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Author Topic: What possible scenario would be?  (Read 1297 times)

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Offline roy100

  • Member
  • Posts: 123
What possible scenario would be?
« on: June 05, 2010, 05:44:49 PM »
Lets assume you are on Kaletra and Truvada for 4 to 5 years and you get to have undetectable amounts of virus. your cd count reach 800.
Then you decide to take a break from everything
Thinking that when you convert from seropositivness to Aids takes an average time of 10 or more years, then you would think that you would loose 50 cd per year.

That makes you go back to Aids treatment after 4 to 5 years, still having 650 cd.

Then start treatment again.

It took me about 10 to 13 years to reach to 46 cd the my actual count, or I bet is higher after almost 2 months taking the above combination , but I am just fantasizing about taking breaks from drugs evewry so on years.
Swallowing pills is kind of hard when you have acid reflux , and possible a iatal hernia, so you need to protect your esophagus wit Prilosec, or omeprazole.
Please tell me what would you thing the outcome might be.My Dr told me he was seen somebody that took a break of 2 years, and going back on therapy doing OK.



« Last Edit: June 05, 2010, 05:48:11 PM by roy100 »
Diagnosed 18Th March 2010
March 30Th VL +100,000 CD4 46
CD8T  575 CD8 %60.6
On Truvada and Kaletra. . Remeron 15mg  and150 mg  wellbutrin xl for depression. Clonazepan 2 mg to sleep. Omeprazole 20  once a day.
July 17 2010 Vl 362 CD4 155, 6.4 %
CD8T suppressors 1482 CD8% 61.1
 Nov 16 2010: V l 937 CD4 188,10%
CD8T Suppresors 997 CD8%55.8
August 15th 2011 Vl UD, less than 40.
CD4:543(26.7%) CD8:887 (43.6 %) Ratio .61
Jan 14th,2012 ,less than 40.
CD4:478 (24.4%) CD8: 962 (49.1%) Ratio.50
June 2012 CD4 599, CD8 856 UD
Oct 2013 CD 702, CD 843 UD Ratio:.87

Offline Inchlingblue

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,119
  • Chad Ochocinco PETA Ad
Re: What possible scenario would be?
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2010, 05:54:25 PM »
Some studies (such as SMART) have shown that structured treatment interruptions lead to higher instances of cancer and other complications and even death. Also, the viral load and CD4 changes usually happen much quicker than during pre-HAART.

Here is more info:

http://www.thebody.com/index/treat/sti.html

Is it true
Apr 3, 2010
Hello Dr.

Is it true that once the virus is exposed to meds, if you stop taking them or they stop working you will rapidly die.

Thanks



Response from Dr. Young


Not true.

The devil's in the details-- the immediate risks of stopping HIV treatments are that the virus will come back and CD4 counts will fairly rapidly drop to baseline. What you allude to are the data from the SMART study that says that, while the absolute risk is low, stopping treatment is associated with an increase in risk of death from all causes-- that is to say that if everything else is equal, it's better to stay on medications with an undetectable viral load, than to stop and let the virus return.



LINK:

http://www.thebody.com/Forums/AIDS/Meds/Archive/STI/Q207706.html


SMART study reaffirms that HIV replication is harmful, even at CD4 counts above 350

LINK:

http://www.aidsmap.com/en/news/ED2F5DFD-658F-4CCF-99E2-302A8229F1BC.asp
« Last Edit: June 05, 2010, 05:55:58 PM by Inchlingblue »

Offline veritas

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,408
Re: What possible scenario would be?
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2010, 06:01:36 PM »

Roy,

If only it was as easy as your scenario suggests, we'd all be doing it. Alas, it's not! I second what Inch posted. Don't mess with an ud vl unless you have to. The risk isn't worth it.

v

Offline Moffie65

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,755
  • Living POZ since 1983
Re: What possible scenario would be?
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2010, 06:05:34 PM »
Simple answer here.  NO.

You of course can make your own choices, but I recommend you read all the studies already on record about the subject and make your own choice. 
The Bible contains 6 admonishments to homosexuals,
and 362 to heterosexuals.
This doesn't mean that God doesn't love heterosexuals,
It's just that they need more supervision.
Lynn Lavne

Offline Matty the Damned

  • Member
  • Posts: 12,198
  • Ninja Please
Re: What possible scenario would be?
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2010, 06:14:43 PM »
Lets assume you are on Kaletra and Truvada for 4 to 5 years and you get to have undetectable amounts of virus. your cd count reach 800.
Then you decide to take a break from everything
Thinking that when you convert from seropositivness to Aids takes an average time of 10 or more years, then you would think that you would loose 50 cd per year.

That makes you go back to Aids treatment after 4 to 5 years, still having 650 cd.

Then start treatment again.

It took me about 10 to 13 years to reach to 46 cd the my actual count, or I bet is higher after almost 2 months taking the above combination , but I am just fantasizing about taking breaks from drugs evewry so on years.
Swallowing pills is kind of hard when you have acid reflux , and possible a iatal hernia, so you need to protect your esophagus wit Prilosec, or omeprazole.
Please tell me what would you thing the outcome might be.My Dr told me he was seen somebody that took a break of 2 years, and going back on therapy doing OK.

I've chopped and changed on medication regimens over the years and I have regrets. I agree with Daddy Tim and Veritas here. Don't fuck with an undetectable VL.

MtD

Offline mecch

  • Member
  • Posts: 11,240
  • red pill? or blue pill?
Re: What possible scenario would be?
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2010, 06:30:55 PM »
PS - your doctor said he/she "heard of it" but does he/she recommend a treatment interruption? Highly unlikely.

A few people talk about drug level monitoring to see if one can get buy with a bit less HAART and still stay undetectable - could that be on interest to you?

Oh, wait a minute.  Excuse me for being dense, but is this your situation now:

"It took me about 10 to 13 years to reach to 46 cd the my actual count, or I bet is higher after almost 2 months taking the above combination , but I am just fantasizing about taking breaks from drugs evewry so on years."


So how long exactly have you been on HAART and what are your numbers.  Maybe the example you gave  (4-5 years on HAART and undetectable) is hypothetical, and not you?  Have you only been on 2 months??
« Last Edit: June 05, 2010, 06:34:43 PM by mecch »
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline roy100

  • Member
  • Posts: 123
Re: What possible scenario would be?
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2010, 11:13:49 PM »
Yes only 2 months, and this is just an hypotetical question after a few years with antiretrovirals.
Diagnosed 18Th March 2010
March 30Th VL +100,000 CD4 46
CD8T  575 CD8 %60.6
On Truvada and Kaletra. . Remeron 15mg  and150 mg  wellbutrin xl for depression. Clonazepan 2 mg to sleep. Omeprazole 20  once a day.
July 17 2010 Vl 362 CD4 155, 6.4 %
CD8T suppressors 1482 CD8% 61.1
 Nov 16 2010: V l 937 CD4 188,10%
CD8T Suppresors 997 CD8%55.8
August 15th 2011 Vl UD, less than 40.
CD4:543(26.7%) CD8:887 (43.6 %) Ratio .61
Jan 14th,2012 ,less than 40.
CD4:478 (24.4%) CD8: 962 (49.1%) Ratio.50
June 2012 CD4 599, CD8 856 UD
Oct 2013 CD 702, CD 843 UD Ratio:.87

Offline mecch

  • Member
  • Posts: 11,240
  • red pill? or blue pill?
Re: What possible scenario would be?
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2010, 08:48:53 AM »
Ah ok thanks for the clarification.

From what I know, currently, treatment interruptions are really the exception to the rule -- and tend to me more about the HIV+ person's wishes than best medical practice.

Since you'll have a couple of years until your body builds up again, who knows what will be the drugs or the treatment guidelines at that time.  

Its important to hope for something, and to have fantasies about the future -  but also live in the moment - now - so stick to your daily dosing faithfully.   And I'm sending you good vibes that your body makes the turnaround quickly and strongly.
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline roy100

  • Member
  • Posts: 123
Re: What possible scenario would be?
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2010, 09:39:24 AM »
Thanks mecch, for bring   me to reality, and the good vibrations.
You have a wisdom soul !
Diagnosed 18Th March 2010
March 30Th VL +100,000 CD4 46
CD8T  575 CD8 %60.6
On Truvada and Kaletra. . Remeron 15mg  and150 mg  wellbutrin xl for depression. Clonazepan 2 mg to sleep. Omeprazole 20  once a day.
July 17 2010 Vl 362 CD4 155, 6.4 %
CD8T suppressors 1482 CD8% 61.1
 Nov 16 2010: V l 937 CD4 188,10%
CD8T Suppresors 997 CD8%55.8
August 15th 2011 Vl UD, less than 40.
CD4:543(26.7%) CD8:887 (43.6 %) Ratio .61
Jan 14th,2012 ,less than 40.
CD4:478 (24.4%) CD8: 962 (49.1%) Ratio.50
June 2012 CD4 599, CD8 856 UD
Oct 2013 CD 702, CD 843 UD Ratio:.87

 


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