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Author Topic: Deliberately infected  (Read 40798 times)

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Offline fraidknot

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  • Posts: 42
Deliberately infected
« on: January 15, 2008, 07:55:16 PM »
I was diagnosed HIV+ on 7/24/07, my 43rd birthday, one week after the death of my 91 year old grandmother who I lived with the last nine months of her life. The man who infected me did so deliberately, knowingly, without regard for my health or my life. I have filed criminal charges against him and am considering filing civil charges. Is there anyone else who has been in this situation? If so, is there any advice you would extend to me?

Thank you

Offline Ann

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2008, 08:00:22 PM »
The man who infected me did so deliberately, knowingly, without regard for my health or my life.


Were you raped? Otherwise, you were a party to your own infection, just as I was. Deal with it and you'll be happier for it.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline fraidknot

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2008, 08:02:20 PM »
How about if you don't have something pertinent to the question you butt out?

Offline Ann

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #3 on: January 15, 2008, 08:06:09 PM »
Fraid,

What I said was totally pertinent. Sex is a two way street. Where was YOUR regard for your health and your life? Did you insist on condom usage? Unless you were raped, you were a party to your own infection, just as I was and just as 99.9% of the people on this forum were.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline fraidknot

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  • Posts: 42
Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2008, 08:08:44 PM »
Yes, I accept that fact. And when we decided not to use condoms after a time I was honest about the fact that I was disease free and he wasn't. I don't want to argue this point. I asked a simple question. If no one has an answer to that specific question I would prefer not to hear from the peanut gallery.

Offline Ann

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2008, 08:17:42 PM »
Fraid,

Unless you two tested together before going without condoms, I'm afraid I don't have much sympathy. It's a simple fact of life - sometimes people lie and sometimes (gasp-horror) sometimes people only ASSUME they are hiv negative.

If you want to file civil charges, charge yourself.

Sorry, but I'm sick and tired of irresponsible people trying to make pariahs of hiv positive people. You'd do yourself a far better service by coming to terms with your positive status and acknowledging your own part in it than pursuing a legal action.

Peanut gallery? Puh-leeeeeeze!

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline thunter34

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  • His name is Carl.
Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2008, 08:21:17 PM »
Yes, I accept that fact. And when we decided not to use condoms after a time I was honest about the fact that I was disease free and he wasn't. I don't want to argue this point. I asked a simple question. If no one has an answer to that specific question I would prefer not to hear from the peanut gallery.

You've already gotten the best advice you can get in this situation.  Do yourself a favor and heed it.

-thunter34

(who was MORE than 99.9% involved with his own infection)

AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline fraidknot

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2008, 08:26:47 PM »
Lady, you don't know a thing about my situation. I came on a support site and asked for help. I am not trying to make a "pariah" of anyone. I am trying to stop a angry man from infecting more people, because he is still out there, fucking people right and left without a condom, he is mad at the world and wants to infect everyone he can. So I should just sit back and shut my mouth and let others be infected as well? Do you wish others to become infected with HIV?

This is not revenge. This is about stopping a man who literally has a loaded gun from taking someone else's life from them. I am sorry you are jaded and feel like lashing out. I certainly don't wish for one more person to have to hear that they have HIV and will do everything in my power as long as I live to prevent it.

Offline Ann

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2008, 08:31:03 PM »
Fraid,

It's up to each individual person to protect their own health by using condoms. Unless this guy is out there raping people, I fail to see how he is 100% responsible.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline fraidknot

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2008, 08:34:48 PM »
In Florida you are required to tell any sexual partner that you have HIV prior to having sex with them or it is a first degree felony. They don't have to ask you. So, legally, by not disclosing his status prior to having sex, he is 100% at fault.

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2008, 08:38:58 PM »
Fraid,

If you want this fellow prosecuted, fine. If the law permits it, go for it.

If you want to sue this fellow, all power to you. Retain high priced lawyers and spend your time and energy trudging through the courts. I hope he's loaded, because if he's not and you win, you won't see a red cent. You'll have pay some healthy costs as well.

If you expect this carry-on to help you adjust to your diagnosis, then you're going to be bitterly disappointed. The apportioning of blame will only leave you a bitter, twisted burned out husk of a person. But it's your call.

One piece of advice, don't try and tell us this isn't about revenge -- it is. You're angry and hurt and you want some vengeance. And that's fine with Matty the Damned. But please don't try and advance the "I'm trying save other people from being infected" line with us. We've heard it 1000 times before and it's always bullshit.

No matter how hard you try, we can see through the cloak of false virtue you've taken to wearing.

MtD

Offline thunter34

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  • His name is Carl.
Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2008, 08:39:40 PM »
Lady, you don't know a thing about my situation. I came on a support site and asked for help. I am not trying to make a "pariah" of anyone. I am trying to stop a angry man from infecting more people, because he is still out there, fucking people right and left without a condom, he is mad at the world and wants to infect everyone he can. So I should just sit back and shut my mouth and let others be infected as well? Do you wish others to become infected with HIV?

This is not revenge. This is about stopping a man who literally has a loaded gun from taking someone else's life from them. I am sorry you are jaded and feel like lashing out. I certainly don't wish for one more person to have to hear that they have HIV and will do everything in my power as long as I live to prevent it.

Then might I instead suggest you take your own personal side of the story to the public to try to warn others about the dangers of assuming the sexual health of their partners?  

And this right here is a perfect example of why such legislation is BULLSHIT.  It lulls people into some false sense of security rather than teaching them to be vigilent in protecting themselves.  

You can hoot and holler all you want about 100% fault, but at the end of the day this little bit of legislation didn't help you any, did it?

And that is why my suggestion above holds a lot more merit than some fiery legal charge - if your real goal is helping people rather than revenge.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Ann

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2008, 08:41:10 PM »
Typical pass the buck behaviour, and one that continues to perpetuate this pandemic.


What ever happened to responsibility for one's self? It beggars belief, it really does.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline fraidknot

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2008, 08:46:35 PM »
I am amazed and disgusted at the vomit you've uttered.

You don't know me from Adam. You don't know how I am processing my diagnosis. You are faceless strangers on a website.

Responsibility for one's self, yes. I would not have this had I insisted on a condom. Had he told me he had HIV I would not have had sex with him even with a condom. C'est la vie.

Thank you for the various lectures. Obviously you've got it all together. Congratulations.

Offline thunter34

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2008, 08:49:49 PM »
The way you are dealing with your diagnosis is quite evident in the posts you've made.  Vomit uttered & all that.

And PS:  None of us are "lecturing" you.  We are actually giving you some seriously sound advice.  You're just too bent out of the frame to receive it.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Ann

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    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2008, 08:50:00 PM »
Look mate, do you not think we've all been there, done that?

The sooner you come to terms with your own part in your diagnosis, the better off you'll be. But don't listen to me, I'm just another AIDS VICTIM. (not)

Take your power back, boy, you'll be happier and live longer for it.

Ann
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Mouse

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2008, 08:58:38 PM »
Yes, I accept that fact. And when we decided not to use condoms after a time...


Right. Both of you decided not to use condoms. You were both involved in that decision. Not just him. You consented to having unprotected sex and so you consented to the risks of unprotected sex as well. Unfortunately you found out the hard way that that isn't a good idea.

What do you expect to gain from legally pursuing this man?

And 'legally 100 percent at fault' means absolutely nothing. That is completely non-reflective upon the real world. In reality, you are both responsible.

If people understood the consequences of unprotected sex more seriously no one would see the need for 'laws' like this that are supposed to 'protect people' when all they do is make people believe they are safe when they aren't and apparently give excellent firewood for angry, bitter people like yourself. Suing this guy or whatever you plan on doing isn't going to protect anyone. If you're really interested in protecting people, as it's already been said, why don't you do something to encourage people to use condoms?

Trust me, buddy, many of us have been in the same situation as you, myself included, yet it became quite clear after a while that nothing positive was to come from being bitter about it and unable to cope.

Also, watch the attitude, seriously. Don't expect people to be very friendly to you if you plan on speaking like that to people like Ann and the rest of us, who are honestly giving wise advice that you should really consider taking.


Offline next2u

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #17 on: January 16, 2008, 01:22:36 AM »
wow, that sucks. you are going get a lot of backlash with this topic. so here's my 2 cents.

everything above me is right, so i'd listen to the advice of others. if you need to prosecute this individual for this grave injustice, do so, but remember which side of the fence you are on. people who deceive other people and take advantage of them based on false premises should have to face some type of consequences for their actions, especially in a case like this.

but, also be aware, prosecuting and locking him up will not make this shit go away. the legal system is a bitch, and you will have to stand through a trial that my drain you emotionally, mentally and financially. You will also have to deal with you HIV long after he is out of the picture. And you still have to forgive yourself for allowing yourself to become infected. In some states (both physical and mental) you did consent to unsafe sex and you are aware of the potential consequences of unsafe sex, what you got is not a surprise.

locking him up so he can't do this to others is a great idea, but if you need vengeance be honest about your emotions. i know this is a moot point, but he can still infect other people in jail and once he gets out too. hiv positive inmates are also an extreme financial burden on any state's system. lastly, moving more towards a restorative, atoning solution will always outweigh a punitive one.

to answer your original question, yes there are people on here who have imprisoned the people that infected them. not a single one of the people i have spoken to felt significantly better after doing this. originally (like many of the others have stated) i was in a similar boat. i felt like i had lost a lot and that someone should be stopped before infecting others. turns out that someone is now myself. i notified my sex partners (the potential infectors) and left it at that. i gave them the information they needed and i contacted the local health dept. if anyone else is infected by the same person they can take over from that point.

but seriously, like ann says, focusing on yourself will get you in a better spot sooner. blaming someone will not fix the situation. afterall, i doubt they wanted it in the first place and maybe they felt they way you do now.
midapr07 - seroconversion
sept07 - tested poz
oct07 cd4 1013; vl 13,900; cd4% 41
feb08 cd4  694;  vl 16,160; cd4% 50.1
may08 cd4 546; vl 91,480; cd4% 32
aug08 cd4 576; vl 48,190; cd4% 40.7
dec08 cd4 559; vl 63,020; cd4% 29.4
feb09 cd4 464; vl 11,000; cd4% 26
may09 cd4 544; vl 29,710; cd4% 27.2
oct09 cd4 ...; vl 23,350; cd4% 31.6
mar10 cd4 408; vl 59,050; cd4% 31.4
aug10 cd4 328; vl 80,000; cd4% 19.3 STARTED ATRIPLA
oct10 cd4 423; vl 410 ;); cd4% 30.2
jun11 cd4 439; vl <20 ;); cd4% 33.8 <-Undetectable!
mar12 cd4 695; vl ud; cd4% 38.6
jan13 cd4 738; vl ud; cd4% 36.8
aug13 cd4 930; vl ud; cd4% 44.3
jan14 cd4 813; vl ud; cd4% 42.8
may14 cd4 783; vl *; cd4%43.5

Offline anniebc

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2008, 01:26:47 AM »
Quote
am amazed and disgusted at the vomit you've uttered.

You don't know me from Adam. You don't know how I am processing my diagnosis. You are faceless strangers on a website.

Quote
How about if you don't have something pertinent to the question you butt out?

First of all drop the bad attitude, it will get you nowhere here you do not talk to the administrators, moderators or members of this forum like that, you asked a question you got an answer, just because it wasn't the one you wanted does not give you the right to insult the poster.
 
Wether or not you like it you consented to unprotected sex, so therefore you have to take some of the responsibility, you cannot put the whole blame onto this guy...News flash..people will lie to you to get you into bed.

You want to get your revenge then go ahead...but don't expect us to back you in this quest.

We will however try and help you to get over your anger if that's what you want.

Jan




-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Never knock on deaths door..ring the bell and run..he really hates that.

Offline blacky1980

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2008, 03:24:05 AM »
SORRY U R GOING THROUGH THIS AND I WISH U ALL THE LUCK IN THE WORLD. PLEASE BE CAREFUL SO U DONT BE EXPOSE TO THE MEDIA BECAUSE, THEY CAN TRY TO DIG UP YOUR PASS AND MAKE U LOOK LIKE THE BAD ONE SO GOOD LUCK AND GOD BLESS U
Blacky1980

Offline emeraldize

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2008, 07:37:48 AM »
Fraidknot

As you've experienced, this is one tremendously touchy topic.

I have always wished there were a way to discuss this without cannon fire. It was one of my first concerns when coming to this site. I learned quickly to stuff it and found what I needed elsewhere. Invariably such posts receive such reception.

Please refer to your Inbox, I'll post a short PM there. I can give you some info you'll wish to consider.

Em

Offline zgood

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  • Posts: 7
Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #21 on: January 16, 2008, 07:57:11 AM »
 >:(  are you sure its not that the guy has moved on and your pissed off?ps i agree if you really want to help the "general public".go out and preach what can happen when one has unprotected sex with your self as a prime example.zgood

Offline vokz

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #22 on: January 16, 2008, 08:03:46 AM »
I have filed criminal charges against him

YOU have? LOL


I smell a troll .. and it is ankle-deep in bullshit.

Offline NLEWLAD

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #23 on: January 16, 2008, 08:19:54 AM »
I think it is totaly terrible to want to press charge against the guy that has infected you, especially when you admit to not using a condom!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I also know the person who infected me, i didnt ask him if he was poz or not and he never asked me  it takes two people and two brains to transmit the hiv virus. - both people have to take the responsiblility.

Now take the advice of most people on this forum and get yourself treated and looked after rather than wasting time money on a personal vendetta against this bloke.

Simon
Simon - Location Manchester England
Negative test 10/11/07
Tested poz 28/12/07
Confirmed WB 07/01/08
Sero-converted Late December 07

Date        CD4            %              VL

7/01/08   1273 :)      N/A       100,232
24/01/08   755 :(      42%         4,010
13/2/08     922 :)      45%       78,234
09/04/08   652 :(      38%       36,604
05/05/08   936 :)      39%       38,952
07/07/08   844 :)      34%       24,000
12/11/08   753 :(      31%       45,600
no meds yet:)

Offline englishgirl

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2008, 09:07:08 AM »
Right, lets take this step by step here

Point 1: Youíve become infected after having unprotected sex. You do need to accept some responsibility for your part in this, regardless of what the law says in the State of Florida. You are an adult, you knew the risks.

Point 2: You had a conversation with the person you had sex with and they told you they were negative. How do you know that he didnít think that he telling you the truth? Maybe he thought he was negative? Itís estimated that half of all new infections are from people who didnít know they were infected themselves. Your infection may not have been as Ďdeliberateí as you think. Ever had and STD and not know about it?

Point 3: Do you even really know that it was this person and this episode of unprotected sex you became infected through? Maybe youíve been positive for ages and didnít know. Maybe you yourself were mistaken about your status.

Point 4: People lie, maybe he did know, maybe he did lie. You donít say how long or well you knew this person. Maybe you trusted his word too soon. Yeah what he did was wrong, but did he really do it to wilfully and deliberately infect you? How long had he known? Had he had any support? Was he in denial himself?

Point 5: Your State gives you the option to pursue punishment for this man. How does that make your life better? Do you want your sex life dragged through the courts? Itís your word against his. Have you any proof that he didnít tell you?

Point 6: Do you really want to continue the portrayal of all positive folks as either evil or victims? Do you want it to be illegal for you to have sex with someone even if you disclose and even if you use a condom? Cos thatís where some States are heading. Do you want it to be illegal for you to enter some countries? Cos thatís the reality of it. Or now you are one of us do you want to try to use this experience in a positive way? Do as people suggest and start teaching safe sex or something.

Point 7: Do you want to heal yourself mentally and move on with your life or do you want to destroy yourself with hatred and anger and victimhood? You may think that a legal solution is gonna do you good but it wont. It will prolong the agony and stop you moving on with your life.

My suggestion: Take a deep breath and re-read what people here have said. It is good advice for you if you want a future that is mentally healthy. Donít pursue it through the legal system. Do seek counselling. Do move on.

Finally:
you said
Had he told me he had HIV I would not have had sex with him even with a condom.
Why?
Now you have HIV too do you expect to be treated this way or to continue having a life and be treated like a normal person?
Or do you want to be treated like a pariah?
Do to others as you would have done unto yourself.
ACT NOW TO CAMPAIGN AGAINST THE TRAVEL BAN:
http://campaigning.tht.org.uk/cms/cmsloader?WfJVLp&view=11,301,1385,0,-html

http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=17352.0


"I'm not keen on the idea of the afterlife - not without knowing who else will be there and what the entertainment will be. Personally I'd rather just take a rest." Oscar Berger, PWA: Looking AIDS in the Face, 1996. RIP.

Offline fraidknot

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #25 on: January 16, 2008, 12:27:27 PM »
You all make a lot of assumptions. Sad.

He DID know he was positive, he made that statement to someone else the night I filed charges against him. He also denied knowing me the night I filed charges against him. Thankfully the other person has made a statement to my investigator. His name has also been mentioned in other cases of new HIV diagnosis. If this was an oops on his part, no problem. There are many more details that prove he knowingly did it.

If someone chooses not to have sex with me because I have HIV even with a condom, that is their right, their choice. The only safe sex is no sex. I have had people tell me no and I respect that decision.

I've had my psych evaluation. Two educated professionals with degrees in psychiatry and psychology have told me that I am dealing with my diagnosis with grace and courage. So don't tell me how I feel or how to deal. I'm doing just fine.

Thanks for taking time out of your busy days to give your opinions.

Offline thunter34

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #26 on: January 16, 2008, 12:43:57 PM »
Yeah, well.  OK.  Good luck with all that.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Dachshund

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #27 on: January 16, 2008, 12:57:34 PM »
YOU have? LOL


I smell a troll .. and it is ankle-deep in bullshit.


concur

Offline thunter34

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #28 on: January 16, 2008, 01:00:06 PM »
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline fraidknot

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2008, 02:55:11 PM »
Let me see if I have this right. Live and let live. Since I was a partner in this, even though I asked if he had any STD's, even though he denied it, in spite of the fact that I have proof he is still actively practicing sex without protection I should just shut my mouth and deal with it?

I'm healthy. I found out early. i can live and will live a normal productive life. By sitting back and allowing him to potentially infect many more I am an accomplice to murder. I am not willing to live with that for the rest of my life. I have never intentionally put anyone's life in harms way and I never will. Obviously you don't get where I am coming from but it sure would be nice on a board that is supposed to be a support to see a little less harshness.

Thank goodness i have a good support system here. I feel bad for anyone who posts, gets flamed, branded as a troll and leaves as a result.

Thank you to the few for their kind words and private messages.

Offline thunter34

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #30 on: January 16, 2008, 03:38:32 PM »
Let me see if I have this right. Live and let live. Since I was a partner in this, even though I asked if he had any STD's, even though he denied it, in spite of the fact that I have proof he is still actively practicing sex without protection I should just shut my mouth and deal with it?

Basically, yeah.  And what direct "proof" do you have that this is still going on?  Unless you're still banging him?

I'm healthy. I found out early. i can live and will live a normal productive life.

Then stop simmering on vengeance and go do it.  Like Ann said...take your power back.

By sitting back and allowing him to potentially infect many more I am an accomplice to murder. I am not willing to live with that for the rest of my life.

Shakespeare was less dramatic.  You're a christian martyr, you are.  If you were really interested in saving the masses, you'd turn your energy outward & try to bring realistic prevention information to a wider group by sharing your cautionary tale.  Instead, you're channeling your energy all to one end.  And as said repeatedly above, we all know why. 
« Last Edit: January 16, 2008, 03:40:35 PM by thunter34 »
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline vokz

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #31 on: January 16, 2008, 03:45:00 PM »
Calmly trying to work the guilt, eh? Good to see you are working to such a predictable script.

.. in spite of the fact that I have proof he is still actively practicing sex without protection

Well do be sure to let us know when you think all his practice makes him as perfect as you think your trolling skills are.

Obviously you don't get where I am coming from ..

You think?

Edited to add:

Quote
You can't report your own post to the moderator, that doesn't make sense!

 ???
« Last Edit: January 16, 2008, 04:20:32 PM by vokz »

Offline Mouse

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #32 on: January 16, 2008, 03:56:35 PM »
Quote
Obviously you don't get where I am coming from but it sure would be nice on a board that is supposed to be a support to see a little less harshness.

Sometimes the truth is harsh, dear.  ::)


We don't know you. We don't have anything against you personally. You came onto this board and made it clear from your first post that you were more interested in going after someone for infecting you with HIV, which you were at least half responsible for in the first place, rather than receive any actual support. Your intentions seem more bitter and hostile than do they seem to have an interest in protecting anybody else.

Obviously there are still people out there like you (and me, like I had already mentioned) that are willing to put trust in the words of people we hardly know rather than take the safe route and just use a condom. However, the difference between you and I is I am quite clear on the fact that pursuing the guy that infected me isn't going to help me nor anybody else and any sense of security I feel is false, just as false as the security I felt when I believed my boyfriend at the time when he told me he did not have HIV and just as false as the security people will continue to feel if they think 'the law' is going to take care of everyone who lies about their HIV status and so therefore surely no one would lie about it in the first place, right?

Offline srmn98

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #33 on: January 16, 2008, 04:10:54 PM »
Hi all,

I'm curious here.

Hypothetical situation: Let's say, there is somebody out there who knows they are HIV positive. And let's say, when potential partners ask them if they have been tested and if they have HIV, they lie and say "I have been tested and am HIV negative."  And in our hypothetical situation, the potential partner has unprotected sex with the person that just lied to them. And they get HIV. Are you saying that the person that lied has no fault ? What if they lie repeatedly ?

Now I understand that there are slippery slopes here, as mentioned above. I understand that if we are all not careful, the laws could end up putting innocent people into trouble.

But I also do not think everything is as clear cut as all of you are saying --  each case is unique. And I think we should be able to talk about this without just ripping on the new person ?? We ALL know that it is traumatic to receive an HIV diagnosis and we all have to go through a certain period of time before we start to accept and integrate our diagnosis. My first though when I was diagnosed was that it had been done on purpose. I eventually found out otherwise --- but I had to go through my own process to start figuring it out  -- these things take time. I think we can EDUCATE people here about the pros and cons without SHREDDING them.

Sara


Offline thunter34

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #34 on: January 16, 2008, 04:19:04 PM »
As for "ripping on the new person", do bear in mind that this poster told another member to "butt out" with his (or her?) very second post.  And referred to others here as being from "the peanut gallery" in the third.  So spare me about us all being too harsh on the new kid. 


/edited to add an "o" to "too".  hate typos./
« Last Edit: January 16, 2008, 04:27:14 PM by thunter34 »
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline vokz

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #35 on: January 16, 2008, 04:23:04 PM »
Are you saying that the person that lied has no fault ?

I donít think anyone here is saying that.

And I will eat my hat if the Ďnewí person is new.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2008, 04:24:49 PM by vokz »

Offline fraidknot

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #36 on: January 16, 2008, 05:27:05 PM »
I am praying that your hat is small and tasty as I am very real.

My activism, if you wish to call it that, has extended beyond pursuing this man. I am an active member of b.com and have been very outspoken there about my part in this and placing too much trust in others instead of just using protection. My screen name is the same there so you can research for yourself if you still believe I am a troll or continue to believe whatever you wish.

I have also discussed the issue with my children who are very young adults and very adamantly suggested they use condoms every single time - do as i say, not as I do as they have seen the disasterous results.

I asked a very specific question here. I didn't ask for all the other advice. Again, I appreciate the encouragement and advice I received via pm.

Offline Matty the Damned

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2008, 05:31:28 PM »
For the record when FK refers to 'b.com' s/he means Bondage.com.

MtD

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #38 on: January 16, 2008, 05:32:51 PM »
It's funny how you still do not accept any of the blame. You are just as much to blame as the guy that lied.

Offline thunter34

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #39 on: January 16, 2008, 05:33:56 PM »
For the record when FK refers to 'b.com' s/he means Bondage.com.

MtD

I was about to ask. Thanks.

And FK, the advice you received was completely in line with your initial post.  It just wasn't what you wanted to hear.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline srmn98

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #40 on: January 16, 2008, 05:37:38 PM »
I don't understand.

What then, is the difference between:

1. Somebody knowingly lies about their status, you sleep with them without a condom, you get HIV.
2. Your boyfriend tests HIV negative. He cheats on you. He gets HIV. He doesn't tell you. You sleep with him. You get HIV.   

Would scenario # 2, then, also be my fault ?

Sara



Offline RapidRod

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #41 on: January 16, 2008, 05:48:00 PM »
Sara, I think you ought to go back and reread your very first post. http://forums.poz.com/index.php?topic=4710.msg53802#msg53802

Offline srmn98

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #42 on: January 16, 2008, 05:50:31 PM »
What does my initial post have to do with my question ? 

Offline milker

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #43 on: January 16, 2008, 05:57:40 PM »
Let's take two situations:

Situation 1:
You - "Are you negative" ?
Alex - "Yes"
You - "Let's fuck bareback"

Situation 2:
You - "Are you negative" ?
John - "Yes"
You - "Let's fuck bareback"

Let's assume that Alex knows he is positive and John doesn't know he is positive but he actually is. What differences does it make to you? You have given both Alex and John a chance to infect you.

How is Alex more responsible than John? Wouldn't you want to prosecute John because he didn't get tested in time before he fucked you? Aren't you responsible for keeping yourself in good health? I don't see any difference in the "guilty" verdict for John, Alex, and you. If you're going to prosecute Alex, then you should also prosecute John and yourself.

Milker.

/edited to add/ I didn't see srmn's post but we say the same thing.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2008, 05:59:21 PM by milker »
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mid-jan: seroconversion
mid-feb: poz
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nov 2 08 start Atripla
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may 27 10: cd4 655 (32%) vl undetectable :D :D

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Offline RapidRod

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #44 on: January 16, 2008, 06:00:09 PM »
What does my initial post have to do with my question ? 

You always used a condom but yet you say you got infected? Not by your ex mind you.

Offline srmn98

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #45 on: January 16, 2008, 06:06:30 PM »
Milker --

I agree with your scenario---  but my scenario, or at least my line of thinking,  is something quite different.

Scenario ONE involves somebody that is lying and intentionally exposing somebody to HIV.
Scenario TWO does not.

I'm not a lawyer. I'm just pointing out that the two situations, in my mind, are different in regards to Alex or John. Just because the outcome is the same for me does not mean that the entire scenarios are the same.  We can take another example:

1. You drive down the road, you get in an accident -- god forbid, somebody in the other car gets killed.
2. You have a few drinks. You drive down the road, you get in an accident -- god forbid, somebody in the other car gets killed.

Both scenarios are pretty scary -- and the outcome for the victim is identical. But the driver faces two very different fates -- (i.e. jail/prosecution versus just having a horrible accident).

In one situation the driver is knowingly impaired, in the other situation, the driver is "fit" to drive.

All I'm really saying is that I don't think it is as black and white as some of you do.

Sara




Offline srmn98

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #46 on: January 16, 2008, 06:08:11 PM »
Rod,

I did always use a condom. I'm one of those people that gets accused of having a faulty memory on this board. I'm also one of those people that believe they were infected by oral sex, another bag of worms which is not appropriate for this thread.

But I don't see how I contracted HIV has anything to do with this. I have posed hypothetical situations, not my own.

Sara

Offline fraidknot

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #47 on: January 16, 2008, 06:08:31 PM »
It's funny how you still do not accept any of the blame. You are just as much to blame as the guy that lied.

Apparently you are only reading part of my post as I have said that I accept my part of the blame. I didn't insist on a condom and I trusted someone at their word. That was my fault. I stated that very clearly in my last post.

Offline RapidRod

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #48 on: January 16, 2008, 06:12:28 PM »
Quote
have also discussed the issue with my children who are very young adults and very adamantly suggested they use condoms every single time - do as i say, not as I do as they have seen the disasterous results.

No where did you accept your part of the blame.

Offline Teresa

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Re: Deliberately infected
« Reply #49 on: January 16, 2008, 06:13:30 PM »
I guess the lesson here is to think that everyone you have sex with is HIV+. I was one of the lucky ones that didnt get infected by someone that didnt know they were positive.

Teresa
Hubby HIV+ 5/5/06
CD4:320
  %: 26.7
 VL: <20
Atripla (started it 8/24/06)
 

 


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