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Author Topic: viral load  (Read 1935 times)

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Offline nmranger

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  • Posts: 26
viral load
« on: January 05, 2011, 08:22:33 PM »
so when i got my first labs on 09/10 my CD4 was 183 / 13.1% and VL  5690 on 10/4/10 is when i first started taking Atripla. Then i got my second set of numbers which were in early 11/10 were CD4 206 and VL in the 800's. In early December i got another set of numbers and my CD4 is now 249 / 17.8% and VL is 200.

my question to you all is, is this normal? like i notice some people go from having a VL in the 100k+ and then go undetectable.  I do like that my CD4 is going up however it seems to be as well as my doctor that the VL isn't becoming undetectable as fast as he'd and well I'd like it too.  They did a resistance test and so far the virus hasn't mutated so the doc said all the meds should work. 

What ya'll think?
12/09 Negative
08/10 Positive
09/10 CD4 183 / 13.1%        VL  5690
10/4/10 ~Started Atripla~

Online zach

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Re: viral load
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2011, 08:57:56 PM »
bet you're undetectable in a couple months  ;D

Offline surf18

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  • Posts: 525
Re: viral load
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2011, 08:58:40 PM »
sounds like your on track. my cd since dx/meds in july was like 225 and now six monts later its 407 % went from 12 to 22
vl ud since i think october.so yep your on track

Offline phildinftlaudy

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  • sweet Ann what you think babe...
Re: viral load
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2011, 09:04:34 PM »
Hey Ranger -
I think that if you are tolerating the Atripla well and seeing increases in your CD4 and CD4%, as well as decrease (although slower then you would like) in VL, you should stick with it for at least the next few months.  My VL wasn't all that high when I went on Atripla and it still took a little time for it to drop to "UD."

So, my 2 cents - for what it is worth - is to stay the course for at least one or two more draws and see how it plays out.
September 13, 2008 - diagnosed +
Labs:
Date    CD4    %   VL     Date  CD4  %   VL
10/08  636    35  510   9/09 473  38 2900  12/4/09 Atripla
12/09  540    30    60   
12/10  740    41  <48   
8/11    667    36  <20  
03/12  1,041  42  <20
05/12  1,241  47  <20
08/12   780    37  <20
11/12   549    35  <20
02/12  1,102  42  <20
11/12   549    35  <20

Offline nmranger

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  • Posts: 26
Re: viral load
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2011, 11:09:41 PM »
great thanks for the replies .....


i do plan to stick with it .... i really do like atripla and sticking to the 1-pill a day ... so hopefully i'll be UD on my next draw next week...

*Crosses Fingers*
12/09 Negative
08/10 Positive
09/10 CD4 183 / 13.1%        VL  5690
10/4/10 ~Started Atripla~

Offline metekrop

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  • Posts: 352
Re: viral load
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2011, 07:46:52 AM »
Your numbers are confusing for me.  How come you are negative in 12/09 and test positive after a year in 8/10 with only CD 183 and VL of 5690?  Is that CD number is too low when a person get tested positive for the first time?
Diag on Dec 8, 2000, CD 440 VL 44K, No Meds
Dec/08 - Feb/09 CD< 50 & VL >500k hosp'z.
St. Atripla - July/09 CD 179, VL 197k
Oct/09 CD 300 VL UD Chol 267
Mar/10 CD 468 UD, Ch 220
Aug/10 CD 460 UD, Ch 195
Dec/10 CD 492 UD, Ch 172
Mar/11 CD 636 UD, Ch 201
Aug/11 CD 530 UD, Ch 98
Jan/12 cd 616 UD, ch 189
Jul/12 CD 640 UD, Ch ?
Dec/12 CD 669 Ud, Ch 125
May/7 CD711 Ud, Ch?
Nov/ 22 663 UD, Ch,
April 17 CD 797, UD

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: viral load
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2011, 12:17:06 PM »
Your numbers are confusing for me.  How come you are negative in 12/09 and test positive after a year in 8/10 with only CD 183 and VL of 5690?  Is that CD number is too low when a person get tested positive for the first time?


Some people just progress faster than others. It could also be that his immune system hadn't yet recovered from the initial infection. It might be that his VL had only recently dropped and his CD4s were still in the process of going back up. It is not unusual for a newly infected person to have a high VL and low CD4s in the first six months to a year before the immune system gets to grip with the new resident.
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline nmranger

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  • Posts: 26
Re: viral load
« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2011, 01:24:05 PM »
Your numbers are confusing for me.  How come you are negative in 12/09 and test positive after a year in 8/10 with only CD 183 and VL of 5690?  Is that CD number is too low when a person get tested positive for the first time?


That's something that's confused both me and my doctor he thinks that I might have a aggressive strain or he says that the test in dec,09 was a false negative. 
12/09 Negative
08/10 Positive
09/10 CD4 183 / 13.1%        VL  5690
10/4/10 ~Started Atripla~

Offline tednlou2

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  • Posts: 4,758
Re: viral load
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2011, 12:15:40 AM »
That's something that's confused both me and my doctor he thinks that I might have a aggressive strain or he says that the test in dec,09 was a false negative. 

As Ann said, I thought this was fairly common to have high VL and low CD4 soon after infection.  Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've read where someone could have a CD4 very low after infection but their immune system still be in pretty good shape.  Basically, someone right after infection with a CD4 of 200 is not the same as someone who has been poz for many years with the same CD4--someone just infected with low CD4 still had a very intact immune system and that CD4 200 was not an accurate picture of the immune system of someone just infected.  If this is correct, this is why I've always wondered why many docs freak out when someone has these numbers within 2 months of infection and their docs want to start them on meds right away.  If this is incorrect, please advise.       

Offline surf18

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  • Posts: 525
Re: viral load
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2011, 07:24:24 AM »
when i was dx'd i had cd of 227 and vl of 16000. so really a low cd and pretty low vl. dr thought i had this for 2 years.
i was very surprised how low my cd was in such a short time. started meds the next day.

Offline Maelrod

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Re: viral load
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2011, 07:54:09 AM »
It's confused cuz happen to me, 2009 november to be specific was  my unprotected sex and in the summer of same year was neg.  So in august 2010 was poz w 279 cd4 and 122k vl never been sick
« Last Edit: January 13, 2011, 07:56:31 AM by Maelrod »
Is better STOp living in the past, the I SHOULDn't doesn't exist.

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: viral load
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2011, 10:29:46 AM »
As Ann said, I thought this was fairly common to have high VL and low CD4 soon after infection.  Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've read where someone could have a CD4 very low after infection but their immune system still be in pretty good shape.  Basically, someone right after infection with a CD4 of 200 is not the same as someone who has been poz for many years with the same CD4--someone just infected with low CD4 still had a very intact immune system and that CD4 200 was not an accurate picture of the immune system of someone just infected.  If this is correct, this is why I've always wondered why many docs freak out when someone has these numbers within 2 months of infection and their docs want to start them on meds right away.  If this is incorrect, please advise.       

I've always wondered too why some docs freak out when someone has poor numbers only a few months into their infection. There can be many reasons for this, as I mentioned earlier. Another possible reason is that the person just had naturally low CD4s to begin with.

It is rare for someone to have a base-line CD4 count from before infection, but it is known that not everyone has high CD4s while hiv negative. Remember, 500 (to 1200 or so) is considered to be a "normal" count in someone not infected. If a negative person normally has CD4s in the 5/600 range, it's a no-brainer to see how they could easily have numbers under 200 when newly infected and the VL is sky-high.

Dunno. Maybe the doctors who freak out are ones who prefer to err on the side of caution and assume that the person is having a very poor response to the virus or that they have a virulent strain and act accordingly.
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline nmranger

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  • Posts: 26
Re: viral load
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2011, 11:34:24 AM »
when i was dx'd i had cd of 227 and vl of 16000. so really a low cd and pretty low vl. dr thought i had this for 2 years.
i was very surprised how low my cd was in such a short time. started meds the next day.

That's what my Dr thought too that i could've had it for 2 yrs since I had a really low vl.  Which I guess would make sense because I was with my partner from June 08 - June 09.  We lost communication so i can't nor do I wish to confront him.
12/09 Negative
08/10 Positive
09/10 CD4 183 / 13.1%        VL  5690
10/4/10 ~Started Atripla~

Offline nmranger

  • Member
  • Posts: 26
Re: viral load
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2011, 11:42:23 AM »
I've always wondered too why some docs freak out when someone has poor numbers only a few months into their infection. There can be many reasons for this, as I mentioned earlier. Another possible reason is that the person just had naturally low CD4s to begin with.

It is rare for someone to have a base-line CD4 count from before infection, but it is known that not everyone has high CD4s while hiv negative. Remember, 500 (to 1200 or so) is considered to be a "normal" count in someone not infected. If a negative person normally has CD4s in the 5/600 range, it's a no-brainer to see how they could easily have numbers under 200 when newly infected and the VL is sky-high.

Dunno. Maybe the doctors who freak out are ones who prefer to err on the side of caution and assume that the person is having a very poor response to the virus or that they have a virulent strain and act accordingly.

I agree with maybe some peoples cd are already low to begin with which is why they'd go under 200 faster.   However how do u think my situation happened that I had a low cd and low vl.  Does that happen ?     ???
12/09 Negative
08/10 Positive
09/10 CD4 183 / 13.1%        VL  5690
10/4/10 ~Started Atripla~

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: viral load
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2011, 12:08:48 PM »
I agree with maybe some peoples cd are already low to begin with which is why they'd go under 200 faster.   However how do u think my situation happened that I had a low cd and low vl.  Does that happen ?     ???

It could be that although your immune system had gotten your virus under a semblance of control, your CD4s simply had not had enough time to fully recover. You need to remember that even people who have become undetectable on meds can take some time to rebuild their stock of CD4s.
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline nmranger

  • Member
  • Posts: 26
Re: viral load
« Reply #15 on: January 13, 2011, 12:44:09 PM »
It could be that although your immune system had gotten your virus under a semblance of control, your CD4s simply had not had enough time to fully recover. You need to remember that even people who have become undetectable on meds can take some time to rebuild their stock of CD4s.

Gotcha.  Thanks Ann for the fast response
12/09 Negative
08/10 Positive
09/10 CD4 183 / 13.1%        VL  5690
10/4/10 ~Started Atripla~

 


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