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Author Topic: b12 shots  (Read 5577 times)

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Offline TheRoof

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b12 shots
« on: November 17, 2009, 01:49:25 PM »
Anyone heard of those. I heard they are beneficial to energy, metabolism. Etc.

Has anyone had experience with those?

Online Miss Philicia

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2009, 01:54:13 PM »
They used to give them out in the early 90s pre-HAART but I've not had one since then.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline anniebc

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2009, 08:43:46 PM »
B12 injections are normally given for anemia (vitamin B12 deficiency), they are also used for weight loss, fatigue, pernicious anemia etc etc...if you are thinking of using the injections I would talk to your Doc first just in case they are a contraindication for any meds you are currently taking.

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Online Miss Philicia

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2009, 08:54:45 PM »
B12 injections are normally given for anemia

Then that would make sense why I was given it monthly in the early 90's as I, and everyone else, was on AZT.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline madbrain

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2009, 10:45:03 PM »
Anyone heard of those. I heard they are beneficial to energy, metabolism. Etc.

Has anyone had experience with those?

No experience with the shots here, but you can get your B12 level checked through a blood test to find out if you are deficient. If so, oral B12 supplements may work, and are much easier to take than shots. Sublingual ones are most absorbable.

Online BT65

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2009, 05:45:13 AM »
Then that would make sense why I was given it monthly in the early 90's as I, and everyone else, was on AZT.

Yep, I remember getting those B12 shots at the ID doc's.  If I remember correctly, the energy only lasted for like a couple days.  But, those were a good couple days.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Online Miss Philicia

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2009, 12:26:43 PM »
No experience with the shots here, but you can get your B12 level checked through a blood test to find out if you are deficient. If so, oral B12 supplements may work, and are much easier to take than shots. Sublingual ones are most absorbable.

I could be wrong, but I recall there being some absorption reason as to why injections were preferred over oral.  I'm too lazy to go googling about it though.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline leatherman

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2009, 12:32:15 PM »
Then that would make sense why I was given it monthly in the early 90's as I, and everyone else, was on AZT.
the shots were much nicer than having to have a transfusion. AZT allowed me to try both methods  :D
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline Nestor

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2009, 10:01:32 PM »
If you eat enough meat you should be getting enough B12.  If you do not eat enough meat, you should.  Organ meats (liver!) are fantastic for this (as well as for copper, zinc, selenium, B6, COQ10....) but even regular ground beef should give you enough.  If you are eating enough meat and still have a deficiency of some sort that would indicate a serious problem. 
Summer 2004--became HIV+
Dec. 2005--found out

Date          CD4    %       VL
Jan. '06    725    25      9,097
Nov. '06    671    34     52,202
Apr. '07    553    30      24,270
Sept. '07  685    27       4,849
Jan. '08    825    29       4,749
Mar. '08    751    30     16,026
Aug. '08    653    30       3,108
Oct. '08     819    28     10,046
Jan '09      547    31     13,000
May '09     645   25        6,478
Aug. '09    688   30      19,571
Nov. '09     641    27       9,598
Feb. '10     638    27       4,480
May '10      687      9    799,000 (CMV)
July '10      600     21      31,000
Nov '10      682     24     15,000
June '11     563    23     210,000 (blasto)
July  '11      530    22      39,000
Aug '11      677     22      21,000
Sept. '12    747     15      14,000

Offline Rayray

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  • Posts: 25
Re: b12 shots
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2009, 03:01:52 AM »
Sounds like your in a struggle,I too have had afew of the same problems you describe in your posts both here and in weight gain.I am on Truvada Reyataz and Norvir once a day for two years now and undetectable.I have also had weight gain issues I have been on marinol, megace,even to the extent of my doc putting me on andro gel still on BTW and then Remeron 45mg and the seroquiel to help me sleep as i have problems there also now that I'm on andro gel the pump once A day after my shower before bed and combined with the remeron and seroquel 50mg I have gained in three months 14lbs and still climbing I hope.I have a regular diet no fried foods and exercise by walking my pug four times A day about a half mile each walk, most days i end up carrying him back home as he is outta shape and has breathing difficulties. But I'm at 140 now two years ago at my worst i weighed 107lbs in the hospital with pcp for 23days.

So I will say this to you be careful how you go about thing always work with your doctor and together you to will find an answer to your problem and if you try some of the things i mention under your doctors care please let me know,And I'm sure if you do it will be a good report.

                                          Best of wishes,Be safe and be well.
                                                                           Ray!
Tested feb 2007 neg
Seroconvert 07/2007
Diagnosed w/ Aids-PCP-Mac-Thrush-PN
09/07 CD4 71 Put on zidovudrine, Efarivnz, prednisone,bactrim ds,Z pak,Diflucan,Mepron
10/07 CD4 9 160,000,000  Stopped all pre meds for observations found current ID. started on Atripila for two weeks end due to sustiva allergy
11/07 CD4 4 VL-1600,000start Norvir-Truvada-Reytaz
12/07 CD4 83 VL-1600,000
02/08 CD4 488 VL- 4100
05/08 CD4 514 VL- 4200
07/08 CD4 434 VL- <400
10/08 Cd4 531 VL-Undetectable
10/16/2008 cd4 393 VL-undetectable
01/29/2009 cd4 419 VL-undetectable
04/28/2009 cd4 385 VL-undetectable
08/06/2009 cd4 358 VL-undetectable
12/14/2010 cd4 741 VL-undetectable

Online BT65

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2009, 05:42:02 AM »
If you eat enough meat you should be getting enough B12.  If you do not eat enough meat, you should. 

Nestor, in the pre ARV days, AZT caused anemia, regardless of how much meat someone ate.  I've always eaten meat, and I remember having to get blood transfusions because of AZT-induced anemia.  I remember the doc calling me saying "your hemoglobin is 4, get to the hospital for some blood."  I couldn't find anyone to drive me there, so I drove myself.  That was quite the ride.
I've never killed anyone, but I frequently get satisfaction reading the obituary notices.-Clarence Darrow

Offline leatherman

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2009, 10:15:33 AM »
in the pre ARV days ... couldn't find anyone to drive me there, so I drove myself.  That was quite the ride.
those were the days, weren't they BT?  :D When I had the PCP, I couldn't find a ride into the hospital and walked 14 blocks, literally in the snow, to get there.  ::) by the time I had pneumonia 2 yrs later, I had a car and drove myself, but then I was all delerious with a fever of 105.  ;D
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline Nestor

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2009, 02:59:37 PM »
Quote
Quote from: Nestor on Yesterday at 10:01:32 pm
If you eat enough meat you should be getting enough B12.  If you do not eat enough meat, you should. 

Nestor, in the pre ARV days, AZT caused anemia, regardless of how much meat someone ate.  I've always eaten meat, and I remember having to get blood transfusions because of AZT-induced anemia.

I know.  That's why my next sentence was:

Quote
If you are eating enough meat and still have a deficiency of some sort that would indicate a serious problem. 

About a month or two before she died (but nobody at that time had any idea that the end was coming so soon) my mother became severely anemic.  I told her to eat lots of liver and she did.  At the next test, she was as anemic as she had been before; the liver hadn't made a dent.   (multiple transfusions didn't make much of a difference either.)  I think her anemia was caused by chemotherapy, and since, if I remember correctly, AZT started its career as a form of chemotherapy, all of this would make sense. 

But the OP does not sound as if he's suffering from severe anemia; if he is, he doesn't indicate it.  He merely says:

Quote
Anyone heard of those. I heard they are beneficial to energy, metabolism. Etc.

Has anyone had experience with those?

It sounds to me as if he's simply heard somewhere that B12 would be a healthy supplement.  That's why I said that the normal way to ensure an abundance of B12 is to eat red meat, especially organ meats. I added the last sentence to indicate that my advice was given on the assumption that there wasn't a serious problem in his case. 
Summer 2004--became HIV+
Dec. 2005--found out

Date          CD4    %       VL
Jan. '06    725    25      9,097
Nov. '06    671    34     52,202
Apr. '07    553    30      24,270
Sept. '07  685    27       4,849
Jan. '08    825    29       4,749
Mar. '08    751    30     16,026
Aug. '08    653    30       3,108
Oct. '08     819    28     10,046
Jan '09      547    31     13,000
May '09     645   25        6,478
Aug. '09    688   30      19,571
Nov. '09     641    27       9,598
Feb. '10     638    27       4,480
May '10      687      9    799,000 (CMV)
July '10      600     21      31,000
Nov '10      682     24     15,000
June '11     563    23     210,000 (blasto)
July  '11      530    22      39,000
Aug '11      677     22      21,000
Sept. '12    747     15      14,000

Online Miss Philicia

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2009, 03:25:05 PM »
the normal way to ensure an abundance of B12 is to eat red meat, especially organ meats.

That reminds me!  It's sweetbreads season (thymus and pancreas of calf and lamb) -- just delicious.  Do you like these?  I'm also big on bone marrow -- it's like butter on toasted baguette. And divine foie gras . Obe ata pelu Shaaki ó Nigerian Stew made with large chunk of cow and goat tripe.

However, I'm not big on heart dishes but as always will try everything once.

Of course, it's hard to find such dishes in the US, unless you focus on Mario Batali's restaurants which spearheaded the US consumption/use of ofal dishes in the mid-90s.

Love love love Oxtail dishes. Coda alla vaccinara.
"Iíve slept with enough men to know that Iím not gay"

Offline Ann

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Re: b12 shots
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2009, 05:08:48 PM »
~shudder~ IMHO, offal is just what it sounds like - awful!
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Nestor

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  • What we love, we shall grow to resemble.
Re: b12 shots
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2009, 06:58:37 PM »
Wow, I didn't know sweetbreads had a season!  I like them well enough but don't actually have them all that often for some reason; I tend to focus on liver and kidneys since they're the ones that are packed with vitamins and minerals.  I happen to love heart, both beef (anticuchos!) and chicken (wrapped with bacon).  Heart turns out to have CoQ10, too.  It's also really easy to make; marinate for a few hours and put under the broiler for five minutes or so. 

The Nigerian stew sounds great!  About half the time I've had tripe in restaurants it's been great, and the other half of the time it's been terrible, so I'm a little bit cautious before ordering it, but there's a very spicy tripe and tongue combo in most Sichuan restaurants that I order whenever I can.  However, I don't think tripe is the nutritional powerhouse these other things are, so I don't go out of my way to eat it. 

Of course Fois Gras is great!

Actually, not only are liver and kidneys among the healthiest things we can eat, but they are among the most inexpensive. (I mean when we cook them at home, not when we order them at a Mario Batali restaurant!) It always makes me sad to hear someone say "I don't have the money to eat healthy food" when in fact most of the healthiest foods (organ meats, brown rice, beans) are so cheap.  
« Last Edit: November 19, 2009, 07:21:05 PM by Nestor »
Summer 2004--became HIV+
Dec. 2005--found out

Date          CD4    %       VL
Jan. '06    725    25      9,097
Nov. '06    671    34     52,202
Apr. '07    553    30      24,270
Sept. '07  685    27       4,849
Jan. '08    825    29       4,749
Mar. '08    751    30     16,026
Aug. '08    653    30       3,108
Oct. '08     819    28     10,046
Jan '09      547    31     13,000
May '09     645   25        6,478
Aug. '09    688   30      19,571
Nov. '09     641    27       9,598
Feb. '10     638    27       4,480
May '10      687      9    799,000 (CMV)
July '10      600     21      31,000
Nov '10      682     24     15,000
June '11     563    23     210,000 (blasto)
July  '11      530    22      39,000
Aug '11      677     22      21,000
Sept. '12    747     15      14,000

Offline Nestor

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  • What we love, we shall grow to resemble.
Re: b12 shots
« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2009, 07:06:19 PM »

Quote
Insert Quote
~shudder~ IMHO, offal is just what it sounds like - awful!

I've found a few suggestions really help improve the taste of liver to someone who isn't used to it. 

First, we should get calve's or lamb's liver, which will be much tastier than the liver of a mature animal. 

We can marinate it in lemon juice or a good vinegar for a few hours before cooking; we can cook it minimally; I think a lot of kids hated liver because their parents were making tough leathery over-cooked liver.  I usually cook liver only until it is still borderline raw in the center. 

We can serve it with some rich sauce containing mustard and beef stock and sour cream, and lots of onions and mushrooms and garlic--one person I know insists that garlic is essential to good liver.  I agree, but then again, I think garlic is essential to almost everything. 

Finally, a good sour dish like saurkraut is almost necessary to balance out the richness of all the above. 

All of the above goes for kidneys too.  These certainly aren't things I grew up eating, but I've come to like them a lot! 
Summer 2004--became HIV+
Dec. 2005--found out

Date          CD4    %       VL
Jan. '06    725    25      9,097
Nov. '06    671    34     52,202
Apr. '07    553    30      24,270
Sept. '07  685    27       4,849
Jan. '08    825    29       4,749
Mar. '08    751    30     16,026
Aug. '08    653    30       3,108
Oct. '08     819    28     10,046
Jan '09      547    31     13,000
May '09     645   25        6,478
Aug. '09    688   30      19,571
Nov. '09     641    27       9,598
Feb. '10     638    27       4,480
May '10      687      9    799,000 (CMV)
July '10      600     21      31,000
Nov '10      682     24     15,000
June '11     563    23     210,000 (blasto)
July  '11      530    22      39,000
Aug '11      677     22      21,000
Sept. '12    747     15      14,000

Offline Nestor

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  • What we love, we shall grow to resemble.
Re: b12 shots
« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2009, 07:17:16 PM »

Returning to B12 and nutrition in general:

100 grams of beef liver contains:

1176% of the DRV of B12,
714% for copper,
634% for vitamin A,
210% for Riboflavin,
88%, 71%, 63%, and 51% for four of the other B vitamins, and
52% for Selenium (!),


As for kidneys, they have only a mere 415% of the DRV of B12, but 210% for the (to us) all-important Selenium! 

The traditional recommendation to eat with (real) saurkraut or some other lacto-fermented vegetable seems wise from the nutritional point of view, since saurkraut, being rich in Vitamin C, would balance the meal, as well as having the probiotics to help digest the rich meats. 
Summer 2004--became HIV+
Dec. 2005--found out

Date          CD4    %       VL
Jan. '06    725    25      9,097
Nov. '06    671    34     52,202
Apr. '07    553    30      24,270
Sept. '07  685    27       4,849
Jan. '08    825    29       4,749
Mar. '08    751    30     16,026
Aug. '08    653    30       3,108
Oct. '08     819    28     10,046
Jan '09      547    31     13,000
May '09     645   25        6,478
Aug. '09    688   30      19,571
Nov. '09     641    27       9,598
Feb. '10     638    27       4,480
May '10      687      9    799,000 (CMV)
July '10      600     21      31,000
Nov '10      682     24     15,000
June '11     563    23     210,000 (blasto)
July  '11      530    22      39,000
Aug '11      677     22      21,000
Sept. '12    747     15      14,000

 


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