why don't you? You should stop thinking the only right way is your way and other people are cowards and on a safe zone.

And true about what you said: many times being in the closet and going around infecting your partner go hand in hand. Or being homophobic, campaigning agaist the gay community, etc. But then I go back to what killfoile said and that is being true to yourself. That's what matters most in the end.

Offline thunter34

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,310
  • His name is Carl.
Re: bisexual
« Reply #99 on: August 04, 2011, 11:04:41 PM »

Like I said, twisted sense of morality. What you guys think about being open about your sexuality or HIV status is unreal, to say the least. It's not about courage, or being a paragon of justice and the fight against prejudices or stigmas. Being open about your sexuality or HIV status is a personal choice and I'm pretty sure whatever decision you've made was not thinking about the well-being of mankind, but your own.

You don't know me and how many Pride Parades I've marched in!!!!
AIDS isn't for sissies.

 


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