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Author Topic: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!  (Read 10553 times)

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Offline Inchlingblue

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HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« on: December 16, 2010, 04:44:06 PM »
A small study indicates what I've stated here before (to vehement disagreement from Miss P): that HIV itself can cause lipoatrophy.

I had noticed even before starting treatment that there was some fat loss on my face and butt. In my case it's relatively minor and I realize that at 48 it's bound to happen but I noticed it happening during a period of less than a year, right before my diagnosis. On the bright side, it has not gotten any worse and I am stable on meds.

Based on this small study at least, they found the most mitochondrial damage the lower the CD4s and the higher the viral load a person had.

Garrabouís team found that mitochondrial DNA integrity and mitochondrial function were more defective in both groups of HIV-positive participants than in HIV negative participants. In the HIV-positive group with no ARV experience, about 38 percent of fat cells had defective mitochondrial DNA and 25 percent had reduced mitochondrial function. In those on ARVs, 31 percent of fat cells had damaged DNA and 30 percent had reduced function. The lower a personís CD4 cell count and the higher the viral load, the more likely he or she was to have damaged mitochondrial DNA and reduced mitochondrial function.

LINK:

http://www.aidsmeds.com/articles/hiv_mitochondria_lipoatrophy_1667_19613.shtml

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2010, 05:07:03 PM »
You're practically 50 dear, just accept your misery and move on.

Miss P just had her fourth set of Sculptra injections so she's no longer interested in your (one) small, tiny study that entails a minute number of participants and still on says "may cause"... I don't know whether to laugh or yawn.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2010, 05:55:48 PM »

Miss P just had her fourth set of Sculptra injections so she's no longer interested in your (one) small, tiny study that entails a minute number of participants and still on says "may cause"... I don't know whether to laugh or yawn.

Why so defensive? I think someone "no longer interested" would not have bothered to respond. 

You had Sculptra and have not shared any pics?

 
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 06:05:28 PM by Inchlingblue »

Offline Ann

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2010, 06:21:54 PM »
Why so defensive? 

Perhaps it has something to do with your borderline flamebait of a challenge in your thread title... "Take THAT Miss P!"  I mean, really. What did you expect if not a little defensiveness? I reckon you were positively hoping for it. Sheesh.  ::)

Oh, and let this degenerate into a bitch-fest at your peril, both of you. Tis the season to be jolly, not the season to be ass-like. Keep that in mind, please.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 06:23:25 PM by Ann »
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2010, 06:30:27 PM »
Perhaps it has something to do with your borderline flamebait of a challenge in your thread title... "Take THAT Miss P!"  I mean, really. What did you expect if not a little defensiveness? I reckon you were positively hoping for it. Sheesh.  ::)

zzzzzzactly

Truth be known I was trying to semi-joke in my response, and I figured Inchling would realize that, so really it is he that is being defensive in his 2nd post, either that or just mock outrage... hard to say.

But I say "semi" joke as at least my reply is half true.  Inchers isn't young and the study size is utterly emaciated, no lipo pun intended.  When a study is done in 20 year olds showing something statistically significant it will be interesting.  Everyone here knows that tiny studies on a variety of HIV issues pop up frequently and then disappear, never to result in anything else.  At any rate I don't believe I ever stated emphatically that it's impossible for someone not on ARV to get lipo, just that it would be exceedingly rare, and certainly NOT reflective of the frequency of claims made on this forum -- you know, kind of like the legions of people infected from oral sex.  Same thing, different issue.  It's more likely to be a "lite" version of body dysmorphia mixed with about-to-go-HIV-meds paranoia.  If that offends anyone I'm very sorry.

As far as putting up pictures I'll have to request that Inchling show us his before and after the purported lipoatrophy pictars first, but I know that will happen when hell freezes over.  I honestly don't mind putting up pictures of what I look like post-Sculptra, it's the ones that clearly show what I looked like BEFORE any injections I don't care to slap up here.  I know I've put some up like the leather one, but those are all selectively edited to show me at good angles.  Ones that show my pre-injection face in its true glory are not things I care to show except to select friends.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 06:37:10 PM by Miss Philicia »
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Offline Ann

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #5 on: December 16, 2010, 06:38:23 PM »
I hear you on the small study size. I always look at the results of minuscule cohorts like this one to be little more than one small step above anecdotal evidence.

And speaking of hell freezing over, it sure is damn cold in my corner of the world tonight (we're getting blasted directly from the Arctic) so you never know, those photos of Inch may appear by morning. :)
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2010, 06:47:15 PM »
Perhaps it has something to do with your borderline flamebait of a challenge in your thread title... "Take THAT Miss P!"  I mean, really. What did you expect if not a little defensiveness? I reckon you were positively hoping for it. Sheesh.  ::)

Oh, and let this degenerate into a bitch-fest at your peril, both of you. Tis the season to be jolly, not the season to be ass-like. Keep that in mind, please.

OMG, are you serious?

You think I was borderline flame baiting?

I was JOKING....KIDDING. Should I have added a bunch of smiley faces? Sheesh indeed.

Honestly, Ann, it really does seem that only one or two people on here are given the license to joke around (you know who you are).

 

 
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 06:50:46 PM by Inchlingblue »

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2010, 06:49:46 PM »

I was JOKING....KIDDING. Should I have added a bunch of smiley faces? Sheesh.

Honestly, Ann, it really does seem that only one or two people on here are given the license to joke around (you know who you are).

Calm down Bessie -- when you have lipo those crowsfeet only make things look worse than they should. :)

Speaking of wrinkles, after having Sculptra I now want Botox.

extra credit: I found out that the gay doctor I go to for Sculptra also performs high resolution anoscopies.  He's pozitively dying to gain entrance to the Holland Tunnel, I can tell.  Oh, and I also ran into my vile downstairs (also gay) neighbor in the waiting room -- you know, the one that recruits 20-year old hipsters with mutton chops to bareback during blizzards.  And yes, I threw him shade.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 06:52:44 PM by Miss Philicia »
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Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #8 on: December 16, 2010, 06:52:51 PM »

Speaking of wrinkles, after having Sculptra I now want Botox.
 

I also totally want Botox. A good friend of mine (straight woman, 50, no HIV) just had it and it really works.

I've started asking around for someone good who does it for a reasonable price in or near NYC.

Offline Ann

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #9 on: December 16, 2010, 06:55:59 PM »

Honestly, Ann, it really does seem that only one or two people on here are given the license to joke around (you know who you are).


Considering some of the bust-ups you two have had over this subject in the past, I wasn't taking any chances. And yes, a smiley or two wouldn't have gone amiss if you were truly joking and not trying to get a rise out of Miss P.
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Online Jeff G

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2010, 07:04:45 PM »
I remember Miss P and others like myself having to respond to people about how unlikely it is for them to be ravaged by facial wasting months after acquiring the virus but that about it .

The newly infected sometime need reassurance and that's where I remember Miss P stepping up and speaking from experience about lipo .  

Offline edfu

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2010, 07:45:44 PM »
extra credit: I found out that the gay doctor I go to for Sculptra also performs high resolution anoscopies.  

OMFG, that got my attention!!!  What is he, a dermatologist AND a colorectal specialist?  Imagine:  "One-Stop Shopping!   Facial Rashes and Anal Lesions!  Inject Your Cheeks and Spread Your Other Cheeks!"  ;D

Seriously, now that I think about it, it has some sense.  Anal cancer is a squamous-cell cancer, the same kind that can occur anywhere on the exterior body's skin.   I've heard that some dermatologists perform HRA's, but I've been unable to confirm it.  My dermatologist will gladly look at my asshole, but he won't look into it. 
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 07:49:05 PM by edfu »
"No one will ever be free so long as there are pestilences."--Albert Camus, "The Plague"

"Mankind can never be free until the last brick in the last church falls on the head of the last priest."--Voltaire

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2010, 07:52:44 PM »
OMFG, that got my attention!!!  What is he, a dermatologist AND a colorectal specialist?  Imagine:  "One-Stop Shopping!   Facial Rashes and Anal Lesions!  Inject Your Cheeks and Spread Your Other Cheeks!"  ;D

Seriously, now that I think about it, it has some sense.  Anal cancer is a squamous-cell cancer, the same kind that can occur anywhere on the exterior body's skin.  

Oh, no -- actually he's the medical director of the Mazzoni Center, and they did the clinical trials in this area for gay men/Gardasil.  He was also either the first, or close to it, local people to start doing Sculptra years ago.  He's not a colo-rectal specialist per se though, so I think this would just be monitoring for dysplasia and if I need something done surgically with a laser zap I'll go to the other person I saw previously, it's just this is much more convenient for me as the other doctor is way out in Chestnut Hill.  Mazzoni I can get to in 15 minutes.  Still, this is exactly what should be being done from our previous conversations -- more general practitioners who can at least do HRA's for monitoring, then refer you if something else is needed.

Plus he's friends with Goldstone in NYC so that makes me comfy, though the guy in Chestnut Hill was too -- everyone knows Dr. Goldstone :)
« Last Edit: December 16, 2010, 07:54:31 PM by Miss Philicia »
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Offline edfu

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2010, 08:04:25 PM »
Still, this is exactly what should be being done from our previous conversations -- more general practitioners who can at least do HRA's for monitoring, then refer you if something else is needed.

Ya got that right...your distinguished voice to God's deaf ear.  I have to go into the hospital and go under general anesthesia to have an HRA done in Connecticut. 
"No one will ever be free so long as there are pestilences."--Albert Camus, "The Plague"

"Mankind can never be free until the last brick in the last church falls on the head of the last priest."--Voltaire

Offline Miss Philicia

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2010, 08:14:51 PM »
I have to go into the hospital and go under general anesthesia to have an HRA done in Connecticut. 

Wow, that's just SO unnecessary.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline edfu

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2010, 08:32:56 PM »
Wow, that's just SO unnecessary.

And that's not even the worst of it.  This colorectal guy (one of only two who do HRA's in Conn., and believe me, I've done the research), insists that while he will remove suspect tissue for biopsies (to be completed two weeks later), he also must simultaneously destroy the entire suspect lesion during the HRA.  Hence the anesthesia.  He does this without knowing what the biopsies will reveal.  When I pointed out that this destruction may not be necessary, he snidely said that then I should go back and have the HRA done in NYC, that his way was the way it was done in Conn. 

(My apologies for highjacking this thread.)
"No one will ever be free so long as there are pestilences."--Albert Camus, "The Plague"

"Mankind can never be free until the last brick in the last church falls on the head of the last priest."--Voltaire

Offline GSOgymrat

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #16 on: December 19, 2010, 11:09:21 PM »
I also totally want Botox. A good friend of mine (straight woman, 50, no HIV) just had it and it really works.

I've started asking around for someone good who does it for a reasonable price in or near NYC.

Did someone say Botox party?

Offline zach

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #17 on: December 22, 2010, 03:38:38 PM »
i just wanna jump in to say, for absolutely no reason at all, that i'm jealous and envious of how many people put miss p on ignore  ;D there should be like a competition or something
gonna go up to the mountain, for to find a little peace
looking over the valley, for the beauty i see
out across the hills, forevermore

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #18 on: December 22, 2010, 03:40:54 PM »
i just wanna jump in to say, for absolutely no reason at all, that i'm jealous and envious of how many people put miss p on ignore  ;D there should be like a competition or something

We gave up competing with her years ago. I've only managed a paltry 17. :)

MtD

Offline PeteNYNJ

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #19 on: December 22, 2010, 03:42:45 PM »
Ignore Miss P or Matty?  What the hell would I giggle about on here?  :)

You don't need botox if you have a fat face like me...you look cherub-like.

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #20 on: December 22, 2010, 08:09:36 PM »
I checked a few months ago, when I put my first (and only) person on Ignore, and I thought RapidRod had the most people ignoring him (16) but I guess Matty beats him a by a hair, making dear David Queen Bee.

Pete you should be glad teh AIDS hasn't chipped away at your cherubic cheeks, are the nether-cheeks cherubic too?

Ford, let's have a Botox party! We just need to find a willing doctor or pseudo-doctor.



« Last Edit: December 22, 2010, 08:43:51 PM by Inchlingblue »

Offline Ann

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #21 on: December 23, 2010, 01:11:51 AM »
Got news for you - most of the people currently ignoring Miss P are perma-banned trolls. Kinda takes the umph out of it. ;D
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #22 on: December 23, 2010, 01:28:16 AM »
Got news for you - most of the people currently ignoring Miss P are perma-banned trolls. Kinda takes the umph out of it. ;D

Perhaps then Matty is the most ignored? :)

MtD

Offline Ann

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #23 on: December 23, 2010, 01:41:19 AM »
Perhaps then Matty is the most ignored? :)

MtD

'Spose you are as far as active members go. You rock the ignored world. Be proud, young man, be proud. If not proud, at least be neat.
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #24 on: December 23, 2010, 01:58:39 AM »
'Spose you are as far as active members go. You rock the ignored world. Be proud, young man, be proud. If not proud, at least be neat.

Fuckin' sweet.  ;D

MtD

Offline MarcoPoz

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #25 on: January 04, 2011, 01:41:00 PM »
Got news for you - most of the people currently ignoring Miss P are perma-banned trolls. Kinda takes the umph out of it. ;D

???

Hey--I just want to be able to sit for a few minutes without pain.  Hate the off season when not training--my ass disappears.  Not that I put much extra padding there during training, but the squats and glute workouts seem to ad least add a bit more lean muscle mass which makes sitting a bit easier.

Offline Ann

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #26 on: January 04, 2011, 02:15:01 PM »
???

Just a bit of joking around, Marco. Nothing to worry about.

Have you considered doing some squats etc during the off-season? You have my sympathy/empathy. When I did the hep C treatment I completely lost my ass and sitting was indeed painful. I've gained enough padding back to where it doesn't hurt any more unless I'm on an unpadded chair for more than a half hour or so. But I can relate to what you and anyone else who may be missing an ass goes through.
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline MarcoPoz

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2011, 02:29:13 PM »
Just a bit of joking around, Marco. Nothing to worry about.

Have you considered doing some squats etc during the off-season? You have my sympathy/empathy. When I did the hep C treatment I completely lost my ass and sitting was indeed painful. I've gained enough padding back to where it doesn't hurt any more unless I'm on an unpadded chair for more than a half hour or so. But I can relate to what you and anyone else who may be missing an ass goes through.
Yeah--starting to realize that at my age--there is no longer an 'off' season.  I just need to take two months for my body to recover from injuries and bumps/bruises--then get right back into the gym--and REALLY focus on legs and backside.  ;D

As far as losing my face cheeks--eh--hell I was never that cute to begin with.

Offline Ann

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #28 on: January 05, 2011, 12:32:50 AM »
As far as losing my face cheeks--eh--hell I was never that cute to begin with.

Ah, but the kilt makes up for that, believe me. I'll never forget the first time I was shown what a man wears under his kilt. And a sporran... to die for. :)
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline MarcoPoz

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Re: HIV Itself May Cause Lipo - Take THAT Miss P!
« Reply #29 on: January 05, 2011, 09:59:19 AM »
Ah, but the kilt makes up for that, believe me. I'll never forget the first time I was shown what a man wears under his kilt. And a sporran... to die for. :)

Totally blushing right now.. Had someone come up to me just last week and ask to pet my sporran  ;D

 


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