Quantcast

Subscribe to:
POZ magazine
E-newsletters
Join POZ: Facebook MySpace Twitter Pinterest
Tumblr Google+ Flickr MySpace
POZ Personals
Sign In / Join
Username:
Password:
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
July 22, 2014, 03:58:21 PM

Login with username, password and session length


Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 631469
  • Total Topics: 47799
  • Online Today: 279
  • Online Ever: 585
  • (January 07, 2014, 02:31:47 PM)
Users Online
Users: 5
Guests: 221
Total: 226

Welcome


Welcome to the POZ/AIDSmeds Community Forums, a round-the-clock discussion area for people with HIV/AIDS, their friends/family/caregivers, and others concerned about HIV/AIDS.  Click on the links below to browse our various forums; scroll down for a glance at the most recent posts; or join in the conversation yourself by registering on the left side of this page.

Privacy Warning:  Please realize that these forums are open to all, and are fully searchable via Google and other search engines. If you are HIV positive and disclose this in our forums, then it is almost the same thing as telling the whole world (or at least the World Wide Web). If this concerns you, then do not use a username or avatar that are self-identifying in any way. We do not allow the deletion of anything you post in these forums, so think before you post.

  • The information shared in these forums, by moderators and members, is designed to complement, not replace, the relationship between an individual and his/her own physician.

  • All members of these forums are, by default, not considered to be licensed medical providers. If otherwise, users must clearly define themselves as such.

  • Forums members must behave at all times with respect and honesty. Posting guidelines, including time-out and banning policies, have been established by the moderators of these forums. Click here for “Am I Infected?” posting guidelines. Click here for posting guidelines pertaining to all other POZ/AIDSmeds community forums.

  • We ask all forums members to provide references for health/medical/scientific information they provide, when it is not a personal experience being discussed. Please provide hyperlinks with full URLs or full citations of published works not available via the Internet. Additionally, all forums members must post information which are true and correct to their knowledge.

  • Product advertisement—including links; banners; editorial content; and clinical trial, study or survey participation—is strictly prohibited by forums members unless permission has been secured from POZ.

To change forums navigation language settings, click here (members only), Register now

Para cambiar sus preferencias de los foros en español, haz clic aquí (sólo miembros), Regístrate ahora

Finished Reading This? You can collapse this or any other box on this page by clicking the symbol in each box.

Author Topic: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s  (Read 21449 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« on: November 13, 2007, 11:44:39 AM »
Hello i have been Poz about 20 years and have found that by using the correct combination of natural substrates i have been able to remain med free for the last 15 months (doctor monitored).Resistance and toxicity issues are non existant, and cd4 gains and viral load suppresion are very significant and functional as compared to meds.Requires multi dosing scheduling.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2007, 07:49:56 PM by Lorenzopier »

Offline dixieman

  • Member
  • Posts: 889
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2007, 03:07:50 PM »
What are the Natural substences? I have used every alternative treatments available... eventually they tend to not work as with meds.. I use alternative along with my meds... I kept myself alive for 5 years with herbs... and eventually the virus finds away around them... What are you using? I don't want to burst your bubble and I'm glad their working but, let everyone know what alternative methods are you using? I think everyone would like to know?

Offline Merlin

  • Member
  • Posts: 642
  • As My WILL, So MOTE It Be !
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2007, 09:52:46 PM »
Yes, by all means, please do tell Lorenzopier. This I really gotta hear.  ;)
I'll leave Hatred to those not strong enough to Love.

                            +++

Believe & The Power Of The Mind Transforms.
Make It Happen...

                            +++

I blame them for nothing.
I forgive them for everything.

---->> Mary J. Blige on dysfuctional parents

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2007, 01:46:30 PM »
What are the Natural substences? I have used every alternative treatments available... eventually they tend to not work as with meds.. I use alternative along with my meds... I kept myself alive for 5 years with herbs... and eventually the virus finds away around them... What are you using? I don't want to burst your bubble and I'm glad their working but, let everyone know what alternative methods are you using? I think everyone would like to know?

Presently the program is similiar in lines to k-pax,but adds the missing substrates that are required to initiate the correct cell signaling process.

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #4 on: November 14, 2007, 01:52:45 PM »
What are the Natural substences? I have used every alternative treatments available... eventually they tend to not work as with meds.. I use alternative along with my meds... I kept myself alive for 5 years with herbs... and eventually the virus finds away around them... What are you using? I don't want to burst your bubble and I'm glad their working but, let everyone know what alternative methods are you using? I think everyone would like to know?

« Last Edit: November 14, 2007, 01:56:44 PM by Lorenzopier »

Offline Winiroo

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,082
  • Positive since 1991
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #5 on: November 14, 2007, 01:56:43 PM »
In a totally non-bitchy way I have to say...

I hate to sound rude but when I read posts like this I always get the horrible feeling someone will soon be trying to sell me Noni juice.

Offline allopathicholistic

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,258
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2007, 02:38:07 PM »
In a totally non-bitchy way I have to say...

I hate to sound rude but when I read posts like this I always get the horrible feeling someone will soon be trying to sell me Noni juice.

ROFL, so true and perfectly understandable  ;D

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2007, 02:42:13 PM »
In a totally non-bitchy way I have to say...

I hate to sound rude but when I read posts like this I always get the horrible feeling someone will soon be trying to sell me Noni juice.

I understand your concerns hear.Because of my chronic hepatitis B i was unable to tolerate HAART.Eventhough i have a laymans background in cell science i still fell victim to all the quack products and scams at the time.I eventually was diagnosed with aids because i could not tolerate HAART.This product is a result of very exhaustive research and self testing and (make no mistake about it) is a very exhaustive program in the begging.The pill count required for me to bring my cd4s from the lower 200s into the lower 500s in under 4 months is in the range of 40-60 per day.

Offline Tim Horn

  • Member
  • Posts: 799
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2007, 03:49:31 PM »
Lorenzopier:

You seem to be shooting blanks. You're quoting previous responses but not adding your own comments.

Anyway, not to cut you off at the path (okay, maybe just a little), fact of the matter is that triple-drug combination therapy is tried and true in its ability to drop HIV viral loads in the hundreds of thousands to below 50 -- I've never seen the same results, in scientific clinical trials, involving "natural substrates." While a lot of people benefit from taking "natural substrates," I just don't if one can conclude that they "work as well as meds."

Tim Horn

Offline Merlin

  • Member
  • Posts: 642
  • As My WILL, So MOTE It Be !
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2007, 05:17:27 PM »
He actually did respond, inside his own quote box!!! Now, that's a feat. How did he do that??
Still, nothing new or what has already been discussed numerous times before on natural therapies.
Tsk tsk, bad boi Lorenzo.. ;D
I'll leave Hatred to those not strong enough to Love.

                            +++

Believe & The Power Of The Mind Transforms.
Make It Happen...

                            +++

I blame them for nothing.
I forgive them for everything.

---->> Mary J. Blige on dysfuctional parents

Offline Matty the Damned

  • Member
  • Posts: 12,198
  • Ninja Please
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2007, 05:21:21 PM »
You gotta love a laymans background in cell science.

MtD

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2007, 07:47:07 PM »
[
« Last Edit: November 14, 2007, 07:55:07 PM by Lorenzopier »

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substrates that works as well as meds
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2007, 07:52:04 PM »
Lorenzopier:

You seem to be shooting blanks. You're quoting previous responses but not adding your own comments.

Anyway, not to cut you off at the path (okay, maybe just a little), fact of the matter is that triple-drug combination therapy is tried and true in its ability to drop HIV viral loads in the hundreds of thousands to below 50 -- I've never seen the same results, in scientific clinical trials, involving "natural substrates." While a lot of people benefit from taking "natural substrates," I just don't if one can conclude that they "work as well as meds."

Tim Horn
[Thanks Tim for correcting me on my assumption that there are natural agents that work as well as meds but for people who cannot tolerate meds this is definitely the holy grail.Also without the clinical trials to prove it i have only my own evidence to stand on.While i have not been able to drop my viral load below 20,000 copies i have been able to bring my viral load from 200,000 copies to around 20,000 copies using a all natural program within 4 months.
]

Offline jack

  • Member
  • Posts: 1,578
  • fomerly the loser known as Jake
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #13 on: November 14, 2007, 08:04:45 PM »
wanna buy a condo in Ft.Myers?

Offline JohnOso

  • Member
  • Posts: 816
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2007, 03:30:09 AM »
I keep reading about this natural substance stuff, but I sitll haven't seen you posting any sample regimens yet.

It's starting to sound like those "See Rock City" painted on barns across the South.....it sounds like the bestest place on earth, but when you get there it's just a trashy tourist trap in Chattanooga.

Offline J220

  • Member
  • Posts: 587
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2007, 09:02:05 PM »
I keep reading about this natural substance stuff, but I sitll haven't seen you posting any sample regimens yet.

Well it won't be long before he either posts a website where they "conveniently" sell what he has been taking (which also conveniently "requires multi dosing scheduling" i.e. keep shelling out cash), or he will tell us to PM him for more information....what a freaking joke...if it walks like spam and sounds like spam...well you know the rest!
"Hope is my philosophy
Just needs days in which to be
Love of Life means hope for me
Born on a New Day" - John David

Offline Mike2008

  • Member
  • Posts: 76
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2007, 01:54:48 PM »
How much is the condo?
4-27-07  cd4 490  vl 1857
6-28-07  cd4 418  vl 993
started Atripla 9-17-07
10-9-07  cd4 502  vl,<75
1-15-08   cd4 473 vl< 75
blood platlets 31-26-79-20 -0-63-109

Offline Ann

  • Administrator
  • Member
  • Posts: 28,134
  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2007, 05:05:51 PM »
How much is the condo?

Mike, I'll do you a special deal. How's $2.99 grab you? ;D

Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline Winiroo

  • Member
  • Posts: 2,082
  • Positive since 1991
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2007, 05:09:26 PM »
You get fries with that?

Offline Ann

  • Administrator
  • Member
  • Posts: 28,134
  • It just is, OK?
    • Num is sum qui mentiar tibi?
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #19 on: November 27, 2007, 05:13:51 PM »
You get fries with that?

Oh yeah. And a SuperSize drink!
Condoms are a girl's best friend

Condom and Lube Info  



"...health will finally be seen not as a blessing to be wished for, but as a human right to be fought for." Kofi Annan

Nymphomaniac: a woman as obsessed with sex as an average man. Mignon McLaughlin

HIV is certainly character-building. It's made me see all of the shallow things we cling to, like ego and vanity. Of course, I'd rather have a few more T-cells and a little less character. Randy Shilts

Offline jupiter

  • Member
  • Posts: 89
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #20 on: November 30, 2007, 12:23:41 AM »
Loren,
What are these substances that have helped you do this.
If you are gonna post something like this, please give more details as this post tell us nothing about how tyou actually did this.

Thanks Jupe

Offline Merlin

  • Member
  • Posts: 642
  • As My WILL, So MOTE It Be !
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #21 on: December 02, 2007, 01:15:13 PM »
At this rate, it's probably an upsized Big Mac meal with cinnamon powder on the latte. Like I said b4, dun get your hopes up. He's probably still baiting the snake for its oil. Really bad bad boi Lorenzo...u should know better than to be a drag  ::) ;D
I'll leave Hatred to those not strong enough to Love.

                            +++

Believe & The Power Of The Mind Transforms.
Make It Happen...

                            +++

I blame them for nothing.
I forgive them for everything.

---->> Mary J. Blige on dysfuctional parents

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #22 on: December 10, 2007, 01:14:40 PM »
Hello Dixieman i too have tried using the natural substances in combination with HAART.Unfortunately this combination seems to inhibit CD4 counts, probaly because they both are competing for the same receptors .The only way the natural method can work to increase CD4 counts is by themselves only.The good news is that the natural system can work effectively in combination with HAART to counter some of the side effects of HAART.Unfortunately i cannot give the specifics of my system at this time,because once something really works the big corporations will turn it into a money  monopoly,just look at how expensive HAART is.

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #23 on: December 10, 2007, 01:25:02 PM »
Hello
« Last Edit: December 11, 2007, 01:25:27 PM by Lorenzopier »

Offline leatherman

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,050
  • Google and HIV meds are Your Friends
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #24 on: December 10, 2007, 01:46:03 PM »
Unfortunately i cannot give the specifics of my system at this time,because once something really works the big corporations will turn it into a money monopoly

I have a few polite questions for you Lorenzopier:

How did your thread about "natural substances" suddenly become about your "system"? Why did you even bother to start this thread if you weren't going to speak about the specifics of your "system"?

Surely you realized that without some sort of information, data, or proof about your "system" that you would get criticized and accused of "selling snake oil". Until you have some sort of evidence to put forth, you'll continue to be questioned and even ridiculed.

Can you tell us more about your system? Something with some facts, rather than just unsubstantiated claims.
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline Merlin

  • Member
  • Posts: 642
  • As My WILL, So MOTE It Be !
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #25 on: December 10, 2007, 02:07:55 PM »
Dito leatherman (well said) and 10 times that to you Lorenzopier. ;D

You started skinning the snake and now you are asking if I have had ever come across any one knowing how to do it properly and then selling the oil successfully? Duh & double duh??!! :o :o

From your wig-waggardly-wriggling manner, I honestly believe you are on a regimen of natural substance alright; ->> does CRACK qualify? ...puff, puff... ::) (man, these smokes sure are oily these days)

« Last Edit: December 10, 2007, 02:09:41 PM by Merlin »
I'll leave Hatred to those not strong enough to Love.

                            +++

Believe & The Power Of The Mind Transforms.
Make It Happen...

                            +++

I blame them for nothing.
I forgive them for everything.

---->> Mary J. Blige on dysfuctional parents

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2007, 12:06:17 PM »
Hello Leatherman.I will go further into this system,which will appear to you,at least on paper, like many of the previous systems on this site. Daily intake is 40-60 pills a day
>Entire B-complex family
>Vitamins C,D,E,K
>Beta-carotene
>alpha lopic acid
>NAC
>CO-q10
>L-glutamine
>L-taurine
>L-carnitine
>probotics
>Omega 6 essential fatty acid
>Omega 3 essential fatty acid
>conjugated linoleic acid
>minerals consisting of calcium,magnesium,phosphorus,potassium,iron,copper,zinc
>trace minerals consisting of chromium,boron,vanadyl sulfate,selenium,manganese,molybdenum
« Last Edit: December 12, 2007, 11:13:39 AM by Lorenzopier »

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2007, 01:44:33 PM »
I understand the ridicule that would come with even the thought that there could be a natural way of increasing cd4 counts especially when the public has been pulled into a 20 year system that seems to convey that only a drug or combination of drugs can increase cd4 counts and supress viral loads.You have to also look at the fact that are government has spent many millions of dollars into drug research and  have made tremendous advcements in HAART,but if just 1/20 of that amount was spent to research natural substances,we would have long arrived at a natural system that could increase cd4 counts and or supress viral loads.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2007, 11:11:47 AM by Lorenzopier »

Offline knowdifferent

  • Member
  • Posts: 11
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2007, 02:36:34 PM »
I tested poz two years ago with a viral load of 110,000, a tcell count of 249, and a syphillis count of 1:256.  I had night sweats, swollen glands and weighed 145 lbs ( I'm 5'11").  I got one shot of penicillin and that was the first and last pharmaceutical drug I received.  It has been a roller coaster ride and I've got a long way to go, but I believed and still do that I have the ability to change my life.  I have been on an extensive nutritional program and take alot of supplements every day.  My viral load is 71,000 and my tcells are 308 and my syphilis is 1:16.  I gained two inches in my waist and weigh 172 lbs.  My lymph nodes have disappeared and I sleep through the night.  I have no side effects and no fatigue. My skin looks amazing.  I look better than I have in years.  I have decided not to live for the tests.  I'm not about to ignore them, but I'm also not going to ignore my body and how I feel either.  Quality of life is just as important as any bloodwork.  Two products that are clinically proven to increase NK cells are Immpower and Ave'.  These are a couple of the very few products on the market that actually support the immune system.  Allopathic drugs suppress the immune system.  The only reason tcells go up with meds is because the viral load is suppressed.  These two natural products don't come cheap, but then neither do the meds.  To each his own, my friends.

Offline Matty the Damned

  • Member
  • Posts: 12,198
  • Ninja Please
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2007, 03:16:24 PM »
Know,

How you manage your health is entirely a matter for you, but you do realise that a syphilis titre of 1/16 shows that you still have active disease, don't you? Not only that, syphilis has long dormant periods where you feel perfectly well but it comes back later on, often with devastating consequences.

Neurosyphilis is a horrific condition, my friend.

Syphilis is entirely curable and I would encourage you to complete the course of antibiotic injections. Being HIV positive is bad enough, combined with syphilis it's a real nightmare.

MtD

Offline knowdifferent

  • Member
  • Posts: 11
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2007, 04:19:44 PM »
Successful syphilis treatment = 2 titres decrease.  I go to the doctor regularly and each time the titre drops by half.  Like I said, I've still got a long way to go  ;)

Offline aztecan

  • Member
  • Posts: 5,382
  • 29 years positive, 56 years a pain in the butt
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #31 on: December 12, 2007, 09:43:21 AM »
After living with the HIV bug for more than 22 years, I have seen people try most everything out there to combat it. Chinese herbal medicine, holistic medicine, macrobiotics, Noni juice, having a body desanguinated, heating the blood and then replacing it, etc.

I, myself, used supplements during some of the 11 years I knew I was positive prior to the advent of the cocktails. The fact  I still breathe probably has as much to do with genetics - mine and and virus' - as it does any of the supplements I took.

The bottom line is you have as much chance of controlling HIV in the body by inhaling your grandmother's farts as you do with any combo of vitamins, supplements, etc.

I find it curious that Lorenzo has never discussed what his system is. Then again, maybe not.

As for the syphilis issue, Knowdifferent, since that particular bug goes through latency periods, I am not in the least surprised that a RPR titer can shoe signs of lessening, albeit still active, infection.

But syphilis will come back and bite you on the ass - or wherever you were infected. I have seen it and it isn't pretty. Nor is it much fun for the individual.

Each person certainly has a right to decide his/her own health care. But anyone making claims regarding the efficacy of non-traditional methods of treatment should be ready to provide clinical data supporting that claim or expect to be treated with skepticism.

HUGS,

Mark
"May your life preach more loudly than your lips."
~ William Ellery Channing (Unitarian Minister)

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #32 on: December 12, 2007, 11:46:20 AM »
Hello Aztecan,I have to  very strongly disagree with your bottom line.Let me try to explain.The science of using vitamins,supplements or any other type of nutraceutical is just that.(A SCIENCE)Just like using HAART is based on the science that  using the CORRECT combinations of 3 drugs or more will provide enough synergy to supress viral loads to very low or undectable ranges.I applaud your 11 year effort into  trying to use vitamins and supplements as a means of controlling the virus or increasing cd4 counts but without the CORRECT knowledge of how to use the supplements in combinations and what dosages to use without actually shutting down receptors sites, a thousand years of effort could still lead to zero results.

Offline thunter34

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,302
  • His name is Carl.
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #33 on: December 12, 2007, 12:27:02 PM »
Hello Aztecan,I have to  very strongly disagree with your bottom line.Let me try to explain.The science of using vitamins,supplements or any other type of nutraceutical is just that.(A SCIENCE)Just like using HAART is based on the science that  using the CORRECT combinations of 3 drugs or more will provide enough synergy to supress viral loads to very low or undectable ranges.I applaud your 11 year effort into  trying to use vitamins and supplements as a means of controlling the virus or increasing cd4 counts but without the CORRECT knowledge of how to use the supplements in combinations and what dosages to use without actually shutting down receptors sites, a thousand years of effort could still lead to zero results.

Oh, get on with it already.  You've had since November 13th draw this thread toward its inevitable crackpot conclusion. 
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline thunter34

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,302
  • His name is Carl.
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #34 on: December 12, 2007, 12:32:42 PM »
I think you should all know that I, too, have come across a system that kicks HAART's ass.  Unfortunately, I can't tell you a thing about it.  Big Pharma would be all over it, don'tcha know.  But it's the shiznit.  What I can reveal is that it involves, at least in part:

>Jump down.
>Turn around.
>Pick a bale of cotton.

AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline leatherman

  • Member
  • Posts: 6,050
  • Google and HIV meds are Your Friends
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #35 on: December 12, 2007, 12:53:19 PM »

>Pick a bale of cotton.


Now, now.  :D He said it was the pills to take, not the cotton from the bottles.  ;D

Personally, that's when he lost me though.  :( I used to take 32 pills a day several years ago. I don't care how "natural" Lorenz' system is, I'll just continue swallowing the 8 a day my regimen is finally down to (especially since these 8 work  ;) ). I'm honest enough to admit I'd never adhere to a regimen of 40-60 pills day.
leatherman (aka mIkIE)


chart from 1992-2013; updated 2/09/13  Reyataz/Norvir/Truvada

Offline thunter34

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,302
  • His name is Carl.
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #36 on: December 12, 2007, 01:08:30 PM »
Now, now.  :D He said it was the pills to take, not the cotton from the bottles.  ;D

Personally, that's when he lost me though.  :( I used to take 32 pills a day several years ago. I don't care how "natural" Lorenz' system is, I'll just continue swallowing the 8 a day my regimen is finally down to (especially since these 8 work  ;) ). I'm honest enough to admit I'd never adhere to a regimen of 40-60 pills day.

EXACTLY!  Not to mention the cost.  I'm sorry, but even in their most generic forms, 40-60 pills a day is gonna cost a chunk of change.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #37 on: December 12, 2007, 01:39:30 PM »
Hello Leatherman and Thunther34 the cost for me to maintain this system is around about 100 dollars a month if i buy in bulk.The pill count situation is a burden still even to this day.But to me is a worth while trade off for the very much enhanced quality of life as compared to the HAART regimen.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2007, 01:42:47 PM by Lorenzopier »

Offline thunter34

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,302
  • His name is Carl.
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #38 on: December 12, 2007, 05:01:31 PM »
Hello Leatherman and Thunther34 the cost for me to maintain this system is around about 100 dollars a month if i buy in bulk.The pill count situation is a burden still even to this day.But to me is a worth while trade off for the very much enhanced quality of life as compared to the HAART regimen.

And yet you still won't say exactly what this miracle regimen is.  So what exactly is your point in posting all this, Lorenzo? 

"I've got this wonderful, all natural regiman that works like HAART.  But I won't tell you what it is."

That's essentially what you're giving us here, Lorenzo.

This is something you're wishing to market to us, Lorenzo, isn't that correct?  If this "system" is so terrific and your intentions entirely selfless, there shouldn't be any reason not to come forth with what it is.

You continue to go on and on about this supposed "system" of yours without a smidge of any substantial information in support of it. 

It's more than pointless to do so.  It's downright rude.

Either ante up or bugger off.
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Merlin

  • Member
  • Posts: 642
  • As My WILL, So MOTE It Be !
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #39 on: December 13, 2007, 12:36:16 AM »
Know:

Keep fighting and believing. Your VDRL is down to 1:16 which still needs to go down further to 1:1. If it does not after 6 months, it's really better to be sure by taking 3 more shots of penicillin. For HIV+ individuals with syphillis, the standard 3 shots of 2.4 million units of penicillin G benzathine each time is given at weekly intervals to prevent complications for neurosyphillis. A normal HIV- person only requires one shot. Your VDRL will never be zero as it stays forever as a "tatto or scar". The lowest one should expect is 1:1 and it will be indicated as non-reactive.

Your supplement program is commendable. Aside from the AHCC, Immpower, care to share your list of supplements with us. Since we are not even getting a drop of snake oil from Lorenzopier, your experience will benefit others; at least yours have been shown to work pretty well.

Take care and good luck. ;)
I'll leave Hatred to those not strong enough to Love.

                            +++

Believe & The Power Of The Mind Transforms.
Make It Happen...

                            +++

I blame them for nothing.
I forgive them for everything.

---->> Mary J. Blige on dysfuctional parents

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #40 on: December 13, 2007, 09:59:35 AM »
You guys are killing me.Once again here is the actual program.Based on my experiments this program does not seem to work well in combinatin with HAART. Daily intake is 40-60 pills a day
>Entire B-complex family
>Vitamins C,D,E,K
>Beta-carotene
>alpha lopic acid
>NAC
>CO-q10
>L-glutamine
>L-taurine
>L-carnitine
>probotics
>Omega 6 essential fatty acid
>Omega 3 essential fatty acid
>conjugated linoleic acid
>minerals consisting of calcium,magnesium,phosphorus,potassium,iron,copper,zinc
>trace minerals consisting of chromium,boron,vanadyl sulfate,selenium,manganese,molybdenum
« Last Edit: December 13, 2007, 10:06:34 AM by Lorenzopier »

Offline knowdifferent

  • Member
  • Posts: 11
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #41 on: December 13, 2007, 12:13:50 PM »
To be honest, my supplement list is not much different than Lorenzo's.  I think it's important to know which brands are the most effective and which companies actually put in the bottle what they say they're putting in there.  That is where a good nutritionist comes in.  It is my belief, however, that there are not any supplements out there to aggressively combat the virus.  My approach is two-fold.  One: attack the virus.  Two: rebuild the immune system.  I have been using ozone therapy for two years to kill the HIV and about 4 1/2 months ago added the supplement program.  My viral load decreased three-fold in three months after starting the supplements and my tcells increased by 30.  The syphilis went from 1:32 to 1:16.  The hardest part of this is sticking with it in the face of mainstream doctors because with ozone, your bloodwork will get worse before it gets better.  That's when I defer to my quality of life.  My numbers might not be great, but they're getting better.  When everyone at work comes down with the flu or a cold, I have been spared despite my compromised immuse system.  I decided to follow my instincts, but also not to turn my back on my HIV doctor.  He thinks I'm crazy and I'll admit, I am a bit touched.  It's just nice to have a reason to get up in the morning and work towards a healthy goal  :P

Offline Basquo

  • Member
  • Posts: 3,250
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #42 on: December 13, 2007, 08:42:29 PM »


>Jump down.
>Turn around.
>Pick a bale of cotton.



You know I have a natural system too.  My system keeps the viral load down naturally.  Somehow my body fights off this infection on its own, so I need a volunteer to EAT ME.

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #43 on: December 26, 2007, 09:14:28 PM »
“AIDS is a multi-billion dollar business, but only as long as this epidemic spreads and only as long as the pharmaceutical investment business is able to protect its ‘AIDS market monopoly’ based on patented toxic AIDS drugs.

Any challenge or break of this pharmaceutical monopoly of so-called antiretrovirals, or ARVs, will inevitably lead to the collapse of this multi-billion dollar market with patented AIDS drugs. Fact is, science-based micronutrients - established many decades ago in the textbooks of biology as key biological factors for improving immune deficiencies – are the greatest threat to the survival of the AIDS drug business.

Any media reports discrediting micronutrients serve neither the scientific truth nor the patients affected by AIDS. In fact, the sole benefactors of such an irresponsible attack are the stakeholders of the pharmaceutical investment business in the AIDS epidemic. ”

« Last Edit: December 26, 2007, 09:24:32 PM by Lorenzopier »

Offline thunter34

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,302
  • His name is Carl.
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #44 on: December 26, 2007, 09:32:51 PM »
“AIDS is a multi-billion dollar business, but only as long as this epidemic spreads and only as long as the pharmaceutical investment business is able to protect its ‘AIDS market monopoly’ based on patented toxic AIDS drugs.

Any challenge or break of this pharmaceutical monopoly of so-called antiretrovirals, or ARVs, will inevitably lead to the collapse of this multi-billion dollar market with patented AIDS drugs. Fact is, science-based micronutrients - established many decades ago in the textbooks of biology as key biological factors for improving immune deficiencies – are the greatest threat to the survival of the AIDS drug business.

Any media reports discrediting micronutrients serve neither the scientific truth nor the patients affected by AIDS. In fact, the sole benefactors of such an irresponsible attack are the stakeholders of the pharmaceutical investment business in the AIDS epidemic. ”

Lovely quote.  Wherever did you get it? 

Look, Lorenzo:  That piddly little description you slung up above is essentially worthless.  It says absolutely NOTHING in terms of how such a "program" is actually proportioned or administered...let alone providing ANY substantial science to back it up.  I have no doubt that good nutrition can play a vital role in maintaining and promoting good health for everyone, positive and negative alike, but you're wasting everybody's time with this malarkey.  Not only is this thread all but useless in terms of providing any information of REAL benefit to anyone reading it, it's being framed in such a way that it dances on the edge of denialism with your talk about "so-called antivirals".

I've personally had quite enough.

I'm reporting this to let the mods give it a proper review.

AIDS isn't for sissies.


Offline thunter34

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,302
  • His name is Carl.
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #46 on: December 27, 2007, 12:21:14 AM »
http://www.jonkaiser.com/docs/StudySummary.pdf

OK...so?  And?  Your point is? 

I assume you placed this link as the "source" for your quote above about the "so-called antivirals" from the "pharmaceutical monopoly", however...

(1) That quote doesn't appear in the text provided when one clicks the link.

(2)  The study itself reports marginal to semi-significant results of having a spiffy diet IN CONJUNCTION WITH HAART.

Again...your point is?

I stand by my earlier report to the mods. 

/edited to change sigficiant to significant/
« Last Edit: December 27, 2007, 12:04:20 PM by thunter34 »
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline thunter34

  • Member
  • Posts: 7,302
  • His name is Carl.
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #47 on: December 27, 2007, 12:27:59 AM »
So is all this just the (extremely) long way around to gabbing about K-PAX? 
AIDS isn't for sissies.

Offline Lorenzopier

  • Member
  • Posts: 90
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #48 on: December 27, 2007, 01:18:47 AM »
Take a closer look.I am using the principals based on Jon Kaiser research and providing the upgrade needed for not just marginal increased cd4 counts, but greatly enhanced cd4 production.His formula provides 33 micronutrients.The system i am using provides at least 39 micronutrients.The important point here is not neccesarily the increased amount of micronutrients being used ,but how they are being staged to reach the optimum level of effectiveness.   
http://www.jonkaiser.com/research/broadspectrum.html
« Last Edit: December 27, 2007, 03:54:33 AM by Lorenzopier »

Offline Merlin

  • Member
  • Posts: 642
  • As My WILL, So MOTE It Be !
Re: There are natural substances that effectively increase cd4s
« Reply #49 on: December 27, 2007, 03:45:30 AM »
The study lists micronutrients already discussed by the buckets before. Really seems like old news to me. :( tell us something we all dun already know.

How about this? I currently switched from snake to emu oil with a dash of VCO added. Wanna turn into Big Bird and fly away to coconut Never Neverland.  ;D

Dun get me wrong. I'm all for supplementation but, Lorenzopier, to take this long to drag out a dead cat is really testing everyone's patience. You need to take a motivational course and improve on execution.  :P
I'll leave Hatred to those not strong enough to Love.

                            +++

Believe & The Power Of The Mind Transforms.
Make It Happen...

                            +++

I blame them for nothing.
I forgive them for everything.

---->> Mary J. Blige on dysfuctional parents

 


Terms of Membership for these forums
 

© 2014 Smart + Strong. All Rights Reserved.   terms of use and your privacy
Smart + Strong® is a registered trademark of CDM Publishing, LLC.