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Author Topic: My Airline prohibits the use of protective gloves and masks when flying to Mex  (Read 2915 times)

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Offline blondbeauty

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  • Posts: 1,785
My airline flies to Mexico at least twice a day. The smallest plane we use has room for 260 passengers and we only carry 100 pairs of gloves and masks is not enough for all the passengers if needed. The airline also says that we are only allowed to open the boxes that contain these gloves and masks if we detect a case of swine flu on board (as if we were Dr's or carried a portable lab).
The airline is still prohibiting us the use of masks and gloves to pick up trays or other residues generated during the flight.
What do you think?
The only member in these forums approved by WINBA: World International Nail and Beauty Association.
Epstein Barr +; CMV +; Toxoplasmosis +; HIV-1 +.
Counts when starting treatment:
V.L.:80.200 copies. CD4: 25%=503
Started Sustiva-Truvada 14/August/2006
Last V.L.count (Oct 2013): Undetectable
Last CD4 count (OCT 2013): 52%= 933

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Sounds like your airline is trying to stop panic. Make sure you have hand-sanitizer with you and use it.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline mecch

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  • Posts: 12,160
  • red pill? or blue pill?
I saw AMERICAN health experts on TV explaining that masks are good for nothing. Psychological!  Handwashing is important, however.
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline Basquo

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  • Posts: 3,277
I saw AMERICAN health experts on TV explaining that masks are good for nothing. Psychological! 

Masks are good for plenty, or else why would we have them?! You must have the right type, properly fitted, to prevent inhaling germs, and that's where the fault lies: most people don't have the right mask or have someone on hand to fit it for them.  But masks are very effective in catching germs on a sick person so that's why patients in Contact Isolation have to be masked before they can leave their hospital rooms.

I agree that handwashing and sanitizing are much more effective than masks.  I think they are psychological in that they are a very effective way to get people's attention, which is great for TV, but to say they are good for nothing is hogwash. It's not like they're pet rocks.

Juan, every flight I've been on in the last few years, the attendants always wear gloves when they're picking up trash. I can't believe your airline prohibits that. I mean, I believe you of course, but what jerks to prohibit them altogether.

Offline mecch

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  • Posts: 12,160
  • red pill? or blue pill?
Yep, better said than I.
But i wasn't talking about masks provided by hospitals or scientists for use in special circumstances.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-sciw-swine-masks28-2009apr28,0,4722242.story

I'm just reporting what I saw on CNN and read. 
Here's another quote:

"The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said there is not a lot of evidence that masks do much good, and have pointedly not recommended their use by the general public. Swine flu is thought to be transmitted in much the same way as seasonal flu, by touching something with the virus and then passing it to the nose or mouth or through coughing or sneezing."
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/health/19315634/detail.html
« Last Edit: April 29, 2009, 01:22:46 PM by mecch »
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline dixieman

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  • Posts: 889
blondbeauty... washing your hands is about as good as it gets... also did you know that money helps spreads some of the nastiest germs around. I rarely handle cash... and when I do I always wash my hands and or use a hand sanitizer. I understand your concern being in an enclosed environment...John

Offline Ann

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  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?

but to say they are good for nothing is hogwash. It's not like they're pet rocks.


Hey! My pet rock was good for something!

A door-stop. ;D
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline hivsweden

  • Member
  • Posts: 81
Masks are good for plenty, or else why would we have them?!

Masks are great for protecting against droplets and bacteria. However they are not so good for protection against virii since the virii are smaller than the pores of the mask.

A N95/N100 (or P2/P3 in Europe) mask will reduce the risk, especially since it stops you from touching your mouth/nose, but I wouldn't want to have anything other than a respirator with oxygen tubes while working with a patient with a lethal airborne viral infection.

Offline mecch

  • Member
  • Posts: 12,160
  • red pill? or blue pill?
Isn't that the real question - is this flu anymore fatal than other flus? Clearly it's fatal.

The media seems to be latching onto this as a "media event".  Tamiful works against this virus. Dont thousands and thousands of people die during influenza breaks around the world every year? The media was making this out to be ebola. Caution and science should clarify the issue soon, we hope.

You know, conspiracy theorists said Roche had a secret hand in Bird Flu hysteria.

Roche is ready to sell you it's product, just give Basel a call.

http://www.saigon-gpdaily.com.vn/International/2009/4/70365/

If I had anything to do with working in close contact with epicenters of this virus, and couldn't thus avoid such contact, I would get me some TAMIFLU and keep it close and handy.

« Last Edit: April 29, 2009, 03:39:58 PM by mecch »
“From each, according to his ability; to each, according to his need” 1875 K Marx

Offline newt

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  • Posts: 3,887
  • the one and original newt
"Gel in gel out" or wash your hands - masks do shot squat - matt
"The object is to be a well patient, not a good patient"

Offline blondbeauty

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,785
Thanks for all the different points of view. Basquo, believe it or not IBERIA does not allow us to wear gloves because they believe it gives a "bad image". I think its the oposite and I always wear them...On the 23 of this month IBERIA sent a new advice to all F/A reminding us NOT to wear gloves because it is against the airlines policy. I still wear them.
Today we had a meeting with IBERIA and they will start loading masks and gloves for all passengers an crew members but only for the flights from Mexico to Madrid.
We have been sending press releases to all the newspapers about this subject and the company has reacted. We would like to achieve more. Lets see what happens....
The only member in these forums approved by WINBA: World International Nail and Beauty Association.
Epstein Barr +; CMV +; Toxoplasmosis +; HIV-1 +.
Counts when starting treatment:
V.L.:80.200 copies. CD4: 25%=503
Started Sustiva-Truvada 14/August/2006
Last V.L.count (Oct 2013): Undetectable
Last CD4 count (OCT 2013): 52%= 933

Offline dixieman

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  • Posts: 889
blodbeauty... put the managers and ceo's of your company  who make the policies...on the plane and let them work in a closed environment with a possible contagion and see how the airline will change its position on this matter! Take care... John

Offline Dale Parker

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  • Posts: 266
Most of this is media hype. CNN hasn't had a major disaster to cover in a while. I don't think the swine flue is any more dangerous or life threatening than the regular flue.
  They are right in saying that the average mask that most people are using are useless in preventing it from spreading.  All they do is provide false hope and spread panic. 
   I do agree with the hand washing.  Wash frequently and I would also do my face as well . Most people are always touching their faces with their hands. We do it so often that we don't realize it.   
  However being immune compromised we do need to take extra precautions.   If I had to pick up other peoples garbage I would use gloves and wash afterwards.  If my employer knew of my lowered immune status I would defiantly ask to be transferred to a safer job.  In your case maybe a flight between New Jersey and Chicago or New York to London England which should provide a lower risk of catching it.
Apr 09  CD4 21, CD4/CD8 ratio 0 VL 500,000+
July 09 CD4 158, CD4/CD812% VL 750
Oct 09 CD4 157 CD4/CD8 14% VL UD
Feb 10 CD4 197, CD4/CD8 11% VL UD
May 10  CD4 252 CD4/CD8 12% VL UD
Aug 10 CD4 211 VL UD
Nov 10 CD4 272 CD4/CD8 0.138 VL UD

Offline blondbeauty

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,785
I agree with the mask "psychological" protection theory. In any case I would not wear a mask because I can not stand breathing through them. But nobody can prohibit you to use any available means to protect your health however effective or not those means are.
Today they have explained on TV the difference between masks. Some masks only protect others but offer no protection to the person who wears them because those masks only stop the virus from coming out, so they should only be worn by people who are already infected. On the other hand there are masks that protect you from catching the virus. These type of masks should be worn by healthy people.
Anyway, I think we should always wear gloves when picking up trays which may contain biological residues (saliva for example) in any flight and even if there is no flu or other pandemic disease.
Prohibiting the use of protective measures is against the right of preserving your health contemplated in our Constitution.
The only member in these forums approved by WINBA: World International Nail and Beauty Association.
Epstein Barr +; CMV +; Toxoplasmosis +; HIV-1 +.
Counts when starting treatment:
V.L.:80.200 copies. CD4: 25%=503
Started Sustiva-Truvada 14/August/2006
Last V.L.count (Oct 2013): Undetectable
Last CD4 count (OCT 2013): 52%= 933

Offline Cliff

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  • Posts: 2,645
If you or your airline are that concerned about the flu, then you should lobby for Iberia to temporarily stop flying to Mexico (and the US, and Canada, and the UK, and Israel, and South Africa, and whereever else this flu has spread to), rather than allow you to work wearing gloves/mask. 

Who wants to fly an airline where it's crew treat paying passengers as if they were on some sort of leper colony?!?  I wouldn't want to be disrespect like that, especially when it's proven not to provide any additional protection than washing your hands!

Offline blondbeauty

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  • Posts: 1,785
The airline is not concerned, but the air cabin crew are. But we are not only concerned about the flu. If we do 10 flights a month and the average capacity of our planes is 300 pax, that means that we can be in contact with 33.000 pax a year. The IRSST (Regional Institute of Safety and Health at Work of the Community of Madrid has determined on an inspection we asked for, that the biological residues have to be handled with latex gloves (before the flu).
So even if the airline thinks it gives a bad image they shoul not prohibits its use as they are doing now.
If I were a pax I would feel much safer if the F/A picked up with gloves because it means they take care of themselves.
Having sex with no condoms, might give a sense of confidence and trust towards your occasional sex partner, but it is unsafe for both.
In Spain at the AVE (HIGH SPANISH SPEED TRAIN) the crews wear gloves, as well as in other airlines (IBERWORLD, EASY JET,etc).
About cancelling fligths...AIR FRANCE´s air cabin crews are refusing to fly to Mexico using tiredness as an excuse.
I will be starting my holidays tomorrow. Two weeks now followed by 4 more days off called recovery days (to recover from my holidays) In july I have another 2 week period of holidays. This is how things work here: as workers we have rights, long holidays, and free medical care!
The only member in these forums approved by WINBA: World International Nail and Beauty Association.
Epstein Barr +; CMV +; Toxoplasmosis +; HIV-1 +.
Counts when starting treatment:
V.L.:80.200 copies. CD4: 25%=503
Started Sustiva-Truvada 14/August/2006
Last V.L.count (Oct 2013): Undetectable
Last CD4 count (OCT 2013): 52%= 933

Offline Cliff

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,645
Comparing having unprotected sex with not being allowed to where a mask and glove as flight crew, in a customer-service oriented industry, is a stretch.

Also, you don't have free medical care!  You have free at the point-of-service medical care.  It's not free, you pay for it through taxes.  Which, by the way, is exactly what I have...I think you were thumbing your nose at the wrong country!

4 days off just to get over a 2 week holiday?  Nice!  But that's not necessarily indicative of worker's rights as much as it's indicative of the results of an aggressive and heavily unionised workforce.

You could always quit if you think your life is in danger!  But given that Spain has the highest unemployement rate in Europe, I'd think twice before doing that. 

There is a reason why no airline has yet stopped flying to Mexico and the US.  Taking simple precautions works and the last thing the industry needs is to add to the hysteria!  You need not treat customers as though they were flying on a leper colony.  Wash your hands.  Use tissues.  Be sensible.  As far as I know, no crew has been infected despite all the flying that has been going on to and from Mexico and the US.

Offline blondbeauty

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  • Posts: 1,785
We obtained what we wanted as you can read in the following press articles thanks to our preassure and today I have been interviewed on TV about this matter. We are very satisfied with our results and Air France crews are not showing for the flights. Anyway the IRSST says biological residues must be picked with gloves now and always even if it makes passengers feel bad.
It is easy to give an opinion when you don´t know what you are talking about. Washing hands is sometimes impossible as our airline also prohibits us to block a lavatory for the exclusive use of the crew. So after a service you keep on serving drinks with your dirty hands to other passengers.
As you can see it is possible to improve working conditions. Quiting a job is not the only way to achieve it. If quiting was the only solution, all jobs would be as bad and there would no decent workplace to go left.
If it was not for people like me and my coleagues we would still work 16 hours a day as in times of the industrial revolution.
And remember that unemployed people still have free medical care and they do not pay taxes.


Links: http://www.abc.es/20090501/nacional-sociedad/iberia-suministrara-mascarillas-todos-20090501.html

http://www.publico.es/internacional/222569/gripe/porcina/virus/iberia/azafatas/guantes/mascarillas/mexico

http://ecodiario.eleconomista.es/sociedad/noticias/1208772/04/09/Nueva-gripe-iberia-suministra-mascarillas-a-todos-sus-tripulantes-y-pasajeros.html

And Cliff, you should apply for a position as a Director in IB.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2009, 12:11:54 PM by blondbeauty »
The only member in these forums approved by WINBA: World International Nail and Beauty Association.
Epstein Barr +; CMV +; Toxoplasmosis +; HIV-1 +.
Counts when starting treatment:
V.L.:80.200 copies. CD4: 25%=503
Started Sustiva-Truvada 14/August/2006
Last V.L.count (Oct 2013): Undetectable
Last CD4 count (OCT 2013): 52%= 933

Offline Ann

  • Administrator
  • Member
  • Posts: 28,140
  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?

Washing hands is sometimes impossible as our airline also prohibits us to block a lavatory for the exclusive use of the crew. So after a service you keep on serving drinks with your dirty hands to other passengers.


That's where hand sanitizer comes in. You don't need water. I use it all the time when out and about. You don't even need something to wipe your hands on after using it - but it does help to wipe if you've got something sticky etc on your hands.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline blondbeauty

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,785
Hi Ann!

We carry wet towels impregnated in sanitizer and we sometimes rinse our hands with those little bottles of gin. They leave your hands clean, soft and feeling well.
The only member in these forums approved by WINBA: World International Nail and Beauty Association.
Epstein Barr +; CMV +; Toxoplasmosis +; HIV-1 +.
Counts when starting treatment:
V.L.:80.200 copies. CD4: 25%=503
Started Sustiva-Truvada 14/August/2006
Last V.L.count (Oct 2013): Undetectable
Last CD4 count (OCT 2013): 52%= 933

 


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