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Author Topic: oral risk  (Read 6552 times)

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Offline ceily83

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oral risk
« on: November 07, 2008, 05:39:48 PM »
Hi everybody,
it's the first time I post here and I have already read different threads regarding the risk associated with oral sex. Though, I am getting more and more nervous and so I'd better ask directly my question instead of going on thinking about that. Here is my case: one month ago I had sex with a guy that I know had and has a lot of sexual partners. We had protected vaginal intercourse, but also unprotected oral sex. He went down on me, and I gave him a bj for maybe one or two minutes, really not longer. He did not ejaculate but I wouldn't be able to tell whether there was precum or not. I have been knowing him for more than one year now and I know - he told me before we had sex the first time - he has HPV, even though warts disappeared lately. He assured me he doesn't have any other disease, but by circumstance I saw he was reading something on this website one day and started getting concerned about HIV. I get easily scared when diseases are concerned, and since he is the only person I had sex with in my life now I am feeling really stupid and guilty. I know that giving a bj isn't that risky, but I still do not understand whether there is any need of testing given the situation I described. Thank you for your help.
-c-

Offline RapidRod

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2008, 06:07:55 PM »
You were never at risk from oral sex. You don't need to test over this. Anyone who is sexually active should at least test annually.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2008, 08:01:56 PM »
I dont' see any cause for concern nor for testing about the incident.

However, make sure you two continue to use a condom everytime for intercourse. The only time they can safely be dispensed with is when both agree to a securely monogamous relationship and test negative together at a reliable testing point. Otherwise condoms are a must.

Otherwise I don't see any cause for further concern about HIV right now.

Cheers.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2008, 08:19:07 AM »
Thank you both very much for your quick reply.
I still am very concerned, but I guess this paranoia is something I have to deal with on my own, right?
The problem is that I continue to hear different versions, people saying oral sex is indeed risky, others telling me the risk is so minuscule that it's practically zero..  :-\
And the truth is that I think I am the only responsible for all this.
Thank you very much again, you do a grat job here.
I think I will anyway get tested in two months, just to erase this fear I have.
-c-

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2008, 09:31:49 AM »
Just one last thing, and sorry again if I am stressing you out..
Does the fact that he has HPV increase anyhow the chance of getting infected?
I feel like I am looking at a white page with a small black spot and that black spot is the only thing I see.  :-[
Thank you for your patience.
-c-

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2008, 09:32:23 AM »
C, fortunately feelings are not facts. The facts in your situation point to theoretical risk only. But I can certainly respect that you feel you need the inevitable negative result when you test to put the issue to rest for yourself.

And no, the fact that he has HPV does not increase the likelihood that he would infect you, IF in fact he's even HIV+.

Good luck with your test. I certainly expect it to be negative.

Cheers.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2008, 09:37:56 AM »
Thank you, again.  :-*
You are great in here.
-c-

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2008, 09:45:39 AM »
You're welcome. Glad we could help.

Turn your mind to other things during the waiting time. It will help to pass the time much more quickly. And at the end I expect all will be well.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2008, 01:19:42 PM »
I am sorry, once again. Even though I am constantly trying not to think about this, I really do not manage. :'(
Yesterday I found out I caught HPV even though I only had protected intercourse. My ginecologist said it is indeed possible just by touching eachoter, if there is contact with parts of skin interested by the virus, even if condoms reduce the risk. This made me worried. I had sex only a couple of times in my whole life and still I managed to get HPV, why couldn't I catch HIV with a single oral exposure, even if without ejaculation.. :-[?
I asked my doctor, and he said he cannot assure there is no risk, but that the risk is usually connected to the presence of blood in the mouth. I understand that you normally state that the risk is minimal and therefore come to the conclusion that it is enough to have protected vaginal/anal intercourse, but it seems there are people stating otherwise. I also understand that noone will ever say it's a 100% safe practice, but then why do you think it's not even necessary to get tested after such an episode?
Last, I wanted to ask you if there is any case of women turning positive because of giving a bj.

To you all: I am terribly sorry I am disturbing once again, but I have noone to talk to about this and am really worried, feeling stupid, and moreover guilty for something natural as sex should be.
-c-

Offline Ann

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2008, 01:30:52 PM »
ceily,

I asked my doctor, and he said he cannot assure there is no risk, but that the risk is usually connected to the presence of blood in the mouth.

How on earth is your own blood in your own mouth going to infect you when giving a blowjob? And anyway, saliva contains over a dozen different proteins and enzymes that damage hiv and render it unable to infect.

I had sex only a couple of times in my whole life and still I managed to get HPV, why couldn't I catch HIV with a single oral exposure, even if without ejaculation.

Because HPV and hiv are two TOTALLY different viruses and are transmitted in different ways. HPV is much easier to transmit than hiv and it only takes skin to skin contact to transmit HPV. This is not true of hiv. Hiv is VERY fragile and difficult to transmit.

Keep using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple. Read through all three condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use them with confidence. Don't be afraid to be the one to put the condom on to make sure it's on correctly.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2008, 01:43:06 PM »
Thank You Ann.

Of course he meant there is a risk if there is a wound in my mouth (blood) and contact with infected semen or precum, I am sorry I didn't express myself well enough but I am not a native speaker :-X.

I know, the viruses are different and so are the routes and risks of transmission.
I just find it very, very hard to keep calm and rationalize.
Sorry once again, and thank you for your precious help.
 :-*
-c-

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2008, 03:13:06 PM »
Ceily, those thoughts are going to continue pop up. That's how we're wired. Instead of trying to push them away, which in my experience never works with those tenacious fears -- instead of doing that, just notice the thought, the tension, breathe and let the next thing come to mind and the next and the next.

The scary ones only stick like glue when you try to push them away.

Your fears and upset notwithstanding I continue to expect you to test negative.

Cheers and not fears.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2008, 12:32:20 PM »
Andy, thank You for your reassurance and understanding.
I will try, try to stop searching in the net as well and better concentrate on something else whenever these thoughts pop up. I hope it will work.
Thanks to you all, once more.  :-*
-c-

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2008, 01:30:22 PM »
Andy.  :-[ Yes it's me again.
I am trying hard to behave as you said, though I can't help thinking that I also got pharingitis after this incident and that after all almost no risk doesn't mean no risk. There are people sure they caught hiv from oral exposure, why shouldn't they tell the truth. The number is probably not relevant in a general overview perspective of course, but their life got destroyed anyway.  :-\
Should I test after 1 month and a half, would the result mean something?
And.. any suggestion to keep this paranoia out of my mind? I am looping all the time and finding all the possible symptoms. Do you think that talking with a psychologist could help somehow?
 :'( I will never, never do that again.
-c-

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2008, 01:40:12 PM »
Pharingitis is NOT an HIV-specific occurence.

Why shouldn't people tell the truth?  Sometimes they are telling it the best they remember but they don't for various reasons remember everything they have done and when. And sometimes they are ashamed of other things they've done so they insist it happened orally. Etc. All sorts of reasons why the reports of oral transmission are not accurate.

The average time to seroconversion is 22 days. All but the smallest number of those who are going to seroconvert will do so within 4-6 weeks. So if you test negative at 6 weeks it's almost guaranteeing you that you will continue to test negative.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2008, 01:49:20 PM »
Thank You Andy.
You are really patient in answering my paranoid questions and I am so grateful for this.
Every time I read what you write I feel better.. even though I wish it could last longer..
I will test, hoping not to go mad in the meanwhile.
And anyway, I would like to get involved in volunteering somehow.
Thank you, again and again.
-c-

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2008, 08:26:35 AM »
I am now in the 6th week and I am feeling awful. Cry all the time  :'(.
On friday I started feeling pain under my armpits, right were the breast-line starts. I have tryied not to touch myself all the time, but the pain doesn't go away, it feels like the whole area around there is irritated. I am aware of the fact that the muscles of my arms and back are a lot tense in these days, but is it enough to cause something like this?
Psycologically, I feel terrible. Forgive me if I need to let all this out.. but I am so scared, and can't talk with anyone.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2008, 09:18:47 AM »
If you will find it helpful in easing your fears, you can do a prelimenary test at 6 weeks. All but the very smallest number of those who are going to seroconvert will have done so by then. I suggest this ONLY because of your fears, since I fully expect a negative result.

As for your physical symptoms, that's something to discuss with your doctor.

We can't really say anything beyond what we've already told you in relation to your incident. Just because you are still worried hasn't changed any of the basic facts of a non-risk situation. Really.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #18 on: November 18, 2008, 09:35:59 AM »
I can't say but thank You again.. and I am sorry that I come to you once more with my fears, but I find it so hard to keep it all inside... I think too much, in spite of all my efforts.  :-[ I guess that this huge fear has also much to do with these being my first sexual experiences and my normally being a very anxious person.

Thank You for your help and reassurance, really. I can't find better words... a virtual hug to You all.
-c-

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #19 on: November 18, 2008, 01:19:02 PM »
Yes, well along with being exciting and hopefully pleasurable as well, becoming active sexually also can stir up anxiety for a number of reasons. My suggestion in general is to go at the pace that's comfortable for you and to only do what's ok with you regarding your health and other important elements.

If you find it's all still getting the better of you, perhaps seeing a counselor or other professional might be helpful in sorting things out.

Cheers.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #20 on: December 09, 2008, 08:26:58 AM »
In the past weeks I kept away from the internet and avoided thinking about the incident I described to you. Mentally I was feeling a bit better, but since it's been almost nine weeks now I have thought about testing so today I went to the center for STDs. I didn't manage to step in.
I am very scared about it despite all you told me.
But of course I don't want to be irresponsible to myself (and to the others) not testing if it would be wiser to do that. I know you gave me all reassurance and I appreciate so much your help, but unfortunately this doesn't change my anxious approach to this.
You told me I don't need to test over this specific incident, but at the same time that everyone who is sexually active should do that at least once every year. So I guess this would be a good moment to test, even though sometimes I think it would be much better for my mental health not to endorse my being so compulsory about everything and try to let go for once.
So now, given that in any case I will probably decide myself to get tested for my own peace of mind, do you think I should wait for the 13 weeks mark or can I test sooner?
And one last thing, but just because I am curious about the way reports are made...if someone states transmission occured through oral sex, is the case then usually reported for statistical purposes?
I thank You again.
-c-

Offline Ann

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #21 on: December 09, 2008, 08:54:44 AM »
ceily,

The vast majority of people who have actually been infected will seroconvert and test positive by six weeks. When there has been a real risk (which you haven't had), a negative six week result should be confirmed at three months.

As you didn't have a risk, you can test now for a conclusive result.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #22 on: December 09, 2008, 10:03:39 AM »
Thank You...
So I hope I will soon have the nerves to go and get tested cause I really can't go on being in such a loop.
Thank You again.  :-*
-c-


Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #23 on: December 09, 2008, 03:25:06 PM »
You don't need to have any specific feelings to get tested. You can be nervous, terrified, worried and quaking in your shoes. Just get in there and do it. And collect what we expect is going to be a negative result.

Keep us posted. 
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2008, 07:58:35 AM »
So today I was everything you said, nervous, terrified, worried, all I could be. I went in and did it.  :-[
It has been two months. I should get the results next week.
I keep reading all your reassurances again but nonetheless I am awefully scared.
I am sorry if I keep bothering you with my fears, but it's the only way for me to let them out. A little update to feel less lonely during the waiting period.
I truly hope that soon there will be no more need.
-c-

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2008, 08:29:39 AM »
All duly noted. While you're waiting for your (negative) result, keep yourself productively busy with other matters.

And don't tell us that you're too worried to do that because that isn't going to fly in here. Right now you need to turn your attention to other things. That way the time will pass more quickly than you may imagine is possible and at the end of it you will have the negative result we expect you to collect.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2008, 08:53:43 AM »
No, I won't tell you I am too worried to keep busy.
Actually, I cannot even allow myself to think about this because of all the stuff I have to do (luckily).
So I will just shut down the computer and do that.
Thank You Andy, once again, for all you kindness and time. Really.  :-*
-c-
« Last Edit: December 15, 2008, 08:55:33 AM by ceily83 »

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #27 on: December 15, 2008, 10:21:56 AM »
OK. Good move on your part. I expect you to come out of this ok.

Cheers.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #28 on: December 21, 2008, 04:42:40 PM »
I am sorry. I think that the impossibility of talking about my fear with someone just worsens it, cause I do force myself to look normal and smile, but in reality I am just exhausted, and lost as ever in this loop of anxiety. So I hope you won’t take it bad, I need to let things out somewhere.

I should get the results tomorrow. I did all I could to keep busy and somehow also managed, but then the weekend came and I started torturing myself again. I am really terrified. Everything around me reminds me of HIV and I wonder how I could be so stupid to ignore it, but in certain moments I proved not to be as rational as I wish I was. I can't sleep, I am tired, scared and my HPV infection is giving me more problems right now so I just can’t stop thinking about the risk I had. Which is low, I know, but still my mind is not able to exclude it… what about all the “ifs”… it seems there are few certainties about the “real” amount of risk in giving oral, that’s the reason why I find it so hard to put my mind at rest, even if you told me that I don’t even need to test over what happened.

Please forgive me, I am obviously not an expert in the subject, but I’m confused. 
I trust your experience and know you devote so much of your time to this forum in order to stop the spread of the virus, but still I’m not able to ignore all conflicting and scary informations which doctors and institutional sites still give.

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #29 on: December 21, 2008, 06:34:49 PM »
Actually, I've been trying to delete my last post but I guess it's not possible.
I wrote it in a moment I was feeling really down and then thought it was better not to bother you further since I have already done that far too often in the past weeks and what I say doesn't add anything new to the facts I told you about. But it seems I did hit the wrong function key  :-\.
I really need to learn how control my being so obsessive.
Thank You for your patience.
You already heard too much from me and gave me all possible reassurance.
-c-

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2008, 06:44:39 PM »
I meant... if you can delete all these last posts of today.
I just can't stand myself when I get so anxious. Thank You.
Anyway, I hope that tomorrow I'll get some relief.
That would help my mind to stop. :-X
-c-

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2008, 06:49:49 PM »
The previous posts remain. Let them be and let yourself be.

I expect your result to be negative.

Let us know.

Cheers.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #32 on: December 22, 2008, 05:40:12 PM »
Thank You.
Today I got the result, t is negative. It is a huge relief for me, all of a sudden when I got that paper my head stopped spinning and I felt like jelly, all muscles going from tense to relaxed.
It was a 9-weeks test, but looking at what you said previously I suppose I could consider it conclusive, right?

I want to thank You all for your help and all the time which you devote to this forum. You do such a great job, and it must be nerving to see people coming back as I have done so often just with the same questions and fears. I am sure you understand all these feelings of anxiety etc. but still I want to say sorry for having been so obsessive. It's me. Time to change maybe.

Somehow, this has taught me something and I won't forget.
Thank You again, and a virtual hug.
 :-*
Happy holidays and Christmas to You all.
-c-

Offline ceily83

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Unprotected intercourse - window period
« Reply #33 on: October 13, 2009, 04:34:53 PM »
Hi everyone,
I had promised myself I would have never made a mistake again, as for HIV, but never say never...I did. :-\ Three months ago I had unprotected sex for a couple of times with a guy whom I would like to trust - but do not in the end. A couple of days after I got a swollen lymphnode in my throat (which I have never ever had in my life, so that scared me quite a lot). Of course these months haven't been easy, I have been feeling stupid and guilty, and moreover had to keep it all inside - cause after all I know it is my responsibility, it was something I had to deal with on my own. 
I got tested after 12 weeks and got a negative result one week later.
Is that reliable? I know you say 13 weeks, does a week make any difference?
Thank You for the patience and the great job you do here. I really appreciate that and it helped me a lot now and in the past.
 :-*

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #34 on: October 13, 2009, 04:53:53 PM »
I have merged your threads. Please follow our rule and keep all of your entries in this same thread.

Well, you're very lucky that you have scooted by safely and tested negative. Yes, a negative result at 12 weeks is reliable.

But you do need to learn from this experience. You can have intercourse with whomever you like. But if you care about your health and staying alive, you need to do it the safer way. That means the guy always has to wear a condom. No exceptions, none of that baloney about thinking you can "trust him" or he looks so great or anything else. A condom is a must Everytime. You were very lucky this time but believe me, you can't count on that happening again.

Get with the program and use condoms. Period.
Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #35 on: October 13, 2009, 05:05:15 PM »
Thank you Andy. Sorry for posting in the wrong place - I didn't know I had to use the old thread even if the incident is not the same anymore.

I have learnt, yes. This time I really have. 
Thank you so much, again.
-c-

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #36 on: October 13, 2009, 05:29:57 PM »
You're welcome.

Keeping in mind that HIV is a forever thing may help you in the future to be firm about the use of a condom everytime for intercourse.

Whatever has in the past prevented you from being committed to the use of condoms is not important. Protecting your health NOW and in the future is the issue. Any guy who won't wear a condom is letting you know that he values his pleasure above risking your life. It's really just as simple and as stark as that.

Andy Velez

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #37 on: October 13, 2009, 05:38:54 PM »
It is...
thank You. Lesson learnt.

Hugs
-c-

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #38 on: October 21, 2009, 11:35:02 AM »
Sorry for coming back once more but I am not able to kick this out of my mind...
Can I consider my 12 weeks test conclusive or should I repeat it again?
I had a blood test, but I don't know which kind, the paper they gave me reports: HIV1/2 - Ag/Ab Combo, non reactive. I don't live in the States but in Europe, so I don't know if there is any difference in the type of test they use. Should I test again or can I move on? I just want to put all this behind me, but I am still very scared.
Thank You for your understanding.
-c-

Offline Ann

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #39 on: October 21, 2009, 11:48:39 AM »
ceily,

A twelve week negative is a conclusive negative. You do not need further testing.

You never had a risk to begin with.

You do not have hiv and it's time you moved on with your life.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #40 on: October 21, 2009, 11:53:54 AM »
Thank You for your reply Ann. Though, I did have a risk: I had unprotected sex with a guy back last summer. The thread is the same but not the situation anymore  :-\...

Is your opinion about my test anyway the same, or does this change things?
What about the type of test?
Thank You again.
-c-

Offline Ann

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #41 on: October 21, 2009, 12:01:36 PM »
Ceily,

No, it does not change a thing. A twelve week negative is conclusive no matter what the mode of possible transmission may be.

YOU DO NOT HAVE HIV!!!

Protect your negative hiv status by always making sure condoms are used in future.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline ceily83

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Re: oral risk
« Reply #42 on: October 21, 2009, 12:06:51 PM »
Thank You Ann.
I will.
Thank You again for the great help (and the great patience above all).
 :-*
-c-

 


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