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Author Topic: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help  (Read 6168 times)

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Offline micardo

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Hi,

I realise I may look stupid by asking these questions but never the less I would like to alleviate my anxiety so please help me if you can.

I have spent the last two nights with a beautiful girl from where I work and needless to say there were some events which I am slightly concerned about.

First just so you have the background on the girl she is French and actually has been with her boyfriend for more than 18 months now. They both had a HIV test at the beginning of the relationship (negative) and have since made love unprotected. She has told me that this was the first time she had played away from in the way I am about to describe but she has had some drunken kisses here and there although never slept with anyone other than her boyfriend. According to her the boyfriend hasn’t cheated on her but then we never know right?

So over the past two nights we have gotten very intimate. The events that have occurred are as follows, I have given her cunnilingus, she has performed oral sex on me, I have fingered her but not really penetrating just initial inner walls and more just the outside around/on the clitoris that kind of thing, and finally we kind of made love ish… but with my boxers on so there was no penetration but maybe some of her fluids got onto my penis through my Boxers when she was rubbing up against me. We were rubbing around the vagina and the anus but no penetration.

I Don’t think I had any cuts in my mouth when I gave her Cunnilingus although this morning my tongue is rather raw… The finger that I used only had some slight cuticle damage but nothing gushing with blood. I don’t think she had any cuts in her mouth either…

So from the events I describe and lets assume worst case scenario with regards to cuts and stuff  (assume that there were some). She was not menstrual!

Do I have a risk that I should go and get checked up? Please be honest with me!

Thank you very much for all of your help.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2008, 06:52:34 AM »
You were never at risk....Have a good day...

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2008, 09:39:57 AM »
What you think you know about the woman's history or status is totally irrelevant. That's never a reliable way to base your actions on. The imortant thing is not whom you are with but rather what you do. And absolutely nothing you did has put you at risk for HIV transmission.

The basic thing to remember in terms of sexual activities and HIV is to always without exception use a condom for vaginal or anal intercourse. All of the other activities you're concerned about are risky only theoretically. In the real world of HIV we know that it's unprotected intercourse that is the real risk.

Other STDs are much easier to acquire than HIV, so if you are sexually active we do recommend that you have a full STD panel done at least once a year.

You are worrying needlessly about HIV this time. Also, avoid mixing excessive drinking and casual sex because that combination will definitely impair your good sense about safer sex.

Cheers.
Andy Velez

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2008, 02:36:01 AM »
Hi Guys,

Thank you for your help.

So just to quickly clarify even with the existence of cuticle damage maybe open but not sure and maybe sore tongue again not sure about open wounds I shoudn't get tested?

What about Receiving Oral Sex? if she has some cuts in her mouth?

Lastly for my knowledge what about the rubbing of genitalia? There were some brief seconds when my penis came into contact with her vagina (without the barrier of underwear, you know moments when your penis find its way out of the boxers) although like I said no penetration.... and is was more the base of my penis as oppose to the head but maybe some head as well...

Sorry guys I just want to be sure of what is a risk and what is not so as to protect myself in the future.

Offline Ann

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2008, 06:55:11 AM »
Mic,

Fingering, regardless of cuticle damage, cuts, scrapes, chewed fingernails, whatever, is not a risk for hiv infection. Not one person has ever been infected through fingering and you won't be the first.

Getting a blowjob is also not a risk for hiv infection, regardless of cuts or whatever in the givers mouth. Not only is saliva not infectious, it also contains over a dozen different proteins and enzymes that damage hiv and render it unable to infect. Again, not one person has ever been infected through getting a blowjob and you won't be the first.

Rubbing the genitals together is called frottage and frottage is not a risk for hiv infection.

It's only anal or vaginal intercourse - penile penetration - that you need to worry about. As long as you're using condoms, you don't have to worry about hiv. Read through all three condom and lube links in my signature line so you can use them with confidence.

You had no risk.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2008, 07:09:36 AM »
hey thanks for the feedback. You didn't happen to mention the risks with cunnilingus could you possibly let me know about that please?

Offline Ann

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2008, 07:49:39 AM »
Mic,

You've already been told that going down on a woman is not a risk for hiv infection.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2008, 06:14:30 AM »
Hi Guys,

OK thank you for all of your response. So just to clarify to make sure I understand correctly:

1: Fingering with any kind of spin is not a risk because the fluids you come into contact with do not carry the virus and your finger does not contain the right kind of cells?

2: Cunnilingus with cuts etc in the mouth is also not a risk for the same kind of reasons as above plus the saliva breaks it down anyway.

3: Getting a blowjob is not a risk as the saliva in the girls mouth breaks down the virus to start with plus saliva doesn't contain the virus.

4: Frottage... this one confuses me a bit but if we were naked and rubbed our genitals together but no penetration this is also not a risk because? is it because the where you are rubbing the lubricating fluids from the vagina are not infectious... is that right?

Please guys if you could just clarify this stuff for me I would be very appreciative indeed.

Thank you very much for all of you help.

Finally just to confirm there is no need for testing, this is correct right?

Offline Ann

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2008, 06:45:49 AM »
Mic,

You're got it. All the points you list are correct, including the one about frottage.

Although you don't need to test over this incident specifically, we always recommend that anyone who is sexually active should be having a full sexual health care check-up, including but not limited to hiv testing, at least once a year and more often if unprotected intercourse occurs.

If you aren't already having regular, routine check-ups, now is the time to start. As long as you make sure condoms are being used for intercourse, you can fully expect your routine hiv tests to return with negative results.

Don't forget to always get checked for all the other sexually transmitted infections as well, because they are MUCH easier to transmit than hiv. For example, while frottage isn't a risk for hiv infection, it IS a risk for things like syphilis and herpes and potentially chlamydia and gonorrhea as well.

Keep using condoms for anal or vaginal intercourse, correctly and consistently, and you will avoid hiv infection. It really is that simple.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2008, 06:35:54 PM »
hey im so sorry to follow up but I just read your transmission page and it contradicts what we both wrote above...

it mentions that giving cunnilingus is a risk for HIV? What should I make of this?

Really sorry about this....

Offline Ann

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2008, 07:10:12 PM »
Mic,

The Transmission Lesson mentions the ONLY two cases ever thought to have happened that way, in over 25 years of this pandemic. The cases were never conclusively proven either, as in both cases there were other possible infection routes. The cases are what's called "patient reporting" where the patient makes claims as to how they were infected. Claims aren't necessarily the truth.

Hiv transmission doesn't stand a chance of happening via female genitals to mouth - there are just too many obstacles on the oral route.

The first obstacle is the mouth itself. The mouth is a veritable fortress, standing against all sorts of pathogens we come into contact with every minute of our lives. It's a very hostile environment and saliva has been shown to contain over a dozen different proteins and enzymes that damage hiv.

Hiv is a very fragile virus - literally. Its outer surface doesn't take kindly to changes in its preferred environment; slight changes in temperature, moisture content and pH levels all damage the outer surface. Importantly, it needs this outer surface to be intact before it can latch onto a few, very specific cell types and infect. 

Which leads to the second obstacle. Hiv can only latch onto certain types of cells, cells which are not found in abundance in the mouth.

The third obstacle to transmission this way is having hiv present in the first place. The female secretion where hiv has been shown to be present is the cervicovaginal fluid. This fluid is actually a thick mucus that covers and protects the cervix.

The fluid a woman produces when sexually excited comes from the Bartholin's glands, located on either side of the vaginal opening. I have yet to discover one shred of evidence (and believe me, I've looked) that shows this lubricating fluid to have any more hiv present than other bodily secretions such as saliva, sweat or tears. Saliva, sweat and tears are NOT infectious fluids.

So there you have it. Once the results of the serodiscordant studies started rolling in, what we know about hiv transmission on the cellular level was validated. The only people who were getting infected were those who had unprotected anal or vaginal intercourse. Period. One of the three studies went on for ten years and involved hundreds of couples. That's a lot of nookie.

I also have personal experience with this. I was in a serodiscordant relationship for eight years and we only used condoms for intercourse, no barrier for oral either way. He's still hiv negative.

Stop fretting. You didn't have a risk.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2008, 02:27:56 PM »
hey ann thanks for all your feedback. I have one more thing to add that I just found out, 24 hours after our last intimate moment she came on her period, does make a difference to my no risk experience? Could there have been blood there when we getting close?

Also you guys do some amazing work, is there anything I can do to show my appreciation?

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2008, 03:24:39 PM »
No, that doesn't make any difference.

The best thing you can do is celebrate by getting on with your life and always without exception using condoms when you have intercourse.

Andy Velez

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #13 on: November 14, 2008, 01:05:31 AM »
Hey Ann,

Getting on and Celebrating definitely but.... I read the Wiki page you linked me to and it had this quote which confuses me as it is slightly against what you mentioned could you please let me know your thoughts...

Function and purpose
They secrete mucus to provide vaginal lubrication.[2][3] Bartholin's glands secrete relatively minute amounts (one or two drops) of fluid just before a woman orgasms.[4] The minute droplets of fluid were once believed as important for lubricating the vagina, but research from Masters and Johnson demonstrated that vaginal lubrication comes from deeper within the vagina.[4] The fluid may slightly moisten the labial opening of the vagina, serving to make contact with this sensitive area more comfortable for the woman.[4]

Offline RapidRod

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #14 on: November 14, 2008, 05:14:29 AM »
Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result or no-risk situation, will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.

Offline Andy Velez

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #15 on: November 14, 2008, 08:50:36 AM »
You really need to give it up and get on with your life or you're going to just be constantly worrying ...needlessly I might add.

Your saliva contains over a dozen proteins and enzymes which are very effective at rending HIV ineffective, if in fact it's even present while giving oral.

Let this go and get on with your life. Aside from anything else you're verging on getting a time out here.
Andy Velez

Offline Ann

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #16 on: November 14, 2008, 09:53:57 AM »
Mic,

As someone who possesses both Bartholin's glands and a vagina, I can tell you for sure that the lubrication comes from the Bartholin's glands. It looks to me like that article has been edited with misinformation. It happens on Wikipedia. I'll have to find another source for Bartholin's glands info to link to. ~sigh~

It's time you got on with your life. You have NOT had a risk for hiv infection.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2008, 09:54:07 AM »
Hi People,

Thank you very much for all of your input I very much appreciate it.

I understand what everyone is saying and I hope to not have to bother you again...

One last thing just for those who also have the same concerns as me... I received this from my Doctor on Friday when I emailed him the same questions. My Doctor happens to be a well respected HIV specialist in London.

"The key to your further sex life is always to use a condom for penetrative sex. This will confidently protect you from HIV. You do not need to worry about fingering or oral sex from a HIV perspective. I hope that helps. I would just enjoy it if I were you!"

For those who are like me... I hope that helps!


Offline jkinatl2

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2008, 12:20:06 PM »
Quote
"The key to your further sex life is always to use a condom for penetrative sex. This will confidently protect you from HIV. You do not need to worry about fingering or oral sex from a HIV perspective. I hope that helps. I would just enjoy it if I were you!"


Which is exactly what Ann and the others have been telling you all along. Nice that you finally heard it from someone you trust.
"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #19 on: November 18, 2008, 04:47:40 PM »
Hi People,

Please note I am not questioning my non risk scenario as I am comfortable with that now... I am merely trying to educate myself. I have read both here and other places that the source of the Infectuous fluids can be found around the cervix or the secretory glands or white cells in the uterine cavity.

Could someone maybe let me know where these are located on the Vagina? I have tried to research myself but can seem to find a diagram or good description of where these are located.

Also I have been looking for information on where the CCR5, CXCR4 and CCR2 receptors are located within the body and again I have no luck.

So I guess my questions are:

1: Are my above assumptions about where the HIV Fluids are located in the Vaginal Correct?

2: Where on the Vagina are they located?

3: Is my above understanding of the receptors correct and again where are those receptors located?

If you could point me to any documentation even stuff i'd need to pay for I would greatly appreciate it.

Again please understand that I am not asking the same questions... I really just want to understand everything that has been said from a scientific stand point as I know the kind of person I am... and that means unless I understand this stuff for myself, I will have another incident in the future and be back here again annoying you guys with my questions...

Thanks

Offline Ann

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #20 on: November 18, 2008, 05:52:26 PM »
mic,

The cervix is located deep inside the vagina. If feels like a bump/nose. It's not something that you are going to have an easy time finding with your finger, providing you have talked a woman into letting you try.

The receptors? They're on a cellular level.

Outside that, teaching you the finer points of anatomy and/or microbiology is outside our remit. There's plenty of information out there on both subjects.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #21 on: November 25, 2008, 12:04:23 AM »
hi guys,

sorry to disturb you again but last night i was up vommitting and i was wondering given my exposure if this could be related to hiv? (unprotected oral both ways two weeks ago)

thank you.

Offline jkinatl2

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #22 on: November 25, 2008, 12:27:10 AM »
Short and polite answer: No.

"Many people, especially in the gay community, turn to oral sex as a safer alternative in the age of AIDS. And with HIV rates rising, people need to remember that oral sex is safer sex. It's a reasonable alternative."

-Kimberly Page-Shafer, PhD, MPH

Welcome Thread

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #23 on: November 25, 2008, 05:55:40 PM »
What is it about the Human brain that doesn't let you get over things that you know logically won't happen. Seriously this is a problem for me and it is likely to destroy my life if every time I have a sexual encounter I freak out.

It seems that many people have the same issue as me. Do you guys have any Idea how I can get over this?

You know my exposure as above which according to you guys and City Clinic San Fransisco and my Doctor are not a risk of HIV however I just cant seem to get the idea out of my head.

I search the internet and always seem to find something to scare me to the point where I feel like crying.

Sorry to post again but it seems like you guys/girls are the only ones I can talk to about this.

I guess one of the issues is guilt... I am married although we are on a little break as things weren't working out so well. This is when I got close to this other girl.

Now I am scared to try to work things out with my wife incase I infect her... does that make sense?

Assuming I do work things out with my wife... would I need a test before? I would imagine no...

But moving on with my life... with or without my wife... can you guys recommend away for me to get over this anxiety I feel everytime I get into these situations? or even let me know why this seems to happen to me... if I get told by reliable sources no risk, then why wont my brain take it on board?

Thanks again... and pleasehelp me out.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #24 on: November 25, 2008, 06:42:58 PM »
Try professional counseling.

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #25 on: December 05, 2008, 01:02:58 AM »
Hi,

I have another question unrealted to the above questions.

Yesterday night I was kissing this same girl. Quite passionate French kissing and suddenly I tasted something sweet on my tongue. Could this have been blood?

If this was the case I should let you know that not only did I have a small ulcer at the back of my mouth but just inside my lip that day I had bitten down on by accident and hence cause breakage in the skin/tissue? This did bleed for a little while..

Could you let me know if this kind of activity is a risk?

I read that the CDC actually don't consider French Kissing as a NO Risk activity which I did up until yesterday... and they mention of one case where this could have been the route of infection.

So could you please tell me if what happened to me puts me at risk... and why the CDC really don't consider anything NO Risk.

Thank you and I hope this question is ok... It is not related to the previous ones...

Offline RapidRod

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #26 on: December 05, 2008, 01:05:31 AM »
Again kissing is a no risk situation.

Offline micardo

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #27 on: December 05, 2008, 02:07:26 AM »
does the blood issue not change anything then, could you please explain this to me?

Offline RapidRod

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #28 on: December 05, 2008, 06:18:45 AM »
Saliva has inhibiting properties. Saliva + blood not even a risk.

Offline Ann

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Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #29 on: December 05, 2008, 07:51:04 AM »
Mic,

Blood doesn't taste sweet, it tastes metallic. BIG difference.

Not only is saliva not infectious, but it also contains over a dozen different proteins and enzymes that damage hiv and render it unable to infect.

Keep coming back here with these no risk situations and you'll be given a time out. We're not here to hold your hand every time you kiss someone.

Ann
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"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline micardo

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  • Posts: 16
Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #30 on: December 20, 2008, 02:31:52 PM »
Hi Guys,

I hope this doesn't constitute pestering you with the same question...

I was just wondering what the facts were regarding Menstrual blood. Should you come into contact with Mentrual Blood would it change anything regarding Oral not being a risk?

For example lets say that you perform oral on a girl and she just came off her period.. like maybe that morning or previous night. Lets say there is still some blood present, I am not sure if this is possible for the blood to still be present, maybe you could answer that question as well. So if you came into contact with the menstrual blood would you now be at risk from Oral?

So to summarise:

1: Would Menstrual Blood Still be present hours after a period finished and the girl took a shower?

2: If for some reason you did come into contact with Menstrual Blood during Oral, would that now become a risk or still no risk?

3: I have read that menstrual blood is not the same a s fresh blood... is this true? If so would it mean that it is not an effective route for HIV?

Thank you for your help and I sincerely hope this doesn't constitute repeating the same question

Offline RapidRod

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  • Posts: 15,288
Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #31 on: December 20, 2008, 03:31:51 PM »
Anyone who continues to post excessively, questioning a conclusive negative result or no-risk situation, will be subject to a four week Time Out (a temporary ban from the Forums). If you continue to post excessively after one Time Out, you may be given a second Time Out which will last eight weeks. There is no third Time Out - it is a permanent ban. The purpose of a Time Out is to encourage you to seek the face-to-face help we cannot provide on this forum.

Offline micardo

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  • Posts: 16
Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #32 on: December 20, 2008, 04:11:22 PM »
dude I am extremely sorry but I really dont think this is the same question... its about menstrual blood?

thanks

Offline Ann

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  • Member
  • Posts: 28,140
  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #33 on: December 20, 2008, 10:10:29 PM »
Mic,

You've already asked about blood. Give it a rest already.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline micardo

  • Member
  • Posts: 16
ARS and Medicine
« Reply #34 on: December 23, 2008, 12:01:50 PM »
Hey Guys,

I have a question From Saturday I was feeling a little under the weather and suddenly from Sunday Night Late I have had the worst sore throat on the planet, combined with a little nausea (being physically sick as well). I have been freezing even though my body has been hot. I also have been shivering badly....

but I took ibprofen and paracetamol whihch made me feel better.

My main question is if it was ARS would the above make me feel better or would it have no effect? and does it sound like ARS?

Thanks people

Offline Ann

  • Administrator
  • Member
  • Posts: 28,140
  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: No Penetration but plenty more to be worried about.... Please Help
« Reply #35 on: December 23, 2008, 01:12:30 PM »
Mic,

We don't seem to be getting through to you. How could it be ARS when you had NO RISK?

I'm giving you that time out you've been warned about. Do not attempt to create a new account to get around your time out or you will be permanently banned.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

 


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