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Author Topic: Scared with classic symptoms  (Read 5338 times)

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Offline Scared184

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Scared with classic symptoms
« on: March 22, 2010, 01:48:23 AM »
Hi Doc,
I am extremely anxious and depressed.
I had a protected sex with a sex worker for a very brief 2-3 mins and made a terrible mistake of touching the condom to see if the tip was intact.  I later realised i had some minor skin cuts/peels on my thumb and index fingure which i might have used to touch the condom.  this was a brief touch and I am not sure how much fluid would I have touched. But I think the sex was not very long and hence the sw would not have cum hence not too much fluid. Further to that I have a habit of moving the foreskin of my penis up n down before peeing. It takes a few mins after sex to pee. In this time I might have touched the finger on the penis and foreskin. After peeing I rem washig the penis with water. No soap. I washed my hand with soap after that.
Thus two exposure, cuts on my finger- I dint rem it bleIeding- touching vaginal fluid and touching the fluid on to the penis/foreskin.
 
My symptoms are the following: the timing is perfect for ars about 18 days.
2 weeks and 4 days later - knee joint aches and stiffness (of a very unsual nature - very very stiff) Lasted for 2 days. After 2 days
2 weeks and 6 days later - mild flu and upset stomach.  This led to a loss of apetite which lasted about 10 days.  I have lost close to 3-4 kgs in this timeframe. Don't think I had high temperature however I felt slightly run down, body feeling hot intenally and muscle aches in thighs and back. All this happened without any stress hence these are 100% REAL symptoms.  I observed a White Tongue subsequently after 10 days in the symptoms. This is still lingering. I have a gum boil.
I went to an internal medicine specialist to investigate the weight loss but all reports (routine) were normal. Thus unexplained. I dint mention to him my HIV concern.

Another big reason for my paranoia is my gf. We had unprotected sex after a week of my exposure. And she got her ars symptoms again perfect timing in 18 days or so.
Her symptoms:
sore throat (lasting 5 days) - used antibiotics but dint help
fever (mild) - lasted 2 days - around 100f
dry cough (lasting 6 days) with sore throat
rashes (on back) red rashes with papules. 

I am currently seeing folliculitis a few bumps here n there for the last 2 weeks. (I am into my 11th week)
I have read zillions of posts in several forums and also have been assessed as no risk for my situation but the ars symptoms above, it's timing and the real nature of these symptoms (none induced by stress) is causing terrible anxiety.
My questions are the following:
1) what amount of vaginal fluid is required to infect. If I hv touched a little more then a few drops and exposed a cut or my penis- would it be sufficient?
2) please please could you throw some light in symptoms. Is ars fever always high fever and last for several days?
3) how common is weight loss and loss of apetite in ars?
4) is folliculitis an early HIV occurance?
I would indeed highly appreciate your help. 


Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2010, 01:57:05 AM »
You had protected sex and as such you were not at risk of contracting HIV. It doesn't matter that you touched the outside of the condom with your bare fingers, you were not at risk and you do not need to be tested for HIV.

Your symptoms are not "classic" for HIV infection. In fact the symptoms that some people get when first infected with are generally indistinguishable from any number of viral infections. Around 50% of people infected with HIV get no acute symptoms at all.

If you feel ill, please see your doctor.

Please read our Welcome Thread and follow the links to our lessons on HIV transmission. You will also find our posting guidelines in that thread.

MtD

Offline Scared184

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  • Posts: 8
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2010, 02:12:12 AM »
Matty,
thanks for your response and I understand that this is a low risk situation. However it would be great if you could elaborate on the symptoms not being classic ars symptoms.  I understand it varies from person to person and can range from mild to severe. Hence appreciate your responses on my qns on symptoms.
Thanks.

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2010, 02:26:33 AM »
This isn't a low risk situation it's a no risk situation. You weren't at risk of contracting HIV so whatever is causing your symptoms, it's not HIV.

Do you see how that works?

I don't intend on getting into an extended exchange with you about the symptoms that some people experience during the acute phase of HIV infection. My previous explanation should be sufficient for you.

You were not at risk of HIV from the sexual encounter you report here, you do not need to be tested for HIV as a result.

MtD

Offline Scared184

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  • Posts: 8
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2010, 03:21:37 AM »
Matt,
understand that symptoms are not distinguishable from other viral causes however for these symptoms to appear in both my and my gfs case in the perfect timing is simply too much of a coincidence to happen.
Hence fixated to symptoms.  And also the other question if a few drops of vaginal fluid through skin cuts or vaginal fluid touched onto the penis/remain inside the foreskin pose risk.  Lastly is there any resorce here on this website that can provide inputs on ars symptoms experienced by people diagonised with HIV?
Thanks
 

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2010, 03:40:01 AM »
Matt,
understand that symptoms are not distinguishable from other viral causes however for these symptoms to appear in both my and my gfs case in the perfect timing is simply too much of a coincidence to happen.
Hence fixated to symptoms.  And also the other question if a few drops of vaginal fluid through skin cuts or vaginal fluid touched onto the penis/remain inside the foreskin pose risk.  Lastly is there any resorce here on this website that can provide inputs on ars symptoms experienced by people diagonised with HIV?
Thanks
 

Actually it is entirely coincidental. You had protected sex with a sex worker. You later develop non specific symptoms which your girlfriend develops as well. Any reasonable person would conclude that you've picked up a cold bug which your girlfriend also catches, colds being highly transmissable in domestic settings.

You feel guilty because you fucked a sex worker when you have a girlfriend and so you conclude that you must have HIV infection. Many people do this, believing that HIV is the consequence of what they consider immoral sexual conduct.

HIV is not the consequence of perceived immoral sexual conduct, rather it can be the consequence of unprotected anal and vaginal sex, neither of which you engaged it. Presuming that you've not be sharing HIV contaminated injecting equipment such as needles and syringes we can conclude that you have not been infected with HIV.

As I said eariler, I am not going to indulge you with an extended discussion about your symptoms and HIV as HIV cannot be diagnosed by observing non-specific symptoms.

Please be aware that you will not be allowed to use this forum to wring your hands over the same non-risk issue.

MtD

Offline Scared184

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  • Posts: 8
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2010, 02:14:14 AM »
Matty,
apologies for writing another post and I promise this will be my last post.
Just wanted to say it's not the guilt but the real symptoms as I said i experienced along with gf in the perfect timing. I could assume it was a normal cold but I hv never lost some much weight in one weeks time.
Another thing is about this being a no risk situation. I hv read several post here which says cervical fluid is infectious and outside the body it remains infectious for few minutes. In my case I had touched cervical fluid, with skin cuts (not actively bleeding) and touched the fingers onto my urethra.  Also with regards to the timing all this happened in not more than 1-2 mins. Doesn't this mean inwas exposed?  I know you won't discuss abt my symptoms which to me are ars related and real - not stress or guilt induced. Thanks for your time and reply and apologies to bother. I really hope what you say and assess is true, my heart wants to believe it but the facts of my symptoms are not in sync.

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2010, 07:05:01 AM »
Scared,

If you feel unwell, see a doctor. Whatever is going on has NOTHING to do with hiv as you did NOT have a risk.

And by the way, it's not just sex workers who might have hiv. Unless you and your girlfriend tested TOGETHER before having unprotected intercourse, then for all you know, you or she may have been positive long before you ever went to a sex worker.

It's UNPROTECTED intercourse that's a risk for hiv infection, NOT PROTECTED.

You need to be using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, every time, no exceptions until such time as you are in a securely monogamous relationship where you have both tested for ALL sexually transmitted infections together. To agree to have unprotected intercourse is to consent to the possibility of being infected with an STI. Sex without a condom lasts only a matter of minutes, but hiv is forever.

Have a look through all three condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use condoms with confidence.

ALTHOUGH YOU DO NOT NEED TO TEST OVER THE SEX WORKER INCIDENT, anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care check-up, including but not limited to hiv testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.

If you aren't already having regular, routine check-ups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine hiv tests to return with negative results. Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than hiv.

Use condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple!

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Scared184

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  • Posts: 8
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2010, 09:04:45 AM »
Thanks ann for your kind reply. As per testing of my gf and myself is concerned- we've both been tested negative hence no issue up until this incident.. We re both monogamous, until this stupid adventure by me.   This forum and others are a great help on gaining knowledge re transmission risks.  If I could hv received responses on my qns re symptoms which I think are not straightforward to address, I would hv like several others, been much much assured. 
Like I mentioned in my last post, I touched the condom mins after it sex. Thus it could be considered infectious.  Touched it with small cuts - could perhaps enter the bloodstream (remote chance).  Rubbed the hand on the penis (under the foreskin), chance rlto infect urethra.  Only respite I can see here is the quantum of fluid (few drops).  All this with symptoms is worrying.  Any change in your assessment.  I promise this is the last post and will not bother. 

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2010, 09:12:33 AM »
The details you are throwing in don't make any difference. This was a no-risk incident for HIV transmission. But a high-risk incident for GUILT after the fact. You can't undo that bit of your personal history. Take a breath and let it go. That's best for both you and your gf.

And check out the physical symptoms with your doctor if they persist. They have nothing to do with HIV.

Cheers.
Andy Velez

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2010, 09:59:47 AM »
Scared,

Hiv is not transmitted outside the body, as in getting vaginal fluids on your fingers, even if you have cuts, or transferring vaginal fluids from your had to your foreskin. Hiv is very fragile and once it's outside the body, small changes in temperature and pH and moisture levels all quickly damage the virus and render it unable to infect.

Hiv IS transmitted INSIDE the body, as in unprotected anal or vaginal intercourse where the virus never leaves the confines of the two bodies.

You are worrying unnecessarily. You did NOT have a risk. If you did, we'd tell you. We're here to get people who need to test, to test. We're not here to miss possible infections. You didn't have a risk so you have no possibility of being infected.

We're also not here to discuss your symptoms with you. That's what your doctor is for. As I said earlier, whatever is going on has NOTHING to do with hiv as you did not have a risk.

If you read the Welcome Thread before posting like you're supposed to, you will have read the following posting guideline:

Quote

Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result or no-risk situation, will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.


Please consider yourself warned!

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Scared184

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  • Posts: 8
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2010, 12:55:17 AM »
Thanks Ann. Andy,
Although I hope wish and pray that the assessment by this forum and others is correct and eventually I get proven wrong re my feeling of "I am positive" there are things that can't be changed. 
The unexplained weight loss in only 10 days time- without stress.  obviously I hv been to the doctor and he was not able to find anything to explain.  Thus, blame it on a viral infection.  Which only I know is perhaps HIV.
Persistent White Tongue and folliculitis.  Thank you guys for your patience. I know there isn't much you can add.  As I have told, I am too scared to do the test for now.  Will try and move on as much as possible and at some point in near future the eventuality will hit.  I will come back to confirm if the NO RISK assessment in this forum is indeed so simple or is there any grey area.   

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2010, 03:25:33 AM »
Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result or no-risk situation, will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.

Offline Scared184

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  • Posts: 8
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #13 on: June 08, 2010, 01:37:28 AM »

hi,  
you hv been extremely helpful and so has been your forum which has kept me occupied over the last 5 months. Ok now the question, I finally got tested at 5 months (1 day short) from the exposure through Eclia for HIV I and ii antibody + p24 antigen. Result negative (value 0.394- cut off 1.0) 
1) is eclia test reliable? Why is it not so widely used?
2) anything to worry if the value is 0.39? Have read posts with 0.11 and less
3) is 5 months testing better than a 3 month testing from a reliability standpoint. 
4) when is a 6 month testing required? I have a mild chronic fatigue syndrome, pre diabetes? Can these delay antibody generation?
5) if I indeed had ars symptoms at 21 day mark, wouldn't antibodies be genrated by this time. I.e., 6 month testing requirement ruled out? 

I really appreciate your great work. My whole hearted support to your organisation. Am sure once I get over the personal trauma I will continue supporting your/other organisations for this cause for years to come. 

Thanks and god bless you all.

Offline Ann

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    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #14 on: June 08, 2010, 02:02:44 AM »
Scared,

You never had a risk in the first place, so of course you tested negative. Your result is reliable and conclusive. You do not have hiv.

If you continue to come back with more about this NO RISK, CONCLUSIVE NEGATIVE scenario, you WILL be given that time out you've been warned about.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Scared184

  • Member
  • Posts: 8
Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #15 on: June 08, 2010, 03:10:40 AM »
Thanks Ann

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Scared with classic symptoms
« Reply #16 on: June 08, 2010, 06:24:11 AM »
The bottom line in all of this is that you didn't do anything which put you at risk for HIV, as you have already been told.

You strayed from a relationship and had some sex with a sex worker and I suspect your feelings about that are what is driving your totally unfounded fears about HIV. You did what you did and you can't undo it. You're a dawg like a lot us and you went straying. It's just a part of your history now. See it, accept it, take a breath and let it go.

There was no risk for HIV transmission in that incident. Get on with your life. If you decide to get tested it is strictly for your peace of mind and a negative result based on what you have reported is inevitable.

There's really nothing more we can do for you here so keep in mind that you have been warned about returning over the same non-risk situation.
Andy Velez

 


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