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Author Topic: Antioxident Complex Vitamin  (Read 1900 times)

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Offline Gio

  • Member
  • Posts: 92
Antioxident Complex Vitamin
« on: November 13, 2010, 10:37:57 PM »
Ok here goes...  I am currently taking multivitamin, Fish Oil, and Vitamin D3.  I am concerned about free radicals and mitochondria oxidation and i read an article that stated  that taking antioxidants will help with this and help only quick aging syndrome associated with the HAART meds but i do want to now i i should even bother or just continue what i am currently taking..  this particular antioxidant complex has grape seed extract and is that safe??  ARRGGHHH Talk about complicated

Offline natthai

  • Member
  • Posts: 130
  • The truth is not determined by majority vote.
Re: Antioxident Complex Vitamin
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2010, 03:08:22 PM »
Ive spent hundreds of hours now researching cellular oxidation and HIV pathogenesis now.

If you want quick and easy a good vitamin to take would be one called ACES. GNS has one brand. It contains:

Vitamin A
Vitamin C
Vitamin E
Selenium
in one pill.

To this I would add simple protein powder (whey).

For a little background, the reason why HIVers take anti-oxidents is that the HIV encoded for an enzyme called 'glutathione peroxidase'. This enzyme is make from sulphur containing proteins specifically the amino acids Cystine, Glutamine, Tryptophan and the micronutrient selenium. This is why you see many people talking about NAC (a form of cystine) and selenium increasing CD4 counts. Glutathione is your body's master cellular anti-oxident. Luc Montagnier (the discover of HIV) has been studying the role oxidative stress plays in HIV infection for 20 years. Anthony Fauci also published a paper showing that in the lab HIV replication can be haulted (95%) by restoring the cell's Glutathione levels. The problem however is that you cannot just eat Gluthathione as it is very poorly absorbed.

The theory is this: HIV needs those 4 proteins to replicate itself. It takes selenium from the infected host cell depleting the cell's and leading to Apoptosis (cell death). The other proteins it takes from the body. Your immune system also needs these proteins to make leukocytes. So the virus is competing with your body and over a period of years it will eventually overwhelm your immune system. This is the reason why some people choose to suppliament with Selenium and protein (whey is a good source) as well as NAC.

Interestingly one of the best foods you can eat that is high in Selenium, Cystine, Tryptophan and Glutamine is a Cheeseburger.

Here is a link to Fauci's paper I mentioned above dealing with Gluthathione, NAC:

Suppression of human immunodeficiency virus expression in chronically infected monocytic cells by glutathione, glutathione ester, and N-acetylcysteine. (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1704137)

I have an excellent paper which is a meta survey study (it surveys and combines many individual studies on nutrition and HIV pathogenesis. It is very well documented hoewver there are over 200 footnote references so its not easy reading. I can post the link if you are interested in the biochemistry.
Infection date: February 14, 2010 (yeah really)
08/03/2010 - CD4 621 (27%) VL 72,250
25/03/2010 - CD4 981 (28%) VL 122,719 <-started anti-oxidants (ABCDE, Se, ALA, NAC)
11/08/2010 - CD4 1,365 (31%) VL 5,451

Offline Gio

  • Member
  • Posts: 92
Re: Antioxident Complex Vitamin
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2010, 06:45:31 PM »
Thank you so much i have spend hours reading and tryin to determine what is best...  This will definetely help

Offline Hoover

  • Member
  • Posts: 286
Re: Antioxident Complex Vitamin
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2010, 03:57:29 PM »
Natthai,
I have CD4 envy!
Keep doing what you are doing.

Cheers,
Hoover &Dr.T.
Infection date: March 16, 2010
20/05/10 - CD4 348  VL 58,000  Lymph nodes in jaw painful!  Antioxidants started.
01/06/10 - CD4 428  VL?
24/06/10 - CD4 578  VL 9,800
13/07/10 - CD4 620  VL?
04/09/10 - CD4 648  VL?
01/11/10 - CD4 710  VL?   CD8 972
16/12/10    CD4 738  VL?  CD8  896   
02/02/11    CD4 520 (month of parasites and new lab)
14/03/11 started Truvida and Sustiva (Efavirenz)
04/07/11 CD4 686 VL 75 CD8 588  41%
10/10/11 CD4 757  45%  VL UD

Offline natthai

  • Member
  • Posts: 130
  • The truth is not determined by majority vote.
Re: Antioxident Complex Vitamin
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2010, 09:23:17 PM »
Thank you so much i have spend hours reading and tryin to determine what is best...  This will definetely help

This link is EXCELLENT. The author of this paper outlines the whole cellular oxidation/anti-oxident HIV connection. It is a metastudy where she looked at over 100 clinical studied conducted on nutrition and HIV. Specifically what is HIV doing inside the body, what proteins it need (and steal from the host) to replicate and what effects that has on disease progression.

If you are scientifically inclined and interested to learn about how HIV works from a biochemical perspective I highly recommend it:

Nutrients and HIV: Part Three N-Acetylcysteine, Alpha-Lipoic Acid, L-Glutamine, and L-Carnitine
http://www.chiro.org/nutrition/ABSTRACTS/Nutrients_and_HIV_3.shtml
Infection date: February 14, 2010 (yeah really)
08/03/2010 - CD4 621 (27%) VL 72,250
25/03/2010 - CD4 981 (28%) VL 122,719 <-started anti-oxidants (ABCDE, Se, ALA, NAC)
11/08/2010 - CD4 1,365 (31%) VL 5,451

Offline Hoover

  • Member
  • Posts: 286
Re: Antioxident Complex Vitamin
« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2010, 12:32:36 PM »
Good article. (complicated!)
NAC 600 mg three times daily for the past 5 months.
While trapped in the US for 6 weeks we are not doing our hyperbaric chamber, but
have added LDN 4.5mg once daily. All supplements have remained the same.
Labs were done before we left home and will retest when we return in mid December.
Yes I know there are many variebles involved, but it will be an interesting test to see how we stand.
These results will be worthless to anyone but my partner and myself, but we choose to do them.

Cheers from Palm Springs,
Hoover & Dr. T.
Infection date: March 16, 2010
20/05/10 - CD4 348  VL 58,000  Lymph nodes in jaw painful!  Antioxidants started.
01/06/10 - CD4 428  VL?
24/06/10 - CD4 578  VL 9,800
13/07/10 - CD4 620  VL?
04/09/10 - CD4 648  VL?
01/11/10 - CD4 710  VL?   CD8 972
16/12/10    CD4 738  VL?  CD8  896   
02/02/11    CD4 520 (month of parasites and new lab)
14/03/11 started Truvida and Sustiva (Efavirenz)
04/07/11 CD4 686 VL 75 CD8 588  41%
10/10/11 CD4 757  45%  VL UD

 


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