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Author Topic: Anne, Andy, anyone - help giving oral  (Read 3945 times)

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Offline bradhelp

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Anne, Andy, anyone - help giving oral
« on: August 30, 2011, 05:23:03 PM »

I have read this site and was briefly very reassured, however then I read something else on here in the 'lesson' section which seemed to contradict what the forums say, so can I please have some advice as I was oing crazy- got some respite and am now crazy again.

About ten weeks ago i gave a 19 year old guy oral sex  - the whole stupid thing lasted about 3 mins, he did not ejaculate in my mouth. I met him on a casual sex meet up site -awful, I know. As far as I know I did not have any cuts in my mouth and the most i could have got in there is pre cum

Anyway, 3 weeks later I noticed the gland at the back of my neck (occipital lymph node) was swollen, I also got 3 nasty mouth ulcers. I googled them and got secro-conversion. ASR!

Now I have seen on the forums that everyone is very confident that sucking a penis is not going to cause HIV, however I then read the 'transmission lesson' section where it suggested sucking IS a possible way to catch HIV.

Am i reading this wrong?

I'm sorry to nag and I know you guys do a great job, please don't think I am being dis-repectful, I am just confused.

« Last Edit: August 30, 2011, 05:54:13 PM by bradhelp »

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Anne, Andy, anyone - help giving oral
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2011, 06:19:33 PM »
You never had a risk of contracting HIV from oral sex.

No incident HIV infections among MSM who practice exclusively oral sex.
Int Conf AIDS 2004 Jul 11-16; 15:(abstract no. WePpC2072)??Balls JE, Evans JL, Dilley J, Osmond D, Shiboski S, Shiboski C, Klausner J, McFarland W, Greenspan D, Page-Shafer K?University of California, San Francisco, San Francisco, United States

Oral transmission of HIV, reality or fiction? An update
J Campo1, MA Perea1, J del Romero2, J Cano1, V Hernando2, A Bascones1
Oral Diseases (2006) 12, 219–228

AIDS: Volume 16(17) 22 November 2002 pp 2350-2352
Risk of HIV infection attributable to oral sex among men who have sex with men and in the population of men who have sex with men

Page-Shafer, Kimberlya,b; Shiboski, Caroline Hb; Osmond, Dennis Hc; Dilley, Jamesd; McFarland, Willie; Shiboski, Steve Cc; Klausner, Jeffrey De; Balls, Joycea; Greenspan, Deborahb; Greenspan
Page-Shafer K, Veugelers PJ, Moss AR, Strathdee S, Kaldor JM, van Griensven GJ. Sexual risk behavior and risk factors for HIV-1 seroconversion in homosexual men participating in the Tricontinental Seroconverter Study, 1982-1994 [published erratum appears in Am J Epidemiol 1997 15 Dec; 146(12):1076]. Am J Epidemiol 1997, 146:531-542.

Studies which show the fallacy of relying on anecdotal evidence as opposed to carefully controlled study insofar as HIV transmission risk is concerned:

Jenicek M. "Clinical Case Reporting" in Evidence-Based Medicine. Oxford: Butterworth–Heinemann; 1999:117
Saltzman SP, Stoddard AM, McCusker J, Moon MW, Mayer KH. Reliability of self-reported sexual behavior risk factors for HIV infection in homosexual men. Public Health Rep. 1987 102(6):692–697.Nov–Dec;

Catania JA, Gibson DR, Chitwood DD, Coates TJ. Methodological problems in AIDS behavioral research: influences on measurement error and participation bias in studies of sexual behavior. Psychol Bull. 1990 Nov;108(3):339–362.

There is no debate (among experts) about the HIV risks associated with oral sex. The risk is so low that almost nobody who cares for HIV infected patients has ever had a patient believed to have been infected that way. Among experts, it's a semantic issue about using terms like "no risk" and "very low risk". There is no difference between my or Dr. Hook's use of "low risk" and other experts' "no risk".

"And oral sex is basically safe sex -- completely safe with respect to HIV and although not zero risk for other STDs, the chance of infection is far lower than for unprotected vaginal or anal sex. Please educate yourself about the real risks. If you stick with oral sex and condom-protected vaginal or anal sex, you have no HIV worries and very little worry about other STDs. " DR HANSFIELD

"I am sure you can find lots of people who believe that HIV is transmitted by oral sex, but you will not find scientific data to support this unrealistic concern..." DR HOOK

"HIV is not spread by touching, masturbation, oral sex or condom protected sex."- DR. HOOK

in the public HIV Prevention forum of MedHelp, TEAK and the other moderators maintain that oral sex in all forms is a zero risk activity. Would you agree with this assessment?
"HIV is not spread by masturbation, through oral sex, through kissing or other casual contact." Dr. Hook
"The observation on thousands and thousands of observations is that HIV is not spread by oral sex (of any sort)." DR HOOK
"I would not say your risk ,if he had HIV is "slim to none"- that's too high.  I would say they are effectively zero.  How much of his ejaculate or other genital  secretions you may have swallowed makes no difference.  EWH "
"As far as HIV is concerned, there is no known risk of getting HIV from performing oral sex on an infected partner, even if that person's genital secretions get into your eyes or if you swallow." Dr.Hook

Offline bradhelp

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  • Posts: 4
Re: Anne, Andy, anyone - help giving oral
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2011, 07:51:35 AM »
Thankyou Rod, I have been reading the lessons page and the nhs page so you think they are out of date and I am being a paranoid fool?

were the symptoms I mentioned even consistent with ARS and does HIV even exist in precum? last question I promise - do u think testing in my case is stupid?

Offline bradhelp

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  • Posts: 4
Re: Anne, Andy, anyone - help giving oral
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2011, 07:52:16 AM »
Also, I will read some of the links you posted, I do appreciate all your effort

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Anne, Andy, anyone - help giving oral
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2011, 08:27:53 AM »
Theoretically anything other than sex with your own hand is a risk. However, claims of having been infected through giving oral never seem to hold up under careful scrutiny. On the other hand, there are longterm studies of sero-discordant couples, both gay and straight who had lots of mutual unprotected oral sex and only protected vaginal and anal intercourse. To date not a single sero-negative partner has become infected.

Your saliva contains over a dozen enzymes and proteins which serve as a very effective natural barrier against the transmission of HIV if it is present.

You are worrying needlessly.

Other STDs are much easier to acquire than HIV, so we do advise anyone who is sexually active to at least annually have a full STD panel done. Right now HIV is not your problem.
Andy Velez

Offline bradhelp

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  • Posts: 4
Re: Anne, Andy, anyone - help giving oral
« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2011, 09:53:43 AM »
I just wanted to conclude this thread.

Despite all your advice I went for a test today, I got an insti HIV test and it was negative 3 months post exposure. Rod and Andy - you were right I was wrong!

Despite my being in a dark place during my 3 month stay on this board, I have been so touched by the many kind people who I spoke with or exchanged messages with, Andy in particular you are a very warm and kind hearted guy. I realise answering questions on this site must get old, the same questions, the same paranoia, however this is natural and it takes a special kind of person to man this section - a place where people are terified, when you feel you can no longer be bothered to respons you should stop working on the site, it isn't fair, luckily for me you two and others who shall remain nameless as they responded to me privately, are real troopers who thankfully for me haven't given up yet.
My absolute best to you all and thankyou

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: Anne, Andy, anyone - help giving oral
« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2011, 10:33:42 AM »
Sometimes the only way to get peace about your status is to get tested, even when you're told there was no risk. So it's good that you did that and great that you got the happy negative result.

Get on with your life now and just remember to always use condoms for vaginal and anal intercourse.

Andy Velez


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