Quantcast

Subscribe to:
POZ magazine
E-newsletters
Join POZ: Facebook MySpace Twitter Pinterest
Tumblr Google+ Flickr MySpace
POZ Personals
Sign In / Join
Username:
Password:
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
September 23, 2014, 10:23:01 AM

Login with username, password and session length


Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 639855
  • Total Topics: 48575
  • Online Today: 212
  • Online Ever: 585
  • (January 07, 2014, 02:31:47 PM)
Users Online

Welcome


Welcome to the POZ/AIDSmeds Community Forums, a round-the-clock discussion area for people with HIV/AIDS, their friends/family/caregivers, and others concerned about HIV/AIDS.  Click on the links below to browse our various forums; scroll down for a glance at the most recent posts; or join in the conversation yourself by registering on the left side of this page.

Privacy Warning:  Please realize that these forums are open to all, and are fully searchable via Google and other search engines. If you are HIV positive and disclose this in our forums, then it is almost the same thing as telling the whole world (or at least the World Wide Web). If this concerns you, then do not use a username or avatar that are self-identifying in any way. We do not allow the deletion of anything you post in these forums, so think before you post.

  • The information shared in these forums, by moderators and members, is designed to complement, not replace, the relationship between an individual and his/her own physician.

  • All members of these forums are, by default, not considered to be licensed medical providers. If otherwise, users must clearly define themselves as such.

  • Forums members must behave at all times with respect and honesty. Posting guidelines, including time-out and banning policies, have been established by the moderators of these forums. Click here for “Am I Infected?” posting guidelines. Click here for posting guidelines pertaining to all other POZ/AIDSmeds community forums.

  • We ask all forums members to provide references for health/medical/scientific information they provide, when it is not a personal experience being discussed. Please provide hyperlinks with full URLs or full citations of published works not available via the Internet. Additionally, all forums members must post information which are true and correct to their knowledge.

  • Product advertisement—including links; banners; editorial content; and clinical trial, study or survey participation—is strictly prohibited by forums members unless permission has been secured from POZ.

To change forums navigation language settings, click here (members only), Register now

Para cambiar sus preferencias de los foros en español, haz clic aquí (sólo miembros), Regístrate ahora

Finished Reading This? You can collapse this or any other box on this page by clicking the symbol in each box.

Author Topic: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)  (Read 2381 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Assurbanipal

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,173
  • Taking a forums break, still see PM's
Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« on: September 23, 2010, 02:31:37 PM »
In the last week or two a number of threads have blown up or veered off course as members have brought up their fears of transmitting HIV and reacted to each other. 

There's been some discussion of ways that we might improve the forums to address transmission fears, but they are scattered in the different threads and don't appear to have come to a positive conclusion.   This thread is set up to see if addressing the issues head on would help.

As a start, I think there are three issues/question topics.

 - Are there actions we could suggest to make it easier for members to be informed by the material on the site?  (The idea of a sticky thread has been evaluated and discarded in another thread-- but are there other steps that would work better?)

 -  Are there steps that would help members reconcile discrepancies between information posted here and on other sites?

 - How can we help members move from an intellectual understanding of transmission to emotional acceptance?  (Especially around children.  I know that, personally, it is one thing to know that I'm not going to put anyone in danger, but that I still emotionally was not ready to change my niece's diapers -- or at least that was my story...)  Have you moved to an emotional/practical acceptance of your transmission risks? How?

I have opinions on all these questions, but I'll save them for a reply.




A final note  -- this is a potentially explosive topic -- fear and all that...  As you post, please remember that pretty much everyone who comes here is looking for support and to support others, so ... assume good intentions and respond with charity.  Also, I'd like to ask that we specifically NOT debate the different theories of HIV transmission risks; I don't want this to devolve into another shouting match over oral transmission.  Instead, please focus on whether there are better mechanisms we could use to help move beyond the shouting matches.

Assurbanipal
5/06 VL 1M+, CD4 22, 5% , pneumonia, thrush -- O2 support 2 months, 6/06 +Kaletra/Truvada
9/06 VL 3959 CD4 297 13.5% 12/06 VL <400 CD4 350 15.2% +Pravachol
2007 VL<400, 70, 50 CD4 408-729 16.0% -19.7%
2008 VL UD CD4 468 - 538 16.7% - 24.6% Osteoporosis 11/08 doubled Pravachol, +Calcium/D
02/09 VL 100 CD4 616 23.7% 03/09 VL 130 5/09 VL 100 CD4 540 28.4% +Actonel (osteoporosis) 7/09 VL 130
8/09  new regimen Isentress/Epzicom 9/09 VL UD CD4 621 32.7% 11/09 VL UD CD4 607 26.4% swap Isentress for Prezista/Norvir 12/09 (liver and muscle issues) VL 50
2010 VL UD CD4 573-680 26.1% - 30.9% 12/10 VL 20
2011 VL UD-20 CD4 568-673 24.7%-30.6%
2012 VL UD swap Prezista/Norvir for Reyataz drop statin CD4 768-828 26.7%-30.7%

Offline jkinatl2

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,007
  • Doo. Dah. Dipp-ity.
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #1 on: September 23, 2010, 03:03:37 PM »
I will repost sopmething I just posted in AM I INFECTED, to a researcher who raised the issues of contradictions between this and other forums regarding transmission theory, as well as specific routes of transmission. I apologize for its length. Please guys, don't hand me a tl:dr for this. It is the long version because the short version sounds abrupt.


It is impossible to quantify an event that has not ever been documented.

Theoretically, HIV could someday mutate into an airborne virus. Such an event has happened before. It has not happened with HIV, and is extremely unlikely to do so.

Scientifically speaking, there is no such thing as 100% certainty. Variables, some of them beyond our current comprehension, exist to make that so.

In the history of the HIV pandemic, we have learned much about human behavior and the analysis of risk. Prior to the long-term studies of serodiscordant relationships, we relied on the following for HIV transmission science:

a) in vitro study, where specific cells were found to be vulnerable to HIV infection. This is the most sound science of all, I posit, because it is directly and continually observable. However, it does not always translate to real-life experience, as a multitude of variables (close to chaos theory, though I do not subscribe) are in play during each individual act.

b) in vivo using SIV, SHIV, or in chimps and other primates. HIV. This isuseful in a slightly different way, as observing the organisms under controlled circumstances is possible, yet variables are introduced that come relatively close to human experience. Sadly, primates react differently than humans when infected with SIV, SHIV, and HIV. Chimps, for example, almost always (I believe science has encountered two exceptions so far) seroconvert, then revert to negative at a later date.

C) Documentation of reported sexual activities. This is perhaps the weakest science regrding HIV, or for that matter, any sexual activity. It is not, for ethical reasons, possible to observe the subjects 24/7 for years, and it is not possible to experiment with people using live HIV (such as putting active virus into the mouth to see if indeed HIV can infect orally).

For many years, scientists and researchers relied on interviews with infected persons and, when possible, their partners. While this went far to advance transmission vector theory (especially in terms of ruling out vectors, such as casual contact), it relied on patient report. As you are, I am sure, aware, patient report is notoriously unreliable - particularly when dealing with socially stigmatized issues such as sexuality, homosexuality, and anal sex. Moreover, when a person is under the influence of mind-altering substances such as alcohol or other drugs, s/he may do things that s/he simply does not recall, or recalls far differently.

The groundbreaking Romero study http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12045500 used that unreliability to an advantage that had not been considered before. It followed serodiscordant couples who engaged in sexual activity over a long period of time (ten years) but used condoms solely for vaginal and anal intercourse. Dr. Kimberly Page Shafer conducted similar studies among gay men in the US, and found the same conclusion.

No incidents of transmission through either insertive or receptive oral sex were found.

Obviously, these studies contradicted earlier ones, which were based on patient report after infection. A resulting round-table discussion amongst scientist and researchers reveals that this is an ongoing controversy.

http://hivinsite.ucsf.edu/InSite?page=pr-rr-05

However, the hard science, the verifiable science, supports Page Shafer and Romero completely. 

Recent discoveries such as the fact that there are very few receptor cells in the oral cavity, the fact that the Bartholin's glands (also called Bartholin glands or greater vestibular glands in females do not carry HIV in greater concentration than sweat or tears, leads to the conclusion that getting HIV from cunnilingus is as close to impossible as science will allow.

Even menstrual fluids, which can and do contain infectious blood, have never been documented to transmit HIV. The fact that there has been exactly zero documented cases of female to female HIV supports this.

HIV is an extremely fragile virus, not nearly as hardy as bacterial STDs. When exposed to temperature and pH changes, the elements of the virus that attach to receptor cells almost immediately become unstable. It is unable to infect another cell without these elements (outside of carefully controlled in vivoexperimentation.

Nothing in life can be called 100 percent certain, scientifically. No promise beyond a doubt that an asteroid will not hit the earth tomorrow. No promise that human mortality will always be a constant. no promise that you will not be the first in the documented history of the HIV pandemic to become infected through the activities you describe.

However, if that happens, and I certainly hope it does not, you would be under extreme scrutiny and study, as your physiology would appear to conflict with the recorded history of human physiology as regards HIV vulnerability. It could even lead to a cure.

This site is the only one in which I participate, specifically because it does not speculate into the realm of the theoretical unnecessarily. It does not give Las Vegas-style odds of infection because to do so would be ludicrous. It does not cover it's collective ass by hedging, and it does not promote stigma and fear by contradicting itself.

This site, thanks in large part to Tim Horn's own scientific and research expertise, uses first-tiered peer-reviewed science with near exclusivity. And science changes, it evolves. What was considered a risk in 1981 was certainly not considered so in 1991. Now, almost twenty years past that, we have refined transmission theory much further. No new vectors have been added, and several have been dismissed.

I hope this has been of some service.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline GSOgymrat

  • Member
  • Posts: 5,029
  • HIV+ since 1993. INTJ
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2010, 03:12:06 PM »


 - How can we help members move from an intellectual understanding of transmission to emotional acceptance?  (Especially around children.  I know that, personally, it is one thing to know that I'm not going to put anyone in danger, but that I still emotionally was not ready to change my niece's diapers -- or at least that was my story...)  Have you moved to an emotional/practical acceptance of your transmission risks? How?

I don't remember ever being concerned that I was going to transmit HIV to someone else.  Fortunately HIV is difficult to transmit, especially if you have an undetectable viral load. I can see if you were having sex with a HIV negative person it would be a concern, especially if you are trying to have children. I'm much more concerned about people, especially children, giving ME a virus then vice versa.

Actually the only time I have thought about infecting others is when I am physically restraining psychiatric patients at work. There is a real risk that someone could bite me and, even if they were not infected, informing someone with severe psychiatric issues that they might have been exposed to HIV isn't good.

Online Miss Philicia

  • Member
  • Posts: 24,111
  • celebrity poster, faker & poser
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #3 on: September 23, 2010, 03:20:08 PM »
I've only ever been concerned about transmission if 1) I was having sex with someone 2) I was injecting drugs with someone.  As I don't inject drugs that cut my worries in half, and for that leftover half I use condoms if the person isn't HIV+.

I've always kept it really simple like that, so my emotional response to any worry has also been simple even when I had a long term relationship with an HIV- person.  Neither he nor I ever worried about the issue.
"I’ve slept with enough men to know that I’m not gay"

Offline GSOgymrat

  • Member
  • Posts: 5,029
  • HIV+ since 1993. INTJ
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #4 on: September 23, 2010, 03:30:40 PM »
I remember back in the 1980s fears of transmission were scarier but by the 1990s I was over it. The HIV+ men were always much more fearful about transmission than I was. I remember one guy wouldn't let me touch his dick unless it was through fabric or latex-- and, no, it wasn't a fetish. I know how some of you think! ;)

Offline newt

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,885
  • the one and original newt
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #5 on: September 23, 2010, 03:31:15 PM »
Fear is irrational, and people have irrational fears. This applies as much to people with bruised lips as to people who sit on toilet seats in lapdancing clubs. A real appreciation of the risks of life is hard enough (I mean, people with children do sky dives for charity, huh!), and with something with as terrible a social valuation as  HIV things get out of proportion. Knowing someone with HIV reduces the fear (this is proven), but also in some cases, perhaps out of concern for others, seems like it increases it. Even me, Mr Statistics, gets the heebie jeebies about giving my (undetectable) virus through (protected) sex to HIV-negative people I like.

I think now I deffo could have a relationship with an HIV-negative person, but I know it would involve 2 people, me and him, and 2 hangers-on, his anxiety and mine, even if they other 2 were only there from time to time. Done it the other way round, so don't see why it would be different, or indeed less loving and valuable.

My old boss used to always drive in a different car to his wife and kids, but what did he know?

 - matt
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline Assurbanipal

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,173
  • Taking a forums break, still see PM's
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2010, 03:44:33 PM »
I will repost sopmething I just posted in AM I INFECTED, to a researcher who raised the issues of contradictions between this and other forums regarding transmission theory, as well as specific routes of transmission. I apologize for its length. Please guys, don't hand me a tl:dr for this. It is the long version because the short version sounds abrupt.


This is getting into the debate about transmission risks.  I think it is more productive IN THIS THREAD to diiscuss what steps the site might take to document views it takes.  For instance, should the lessons have links to more detailed info / that cite to the sources used and not used such as the above?
5/06 VL 1M+, CD4 22, 5% , pneumonia, thrush -- O2 support 2 months, 6/06 +Kaletra/Truvada
9/06 VL 3959 CD4 297 13.5% 12/06 VL <400 CD4 350 15.2% +Pravachol
2007 VL<400, 70, 50 CD4 408-729 16.0% -19.7%
2008 VL UD CD4 468 - 538 16.7% - 24.6% Osteoporosis 11/08 doubled Pravachol, +Calcium/D
02/09 VL 100 CD4 616 23.7% 03/09 VL 130 5/09 VL 100 CD4 540 28.4% +Actonel (osteoporosis) 7/09 VL 130
8/09  new regimen Isentress/Epzicom 9/09 VL UD CD4 621 32.7% 11/09 VL UD CD4 607 26.4% swap Isentress for Prezista/Norvir 12/09 (liver and muscle issues) VL 50
2010 VL UD CD4 573-680 26.1% - 30.9% 12/10 VL 20
2011 VL UD-20 CD4 568-673 24.7%-30.6%
2012 VL UD swap Prezista/Norvir for Reyataz drop statin CD4 768-828 26.7%-30.7%

Offline jkinatl2

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,007
  • Doo. Dah. Dipp-ity.
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #7 on: September 23, 2010, 03:55:35 PM »
This is getting into the debate about transmission risks.  I think it is more productive IN THIS THREAD to diiscuss what steps the site might take to document views it takes.  For instance, should the lessons have links to more detailed info / that cite to the sources used and not used such as the above?

It was not my intention to do that. I was stating the methodology, and rough timeline by which transmission vectors have been proven/ruled out.

If I used oral sex as an example, it was merely because I have done fairly exhaustive research on the topic, and the science translates almost seamlessly to other examples of non-(vaginal or anal) penetrative contact.

I refuse to have the oral debate again any time soon on this board, and if yo would like, I will remove my post from this discussion, or request that a moderator do so.



"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline Assurbanipal

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,173
  • Taking a forums break, still see PM's
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #8 on: September 23, 2010, 04:01:21 PM »
It was not my intention to do that. I was stating the methodology, and rough timeline by which transmission vectors have been proven/ruled out.

If I used oral sex as an example, it was merely because I have done fairly exhaustive research on the topic, and the science translates almost seamlessly to other examples of non-(vaginal or anal) penetrative contact.

I refuse to have the oral debate again any time soon on this board, and if yo would like, I will remove my post from this discussion, or request that a moderator do so.





 No need to remove posts -- just trying to keep us on the topic of better delivery of info rather than debating specific content.
By analogy -- how do we make physics more useful to people rather than whether we believe in relativity.
5/06 VL 1M+, CD4 22, 5% , pneumonia, thrush -- O2 support 2 months, 6/06 +Kaletra/Truvada
9/06 VL 3959 CD4 297 13.5% 12/06 VL <400 CD4 350 15.2% +Pravachol
2007 VL<400, 70, 50 CD4 408-729 16.0% -19.7%
2008 VL UD CD4 468 - 538 16.7% - 24.6% Osteoporosis 11/08 doubled Pravachol, +Calcium/D
02/09 VL 100 CD4 616 23.7% 03/09 VL 130 5/09 VL 100 CD4 540 28.4% +Actonel (osteoporosis) 7/09 VL 130
8/09  new regimen Isentress/Epzicom 9/09 VL UD CD4 621 32.7% 11/09 VL UD CD4 607 26.4% swap Isentress for Prezista/Norvir 12/09 (liver and muscle issues) VL 50
2010 VL UD CD4 573-680 26.1% - 30.9% 12/10 VL 20
2011 VL UD-20 CD4 568-673 24.7%-30.6%
2012 VL UD swap Prezista/Norvir for Reyataz drop statin CD4 768-828 26.7%-30.7%

Offline Matty the Damned

  • Member
  • Posts: 12,228
  • Ninja Please
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #9 on: September 23, 2010, 04:02:51 PM »
This is getting into the debate about transmission risks.  I think it is more productive IN THIS THREAD to diiscuss what steps the site might take to document views it takes.  For instance, should the lessons have links to more detailed info / that cite to the sources used and not used such as the above?

As I understand it the Lessons are designed to present often complex information in a simple, straight forward way that is understandable to ordinary people.

Consider the transmission lesson.

I don't know if citing sources in the Lessons is going to help much (I can see it being a hindrance for some people), but there might be scope for a "further reading" or similar section which deals with that.

Notably the introduction to the Transmission Lesson notes the dearth of reliable information available on other sites.

MtD

Offline Tim Horn

  • Member
  • Posts: 799
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #10 on: September 23, 2010, 04:08:27 PM »
- Are there actions we could suggest to make it easier for members to be informed by the material on the site?  (The idea of a sticky thread has been evaluated and discarded in another thread-- but are there other steps that would work better?)

While I do not believe that yet another sticky thread would be effective -- we already have these in each forum, with links to the various lesson pages on the site -- for newbies to consider and veterans to refer back to. Of course I find this frustrating, not only for the sake of informed dialog in the forums, but because I'm eager to see everyone who participates in these forums using other components of AIDSmeds. After all, what pays the bills to keep this AIDSmeds roof over everyone's heads is traffic -- not just here in the forums, but everywhere on the site.

I've already taken some steps to bring AIDSmeds content directly to the Forums. Depending on which SMF template you're using, you should see the "widget" I placed on the site just a few days ago. It's a feed of our various treatment news stories and I thrilled to see that many of you are already using it. What I'm currently investigating is whether I can easily format the widget to include tabs, listing treatment news stories under one and links to important lessons (e.g., our HIV transmission lesson and when to start treatment lesson) and interactive tools (e.g., our drug interaction checker and lab graphing program). This will put our content in plain site of those using the forums who aren't inclined to actually hunt for important content using the navigation bar or search function at the top of the page.

It's also really helpful, I think, when Forums members refer other members -- particularly those with questions about, say, an ARV, an opportunistic infection, or treatment decisions -- to the content we have on this site. Not only does this help keep the conversation focused on a particular source of information, it also helps me to know when our lesson pages AREN'T addressing -- or are doing a lousy job of addressing -- questions that people have.

Quote
-Are there steps that would help members reconcile discrepancies between information posted here and on other sites?

This certainly isn't easy, because there's not necessarily "right" and "wrong" information on various sites, but rather information published just so for a variety of reasons -- sometimes its political, sometimes its an interpretation of science, sometimes its simplified to the point of appearing inaccurate and sometimes it's just plain wrong.  What's more, it's up to individuals to review various sources of information, scrutinize the sources, receive feedback from others regarding what they may have read, heard, or seen and make decisions that they're most comfortable with.

AIDSmeds isn't about being "right" -- it's about providing people with information and tools, including online communication with each other, to help make the best decisions for themselves. A tremendous amount of insight can be gained from different POVs.  

Quote
- How can we help members move from an intellectual understanding of transmission to emotional acceptance?  (Especially around children.  I know that, personally, it is one thing to know that I'm not going to put anyone in danger, but that I still emotionally was not ready to change my niece's diapers -- or at least that was my story...)  Have you moved to an emotional/practical acceptance of your transmission risks? How?

I fear that this question ultimately requires a PhD dissertation to address.  Personally, however, I think we all need to respect that people enter these Forums with different levels of education, literacy, cultural upbringings, self-awareness, and feelings of shame and stigma and that it's probably best to err on the side of caution with someone who may not have achieved your level of personal (and viral) awareness. A basic question about HIV transmission, no matter how "stupid" it may seem, should simply be answered respectfully or not at all. I'd like to think it's as easy as that.  


Offline jkinatl2

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,007
  • Doo. Dah. Dipp-ity.
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #11 on: September 23, 2010, 04:15:50 PM »
To the questions raised, I think that links to the fist-tier peer-reviewed support for the transmission vector assertions made on this site would be an excellent addition. Or at the very least, citing the examples if we can not or shold not link to them directly would be supportive.

Insofar as reconciling information between this site and others, I have no idea how to approach that. Perhaps a conversation between Mr. Horn and Dr. Gallant would help, but I suspect not. Other sites use inaccurate and misleading information. Other sites use outdated information.

And as I pointed out, some information is controversial even within the scientific and medical community, and I submit that trying to resolve those contradictions would at the very least end up with people flinging scientific references at one another like monkeys throw feces.

For example, a study came out over a decade ago that was the cornerstone for HIV transmission vector  science. The researchers gave specific odds for each sexual activity. Because there had been zero documented instances of transmission through cunnilingus, that vector should have rated zero percent. But as science cannot tolerate either zero or one hundred percent in an estimation, the researchers rated that vector as 0.5%.

Remember, this was before the Romero and Page Shafer studies, which used observation instead of estimation, and tipped the unreliability of patient report in favor of the premise.

The original study has been discredited for years, and the researchers themselves have admitted that as each individual sexual act carries unique variables, there exist within each individual variables which can alter from moment to moment. Making even a ballpark estimate is, at best, soft science.

We do know that some activities infect more easily than others, and have placed a fairly reliable stacking order to that regard.

However, short of mandating that a certain amount of information be read and assimilated, I do not see how we can possibly stop people from parroting inaccurate information, or knowing anything at all about what HIV is and how it works.

I myself can attempt to be civil and courteous when someone asks a question, and I think I manage that much of the time. We have such a terrific LESSONS section, that pretty well sums everything up nicely. It really is all out there... or in here, however you look at it.

But when someone who has been infected for a number of years expresses ignorance about basic HIV transmission vectors on a site like this, with so many personalities and levels of experience, there will no doubt be a few snarky comments. Such is the nature of the web.

Like I told a poster in another thread, some of the most acerbic people on this site also carry an awful lot of sheer intelligence and information. It would not be wise to place them on ignore, as their scientific insights are almost always spot-on.

But  a person has to be ready to endure a bit of negative feedback when they post a question that is, frankly, startling. I think the same question, posted in another forum such as RECENTLY INFECTED and SOMEONE I LOVE HAS HIV would have been answered, and would be answered far more courteously, without the overtone of "You should know this already."

So the shortest possible answer is that there is no way to promise that a similar question, posted in a similar forum, would not get the same tone insofar as replies are concerned.

As for helping someone move from intellectual to emotional acceptance, that really varies on the persons involved, including the posters who respond. Some of us avoid confrontation, some of us are nurturing, some of us are abrasive and hard-ass. I submit from my own experiences that there have been times when I have needed, indeed benefited from, all of the above.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline mecch

  • Member
  • Posts: 11,726
  • red pill? or blue pill?
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2010, 04:30:05 PM »
People who post to Am I Infected with rational or irrational fears are also in the grips of emotion. You people who answer that thread are so patient and always do a great job. Maybe the challenge is to get funds to pay the people who moderate that thread.  Or refer them to a site that YOU think does a better job, but does one exist?  Its such a public service, to do it here, or anywhere in any site.  I guess those are my thoughts.  I don't know much about the administration involved in moderating such a thread here, or on another site.  It seems the questioner often requires a very individual response to get that person the response he needs.

About fears of transmission when we are already HIV+, arent they handled swiftly enough by the many people who reply when people post such fears in other threads?

“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline john33

  • Member
  • Posts: 407
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2010, 04:53:34 PM »
People who post to Am I Infected with rational or irrational fears are also in the grips of emotion

Mecch,
there you've hit the nail on the head! And I'm sure it's the same in all the forums.

I think patience and reiterating the facts calmly will help. After all, I'm sure I'm not the only person who's mind goes blank and forgets facts when fear and worry come into play.

John

Offline Ann

  • Administrator
  • Member
  • Posts: 28,140
  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2010, 05:36:44 PM »
People who post to Am I Infected with rational or irrational fears are also in the grips of emotion.

We're NOT talking about people who post in the Am I Infected forum nor are we talking about how that forum is moderated. We are talking about people who are living with hiv and ask transmission questions. As I sometimes say to people in Am I, "get with the program already!"
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline mecch

  • Member
  • Posts: 11,726
  • red pill? or blue pill?
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2010, 06:33:01 PM »
We're NOT talking about people who post in the Am I Infected forum nor are we talking about how that forum is moderated. We are talking about people who are living with hiv and ask transmission questions. As I sometimes say to people in Am I, "get with the program already!"
Cool your jets Ann, gee wiz. I got confused cause jkinatl2 posted stuff here about his posts to Am I infected. Excuse me.  Sorry. 
I quit this conversation cause I don't see much of a problem in any other thread.

If actively contributing members get into shouting matches about transmission routes its usually just those people jerking each other off. 

If someone comes in with a left field fear of transmission concern, they usually get a good answer and some info, no?

“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline veritas

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,410
Re: Fear of Transmission (for and by people living with HIV)
« Reply #16 on: September 23, 2010, 06:36:18 PM »

Actually, the emotions involved between the two ( Am I infected and transmission questions) are quite similar. Many factors come into play. It is how we percieve the issue that determines how we cope with the problem in order to move on.

An interesting Doctoral Thesis, by Eileen Delaney, approaches the problem  from the standpoint of  acceptance and health for individuals who are hiv positive. Fear plays a big part. How does one overcome fear of an action within the non-personal confines of a web forum? Education is a start. But the demons must be overcome and for some, it is beyond the limits of this forum.

If you are interested in Ms Delaney's hypothesis, along with her conclusions, here is the link:

http://etd.ohiolink.edu/send-pdf.cgi/Delaney%20Eileen.pdf?bgsu1264021049

Although her samples were limited to the military (52), she made some thought-provoking conclusions.

v

 


Terms of Membership for these forums
 

© 2014 Smart + Strong. All Rights Reserved.   terms of use and your privacy
Smart + Strong® is a registered trademark of CDM Publishing, LLC.