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Author Topic: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet  (Read 2714 times)

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Offline WillyWump

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Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« on: January 29, 2010, 02:27:40 PM »

5/09- Started Atripla
7/09 - CD4 464 (20%) VL- 525
9/09 - CD4 520 (22%) VL - 1460
Switched to Prezista/Norvir/Truvada
10/3/09- CD4 678 (30%) VL-460
1/29/10- CD4 600 (29%) VL- 199 -Today's new results.

So my CD4 dropped slightly, Doc says this is most likely attributed to my Upper Respiratory Infection a few weeks back. I accept that.

VL still decreasing but still not U/D, I guess the last few hundred are the hardest to get rid of, at least for me. I know patience is a virtue, but it's not one I ever embraced.

On the upside, Doc says my Prostate felt good. I agreed and almost asked for a re-check it felt so good.

-Will


POZ since '08

Last Labs-
6/3/14 CD4- 736, UD 34%
6/25/13 CD4- 1036, UD,
2/4/13, CD4 - 489, UD, 28%

Current Meds: Prezista/Epzicom/ Norvir
.

Offline veritas

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2010, 02:38:42 PM »

WW,

Your doing great ! I especially like the increase in your cd4% from a low of 12 to 29. Give the vl a little more time to get to ud.

You'll get there.

v

Offline John2038

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2010, 03:47:34 PM »
Hi Will,


have you made a genotype before your switch when your VL was of 1460 ?

John

Offline WillyWump

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2010, 04:05:22 PM »
John,

Not that I'm aware of. Are you seeing something here? Should I request one?


-Will
POZ since '08

Last Labs-
6/3/14 CD4- 736, UD 34%
6/25/13 CD4- 1036, UD,
2/4/13, CD4 - 489, UD, 28%

Current Meds: Prezista/Epzicom/ Norvir
.

Offline John2038

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2010, 04:43:46 PM »
Hi Will

Your last VL while on Atripla:

7/09 - CD4 464 (20%) VL- 525
9/09 - CD4 520 (22%) VL - 1460

may indicate a virological failure.
As your new regimen contains two of the Atripla drugs (Truvada - TDF+FTC) , a genotype should have been made before your switch (and should be made before any switch anyway).

To preserve the Prezista, it is something you have to know.

A VL of 199 is too low to do a genotype now (500 would have been more indicative and 1460 was the right time to do it).

There are no ways now to know if your new combo will be fully potent.
It is still possible, but due to your prior VL count while on Atripla, it really has to be confirmed by your next blood draw.

Are you self prescribing your meds ?
If not, I guess of doc have made a genotype and have prescribe you your new combo accordingly.
In any cases, you should clarify the situation with your ID doc as again, you have to preserve the Prezista.

Best Wishes

John

EDIT
Typo.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2010, 05:28:52 PM by John2038 »

Offline BlueMoon

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2010, 05:03:54 PM »
Close, hopefully your next lab will get you there.

It took me over a year. 
...................VL.....CD4.....%
-----------------------------------------
08/10-- ......<40.....290.....42
05/10-- ......<48.....290.....46
02/10-- ......<48.....481.....44
10/09-- ......<48.....277.....46
07/09-- ......<48.....300.....38
05/09-- ........51.....449.....39
03/09-- Added Isentress
02/09-- ........65.....299.....34
11/08-- ........62.....242.....40
08/08-- ........66.....212.....29
05/08-- ......202.....217.....27
03/08-- ....5210.....187.....21
02/08-- Began Truvada/Reyataz/Norvir
12/07-- 273,000.....157.....22
11/07-- 229,000.....209.....22
10/07-- Diagnosis

It's a complex world.

Offline bocker3

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2010, 05:42:16 PM »
Will,

I would ask your doc to order a bDNA (branched DNA) VL test, vs. the Quantitative RNA test that I assume you are getting.  the bDNA is less susceptible to handling "issues".  The lower end of bDNA is only 75, so an UD is <75, however, if you get that with this test, you are far less likely to be concerned about any failure of your regimen. 
Another possibility is to try a different draw location -- assuming you always go to the same place.  Perhaps they are improperly handling the specimens in some way.

I say this because I could not get to UD for over a year, but once I convinced my doc to try bDNA -- presto -- UD.  I subsequently stopped getting drawn at the same site, due to an insurance change -- the new site accidentally ordered the quant RNA test and it came back UD -- and has ever since.  My interp of all this was that something was going wrong with the handling at my original draw site and that I was probably UD from very early on in my treatment.

Hope this helps -- feel free to PM me if you have any other questions.

Hugs,
Mike
Atripla - Started 12/05
Reyataz/Norvir - Added 6/06
Labs - Pre-Meds
Sep05 T=350/25% VL98,559
Nov05 288/18%  47,564
Current Labs
May2013 691/31% <20

Offline WillyWump

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2010, 06:00:37 PM »
John,

By "self prescribing" I'm assuming you mean that I asked to be put on my current combo. No, I did not, It was my doctors decision to switch because she thought it would be a better combo for me (she thought I wasn't going UD quick enough, but alas here I am still not UD). I will bring up the Genotyping with her, I agree it is something that needs to be clarified. It's possible she did the genotype and I'm just not aware of it. Either way I will confirm this with her. In the meantime we will see what happens in the next 3 months when my next results are due.

Bocker,

That's very interesting. You're correct, I just looked on my lab sheet and it says RNA PCR, Quantatative. I will call now and request that the  branched dna test be performed in my next labs in 3 months.

"the bDNA is less susceptible to handling "issues" - Interestingly enough, she mentioned something about how the lab handles the tests might be the reason for me still showing a VL of 199. I didn't delve into this "handling issue" with her (I should have, my fault), I wonder if maybe this is what she was referring to??? Hmmmm.

Very good information, many thanks to you both

-Will
POZ since '08

Last Labs-
6/3/14 CD4- 736, UD 34%
6/25/13 CD4- 1036, UD,
2/4/13, CD4 - 489, UD, 28%

Current Meds: Prezista/Epzicom/ Norvir
.

Offline Sera

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  • Posts: 36
Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #8 on: January 29, 2010, 06:27:02 PM »
Will,

Did you also know "patience is the key to paradise"? Your numbers looks great though. Forgive me if I am being intrusive -  if I may ask between  atripla and what you are taking now, which did you find easier to tolerate? The reason I ask is because I start meds next Friday and I am leaning on both selections.

Thanks.


Offline WillyWump

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #9 on: January 29, 2010, 06:49:11 PM »
Serra,

No, I wasn't aware that "patience is the key to paradise", I always assumed the key to paradise was a lonely straight guy and a 12 pack of beer.

For me, Atripla was fine. I did have the slight constant dizziness. But the dizziness was more of a nuisance than a real problem. I also had the "high" feeling for about 2 hours after taking Atripla, but I took it before bedtime so again, it wasn't really a deal breaker.

The first 5 days, Prezista/Norvir/Truvada was pure Hell. I was constantly throwing up and couldn't keep anything down, my doc put me on Phenergan and then Reglan and after the 5days or so I was fine.  The combo is now absolute heaven and was well worth the shitty 5 days I had to endure. I have ZERO side affects, no dizziness, no high feeling, no nothing.

So, for me, based on zero side effects with Prez/Nor/Tru vs. the slight dizziness with Atripla I would say Prez/Nor/Tru is the better choice. Jsut my opinion, everyone is different.

Also Keep in mind the pill ratio between the 2...Atripla= 1 pill a day. Prez/Nor/Tru= 5 pills a days.

Wishing you the best! :0

Will
POZ since '08

Last Labs-
6/3/14 CD4- 736, UD 34%
6/25/13 CD4- 1036, UD,
2/4/13, CD4 - 489, UD, 28%

Current Meds: Prezista/Epzicom/ Norvir
.

Offline Sera

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  • Posts: 36
Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2010, 07:30:18 PM »
Will

 That part about throwing up is very encouraging - or not. Probably I will go with the second choice since I want to experience heaven - and buy a bigger bucket. Thanks for the info.

Sera.

Online Miss Philicia

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2010, 07:36:05 PM »
He probably just went to Taco Bell that day.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline WillyWump

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  • Posts: 7,177
  • your ramblings bore Yamaguchi Kitteh
Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2010, 07:48:58 PM »
He probably just went to Taco Bell that day.

Word
POZ since '08

Last Labs-
6/3/14 CD4- 736, UD 34%
6/25/13 CD4- 1036, UD,
2/4/13, CD4 - 489, UD, 28%

Current Meds: Prezista/Epzicom/ Norvir
.

Offline darkerpozz

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Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2010, 09:44:55 PM »
Hi,
Purely out of nosiness and silliness cause things in the sexual area are always wishywashy, but how long did the prostate check last because my doctor is gorgeous and I have had a lonely week....

Offline WillyWump

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  • your ramblings bore Yamaguchi Kitteh
Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2010, 10:26:24 PM »
Hi,
Purely out of nosiness and silliness cause things in the sexual area are always wishywashy, but how long did the prostate check last because my doctor is gorgeous and I have had a lonely week....

LOL! like 7 seconds. But it was the best 7 seconds I've had in awhile. Next time I'm gonna kick it up a notch and take a bottle of Boones Farm and a couple candles.
POZ since '08

Last Labs-
6/3/14 CD4- 736, UD 34%
6/25/13 CD4- 1036, UD,
2/4/13, CD4 - 489, UD, 28%

Current Meds: Prezista/Epzicom/ Norvir
.

Online Miss Philicia

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  • celebrity poster, faker & poser
Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #15 on: January 29, 2010, 10:43:05 PM »
Boones Farm

Remind me.  Don't you live on the Redneck Riviera?
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline WillyWump

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  • Posts: 7,177
  • your ramblings bore Yamaguchi Kitteh
Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #16 on: January 29, 2010, 11:31:27 PM »
Yes, yes I do. San Antone....The armpit of Texas/Redneck Riviera...where a screw top bottle of wine is never far.
POZ since '08

Last Labs-
6/3/14 CD4- 736, UD 34%
6/25/13 CD4- 1036, UD,
2/4/13, CD4 - 489, UD, 28%

Current Meds: Prezista/Epzicom/ Norvir
.

Offline chguy78

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  • Posts: 67
Re: Stubborn VL, No U/D Yet
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2010, 09:52:33 AM »
VL still decreasing but still not U/D, I guess the last few hundred are the hardest to get rid of, at least for me. I know patience is a virtue, but it's not one I ever embraced.

Will -

All of those numbers look great.  You and I started treatment at about the same time and my VL finally went UD at my last labs (01/2010).  The trend is good for all of your numbers and I look forward to hearing what they are at your next checkup - most likely UD for the VL.
01/11: CD4=753 (36%), VL=Undetectable
07/10: CD4=531 (33%), VL=Undetectable
04/10: CD4=746 (33%), VL=Undetectable
01/10: CD4=566 (35%), VL=Undetectable
10/09: CD4=436 (31%), VL=405
07/09: CD4=631 (27%), VL=847
06/09: Started: Truvada, Reyataz, Norvir
05/09: CD4=426 (28%), VL=38,300
04/09: Positive; CD4=466 (28%), VL=39,700
10/08: Negative

 


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