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Author Topic: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy  (Read 4441 times)

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Offline positivmat

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2009, 05:24:34 PM »
This study really sounded encouraging.  However chemo seems severe but if that kills the bugs in the latent reservoirs then I am game.  I googled chemo and hiv and I see that there have been studies before. It was not clear to me what the past results have shown. Does anyone understand what the past studies on chemo focused on if it was not on t-cells? 
Matt

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2009, 05:50:05 PM »
One thing that concerns me about HIV research is that different scientists make pronouncements about things that are just not accurate.

For example in the link above is the following quote:

"For the first time, this study proves that the HIV reservoirs are not due to a lack of potency of the antiretroviral drugs, but to the virus hiding inside two different types of long life CD4 memory immune cells," explains Dr. Jean-Pierre Routy, a hematologist with the MUHC, researcher in infection and immunity at the RI-MUHC and professor of hematology at McGill University.

This is simply not true that this is being shown for the first time. It has already been shown by Siciliano (and others) that we have reached a limit with what current HAART drugs are capable of doing and the existence of reservoirs is not due to "lack of potency" of antiretroviral drugs. These scientists in Canada are not showing this to be the case "for the first time" as they state!

Another aspect of the above quote that is of concern is that they mention "two different types of long life CD4 memory immune cells" implying that those are the only two reservoirs. What about macrophages/monocytes and follicular dendritic cells, which have also been shown to harbor latent HIV?

The more I read about HIV research,  the more I notice that many scientists are pursuing aspects of research in their own "bubbles" seemingly without regard to the science that already exists. It's very frustrating how announcement and pronouncements are made again and again as if it is "new" information, it feels like that movie Groundhog Day.

It seems we really do need that recently called-for HIV Collaboratory so that information can be shared and maybe more progress can be made toward a functional cure once and for all.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2009, 03:16:53 AM by Inchlingblue »

Offline georgep77

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2009, 10:50:42 PM »
It seems we really do need that recently called-for HIV Collaboratory so that information can be shared and maybe more progress can be made toward a functional cure once and for all.
I totally agree with you Inch  :-\
Come on Sangamo,  Geovax,  Bionor immuno, ...Make us happy !!!
+ 2008

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2009, 03:48:35 PM »
June 22, 2009

New Ideas About Reaching HIV Sanctuaries in the Body
A joint U.S. and Canadian team of researchers say they have confirmed how specific immune cells serve as a protected reservoir of HIV, despite potent antiretroviral (ARV) therapy. They also offer ideas for eradicating that sanctuary of cells—and the virus along with it—in a study published online June 21 in Nature Medicine.

Scientists once though that HIV might be eradicated in people who kept their viral loads undetectable for several years using ARV therapy. Ultimately, they learned that HIV manages to hide out in some very long-lived cells in lymph nodes throughout the body that remain unaffected by HIV treatment. When ARV therapy is stopped, the virus comes roaring back.

Nicolas Chomont, PhD, from the Université de Montréal, Canada, and his colleagues in Montreal and Florida claim they have now confirmed which cells specifically serve as hidden sanctuaries, and how those cells manage to replicate new virus even when potent ARV therapy is being used.

The cells in question are memory CD4s—cells programmed, often in childhood, at the time of an initial infection with a disease-causing microorganism. This particular group of cells was determined to be the long-lived sanctuary of HIV more than 10 years ago.
Continued.....


MORE:

http://www.poz.com/articles/hiv_sanctuary_chomont_761_16832.shtml


NOTE: I still don't get why no mention of other HIV reservoirs such as macrophages/monocytes and follicular dendritic cells, are they implying that the only reservoirs that can lead to replicating HIV once HAART is stopped are the memory CD4s?
« Last Edit: June 23, 2009, 03:52:38 PM by Inchlingblue »

Offline elf

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2009, 05:43:24 PM »
Hopkins-hivguide questions this approach:

So far, all available drugs act by suppressing the replication of HIV, so none would be effective against non-replicating virus--namely, virus that exists in the form of pro-viral DNA in latent reservoirs.

They're circulating and also in lymphatic tissue. They can't be eliminated with chemotherapy.
ENOUGH ALREADY!


http://www.hopkins-hivguide.org/q_a/patient/recent_questions/residual_viremia.html?contentInstanceId=485451&siteId=7151

« Last Edit: June 23, 2009, 05:47:04 PM by elf »
Let's have a Kiki!

Offline freewillie99

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2009, 08:59:33 AM »
They can't be eliminated with chemotherapy.
ENOUGH ALREADY!
[/color][/b]


According to whom?  You?  Please cite your credentials for making such a claim.
Beware Romanians bearing strange gifts

Offline veritas

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2009, 09:06:46 AM »

Free,

His quote came from Joel Gallant at Johns Hopkins. It's in the link he provided.

v

Offline stargate12

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2009, 10:26:54 AM »
Hopkins-hivguide questions this approach:

So far, all available drugs act by suppressing the replication of HIV, so none would be effective against non-replicating virus--namely, virus that exists in the form of pro-viral DNA in latent reservoirs.

They're circulating and also in lymphatic tissue. They can't be eliminated with chemotherapy.
ENOUGH ALREADY!


http://www.hopkins-hivguide.org/q_a/patient/recent_questions/residual_viremia.html?contentInstanceId=485451&siteId=7151



The question is: Where does the residual viremia come from ? Residual viremia is not latent because some investigators measured the residual viremia and they are replicating constanly. The residual viremia is not zero. Why HAART does not stop their replication?

Activated cells or resting are CELLS with no doubt... and if HAART works inside the activated cells WHY haart does not work inside resting cells ? ( the example of haart plus additional integrase is completely wrong to reduce the residual viremia COMING from resting cell ... do you agree? )
Virus evolution is not the answer....in any case with or without evolution the virus is assembled inside the activated or resting cells. Why in one case haart works ? Joel E. Gallant does not know know the source of replication .... that is the true. If they do not know the source of the residual viremia they can not find the right chemio drugs to destroy the cells..
« Last Edit: June 24, 2009, 10:32:40 AM by stargate12 »

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2009, 01:21:51 PM »
Free,

His quote came from Joel Gallant at Johns Hopkins. It's in the link he provided.

v

The thing is Gallant was not commenting on this particular approach with chemo. The bottom line is it is still too early to know if it will work (duh!) but it is definitely promising and worth pursuing.

Additionally, as mentioned in another thread, Dr. Gallant is one of the very best doctors in the world when it comes to his area of expertise, which is the treatment of HIV/AIDS. He does not closely follow research toward a cure, it's just not his ambit. He is not necessarily the best person to ask when it comes to evaluating the validity of possible cures.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2009, 02:34:25 PM by Inchlingblue »

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2009, 01:30:22 PM »
The question is: Where does the residual viremia come from ? Residual viremia is not latent because some investigators measured the residual viremia and they are replicating constanly. The residual viremia is not zero. Why HAART does not stop their replication?

 

Your statement is not correct. The residual viremia is not replicating (if it were we'd have many problems with resistance, among other things), whatever virus exists in the plasma if a person is on a stable and effective HAART regimen is coming from the reservoirs. And as soon as these viruses leave the reservoirs and enter the blood, HAART does stop them from replicating, HAART just cannot get at them when they are inside the reservoirs. This has been analyzed and proven scientifically by several researchers, specifically Robert Siciliano (that's why I mentioned above that the Canadian researchers did not show this to be the case for the first time, as they state). They have in any case, corroborated Siciliano and others, and that is a good thing.

Some of these reservoir site cells are dividing, which is not precisely the same thing as "replicating" virus (the cells themselves divide, be they CD4 or macrophages and when they divide, the virus inside them also gets copied). That is why the scientists in Canada hypothesize that if these reservoir cells can be targeted with chemo and killed, there will be no more virus. The real challenge is to get at 100% (or very close to that) of the reservoirs without too much damage to the host (i.e. the person). The treatment the Canadian researchers are proposing is similar to what is now done with leukemia patients, many of whom become cured and cancer-free.

Worth repeating: residual viremia in the plasma (blood) when a person is on an effective HAART regimen is not replicating, it is coming from the reservoirs. Theoretically if someone is on an effective HAART regimen and they are adherent, they will be rid of all their virus eventually —but it would take about 60 years!

I highly recommend you read the link below:

http://www.thebody.com/content/toparts/art50467.html#commentAdd


« Last Edit: June 24, 2009, 06:12:43 PM by Inchlingblue »

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2009, 06:30:36 PM »
I googled chemo and hiv and I see that there have been studies before. It was not clear to me what the past results have shown. Does anyone understand what the past studies on chemo focused on if it was not on t-cells?  
Matt

According to wikipedia, Chemotherapy, in its most general sense, refers to treatment of disease by chemicals that kill cells, both good and bad, but specifically those of micro-organisms or cancer.

So, technically, existing antiretrovirals (HAART) would be considered chemotherapy.

These researchers are proposing some chemical that would target and kill the long-lived "memory" Tcells, so that would also fall into the chemo category.

Offline positivmat

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2009, 09:06:37 PM »
Ah ok that explains it. I didn't think of the antivirals as chemo but that makes sense. Its amazing what they are doing for us. I am grateful for these pills and all who helped us get them.

Offline Inchlingblue

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Re: New Weapon - Combined Antiviral And Targeted Chemotherapy
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2009, 06:09:41 PM »
I'm reprinting this article because it has the added information that there will be a study in September testing this theory (I presume on animals).

New Targeted Therapy Could Eradicate HIV, Study Finds
June 22, 2009

Researchers from Oregon State University's Vaccine and Gene Therapy Institute (VGTI) Florida and the University of Montreal say they have discovered a potential way to eradicate HIV by suppressing viral replication and stopping the division of certain T-cells in the body, according to a study published on Sunday online in the journal Nature Medicine, the Treasure Coast reports (Copsey, Treasure Coast, 6/21). Lead researcher Rafick-Pierre Sékaly, scientific director for VGTI Florida and a professor at the University of Montreal, and colleagues say that a new therapy that combines traditional antiretroviral treatment with what they call "intelligent targeted chemotherapy," might completely destroy "HIV reservoirs," where the virus hides inside immune system cells and cannot be reached by existing treatments.

Co-author Jean-Pierre Routy, associate professor of hematology at McGill University in Montreal, said that if a patient responds to traditional antiretroviral therapy, then they could be a good candidate for the new treatment, which could kill the remaining cells that keep the virus alive in the body. He said "the patient will remain virus-free for a long time or forever." A study will begin in September to test the validity of the findings (Minsky, Canwest/Calgary Herald, 6/21).

LINK:

http://www.thebodypro.com/content/news/art52325.html

From the "take it with a grain of salt" department:


A study will begin in September to test the validity of these results. If targeted chemotherapy successfully eliminates HIV, researchers say the feasibility of the treatment will be determined over the next two to three years, with medication becoming available a few years after that.

LINK (CALGARY HERALD):

http://www.calgaryherald.com/Health/Treatment+sanctuary+cells+creates+path+possible+cure+researchers/1718820/story.html
« Last Edit: July 01, 2009, 02:52:21 AM by Inchlingblue »

 


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